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Wednesday, February 7th, 2007 at 5:42 pm  |  154 responses

Outro

John Amaechi is gay. But I knew that.

It’s hard to imagine a basketball “news” story that could be as simultaneously overwhelming and underwhelming as John Amaechi acknowledging his homosexuality:

Overwhelming, because as far as anyone can remember, no current or active NBA player has ever done this, making it potentially newsworthy and groundbreaking and incredibly socially relevant;

And underwhelming, especially for the kind of people who read SLAM, because John was never any of the things that most of you care about in a basketball player. He’s not hip-hop. He’s not gangsta. He was never smooth or athletic or dynamic on the court. Most important, at least at the pro level, he just wasn’t that good.

So maybe you don’t care — and if you don’t, seriously, stop reading now — and maybe I wouldn’t either, except that I know the guy. Penn State being a huge university, I don’t remember if we ever had any actual classes together, but John Amaechi and I were essentially classmates at PSU in the mid ’90s. More directly, I covered the men’s basketball team as the beat writer for our student paper during John’s senior year. The team was decent (NIT Final Four) and John was first-team All-Big Ten, and over the course of following the team all season, I got to know him relatively well — well-enough, at least, to write a really corny feature about him. At least my writing has gotten better. I hope.

The singular thing about John was just that: He was always unique. Always, and in all ways. He was was All-Big Ten, but he wasn’t really a very good basketball player, at least not by any standard definition: Couldn’t jump, wasn’t particularly graceful — he just never looked the part, but he practiced relentlessly and made it work (and that just came down to pride and love of the game; dude would run pick-up with anyone). As stated, he’s English, and before Luol Deng, the idea of a top-flight English ballplayer literally seemed alien. He never tried to play the tough guy (although he was tough on the court –you don’t average 10 rebounds a game in the Big Ten if you’re not), never talked sh*t on the court, just never fit the part, especially in the Fab Five, Big Dog, Bobby Knight era of Big Ten hoops.

But you know the most compelling thing about John Amaechi, at least if you went to Penn State in the mid ’90s? He was the most popular guy on campus.

Understand, this is the equivalent of some linebacker from the football team at Kansas or Duke being the biggest celebrity in town: It’s not supposed to happen. Penn State is was and always will be a football school, and yet this guy, on force of personality, just owned the school. You could just tell, without the slightest trace of arrogance on his part, that John was smarter and more approachable and more thoughtful than any of the other big-time athletes on campus, and pretty much the rest of the student body in general. Dude was just… cool.

He was also, even then, gay, and a lot of us knew it, or at least assumed it. I mean, I didn’t have the evidence to prove it in court, but part of it was just his manner, the way he carried himself — pardon the stereotypes here, but this is truth. John wasn’t what anyone would describe as “flamboyant,” but the whole half-innocent / half-ignorant “Is he gay or just European?” jokes were common, if sort of quietly so. For starters, no one was really sure — he was really close friends with a girl on the volleyball team, and a lot of people assumed they might’ve been dating. I didn’t rule it out, but if I’d had to put money down…

And then there was the openly-gay guy I worked with at the student paper. The joke with the rest of us halfwits on the sports staff was, “Yeah, he’s gay, but he knows more about college basketball than anyone we know, so he must be OK.” And he did know more about college hoops than pretty much anyone I’ve ever met; this guy actually spent his spring break one year traveling to a bunch of the small conference tournaments — MAAC, So-Con, whatever — just straight hoop nerd stuff that you had to appreciate. We were cool, and at some point I asked him about John. His response: “Oh, yeah. He’s definitely gay. Everyone in the gay community here knows it.”

So why not come out back then? Why not parlay the popularity and respect he had on campus, and in the community in general? Well, if you’ve ever been to Central Pennsylvania, you might have an idea. Progressive is not a word often associated with this part of the world, which is why a coach like this has total job security around here. (Of course, unlike the men’s teams, hers usually win…) So, I can’t blame John. Maybe at the time even he wasn’t really sure. He might’ve also known that a lot of his charity work — he was actively involved with the Big Brothers program, and he’s been a tireless activist for child welfare — would’ve been looked at differently, which would’ve been an incredible shame. I don’t know. All I know is, he didn’t come out, and no one ever felt compelled to push him out, either.

Anyway, fast-forward: John doesn’t get drafted, then he gets a free agent chance with the Cavs and doesn’t do much with it. Goes to Europe for a couple years, comes back and has a shockingly strong run with the Magic (10.5) in ’99-00. After another year in Orlando, he ended up in Utah, which seemed like a really horrible place for a cultured, liberal, British black guy even if he’d been arrow straight (and even if Jerry Sloan wasn’t ALLEGEDLY a homophobe, which we may be hearing much more about soon.) Then, a brief stint in Houston, and then, dunzo. Last I knew he was back in the UK, where he’s apparently stayed pretty busy with work that’s both socially relevant and focused on helping establish basketball as more than an afterthought to soccer, cricket, rugby and (no joke) darts.

Until sometime last year, I hadn’t seen or talked to John in a while. I always made a point to see him and say what’s up when the Magic or Jazz came to the Garden, and we might’ve traded emails a few times, but that was it. Then, maybe 6 or 8 or 10 months ago, we heard a rumor that espn books was planning to publish his “tell-all” memoir, in which, among other things, he’d come out of the closet. Soon as I heard this, I emailed him telling him I’d heard he had a book coming out, and that I’d heard it was going to be “interesting.” His reponse was intentionally vague enough to neither confirm nor deny anything, and I let it go. And then, this week, the rumors have proven true.

I’d been telling my SLAM co-workers for years that I was pretty sure of this, and plenty of people in basketball circles had an idea. There was just never a way for it to be brough into the light unless John brought it himself. My man Dave Jones, who you might not have heard of because he works in Harrisburg but is, for my money, one of the better college hoops writers in the country, nailed that topic (and a lot more) in a great column today.

Even before the book rumors and that email exchange last year, primarily while he was still in the League, I’d been tempted to ask John if he was gay. I didn’t, I guess, because I don’t know him that well, and because it wouldn’t have been any of my business unless he’d wanted it out there. My thought, I guess, was that any impact it might have would be a lot more powerful if he was still an active player. I also thought it would be a cool article to write. But I never asked, and now we’re all going to be inundated with the worldwide leader’s multimedia coverage for the next few days.

Of course, I’ll watch. As much as I hate that network and its magazine, they’ve got the story, and it’s a story I’m interested in, even have a stake in (who knows, dude might end up on the cover of my new mag before too long…) But after espn’s media blitz, I’m guessing there won’t be much of a shelf life for this story in the U.S. All-Star’s coming up, and then it’ll be time for the playoff push, and basketball fans, SLAM readers in particular, will have a lot more relevant sh*t to talk about than a mediocre ex-player who happens to be gay.

And that’s the thing I’m disappointed about. I’m disappointed I didn’t get to write some big-buzz story while John was still playing, which would’ve raised a lot of issues that would’ve had to be addressed. As it is, a bunch of John’s former teammates and random guys in the League will be asked about this in the next couple days, and most guys, no matter what they actually believe, will be smart enough to give controversy-free answers if they answer at all. But if this had come up while he was still on a roster? There would’ve been drama, and it would’ve been fascinating to watch.

Of course, it probably would’ve been too much to deal with, even for a guy like John, which is probably why he wouldn’t have — couldn’t have — done this while he was in the NBA. And I can only respect that. Hopefully, the next guy who comes out will be a better player, a player kids can identify with, and he’ll find the courage to drop this bomb while he’s still on an active roster. I’m definitely not holding my breath.

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  • H to the izzo

    Great piece good to see this happen,you’ll have to think that there is others now and in the past in the same position as John,I can think of at least five players I have doubts about…….and there’s nothing wrong with darts

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Izzo, if you like darts, you should read London Fields. Great book.
    Also, I just read Chris Sheridan’s piece on espn.com about all this, and at one point, quoting something from Amaechi’s book, it appears that he did/does have a partner named… Ryan. Yeah. Just wanted to make sure I beat Lang and Sam to the punch on that one. It’s not me, for the record, but if you’re entertained by the thought that it might be, hey, go right ahead.

  • H to the izzo

    Darts is a great sport,what other walk of life could a beer bellied-hairy 250 pound guy’s with more tattoos than teeth earn so much money and this is the best part they practice in pubs..brilliant.And there was a post recently about the declining standard of nicknames in the NBA look no further than darts for inspiration on nicknames example Wayne”Hawaii 501″ Mardle and I’ll look out for that book Ryan

  • Oliver

    so thats what was interesting about john amaechi-
    weird how we were talkin about that the other day like 2 columns
    well good luck to the dude i say-

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Good stuff as usual, RJ.

  • dogman

    Fine piece, Ryan. We share the same dream that some day none of this stuff will matter. More probably in your lifetime than mine. I think it may be the very nature of the lower profile player that permits this kind of candor. However, everything you described about John Amaechi suggests he is already a fine role model worthy of admiration and identification from youngsters of all stripes. And in this context courage is a two way street. Rather than hold our breath and wait for a larger bomb, we, as fans and people, need to push for greater tolerance to get over the mountain.

    By the way–you can bet someone’s already working on the movie…Peter Lefcourt’s decent novel, The Dreyfus Affair, concerning a gay major league baseball double play combo is finally seeing production daylight. It’s only taken 15 years…

  • http://slamonline.com mutoni

    dope writeup. (i read an old interview–2003–with mcgrady today, in which he claims that at least 5% of the league is gay.)

  • BETCATS

    There is still coffee to mooch, John Amaechi says

    u couldnt figure it out by then Ryan????

  • whooo!

    That was a great post, and the link to Dave Jones’ column was a very worthwhile read as well. Let’s just hope that all the media blitz and publicity this will receive will prove beneficial rather than negative.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Ben Collins

    Ryan, great read. This is just as important than writing it back then and it’s a perspective that needs to be addressed. Got me antsy to write something important.

    Marcel — in ’00-’01, McGrady and Amaechi started together for the Magic 32 times. Think he knew something we didn’t?

  • SteveSmith rules

    In that same article with T-Mac I think it was with Maxim T-Mac mentioned that he has played with a gay player. It all makes sense now.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Ben Collins

    Something else — could this guy have picked teams in states less welcoming to the homosexual community? Florida? Texas? Utah? Quaker-laden Pennsylvania?

    Really, what are the odds?

  • Boing Dynasty

    Yes, AL,AR,MI,LA, But i see your point.

  • Boing Dynasty

    MS**

  • http://slamonline.com mutoni

    ben, im guessing this isn’t a huge shocker to most people who were around him.

  • Ryan Jones

    Thanks for the feedback, fellas. And Mutoni, to your point: I was at the Penn State-Wisconsin game tonight watching my boys predictably get smoked by Alando & Co., and obviously all this stuff came up among a lot of the OG beat writers, a lot of whom I know from when I was an undergrad. Pretty much to a man, they were all like, “Amaechi is gay… Yeah? And?” No surprise at all.
    Also, a friend of mine emailed me earlier today to remind me of a funny moment that I somehow didn’t think to include in this post: Junior year, 93-94 I think, we beat then No. 7 Purdue at our place, one of the biggest wins in school history, and Amaechi pretty much outplayed Big Dog head to head. Having front row seats with a bunch of my friends from the dorms, we were at the front of the wave of students who rushed the court at the buzzer. And what did I do? I ran straight toward Amaechi and wrapped him in a bear hug. I guess maybe I am gay after all.

  • http://www.myspace.com/russellkeewatin Chief

    So dude is a homosexual, let’s move on. Is he in the hall of fame? No so this seems more about publicity(I’ll wait five years and then come out) whoop dee doo. You gay moving on. It shouldn’t matter anymore, like race doesn’t (or shouldn’t) matter.

  • http://www.myspace.com/russellkeewatin Chief

    He was born gay, so who cares? I was born brown..ang i ain’t writing a book. Why should this matter so much? Is it affecting straight people that a gay man can play a professional sport? If so you need to check yourself into Rehab you homophobe. This is cool and all but i want to see some football players and hockey players come out. Cause they are such manly sports i think people will come to realize that it doesn’t matter if you are gay. We pay them to play, their personal life is theirs as long as they get on the court and play the same game everyone else is playing that is all i ask of them. Word is bond.

  • Tom Jackson

    Ryan: Thanks for the heads-up. I guess this was one part of the new SLAMOnline format I hadn’t figured out. I thought all writer’s posts would be under the NBA category (or whatever category they would be assosciated with). So now I’m caught up on a lot of great posts. BTW, any truth to the rumor that John committed to PSU because he got the traditionally synonomous American terms gay and happy confused? As my man would say, play wit it. Wait, no, let’s not use that phrase on this post. Just think about the metaphor okay. Nevermind.

  • Tom Jackson

    Hey Chief, publicity was my first thought on John’s timing, also. But, actually it would have been better a couple years ago when he was still fresh in some fans minds, for that purpose. After reading Ryan Jones’ post here, if John was that competitive and had that kind of a love for the game, maybe he didn’t want to be stuck wondering “am I out of the league because I came out of the closet or because I really wasn’t good enough anymore?” That could have really weighed on his mind.

  • Harlem_World

    Actually, Chief, Amaechi IS in the Hall Of Fame. So not only is he the first NBA player to come out, he’s the first HALL OF FAME inductee to come out. That he got into the HOF on a technicality (he was the first NBA player to score a bucket in the new millenium) doesn’t really matter, he’s in. And now he’s out. One thing this story has done is made me, for one, do a lil background research on the guy, and to be honest, looking at all he has done for his community and his commitment to worthwhile causes – I’ve got alot of newfound respect for him. Maybe him coming out will draw more attention to all the good work he’s been doing off the court over the years. I say, good luck to him.

  • Tom Jackson

    Good catch on the HOF, Harlem World.

  • 15AM

    one thing to add to this just for information purposes: pete lisicky, who was mentioned in the article from back in ’95, went on to play professionally in europe. last thing i heard had him playing in braunschweig, germany (first division). so the penn state players aren’t so bad, after all …

  • Slobodan Chutzpah

    Nice piece, Ryan. But, but… you seem awfully eager to point out in the comments that you’re not gay. (Like the hug thing – you would never mention, or even remember, it if you had hugged a straight guy.) I know it’s all in good fun and what not, but I’d argue this is part of the whole problem. As long as people keep saying stuff like “It’s okay to be gay, but I AM certainly not one,” it keeps perpetuating the idea that it really does matter (and, ultimately, reflect negatively on you) whether you are or not. Isn’t the point that it should not matter whether you are gay or not, and whether some people may think you are. I know it does matter in societal terms, but my point is that we shouldn’t contribute to that. (And does anyone really have a doubt in their mind as to Sloan being a homophobe? He has my utter respect as a coach, but the guy has “bigot” written all over him.)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Jake Appleman

    Well done. I remember watching Amaechi play with the Magic in 99, thinking he was going to turn out to be a very good player.

  • http://slamonline.com Sam Rubenstein

    Jake, Amechi stole the title of your blog for the name of his book.
    And speaking of NBA players and books, Phil Jackson is the best:
    http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/la-sp-lakerep7feb07,1,7554235.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-nba

  • James

    Ryan: so thats what it was…..

    nice article, really good.

    John can still ball you know, he helped England to a bronze in the last Commonwealth games!

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Slobo: I feel you, and in fact I was conscious of trying not coming off that way — “Hey, it’s not like I’M gay or anything” — and I don’t think I did, but I guess I felt compelled to mention it just as point of fact. Anyway, most of my references to this in the comments here — the fact that his partner and I apparently have the same name, and the oncourt bearhug — were obviously thrown in for the sake of levity. You know, I like the jokes. And in fact, I would ABSOLUTELY remember the hug no matter which way John swung, because the two years that I had those front row seats at old Rec Hall brought me some of my greatest college memories, and John’s play on those teams was a big part of that.

  • Danny Ferry

    Is it just me or does that link to the story about John, where the author(David Jones’) picture look like Colin Farrell with a terrible wig?
    http://www.pennlive.com/columns/patriotnews/jones/index.ssf?/base/columnists/11708115074070.xml&coll=1

  • http://www.slamonline.com Cub Buenning

    I felt the same way, Jake. I always thought he was going to have a long career.
    Ryan, again, nicely done.
    Maybe John should call up Dub-ya’s boy, Haggard, for the number of his shock-therapist.

  • Slobodan Chutzpah

    Fair enough, Ryan. I just felt that had to be addressed a little bit ’cause it’s so prevalent every time this topic comes up. I did realize you were pretty sensitive to these issues and had considered them when writing the piece – which, again, was really balanced. It’s just that, for instance, almost all the players who were asked to comment felt they needed to moderate their PC answer of “I guess it’d be okay to have a gay teammate” with a “as long as he didn’t try to hit on me” or “stayed out of my face with that stuff”. LeBron, for one, referred to the pussy-out clause with regard to him not wanting a gay teammate, saying it was an “issue of trust” in the locker room. Gimme a fuckin break.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Word… one of the Sixers (I think it was Shavlik or Stephen Hunter) said something like “As long as he doesn’t bring that on me.” You know, like it’s a fungus or something. When the majority of NBA players are illuminated about sh*t like this, we’ll have come a LONG way.

    And Danny, I saw Dave Jones last night. It’s his real hair, I promise.

  • http://slamonline.com Ben Osborne

    Great post, Ryan. I think it was so well done that (at least so far), the ignorant comments have been kept to a minimum, which represents a shining moment in Slamonline history…

  • Slobodan Chutzpah

    True dat, Mr Jones.

  • Wizfan

    stop careing about amaechi

  • http://www.slamonline.com Khalid Salaam

    good post jones

  • Nathalie

    honestly, i could care less who is gay and playing with or against me and it wouldn’t make a difference if they were good or not. but i guess that just from being a female….and from florida

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Thanks Ben (and Kha). All this sincerity is kind of unnerving…

  • http://slamonline.com mutoni

    that sucked balls. there, happy?

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    My man! Mutoni, I do believe we’re engaging in edutainment here, no?

  • Reggie Evans

    If Ameachi had come out while he was still playing, I would have been curious too see who would reveal their ignorance – maybe some guy wouldn’t want to play post defense on him? Or maybe I would be surprised by their acceptance? It would have been nice to see some of the players’ and coaches’ true colors, when forced to deal directly (on the court) with an openly gay man.

  • NAS

    Ameachi is a faggot, he came out so he could make some cash, isnt it convenient that he comes out at the same time he has a book out???????

    I’m a homo and I wanna make some cash – bitch ass mutherfucker

    BTW a person is born black, but a person (for the most part with a few exceptions) chooses to be gay – BIG DIFFERENCE

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Ah, yes. Thanks for that, Nas. It was getting way too agreeable in here, what with all the understanding and thoughtful discussion and lack of ignorance. Glad you could join us.
    Nas is like… not smart.

  • Steve Francis/ Cuttino Mobley

    John Amaechi has given us the courage to come out the closet.

  • Cheryl

    Remember when Magic announced his HIV+ status? There was this behind-the-scenes gossip about Magic “swinging both ways” and players who really didn’t want to play with him when he tried to come back. Seems we’ve come a long way from that, but still have a lot of road to cover. I’m glad John’s come out and I’m glad I haven’t heard a whole lot of negative crap about it. Most writers have said “so what?” and you know what? That’s a broad leap from where we were just 10 years ago.

  • Cheryl

    Whoo, wrote that one before Nas’ comments. Gotta be at least one in the bunch or this wouldn’t be America, right??

  • NAS

    And as Malcolm X once said “hating a person because the color of his skin is worse than hating a person because of his religion (or in this case sexual preference), because a person can hide their religion (he was referencing to jews who were also hated on at that time, as a black man its kind of sad as it goes to show you how organized and how hard the jews worked as now they get every single right imaginable but the black man is still stuck in almost the same spot we was in in 1965) but a person can’t hide the color of their skin which means that a person of color is automatically persecuted at birth” the quote was along those lines and im tired of this idiot being in the news he was a crappy player

  • NAS

    everyone wants to say the “correct” thing but thats not the way everyone feels its not wrong to say how you feel, if a homosexual interacted with my i wouldnt have a problem, im pissed off at the fact that they compare themselves to minorities, AND WHY DOES HE HAVE A BOOK OUT IF HE DIDNT SAY IN THE BOOK HE WAS GAY WOULD ANYONE READ IT???????????????????????

  • NAS

    IF KEITH MCLEOD CAME OUT WITH A BOOK WHO THE FUCK WOULD READ IT EXCEPT HIM AND HIS MOMMA??????? (NO DISRESPECT TO KEITH)

  • Bigi

    Nice words God’s Son…Homophobia…Maybe?Ryan,what do you think…?Ilmatic to Gaymatic.Peace.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Gays? Check. Jews? Check. Nas, all that’s left is a demand to put all the women in burqas and we can get you a leadership position in the Taliban. You go, dog!

  • NAS

    what? I JUST GAVE JEWS PROPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    in 1965 they had no rights like african americans (THAT IS A HISTORICAL FACT) and they fought hard and got their rights????? what was wrong with that???
    what the f? everyone is too sensitive

  • NAS

    would you read a book or even care about a john ameachi book if he wasnt gay or hadnt come out of the closet and was just talking about his life ryan – seriously? would it have made ESPN?

  • Bigi

    And Nas,if your girlfriend (or boyfriend!?!) doesen’t wear a scarf all the time just throw acid on her/his face!Because that’s the way the cookie crumbles!!!

  • NAS

    FOR EVERYONE PLEASE LISTEN:
    1. Im not pissed hes gay, he can do WHATEVER he wants, im NOT ANTI-GAY
    2. Im pissed that a BOOK IS ACCOMPANYING HIS REVELATION – COULDNT HE DO AN INTERVIEW AND CALL IT A DAY
    3. IM upset that sexual preference is on par with COLOR OF SKIN, I personally believe being a minority is MORE difficult than being gay and shouldn’t be on equal par

    THATS ALL PEOPLE

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    I think the sensitivity here can be seen in the multiple punctuation marks…

    Nas, tell me something: Do you buy evolution as a theory? And do you think that global warming is probably real? I ask because these are two newsworthy things that the vast majority of scientists who have researched these topics agree on. Another thing scientific consensus tells us is that the vast majority of people who are gay were most likely born that way, and thus didn’t have a choice in the matter.

    So… if gays are a numerical minority (which they are), and there’s a history of them being persecuted and discriminated against and in many cases even beated or killed (which there is), and they’re born this way (which, again, science tell us they probably are), I would say they qualify for minority status. Hence, it’s totally valid to compare their fight to that of an other minority group. Khalid and I had heated (and respectful) discussions about this back in the day, and I made it real clear that I understand it’s not the SAME thing as, say, the fight for black civil rights. But there are similarities, and rationally, I don’t see how you can deny them. What you CAN do is get caught up in fear or ignorance or selective pieces of certain religious beliefs and deny your a** off, but then, that wouldn’t be rational at all.

  • Harlem_World

    He does have a point about ESPN being all over this book though. No way he gets a deal with them if there isn’t some type of sensation that could make news (content) for them for some time to come.

  • Harlem_World

    Richard Jefferson, Cuttino and Stevie and (yes, its possible) Vince, should all come out now, followed by Isiah. That would be interesting…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Cub Buenning

    Doctor NAS, thanks for this clinical diagnosis of any one person’s sexual preferences….

    “but a person (for the most part with a few exceptions) chooses to be gay – BIG DIFFERENCE” What are the exceptions that you speak of?

    You call Ameachi the “gay equivalent” of the N-word, and you’re saying everyone is too sensitive? Or ignorant.

  • ALX8725

    Lebron James should really just keep his mouth shut and actually put more effort into trying to look interested in games. He owes atleast that much to the fans of Cleveland.

    http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1170929106283650.xml&coll=2

  • Marques

    1st: To Chief from earlier: You are not “born” gay.
    2nd: I am not trying to gay bash, but the real reason that there are people who have a problem with the homosexual lifestyle is because they are Christian. There are more Christians than any other faith in this country. And it’s not that a Christian “hates” a homosexual, but they recognize homosexuality as sexual immorality and they consider “the act itself” sinful. But to be totally truthful, sexual immorality is any sexual act not done by a husband (man) and wife (woman). It may seem too black & white with no grey area, but people are not the ones who created these commandments. You may say “Not everyone believes what you do”. But The Bible is the most historically accurate document in the world. Can any other faith say that?

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Damn, Bigi….

    Nas, please check out my man Dave Jones’ column that I linked to above. He addresses the expected criticism that John’s catching from people like you about this only being a money/publicity move. My thing is: Dude doesn’t need the money, and the way he’s lived his life (getting a PhD in psychology, if I’m not mistaken, and donating HUGE chunks of his time and money to helping at-risk youth), I think he should get a pass. Fact is, if he wanted to actually have an impact and tell his story with the intent to help people who might deal with similar sh*t that he’s dealt with, why NOT write a book, publicize it and try to get the word out to as many people as possible?

    As for why anyone (including ESPN) cares, that’s simple: It’s news. No NBA player has ever come out before, and now this one has. News, by any definition. If you don’t care, don’t read it. Ignore it. Whatever. But when you start your first post “Amaechi is a f@ggot,” it kind of kills your whole “I’m not anti-gay” argument.”

    Or put it this way: If a white person had opened a post by saying “You’re a n*gger” and then tried to convince you they weren’t anti-black, I doubt you’d buy it, either.

  • sush carter

    Yeah, Tmac did say he played with a gay player in Orlando…this whole time I thought it was Juwan Howard

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Marques, you’re opening a whole ‘nother can of worms here, my friend…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Cub Buenning

    Ryan, are you sure you’re not teaching a class in Sociology up there in State College, because your most recent post was deep.

    Yes, the book probably exists because of his sexuality. Would a “straight” John Amaechi story sell?

  • NAS

    First of all im all for respectful discussions, so if i got caught up sorry for that the word I used wasn’t called for, Ill give yall that

    I believe that global warming is real but i dont buy into evolution as a theory, Ive opened my mind and heard what scientists said and as a person of faith ive read my religious books and made my personal opinion that i personally dont buy it (everyone is entitled to their own opinion)

    I agree with you on some points with regards to them being beaten and what not because of their life preference which is WRONG on all accounts

    I personally just felt the dude was all about the money and it pissed me off

    However i dont fear what i don’t know and I will agree with you to an extent, ill check out the article ryan – peace to everyone

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Fair play, man. I’m not mad at that.

  • NAS

    I am seriously apologizing for the derogatory term used cuz id be pissed if a white person called me n*gger, i aint backing down from my opinion but when im wrong ill say im wrong and i was wrong on using that term – seriously

    but i stick with my overall opinion – respectfully

  • http://www.slamonline.com Cub Buenning

    The basic tenants of the Christianity that I grew up with were about love and understanding. It just bugs me that religion is often used as an excuse for hatred.
    http://www.slamonline.politicalforum.religiousdiscussions.com is dope.

  • William

    This discussion would then branch out to religion, faith and stuff. Then everyone would have a piece to say about everything and this will go on for days and weeks. Which is why no active NBA player with endorsement potential wouldn’t want to risk it by polarizing the masses.

    Anyway didn’t McGrady said something like “5% of all NBA players are gay” and he saw the evidence in the locker room ? This quote was during the Orlando days I think. And John Amaechi played in Orlando about the same time too!

  • sush carter

    one thing to keep in mind is that despite our country’s self professed value of freedom, we have historically not taken kindly to athletes who have attempted to transcend the boundaries of sports to bring their personal, political, religious, or in this case sexual beliefs to the masses of fans. for instance, muhammad ali stood up for his political views on the vietnam war and was literally and legally kicked out of his sport. mahmoud abdul rauf chose to express his religious beliefs in a certain way and was blackballed out of the nba. athletes who do such things are historically not treated kindly, which might have been why amaechi chose not to take the risk of putting his personal life ahead of his career.

    that being said, my opinion mainstream america is afraid of offending gay people. had amaechi come out during his playing days, he would have undoubtedly received some discriminatory shit talking from fans on the road and might have faced backlash from fellow players.

    however, not a single espn reporter or si journalist would have been able to say anything negative about him because they would be fired. the producers of “will and grace” and “queer eye” have mad clout and for one to think otherwise would be foolish.

    hypothetically, john amaechi might have been called a gay revolutionary had he openly expressed his gayness during his playing career. mahmoud was called un-american and run out of the league for expressing his religious beliefs.

    does this mean we are becoming more socially tolerant in sports, or are we just hypocrites?

  • Pingback: » The Links: John Amaechi, Dikembe vs. Isiah - SLAM ONLINE

  • Chris C

    you know nas, im bisexual, and for a while i thought i was gay, and acted on it.

    i really didnt want to, but its what i felt deep down.

    i never chose it, and came from an upbringing that was really against it.

    so why would i choose it?

    yeh maybe i can easily hide it, but why should i have to?

    you miss the point on this.

    prejudice, is prejudice.

  • Chris C

    hahaha well i came out on slamonline ;)

    guess no one will steal my name anymore :)

  • NAS

    i wasnt saying you should hide it chris, all i was saying is that it is difficult to say that is on the same level as race because you could POTENTIALLY hide it if you wanted to avoid scrutiny, should you be scrutinized – NO but at least you have a choice – thats all man, take care

  • Chris C

    hey np, im just sayin its kind of crazy that if i kissed a guy in public, i could be beaten to death.

    thats all i mean, it may be different that i aint gotta think about it all the time, but it definetly prevents you from living a normal open life in that style.

    and im not mad at ya nas, i still have one mic on my ipod ;)

  • NAS

    thanks for the love man
    Ill send you my new single soon as i finish it :-)

  • Harlem_World

    I posted this on Mutoni’s spot, but its probably better placed over here:
    Chief, discrimination – yes, I totally buy that. On that level you can say race, sexual preference, gender, age (and a whole lot of other things) share the same intolerable prejudice. BUT, I don’t agree that homosexuality and race are totally the same because while I agree that a percentage of gay men/women are certainly born with that way, there is also undeniably a significant percentage of currently gay men/women who are that way through choice. Look at bi-sexuals, for example. They choose to participate in that, but couldn’t say they are genetically NOT attracted to the opposite sex. Where I’m going with this is, I’ve come up with guys who have had sex with a whole lot of women from all races, backgrounds etc – and for a couple of them, they truly feel they have ‘done all there is to do’ with women and have experimented with men to ‘try something different’. This, even in their opinion, is a choice. My point is, no matter who you are, you don’t get to choose the color of your skin. So in that sense, I think there are some major differences between race and homosexuality. (End of paper).

  • Bhard63

    how come i have never herd of this gay dude until now?

  • http://slamonline.com Jared

    I was watching espn this morning and heard some of the interview with Amaechi. I heard his voice and could tell right away he was gay.

  • Shiz

    Bhard63: ummm…cuz he sucked…absolutely no pun intended…

  • Shiz

    I always knew Ameachi was a bit different, but I always figured it was cuz he was from the UK and just didn’t like basketball like that. I always felt that he was a bit too high-brow, or maybe cultured is a better word, for the rest of the league…
    At the end of his playing days in the L, he’d interview and have this face like the guy from those old Careerbuilder commercials, just trying to get through the morning meeting while dealing with all those monkey-jagoff’s he worked with.

    Who knew?…well, I guess Tmac knew…maybe a couple other people did too…Its really not that important to me, though, cuz as I so eloquently put it in my last post, he was no game changer…

    Now, when Magic dropped his bomb, it was such a blow to me, I think my mind just retreated into itself…That whole day felt like a bad dream. I just kept drifting through the day, waiting for them to be like “pysch ya mind!” but…they never did…it felt like a president died that I actually cared about…

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    True enough, Shiz. At risk of overstating, Magic’s HIV announcement felt like our generation’s equivalent of our parents/grandparents hearing that JFK got shot. No one died, but it sure felt like it that day.

  • Shiz

    No you’re not overstating…I was stuck on stupid…just mute..my parents were worried I’d had a mild aneurysm… It really felt like the whole world had gone silent

  • Slobodan Chutzpah

    It renewes one’s belief in humanity a little bit that most people on a sports discussion board (which, let’s face it, generally aren’t the most tolerant of environments) are able to converse on a topic like this in such a sensible, thoughtful manner. And even the guy that at first seemed to embody the response everyone seemed to be expecting kind of came around and even apologised for his language. Awww… Crossing bridges, coming together and all that s**t. Makes me proud like a father.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Cub Buenning

    I still have the cover of that day’s Denver Post (i was a highschooler then)that had a picture of the Laker star at his press conference.
    The Headline read- MAGIC: I HAVE AIDS.

    Ironic, that to my knowledge, he has yet to ever even have AIDS, rather is a carrier of HIV. We were all so ignorant back then.

    Word to Slobodan! Like Bob said, “One Love.”

  • Dan

    As an aspiring journalist myself, I can understand that Farmer Jones would not shy away, and in fact regret not having the opportunity to cover a story of such magnitude, but to be honest I think you shouldn’t feel this way. This isn’t just a news story, this is a man’s life. Perhaps I misunderstood the message of this article, but I feel as though you are standing behind John Amaechi, but also having a slight ill-will towards him, for reasons mentioned in your story. Certain things just stand-out to me in your story that are objectifying John Amaechi as a homosexual rather than a “hoops-head” just like you and I. I say, who cares if you didn’t cover the story. This was probably a rather difficult thing for him to parlay to readers around the world, and I feel as though we should all commend his courageous efforts rather than show a slight distaste for not having the opportunity to write about it. This was his story to tell, not a PSU classmate’s. Although I will commend you, Farmer Jones, for discussing the possibility of future star athletes to follow suit with John Amaechi by showing children that the ideals held by certain political figures on the subject of sexual preference should not be held in such high regard.

  • 1hush D

    Great column. Cannot remember the last time I actually read all of the posts on a thread this long. Shout out to RJ, Chief, Slobo…wisdom. One quick comment going way back to TomJ is that the midwest may be intolerant but Quakers certainly are not. As for sexuality, I think nature and nurture, not just nurture (lifestyle choice). And someone tell LeBron to relax. Nudity is just our birthday. Sexual preference does not turn it into a violation of trust. I would not expect anything better from someone willing to drive a hummer.

    This post did remind me of a friend who I grew up with who came out years ago. I told him not so long ago that I knew he was “different” than me when we were kids and we were all playing basketball and he would not just play basketball (no interest) but would wrestle and giggle with another friend on our block, who also came out of the closet years later. I was making an assumption that it was because the two of them were gay that they had no interest in focusing on ball that day.

    I guess Amaechi throws that presupposition back in my face. It sounds like he loves the game. Just when you think you are shedding your own bigotted chains, you find another one pulling you down. I guess I have not dropped my own stereotype that gay men would prefer decorating over sports and dancing over basketball. Hope I didn’t offend him with it at the time.

    Great discussion all of you!

    Whitey on the moon

  • http://www.myspace.com/russellkeewatin Chief

    Man i don’t care what anyone says I went to a school in Edmonton called Victoria Composite school for the Performing and Visual Arts. I did my time played ball and acted. Along the way i met so very flamboyant men. The school is very tolerant of people’s choices in life and i took some getting used to. Upon getting to know these people i began to understand that hey, they are exactly like us. WOW. I’d always been okay with Gay people but never meet any of them really. Now i never meet any of them who could ball but am sure that at least some of them can. Just like some white guys can ball. eg: Jason Williams (this is a joke for all you sensitive people out there)
    The point is when people are tolerant of other people’s choices in life the tension goes away and you can learn to accept people for what they are…themselves. Is that not essentially what happened in the 1960s? Did white people realize that all their preconceptions of black people were unfounded? That is what is happening now that Gay people are coming out(pardon the pun) to the rest of society. What they are is not wrong and straight America and Canada has to learn that. As far as i am concerned John Ameachi is a hero among men.
    Anyone else who thinks otherwise will have to deal with my arrows! Word is bond boys!

  • 1hush D

    Damn. Charles and Kenny are complaining about Amaechi’s timing with the book deal. Those two would benefit if they would read this site – I think RJ nailed it with Amaechi’s social activism and philanthropy. We get great analysis from those two and I think they are funny but damn they are thick headed. Chuck should have stuck to his initial interview comments. Somebody order Charles and Kenny up some edutainment.

  • Ryan Jones

    Dan, journalism is for suckers. If you’re smart you’ll go into computer programming or used-car sales or Internet porn. Don’t say I never did anything nice for you.

    And to your point… I don’t disagree with you, and I was kind of trying to imply (too subtly, maybe) that of COURSE it was selfish of me to be “disappointed” that John came out with this now, and that I was bummed I wasn’t the one to help break the story. This being a blog/column (blogumn?) from my perspective, I obviously take the liberty of making it personal when the subject demands. But John has nothing less than my complete support here, which hopefully the other 98 percent of this column makes clear.

  • Ryan Jones

    And yeah, Hush, I’ve been disappointed by some of the NBA responses, most notable Chuck and Kenny (I wonder what sort of timing they would’ve been OK with? Or maybe Chuck just doesn’t like competition in the overweight ex-baller-turned-author category…) and, dare I say it, even my man bron. The implication of “trust” being an issue here is horsesh*t. For once, kid’s showing his age.

  • http://www.myspace.com/russellkeewatin Chief

    yeah Lebron not using his mind when he made that comment.

  • JOE

    HE’S COMING OUT RIGHT BEFORE HIS BOOK DOES???????????? HMMMMMMMMMM!

  • http://slamonline.com mutoni

    i thought chuck and kenny were spot on with their comments. you have to admit, it does look a tad shady that he’s coming out in an espn-sponsored book. look, i respect the guy for coming out, but the more i think about it, the more obvious it becomes that is more about the $ than anything else.

  • Paniscus

    Marcel, even his choice of timing for is coming out is to sell his book, so what? I don’t criticize Slam for accepting advertising money from companies that use sweatshops, even though I probably should. No offense to you guys, but everyone’s looking to get paid on at least some level. At least John Amaechi is a also a proven philanthropist and a serious volunteer. I’m mostly just fed up with Barkley. Dude has some good insights, but for someone that vehemently defends his right to throw his money away gambling I think it’s hypocritical to criticize someone else for trying to make some. Seriously, go pimp yourself out to T-Mobile and shut the f*ck up.

  • Brian

    There’s already an active Gay player in the NBA, and his first name is Rudy.

  • Harlem_World

    As I said, unless this is a ‘name names’ type of tabloid book where he gets into calling out big name players (which just doesn’t seem his style) you have to wonder why ESPN would be backing this with their own money. But as Paniscus rightly said, Charles Barkley is in NO position to say shit about someone else taking advantage of a media opportunity to make some green. Barkley, probably more than any other player in history, gets the ‘pass’ on just about everything, from everyone. He can pretty much say what he wants without fear of media/fan recourse. Hey, maybe he should run for president?

  • Drolfe

    Man, what a long thread this is. Someone said earlier hopefully in about 75 years this would just be a non-issue.. i really hope its that close. But were headed in the right direction. Most the comments on here are more or less in the correct light.
    What’s funny is most people’s immediate reaction is ‘whos gives a sh*t?’, but its still an interesting story that generates a bunch of interest, evidenced by the swarm of comments here.
    I think the people saying he’s coming out just to sell books are a little off… i mean, isnt the book primarily about being a gay professional athlete? It’s like a book about someone climbing Mount Everest. You dont say ‘oh he’s only going around telling people about it to see books’. He experienced it, its an interesting situation, and he’s written a book. Its not like he wrote a book about being a shitty back up centre in the NBA and came out just before its release.. you know?

  • underscore

    Anyone who’s known or at least met Amaechi (I have on a couple occasions when we were at PSU) knows he’s not doing this for money or attention or revenge or anything like that. He lives his life to help others. Surely, this is part of that cause, not any others.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    100th!

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones
  • Nathalie

    RYAN! lol that was great! i didn’t even read past the first paragraph lol

  • 1hush D

    Colbert beat you to the gay sheep story (last week).
    Isn’t Amaechi coming out (to the public) in his book…not a publicists press release? Could he have just written a book and now is getting pimped (perhaps willingly) by the publicists? Maybe not, but I too don’t care if he is working the publicity corner.
    I am surprised and pleased to hear most of the pundits (excluding Chuck and Kenny) defending gays…that is the biggest surprise for me.
    As for Barkley, Kenny always kills him in ball analysis and I am not going to laugh at any of Barkley’s “ugly girl” jokes anymore…I’ll only laugh at his self-deprecating stuff and when Baveta kicks his ass.

  • 1hush D

    in fairness, Chuck downplayed being gay, and playing ball with gays and said it was no big deal. He and Kenny only went after the timing.

    When does Amaechi get a nickname? He is in the HOF. sorry, could not resist.

  • http://www.myspace.com/russellkeewatin Chief

    Cool Story ryan!

  • yann blavec

    don’t you think gilbert arenas is a kinsey 0 ?

  • Harlem_World

    Gay SHEEP?!! Incredible. I thought animals only had sex to procreate! This opens up a whole new train of thought. So animals basically have sex for the pleasure too? And taking it a step further, some people say eating the meat of a stressed animal (when its killed) actually has effects on the brain…could eating Gay goats effect sexuality? (Okay, i’m reaching, but hey, its Friday and I only have to make up a few more hours and I’m outta here!!)

  • Dan

    I understand what you are trying to say, which is why I ackowledged your support for John Amaechi. Although your comment about not being a journalist threw me off ever so slightly. I love reading your articles, and to sound as respectable as possible, you are a factor in my pursuit of journalism. Although I can’t afford a subsription up front, thanks to outrageous university costs, I always go to the local newsstand to piick-up the latest issue of Slam. Help me out Jonesy! ! ! Do you truly believe it’s such a bad thing?!?!?!

  • Shiz

    Im with Chuck an Kenny on this one…Who cares? really. I think the question they assumed when saying that was “if he weren’t coming out with a book, would his sexuality even be an issue?” I mean its not like this guy is constantly bombarded by paperazzi. Its the “if a tree falls in the forest” question. Its definitely a publicity thing…ESPN has been whoring itself out to any willing athlete for years. What makes this book, this topic, and this guy so monumental and life altering?

    Kenny and Chuck have both said that they’ve both played with gay players and Chuck played with Doc, Moses an nem…So thats a long time, through which Im sure a FEW gay players have come and gone, so what makes this such a big deal?
    Maybe its the fact that he always had beef wit Jerry Sloan and now he’s trying to throw him under a bus. I don’t think that Amaechi’s a necessarily spiteful guy, but I do think he’s kinda an elitist. thinking himself so “socially knowledgeable” that he looks down his nose at the others of his profession. I wonder if his book is gonna be just a NBA bash fest or if he’s actually gonna acknowledge the opportunities basketball gave him, cuz without ball to give him the money to do his little ventures, he’d just be John Amaechi, the big gay guy from Penn St. University, District Sales Manager of [fill in franchise]…
    Using one’s “celebrity” status to address social climate is one thing, but just to use it to gripe and say things today you didn’t have the heart to say in front of say…your ex- coach is another…
    I mean lets really look at this…When Etan came out with that eloquent blog about his incident with the ref, people got so pissy it was insane…But as soon as someone comes out, just cuz they’ve been in front of a camera, people act like they’re hero’s or some shit (cough, cough Ellen anyone?)…
    No, this is just a regular dude…that happens to be gay and like Chuck said, “I..REALLY…don’t care”…I’ll be too busy reading Kareem’s book “On the shoulders of giants” anyway…yeah, thats right, stories from a REAL hoops hero with some relevance to society in America as a whole, not simply singling out one group, or team, or coach (cough, cough, Jerry Sloan”)…Not a “whoa-is-me-Im-the-minority-among-minorities” story I couldn’t care less about…cuz noone forced this guy to play ball… Unless there’s some real trial or tribulation he had to go through, I’ll just wait for the SLAM book review..Until then, you can keep “Big John Stud” and his book…Keep speakin the truth Chuck!! Im witcha!!

  • Shiz

    I’d much rather read about gay sheep than John Amaechi…not hatin…just sayin…

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Just f*cking with you, Dan. Do your thing.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Shiz, it’s totally cool if you think the topic’s not interesting or newsworthy (though I heartily disagree).

    However, I think if you did know more about John, by reading this book or any other means, you’d most likely learn that A) he’s had a pretty interesting life by any defintion — mixed-race parents, raised essentially by a single-mother, grew up in two different countries, and developed from an unathletic fat kid to an NBA player, AND is the first NBA player from his country, AND is the first player to come out, all of which makes for a pretty interesting story, I’d say — and that B) in fact he wouldn’t be a district sales manager, but probably a practicing psychologist or something, because PhD has nothing to do with hoops.

    Anyway, you kind of killed any respect I might have had for your argument with your tossed-off “little ventures” crack. Say all you want about how he’s cashing in with this, but dude is doing actual, tangible work — including spending his own cash and his own time (LOTS of both, in fact) — to actually help kids who need it. This isn’t some save-the-whales bumper-sticker bullshit; he’s having an active, positive, first-hand impact in the lives of real human beings. I haven’t done anything close to that today. Have you?

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    I mean “bullsh*t.” Sorry, kids.

  • Shiz

    Ryan: by little ventures I meant whatever he is doing that I don’t know about cuz I a) haven’t read the book and b) don’t know anything about ya boy…so fall back…didn’t mean to ruffle ya tailfeathers.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Oh, and Shiz, on the socially elitist tip and the whole looking-down-his- nose-at-other-ballplayers thing: Having spent a lot of time with a lot of ballplayers, I can tell you that they are, generally speaking, a pretty incredibly socially isolated — and therefore ignorant — group. Most of them can’t help it, so I tend to give the benefit of the doubt, but it’s not even up for argument. Well-read, socially conscious cats like Etan and Nash are DEFINITELY in the minority. If John comes off that way, you may find it offputting, but please understand it’s probably valid.

  • Shiz

    Its like this wit me: hats off to JA for doin his thing, just dont sign me up for the John Amaechi parade committee. I wasn’t dissin ya homie, but whatever to each his own.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Never that. Just enjoying the dialogue, homie.

  • Shiz

    ryan: my elitist comment comes from the fact that he just seemed to have this air about him that suggested he’d rather eat glass than talk about the game, which is fine, but if you work at IBM, can you really get THAT mad when guys only wanna talk about servers?
    I just felt like he should have either shit or got off the pot a couple years earlier. No biggie though, just my opinion.. No need to defend with tooth and nail…

  • Shiz

    And just for the record: you and I are in complete agreement that 90% of the League is dumb as rocks…Thats including Billy Hunter an nem…

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    He can’t help sounding elitist. He’s English.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Anyway Shiz, don’ t you know I’m just trying to up my hits? I’m like Moses (or was it Dawkins?) who used to miss on purpose to pad their rebounding stats. Shameless!

  • Marcel Mutoni

    this whole thing’s pretty gay

  • dogman

    For those interested in a brilliant, touching AND sometimes hilarious look inside a pro clubhouse dealing with a star player’s homosexuality –may i recommend or remind anyone with an inclination of Richard Greenberg’s excellent play, “Take Me Out”. I think it ran for 2 + years off and on Broadway and took home a locker room full of awards. It’s got every point of view under one roof (from neanderthal to enlightened) and features a star player of mixed race (in the Derek Jeter mold) who deals with his sexual identity crisis during the heat of a pennant race. From what i’ve seen of the NBA player response to JA’s forthcoming book–Greenberg’s play should be required viewing for at least some who graduated with, shall we say, less than honors…if they graduated at all.

  • Shiz

    Dogman: so…was this star player based on A-rod? Its A-rod, isn’t it? Yup…gotta be A-rod…
    Ryan: both of them dudes used to pad rebounding stats. Pad away amigo

  • http://www.slamonline.com Khalid Salaam

    I missed it, what did charles, kenny and lebron say??

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Bron’s comments are available in the AP stories about all this that came out Wednesday adn yesterday. Chuck and Kenny I heard/read second hand. Various levels of ignorance, I guess I’d say.

  • http://slamonline.com Lang Whitaker

    Ryan, I assume you’re covering all this for the Penn State alumni magazine? Got to be the biggest story involving a Penn State grad this year, unless Barbaro went there.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    It’s in discussion, yeah. Biggest story is debatable, though, only because of anything involving football is bigger by default, and Joe did get his leg snapped on national TV.

  • http://slamonline.com Sam Rubenstein

    and there was that penn state football player that stabbed someone 93 times. And Larry Johnson broke the record for rushing attempts before disappearing in the playoffs, Lavaar Arrington snitched on the NFLPA calling it mafia-like, and the Kerry Collins actually started games ahead of Vince Young.
    If you need story ideas.

  • Ryan Jones

    Sam, did Penn State used to date your girlfriend or something?

  • Ryan Jones

    Anyway, are you bitter because your college didn’t have enough students to field a football team?

  • Ryan Jones

    Or because Larry Johnson isn’t a really weird twin who’s more interested in being on Fox News than playing football?

  • Ryan Jones

    Or because players unions in pro sports really ARE bastions of brotherhood and good intent, and Lavar got it all wrong?

  • Ryan Jones

    Or because Kerry Collins actually got your crappy franchise to a Super Bowl, which is more than your current halfwit karaoke piece of sh*t QB will ever do?

  • Ryan Jones

    I mean, I’m just asking.

  • BETCATS

    it was always kind of odvudous. I really think this is a dumbass story, dude is a fruit and want to make money from it. Wel tat wold be a fisrt for a Penn State Grad. HA HA

  • Ryan Jones

    Well played, BET. Especially the part where you said “Wel tat wold.”

  • BETCATS

    ha ha ha Ryan well played. Expseccially when u wrote There is still coffee to mooch, John Amaechi says

  • Ryan Jones

    Got me there.

  • Coach Mommy

    Isn’t “odvudous” pronounced backwards the name of a Phil Collins song?

  • BETCATS

    well that just made my black history moth a hel of a lot bettr. I am gonna writ a book called: Negro beats ex Slam edtior in a play wit word.

    And if i misspelled anything donot blam me, i could finsh high school for the same problm. Teachers would bul shit me about my bad spellin so i just droped out.

  • Ryan Jones

    Oh, sorry. that was a typo. I meant to say, “Got me here,” as in, “My sh*tty writing in college still got me to this point, where I’m essentially getting paid to write on this blog and you’re not.” Ha ha ha ha haha hahahahahah…. hmmm.

  • 1hush D

    Khalid,
    You asked what Kenny, Charles and LeBron said and I can sum it up like this…
    Bron basicly represented all athletic uncomfortable hetero 21 year olds and said, we can’t trust you if you don’t tell us and I don’t want to undress in front of you if you are gay so tell me now. While not as dumb as the “don’t bring your gayness on me” comments made, it was disappointing.

    Charles was initially spot on when asked and said it doesn’t matter whether you are gay or not – period.
    But after Charles and Kenny got together on it they bitched about how it was an attempt to pimp his book which if you read all of these threads you would see that RJ successfully defended because even if it is, we like guys who are social activists and philanthropists to get money so they can help out our families and citizens.

    Who was spot on overall other than RJ? former teammate Grant Hill who said not only should we support fellow gay athletes but props to JA who is making it easier for gay athletes to feel more comfortable with themselves. This is a story about tolerance and that BETCATS is why it matters. Because today, in a society that frequently shows its intolerance of gays, fat people and people of color, stories of tolerance help us evolve! And that is the update, the true word and another hit for RJ who was kind enough to get this discussion rolling. Wish you were not leaving.

    D

  • Ryan Jones

    WORD. And I’m still around homie. Thanks.

  • BETCATS

    Touche Ryan Touche

  • Slobodan Chutzpah

    And of course the inimitable Mr Cubes has his own take on the subject. Good man.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2762656

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Just f*ckin with you. As always.

    Anyway, I think this thread is just about worn out, but I did find one more link that makes some great points:

    http://www.mcall.com/sports/basketball/all-bkn-amaechifeb12,0,5958355.story?coll=all-sportsmorehoops-hed

    Like LBJ’s comments about trust — I wonder if he has any problem “trusting” teammates who cheat on their wives?

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones

    Cubes can own my team any time.

  • http://slamonline.com mutoni

    nobody in the nba cheats!

  • 1hush D

    Yeah, this thread would be worn out but for Tim Hardaway on Amaechi…”it ain’t right” “I hate gay people” and more. Thank you Mr. Hardaway for demonstrating why Amaechi coming out is an issue. Now it is your turn Tim.

  • http://slamonline.com Ryan Jones
  • BETCATS

    1hush D says:
    Yeah, this thread would be worn out but for Tim Hardaway on Amaechi…”it ain’t right” “I hate gay people” and more. Thank you Mr. Hardaway for demonstrating why Amaechi coming out is an issue. Now it is your turn Tim

    this just shows us all the british have ruined america

  • bif

    scott irwin

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