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Friday, January 29th, 2010 at 9:00 am  |  86 responses

The Post Up: Close Ones

Thursdays are the best!

by Holly MacKenzie / @stackmack

Great, great, great Thursday night of games.

The Raptors defeated the Knicks 106-104 in New York, despite falling behind by 16 in the first half on the second night of a back to back. Clawing back to trail by four at the break, Toronto battled against the Knicks throughout the fourth, with the lead switching sides until the final seconds. While Jarrett Jack missed a free throw that would have put the Raptors up three, he was the one to step in to take the charge on a Harrington drive as the clock expired.

I was surprised that the final play of a game was a charging call against the Knicks.

I was shocked to see Hedo Turkoglu finish with 26 points, 11 rebounds and three dunks. If you’re on Twitter you’ll know what I mean when I say, #ball. In Hedo’s postgame interview when he was asked why he was effective offensively, he simply says “ball.” When the interviewer repeats him, he says he doesn’t have anything else to say. He meant he was effective because he had the ball, but meh. Dude has had the ball quite a bit this season, so I’m not buying that. Also, having the ball doesn’t suddenly make you jump up and grab rebounds. I’m just happy he finally had a great game for the Raptors. He had the free throws against the Lakers to get the win and appears to be building on it. Here’s to hoping it continues.

Now, David Lee was showing everyone why he should be on that All-Star list of reserves. He was also fouling the hell out of Bosh as he scored 29 points to go with 18 rebounds. He was a beast. Bosh just happened to outbeast him when it mattered, going hard to the hoop for a bucket down the stretch.

In Orlando, the Magic came back from 11 down to start the fourth and got the W as Rashard Lewis waited, waited, waited and waited some more before driving to the hoop and getting the layup with 1.3 seconds to go. On the C’s final possession of the game they were unable to get the ball into the hands of Ray Allen and Sheed was forced to take a three at the buzzer that was an ugly, ugly airball. Magic win, 96-94.

It was kind of sad and a little painful watching Lewis blow by KG on the baseline. It served as a reminder that he’s not as young as he used to be. I know he would probably want to rip my head off if he was reading this, but it’s true. And it sucks.

With 41 seconds on the clock, JJ Redick came up big, tying the game with a 3-pointer and a miss from Ray Allen from deep set up the Lewis lay in. And even that excitement couldn’t get Mrs. Doc Rivers to pay attention to the game. You guys see her sitting in the stands with her book?

In Phoenix, Jason Terry said the Suns can’t play defense during his halftime interview and then the Suns came out in the second half with some grit, hanging on to get the 111-106 victory. While Amar’e had 22 points, Nash had 19 points and 11 assists.

He was balling down the stretch.

Dirk had 19 for the Mavs and Jason Terry scored 21 in the loss. It was a huge win for the Suns against the best road team in the Western Conference.

Thoughts are with Grant Hill’s father who was taken to the hospital during the game for “precautionary reasons” after he was not feeling well.

What were your thoughts on the All Star reserves? I know Lee got snubbed, but besides that how do you think they shook out? I’m just so happy Gerald Wallace made the team. I’m also so happy Stephen Jackson has had such a great impact on that team since the trade.

Someone ripped Bargnani for averaging 6.4 rebounds per game yesterday as a center. I’ll remind everyone that All-Star Amar’e Stoudemire is averaging 8.1 boards per game on a team where he is the main rebounder (no Chris Bosh alongside him) as a player who plays under the basket. Bargnani’s average of 6.4 needs to go up, but it’s not that despicable, considering where/how he plays.

If you could only name one Hawks player and one Boston player to the All Star game, who would it be? I think Josh Smith would be my Hawks pick and he didn’t even make it. You know Rondo’s my Celtics pick.

Thoughts on the good, the bad and the snubbed?

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  • serevei

    First

  • serevei

    Bogut… that is all

  • floe

    i find myself disagreeing to almost everything on this post.

  • T-Money

    So… because Amar’e is soft on the boards it makes it OK for Bargs to avg 6.4? Amar’e constantly gets killed for his rebounding avg and his defense and that’s the reason why he’s not a max player. Bargs needs to man up.

  • Milan

    Goran Dragic!

  • jumpman3224

    Did the Suns actually win on TNT last night?! Also, I love when the Magic where the throwbacks. REVENGE OF PENNY HARDAWAY!

  • vtrobot

    a lot of very good players got snubbed. but i don’t think there’s many players going who don’t deserve to. talented league. forget about the “all-star” game, bring on the playoffs.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Amare’ one rebound. Pathetic. Lee should be an all star but I understand team record hurts. Not as much as chris duhon hurts bit it still hurts. I have to say I never in my life thought JJ Redick would be better than Adam Morrison at any point in their careers.

  • jumpman3224

    cosign @vtrobot. Billups and Lee stand out the most as snubs, but its not like there are guys going that don’t deserve it. You could obviously argue for Lee over Horford, because statistically Lee is far superior. But, a lot of times team record plays into reserve selection.

  • iLL wiLL

    JSmoove and DLee got snubbed.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    Congratulations to Barn-nanny, on averaging 6 rebounds as a center. God I hate that guy… just ONE game PLEASE close your mouth. That is all I am asking. He is the main reason the Raps are sometimes hard to watch.
    David Lee, I feel for that guy man. Hopefully the knicks start building a solid team next year, or he goes to a contender… or makes a team a contender.

  • T-Money

    Oh and KG is old. Both teams actually looked bad last night. Who would have thought that of all the summer acquistions, the Shaq one would be the one that has fulfilled its promises so far? Jefferson, Carter, Artest and Sheed are all playing below expectations.

  • jumpman3224

    KG does look old. There was at least twice when he couldnt covert appearingly simple alley oops. One in the 3rd Quarter he missed…bad.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    T-money… Shaq hasn’t really worked out at all. Two seasons ago the Cavs beat the Lakers twice. last year the Lakers beat the Cavs twice. This year the Cavs beat the lakers twice. The lakers and Cavs have the same record. Boston is two games behind the Cavs. How is it that no one has fulfilled promises. The spurs are a top team, Boston is a top team, the Lakers are a top team. All the teams have gotten stronger. So there are less wins to be gathered this year. Shaq has had a few good games, nothing crazy, same with Artest and Sheed, and Jefferson, and Jefferson has probably been the most consistent. If Shaq is the only one that has worked… then why was last year a better year for the Cavs?

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    James the balla, richard jefferson has been consistently mediocre at best. Come on now. Everyone thought that Sheed was going to be 6th man of the year, and that Jefferson was gonna make the Spurs favorites and neither has happened. And if Artest was as good as he was supposed to the Lakers would have like 5 losses.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Shaq on the other hand has helped against the magic and the Lakers (so far) and that’s what he was brought in to do. He wasn’t brought in to put up 20 and 10 or even 15 and 8. He was brought in to be a big body and enforcer and that’s exactly what he’s been doing.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    Jefferson being on a great team like the spurs… who thought he was going to be avg. 20-5-5? And Artest, being the 5th guy in the o basically…maybe 4th… why would he be avg. high numbers? I just don’t get how the Cavs are so effing strong with the same record as the Lakers. But the lakers, and Spurs and Celtics are so weak lol. Artest wasn’t brought in to be an enforcer for the Lakers? Really? I could have sworn that’s what they brought him in for … hmmm. Well if the Cavs 36-11 record is so much better then the lakers 35-11 record then I must be punch drunk. And the Celtics in the playoffs are going to be a lot scarier then the Cavs in the playoffs. Hope Shaq can enforce his self towards the 3 point line to try and guard a shooter. Or at least guard a pick and roll for once.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Wow so you’re one of those people that argues against a point nobody tried to make. Like : nobody said Jefferson would be 20 5 and 5 since HE’S NEVER BEEN THAT BEFORE IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER. No one said anything about numbers and stats actually and nobody said anything about whose record was better. Individually Artest and Jefferson are struggling to be effective and so is Sheed. Shaq is playing the role he was brought in to play and is not making any waves. The only persons numbers I will throw out are sheed’s 29 percent from 3 while taking 5 a game as a 6’11 guy with his post game is ridiculous. But I’m sure you’ll come up with some other ridiculous argument that has no relavance to what I’m saying to try and sound smart. I’ll wait.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    *clears throat*
    Thanks for waiting.
    Okay…well you are saying that no one has fulfilled promises except Shaq.
    So with Sheed, do the other teams centers not have to guard him on the 3 point line? Make or miss he is drawing a big player like Shaq out there …
    Does jefferson not give the spurs an extra threat that can do everything offensively and actually play D. So what you are saying is with Shaq it isn’t about numbers … but Sheed and Jefferson it is about numbers?

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Sheed is about numbers. Again I did not say Jefferson is about numbers. He clearly has trouble fitting in and if you can’t see that I guess you should take balla out of your name because you obviously know sh*t about ball. Whatever you’re right james the numbers are the only things that matter in basketball. Shaq not having big games is proof that the other signings were just as effective maybe moreso.

  • A.

    Artest was brought in to stop guys like LeBron from doing whatever they wanted. Not the case at all. Jefferson was brought in to add a scoring punch for when the Spurs’ offense became stagnant. Not the case. Sheed was brought in to replace Garnett in case he missed time due to injury. He replaced him, yes, but not positively. When he’s on, the C’s are a dangerous team. But that happens once every 20 games. Shaq was brought in to bother the bigs who played against the Cavs. And he’s done a fine job.

  • T-Money

    James is very, very dense. It’s not about numbers bur roles. Cavs didn’t need Shaq to be 1st in the East and sometimes they’re better with him off the floor. He’s there for Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol, Andrew Bynum, Kendrick Perkins and Kevin Garnett. That’s it. That’s where the list stops. And so far, he has done an excellent job against them. Artest, on the other hand, got his a– handed to him by Bron (twice) and Melo. I’m curious to see what he does against Pierce.

  • http://www.slamonline.com MooButter

    Agreed. Shaq has done exactly what he was supposed to do. C’s, Magic, Spurs, all are worse off than they were last year, at least at this point. Lakers signed Artest to stop Lebron and came up empty handed…twice. Oh, theres also the fact that the Cavs schedule was frontloaded with road games and back to backs. The lakers played 75% of their games at home so far. After the Cavs Lakers game last week, the Cavs road record was 17-8. The Lakers were 10-8. We’ll see who keeps their pace up for the rest of the season. We all know by now to just ignore James the Balla. He loves all things Kobe and hates all things Lebron. It boggles my mind how some people can’t seem to just appreciate both.

  • http://www.slamonline.com MooButter

    Oh, and Paul Pierce is a B*tch.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    Do the Spurs have a better record then last year?
    Anyways… we will see in the playoffs. Last year the Cavs had the MVP, Coach of the year, best record in the NBA. But nothing past that.
    If the Cavs and the Spurs picked their nose, people would say the Cavs went further up and found more gold. I think that Shaq, Jefferson, Sheed, Artest, and Vice have all been not so great. But it’s hard when all of those teams have SO much fire power. Shaq is not doing that good of a job, or like you said about Artest, the Cavs would have 4/5 losses. The best pick up was Jamal… now that worked wonders!! I think that the pick up by all the big teams have been mediocre at best. But they still provide mental and physical toughness. Like Artest, and Shaq, Sheed makes the center guard the 3. What it boils down too, are two things. Your record to get into the playoffs… and how you perform in the playoffs!! We will see what acquisition pays off come playoff time.
    Bron will be MVP and will be trying to lead his team with Shaq stopping other teams big men, Kobe will be a lying, snivelling punk who sucks at basketball but will try and go for a championship and we will see if Artest can add toughness. Kg and Pierce will hopefully stay healthy and see if Sheed steps up like he usually does in the playoffs (except for his last years with the Pistons). Spurs will look for Jefferson to be the park they need to top the Lakers… but right now… 44/46 games into the season. With the Cavs and lakers having the same record. No sense in saying that the Cavs are so strong with Shaq and everyone else has not fulfilled promises.
    Oh and about the debate, that is what this site does. We talk about non sense lol. You know this Bryan. Sh1t.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com DP

    Love seeing Sheed fail. Love seeing Nash do the nasty last night. play wit it.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com DP

    Love seeing Sheed fail. Love seeing Nash do the nasty to the Mavs. play wit it.

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    I love Lebron actually, just the last couple years he has become very hard to like.
    How is it that the Lakers defence in number one in the NBA… who knows if Lebron when he dropped 37 on Artest that if Ariza was guarding him that night he would have dropped 54 … So if the Cavs road record is so good, what is their home record? And what is there total record? lol didn’t the Cavs have a crazy home record last year with only two losses? How did that work out again?
    The top 6 teams in the west can win the ship this year with a good run, and the top 3/4 teams can win it in the East. All the teams at the top this year are fat… but I don’t see how the Cavs record, worse then last years, is so great. I don’t see it. The Cavs and Lakers will be lucky this year to even hit 60 wins. With maybe only one of them doing it.

  • T-Money

    Who cares about their overall record? Watch the games. Last year the Cavs got 66 wins by never slipping against average team even though they didn’t fare well against the good ones. This year, they have an excellent record against elite teams. And it’s not even just about winning and losing but matchups. The matchup advantages that Orlando had are gone. Shaq can body up 1vs1 against Dwight and Turk is not there for the pick n roll (jameer and vince are not as good to run the p’n'r).

  • T-Money

    Who cares about their overall record? Watch the games. Last year the Cavs got 66 wins by never slipping against average team even though they didn’t fare well against the good ones. This year, they have an excellent record against elite teams. And it’s not even just about winning and losing but matchups. The matchup advantages that Orlando had are gone. Shaq can body up 1vs1 against Dwight and Turk is not there for the pick n roll (jameer and vince are not as good to run the p’n'r).

  • T-Money

    The only unknown about the Cavs is: is Mo Williams ready to step up this time? I’m still not 100$% convinced that he is a reliable 2nd option. If the Cavs add a 18-20 ppg guy at the deadline, it’s over. It doesn’t even matter what position he plays, he could be a 2 or a 4: Jamison, STAT, Kevin Martin, Iggy, David West. I’m not sure that Troy Murphy is such an upgrade though.

  • letsmotor

    was Shard blowing by KG a reminder of KG’s age? maybe a little. but let’s not forget that KG’s knee, while it may not be hurting him any longer, is not at full strength and capability (did you see that brace??!!). come playoff time, KG’s in tip top condition and he either forces Shard out of bounds or swats the shit out of that shot.

  • http://www.slamonline.com MooButter

    You’re right, record doesn’t really matter. However, if we’re talking about who’s having the better year so far, it is a logical factor. Especially when your making the arguement that they have the same record. One has played a difficult schedule, one has played an easy schedule. You can act like the regular season doesn’t matter all you want, but last year when the Lakers swept the cavs in the regular season, I didn’t have high hopes if we met up in the finals. I’ll admit it, I was worried. We din’t get there any way so it didn’t matter, but I refuse to believe the Cav’s wins this year don’t have Lakers fans a little uneasy.

  • LA Huey

    T-Money, gotta agree with all you said there (‘cept for K-Mart or Iggy). Last year, the Cavs just seemed like an regular season juggernaut that was constructed to only beat weak teams and Boston come playoff time. This year, their roster gives them the flexibility to matchup with any team and take any elite squad to 7 games.

  • Frank

    The best pickup of the season has been the raptors getting reggie evans. He hasn’t even played yet and he’s still the funnest raptor to watch.

  • http://slamonline.com tina

    As a Laker fan i am very worried that the Lakers didn’t pull off at least 1 win against the Cavs. Heck i was worried last year when i found out that the Lakers would face Orlando in the finals (Orlando swept the Lakers too). There’s something just off in the way the Lakers are playing right now, hopefully they can fine tune themselves after the allstar break

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    So basically lol… the record of 36-11, is stronger then a Lakers 36-11 … if they win tonight in Philly?
    Tina, fully agree. I was calling Lakers in 6 against the Cavs though. The Lakers haven’t been playing right except for the last two games. And I think a big reason is because phil is fu(king around with a lot of the teams. And he is resting Kobe at weird times of the game to start getting the bench involved more. That’s why we have seen, Mbenga, Sasha, and Adam out there a little bit. It’s not a tight rotation. 10/11 guys every night are playing basically. Some nights Artest has 20 minutes, other nights he is playing 32. When the playoffs roll around it will be back to a tight rotation.
    I love Mo Williams and West to be honest. West has always been a great player in my mind, I love left handed shooters who can get their own shot!! Mo can definitely average 20 a game and same with West i think. But how many guys can you add with Mo, West, Williams getting time now, parker and Moon …
    The next two weeks is going to be huge for teams. I am hoping the Lakers grab Harris from the NETS!!! : D!!!

  • http://www.slamonline.com James the Balla

    Just want to put it out there that the last couple games, where Kobe hasn’t been playing injured .. 27.3 points, 9.6 rebounds and 8.0 assists in three games while shooting 53.7 percent. In about 36 minutes of play. Good numbers!!

  • http://raptorsrevelry.blogspot.com/ Aaron

    The empathy being shown for David Lee is tiring. He’s good no doubt, but Josh Smith was the real snub as an all star and most people don’t even see that.

    One of the most explosive, unique and productive players in the league and dude is still kept in the dark.

  • T-Money

    David Lee is overrated. The Hawks would never trade him for Al Horfor, ever. Shoot, the Cavs would not trade him for Andy V either and he’s no all-star. Big men that can’t defend have to be supremely talented offensive player to get away with it (e.g., STAT or Z-Bo).

  • T-Money

    The Raptors never trade Lee for Bargs too while the Knicks would do that in a heartbeat. Ditto with Noah, Chicago would not do it. So how good is he, really?

  • LA Huey

    About David Lee, we know his snub is just an example of sportswriters pandering to New York and conservative white fans. I’d love to have the dude on my team but would not trade him straight up for any of the guys T-Money just mentioned. Well, maybe Bargs.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    if you people look at all the other people on the all star team you quickly realize david lee was not snubbed. considering there is not 1 player on the all star team with a losing record

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    You guys are morons. He plays with CHRIS DUHON if he had a real point guard he’d be putting up 25 and 12. Ridiculous the hate on this guy. Just ridiculous. His defense is bad but sh*t 19.5 points and 11.7 rebounds and almost 3.4 assists including 20 ,12 and 5 over the last month please get that man some respect.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    LA Huey, David Lee not being on the All Star team is a result of the coaches voting that he does not belong there. it has nothing to do with any media at all. – bryan i ain’t hatin on him, im just saying if you look at the situation with logic, it makes a lot of sense that david lee didn’t make it

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Nbk I was talking other people here. I conceded it was a record thing its people saying he’s not better than this or that.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    fa sho, i agree then 100%

  • T-Money

    David Lee is not a better player than any of the reserves that made it.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Oh that’s a great point t money thank you for repeating that it all makes sense now. I finally agree.

  • LA Huey

    @nbk, my bad. I was talking about the outcry over his perceived snubbing. He’s not an All-Star when you compare him to actual reserves that made it.

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    When Greg Oden comes back, I really feel bad for whomever he’s dunking on. That’s gonna be one big facial.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Bargnani is getting quite good right now. Ya’ll needs to chill. He’s not as stable as he should be, but he’ll be All-Star caliber in a few years. Yeah, I said it.
    He’s actually POSTING UP now, too. Its clear he’s developing his post game now, and he’s already playing with his back to the basket more than young Dirk was.
    Also, its misleading to call Bargnani the center… He’s more of a power forward.. And Bosh is a great rebounder playing beside him. I know, that’s not an excuse, but 6 rpg right now isn’t the worst thing for the team.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    David Lee is playing better than Al Horford, Gerald Wallace, AND Paul Pierce. What are you talking about T-Money?

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    The only knock on Lee’s game is defense. But his scoring and rebounding are great. His skills ARE good–he can shoot the J, catch in the lane, and finish with both hands. He’s actually been ambidextrous since birth, which is a huge bonus. He’s one of the best big men in the league at running the pick and roll, and his point guard is Chris Duhon–not exactly Steve Nash or Rajon Rondo. So don’t give me that “his numbers are inflated” business. David Lee has a soft touch from pretty much anywhere inside the arc, AND he’s very athletic. He works harder than most players and he isn’t afraid to body up and get physical in the paint. He can also post up when he needs to.
    Again, Lee was CLEARLY shafted by the coaches this time around. That’s bull.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Teddy – you think his argument is based off of logic, or some weird combination of trade value and potential? my guess is the latter, which means your not gonna get a good answer

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Just to throw something out:
    Bryan is wrong to say Shaq is doing ‘exactly what he was brought in for.’ If you think Shaq was brought in to sit fourth quarters, I have a bridge to sell you. The Cavaliers just have no offensive schemes except “hand the ball to Lebron” so it’s just easier to sit Shaq.
    James is wrong saying Artest guarded Lebron better than Ariza. Artest was getting murdered hardcore. Artest has been more of a disappointment than Shaq, because unlike the Cavs who have pieces to replace Shaq when he’s sitting, there is no good replacement for Artest (Odom is better when he’s at the four).

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    And I’ve always hated on David Lee, saying his numbers were a bit inflated, but this year he’s impressed me. He’s no longer getting clean tip-ins or dunks, he’s driving off the baseline, taking jumpers, his spin moves are less mechanical and more to the flow of the game. I mean, he’s worked on his offense HARDCORE. His defense is still suspect, but if you watch some Knicks games, you realize it has improved ever so slightly. And because his game has moved farther away from the basket, his passing has naturally improved with it.
    So yeah, I think Lee really deserved an all-star bid. I think it was taken away when Pierce was undeservingly given a bid… that meant a center had to be picked, and Atlanta only had one all-star, so they took Hoford. If people realized Pierce sucked hard, J-Smooth would have been picked and Lee coulda been in it.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    what was shaq brought in for exactly? i thought it was to help defend dwight howard in the playoffs. and thats the only reason

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    NBK: If that was the case, Shaq wouldn’t even be in the games against Golden State and Phoenix. He was brought in to yes, a) defend one-on-one against larger defenders
    BUT
    b) to provide help defense and provide blocks down low (people just run picks and rolls and switch him and get easy baskets)
    c) to provide firepower from the post and take double teams away from Lebron (they go to the post early to give him a few freebies, but they immediately shy away from it from the second quarter on because he takes away any tempo the game has and usually misses. I can count on my hands how many times I’ve seen Shaq double teamed)
    d) Leadership (hohum….)
    Now, I’m not saying Shaq has been a failure— he’s taking being benched in stride, which actually, to me, makes Shaq more of a complete player because he is doing what the team needs to win. He’s also altering his offense, getting around the defender for clean dunks instead of just trying to post all-the-damn-time. But he certainly isn’t accomplishing what he came into do. Doing ONE thing well doesn’t mean you were worth the acquisition.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    i would have thought after what he did to phx’s offensive tempo cleveland would realize that when they signed him (it actually seems like they knew that all along considering as you said, they don’t go to him after the 1st quarter). To me Shaq is doing exactly what I expected him to do. especially w/out the phx medical staff

  • buschfire

    BOSH IS A MACHINE!!!

  • chingy

    Teddy-the-Bear knows what he’s talking about

  • chingy

    and for all who are saying shaq hasn’t done what he was signed to do, let’s just wait for the playoffs cus that’s when it really matters

  • http://raptorsrevelry.blogspot.com/ Aaron

    I say Shaq will foul out at least twice in any given series, while averaging 10 and 6. People like to hold onto his glory days though, I understand. I’m just lookin forward to his entertainment in Dallas next month…kind of like a road clown.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Well I think I was 100% right so far today.

  • http://www.luketynan.blogspot.com therighttoremainsalient

    Could Amare look anymore tradeable than yesterdays DALMAV – PHX game? dude gets one rebound, is so lax on D they play Dudley, Lois and deep fryer ahead of him (actually even grant hill was all hustle and earl brought it as did Goran)… I can see amare being trade for 2 players (preferably one scoring type C/PF and a rebounding guy) and the suns getting a whole lot better STRAIGHT AWAY.

  • J-Ro

    Other off season moves not mentioned above that have helped their teams respectively; arron afflalo, drew gooden, earl watson, matt barnes, andre miller, channing frye, and Jarret Jack.

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    Jukai, I am disappoint. What then, in your opinion, was Shaq brought in to do? Get 30 touches? He’s obviously fading but he’s making use of his abilities the best way he can, and it’s pretty damn effective against the elite teams. His biggest negative is lack of speed and perimeter D, but he still looks faster than Zydrunas “3-Second Late Reaction” Ilgauskas.
    He was brought in for D in the paint and instant post offense (also, he gets a lot of 5′s and 4′s in foul trouble early). Dude straight bullies most centers 1-on-1. That’s all he needs to do in the playoffs, period.
    And that’s the bottom like cause Stone Cold said so.

  • http://fdskjlf.com Jukai

    Anton, my man, I know you can read, so perhaps you simply missed when I listed what Shaq was brought into do and what Shaq has not done. He really HASN’T brought any D outside of hard fouls on players who may or may not have deserved it. They are a worse defensive team. And he has been awful in his post offense.
    Now, he IS doing a great job of fronting cats like Perkins, Howard, and Bynum, so that was the most important reason eh was brought in and he’s accomplishing that. But to say Shaq is ‘doing exactly what he was brought into do’ is an exaggeration hardcore. They expected him to put up his Phoenix numbers. There was many expectations that Lebron would get a secondary scorer. That ain’t exactly happened. Remotely.

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    There is no way that the Cavs expected him to be the 2nd scorer, especially with monitoring minues, sharing them with Z, and resting him altogether.
    In the playoffs, Shaq Daddy will put down the krispy kremes and drop 30 and 10 on fools.

  • wassup

    ball

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Anton: They were hoping he was gonna jump right out of Phoenix and drop 20-10 off the bat bro. You sure as hell know that’s what that dolt Mike Brown thought, he more or less said it. Shaq has been a disappointment in the post (getting owned by Joakim Noah?) the same way Artest has been disappointing in the triangle, Jefferson has been disappointing in the half-court, and Rasheed has been a disappointment uhm… doing anything.

  • itaigruss

    word to big bird ^

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    How do you know what they were hoping for? (Mike Brown doesn’t count, I don’t care what he’s hoping for unless it was an offensive playbook). Most fans were comfortable with 12 and 8, with a big impact in big games, which he has done. But I know where you’re coming from, he misses a lot of shots he used to make. His defense is pretty much flagrant fouls but it’s effective (ask Dwight and Pau). For me, to define “total failure” is he is a non-factor in big games. Take Orlando, now that they didn’t have to double Howard in vain, everyone stayed home on the shooters so overall defense goes up tenfold. I’m sure there were some people who thought he could still go 18 and 8 (playing 30+ minutes) but I never thought it was realistic on a contender. Bottom line, they got him for the playoffs and he’s been important vs. elites this season (as opposed to Cavs winning 66 but losing vs. elites last season).

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    no mention of amare sitting the whole fourth quarter? that was kinda weird. jj redick has become a very nice nba player. he plays good d, passes well, plays team ball, and of course hits shots. i knew hed be better than adam, who is trash. 3rd pick? hahahahahaha

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    So not used to Anton discussing ball at length. It’s usually a funny one liner and au revoir. Nice. Watching yesterday’s BOS-ORL game, i noticed Gortat, White Choco and JJ playing large chunks of the 4th (with Gortat playing most of the 3rd & 4th) and that group along with a very energetic Lewis and an unstoppable Howard made the comeback happen. All this with Nelson, Pietrus, VC (who threw the ball away when he subbed in late) on the bench. If Orlando figures their ish out, they will be DANGEROUS in tge playoffs. That twin tower lineup picked the C’s apart and stopped easy forays to the hoop.

  • Vince5

    Ball

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Anton: I never said total failure, I said disappointment. He has been effective in SOME games but other games he’s more effective when he’s sitting on the bench. He hasn’t made the Cavaliers worse, per say, but having a shooter like Sasha and a team-defense guy like Wallace certainly wouldn’t hurt. Parker has been a bit underwhelming.
    And c’mon, I’m a Cavs fan, I know plenty of Cavs fans. They were still hoping Shaq was gonna be drawing double teams and fouling out the entire center lineup of opposing teams.

  • Lazaruz

    Someone explain to me how Horford is better than Bogut.

  • therighttoremainsalient

    @LAzaruz – I suppose I could make something up… but it woulnd’t really be plausible. Like so many comments on here.

  • therighttoremainsalient

    note to self: PHX actually play gritty Defense on every play when Goran Tragic and the Bench Boys from the Badlands take to the floor…

  • Jon

    You guys gotta be joking. All this arguements over nothing. The Nuggets are gonna strike gold this year. Their play has been very very solid despite losing Melo for so many games and Billups/K-Mart got some games too. Watch out.

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    Lol yeah let’s bring Sasha and the corpse of Ben Wallace back (though his corpse looks stragely animated back in Detroit). C’mon son, you’re better than that.
    And I thought you were a Suns fan?

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Anton: Suns are my favorite team. Cavs are second. Hornets are third but only cause of Paul.

    I liked Sasha better than Parker, that is for DAMN sure. So what, Parker is better on the inside, Sasha is a better 3-point shooter and just as good of a defender. Why do they need Parker to drive? They have Mo and Lebron. Wallace was great for the Cavs, he just couldn’t do crap against Howard.
    I mean, they won 66 games with those guys. It’s hard to argue they weren’t good members of the Cavaliers.

  • T-Money

    66 games don’t mean anything if you don’t match up well with teams you have to beat to win a title. Ben couldn’t defend Howard or the trees from LA so he had to go. Look at Shaq’s splits, he’s rounding into shape shooting 60%+ in January. Shaq > Ben, Parker > Sasha, Moon > Wally, Powe > Joe Beast.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    T-Money: Shaq > Ben, Sasha > Parker.
    Wally is better than Moon, but well, Wally’s gone through his third leg surgery and probably can’t move right now. Joe Beast is probably better than Powe because POWE ISN’T PLAYING.
    Shaq is shooting 60% in January because he’s facing up and getting easy dunks from Lebron passes. They’ve gone away from him posting up.

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