Friday, October 2nd, 2009 at 8:00 am  |  100 responses

Top 50: Joe Johnson, no. 20

The definitive ranking of the NBA’s best players.

by Lang Whitaker

It’s impossible for a Hawks fan to understate the importance of Joe Johnson. Simply: Dude IS the Hawks. Josh Smith is nice, Marvin Williams and Al Horford have improved, Bibby can still knock down jumpers, but everything revolves around Joe Johnson. Even the franchise. EsJoe Johnsonpecially the Franchise.

Don’t forget, it was just four years ago that then-Hawks GM Billy Knight, with free agent dough burning a hole in his pockets, decided to splash his cash on JJ, a restricted free agent with the Suns. BK was so determined not to miss out on Joe that he was willing to work a sign-and-trade with Phoenix, giving them a couple of first-rounders and Boris Diaw. This made one of the owners so angry that he ended up suing all the rest of the owners (and giving us one of the greatest photos of all-time). This mess dragged on for four years, until recently a judge ruled in favor of the remaining Hawks owners.

That entire time, while Judge Wapner tried to figure out a ruling, we had Joe Johnson, who has proven himself over and over again as being completely worth the trouble. Without Joe, the Hawks aren’t the fourth-best team in the Eastern Conference. Simple.

It’s hard to remember, but at the time, signing Joe to a huge contract was considered a questionable move by the Hawks. Joe was coming off a nice season in Phoenix, but the Suns didn’t want to pay him, and most people thought Joe was largely a product of the Suns’ system. As Josh Smith once told me: “I didn’t know how good Joe was until he came on the team. Then I was like, I don’t care what nobody says, this dude is worth whatever money they paid him.”

Joe’s stats as a Hawk are tremendous: He’s played 82, 82 and 79 games over the last four years. He was sixth, second, second and third in the NBA in minutes. He has totaled more points and more assists than any other player on the Hawks each of the last four seasons. He’s averaged at least 20 points per game every season as a Hawk. The last three seasons, the coaches in the Eastern Conference have selected Joe Johnson as an All-Star.

The first play of every game, the Hawks run a pin-down for Joe. Like clockwork. At the end of every game, the ball is always in Joe’s hands. He’s rarely flashy, just steady. He’ll cross you over, pull up and drain the J. Whenever the ball leaves his hands to go to a teammate, it’s a little unsettling.

Is Joe Johnson the 20th best player in the NBA? At least. He’s the best player on one of the 8 best teams in the NBA. Without Joe Johnson, the Hawks aren’t what they are right now. For better and for worse. It is what it is.

Some of you may disagree. But I’ll disagree with you. And I’m right.

After Joe’s first season in Atlanta, I asked Mike Woodson about JJ. “He’s been blessed,” Woodson said. “Surely you have to give him credit because he works on his game — this guy is a gym rat — but he’s been blessed. Hell, I was a player in the League; all I could do was score the ball. If I could rebound, defend and do all the things he does? At 6-7? Well, it’s beautiful to watch.”

I know, Coach. I know.

Notes
• Rankings are based solely on projected ’09-10 performance.
• Contributors to this list include: Jake Appleman, Brett Ballantini, Russ Bengtson, Toney Blare, Shannon Booher, Myles Brown, Franklyn Calle, Gregory Dole, Emry DowningHall, Jonathan Evans, Adam Fleischer, Jeff Fox, Sherman Johnson, Aaron Kaplowitz, John Krolik, Holly MacKenzie, Ryne Nelson, Chris O’Leary, Ben Osborne, Alan Paul, Susan Price, Sam Rubenstein, Khalid Salaam, Kye Stephenson, Adam Sweeney, Vincent Thomas, Tzvi Twersky, Justin Walsh, Joey Whelan, Eric Woodyard, and Nima Zarrabi.
• Want more of the SLAMonline Top 50? Check out the archive.

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  • andre Posted: Oct.2 at 8:14 am
    one of the FIRST!

  • K.a. Posted: Oct.2 at 8:15 am
    first! JJ is nice but I’ll take me a pachulia jersey.

  • K.a. Posted: Oct.2 at 8:16 am
    dammit. Shoulda just typed first.

  • andre Posted: Oct.2 at 8:17 am
    Hey, lucky me.
    “some of you may disagree. But I’ll disagree with you. And I’m right.” Do you mind if I steal this? Its beautiful. And a nice article on JJ. Whats the story with that photo? Some of us (still) don’t follow the Hawks…

  • Blinguo Posted: Oct.2 at 8:17 am
    Joe Jo-Knows, free agency is coming.
    Which is the last topic of the Sekou Smith Hawks blog for all your ATL basketball news.

  • Simon S.Y Lawy Posted: Oct.2 at 8:19 am
    He’s the best player on one of the 8 best teams in the NBA ??? Hawks …

  • Blinguo Posted: Oct.2 at 8:20 am
    Lang dropped a youtube in the top 50, nobody else got one of those, right? Next year we’ll need a youtube of DRose vs Nash or something, in the vein of DRose vs Andre Miller to put out the fire of that argument before it happens.

  • Simon S.Y Lawy Posted: Oct.2 at 8:21 am
    Top 3 SG …

  • arthur Posted: Oct.2 at 8:26 am
    Too low

  • Blinguo Posted: Oct.2 at 8:26 am
    Powe stepping on the Jordan XXIII PE of Joe in the clip wasn’t as bad as Andre Miller’s legs refusing to work anymore after DRose did him dirty.

  • jcoll Posted: Oct.2 at 8:37 am
    JJ should be higher.
    I’m thinking around 12. Maybe not top 10 yet

  • Ken Posted: Oct.2 at 8:40 am
    I’m comfortable with JJ around #20. But I really hope this means D.Rose didn’t make the list. Rose is gonna be nice, but certainly not top 20 in the league next year.

  • rog123 Posted: Oct.2 at 8:43 am
    Enough about rose already. Come on now, his name has not even appeared on the list yet that’s all some people wanna talk about.

  • Lang Whitaker Posted: Oct.2 at 8:45 am
    If Derrick Rose is better than Joe Johnson, then I am, too.

  • DP Posted: Oct.2 at 8:49 am
    So smooth with his game. Slick Rick of the NBA. play wit it.

  • mumadone Posted: Oct.2 at 8:53 am
    ”He’s played 82, 82 and 79 games over the last four years.”…..so…..he sat out one year?

  • Michael Posted: Oct.2 at 9:02 am
    these guys love to pick and choose their criteria…if we accept the extremely loose argument that the hawks were one of the best 8 teams last year, how does that translate into this ranking given that these are based on upcoming projections??? JJ is a decent player, maybe somehwere between 20 – 30 is a good spot but i dont buy the best player on of the best 8 teams argument

  • Dagomar Posted: Oct.2 at 9:04 am
    Rose did not make the top 50, which is about right as he’s coming off his rookie season. JJ’s placement is about right, maybe a little low.

  • Hussman25 Posted: Oct.2 at 9:05 am
    Silky describes his game… so smooth! 20 is acceptable, could be a lil higher, but well see as the list unfolds…

  • minikidd Posted: Oct.2 at 9:16 am
    So you guys think SLAM included OJ Mayo, but not the R.O.Y.? hmmm, naah I don’t think so…

  • tavoris Posted: Oct.2 at 9:17 am
    Dagomar, Rose is definitely on the list…and when he appears, Apocalypse will begin. Back to Joe…good spot.

  • Co Co Posted: Oct.2 at 9:23 am
    I can’t believe you told all the other teams the Hawks first play of every game!!!!! Darn you Lang! Funny enough that’s also the play they run every three trips up the court.

  • Blinguo Posted: Oct.2 at 9:25 am
    That note about coming off the rookie season just reminded me Brandon Roy was in the Rookie Vs Sophomores game and the Sunday All Star game the same year, bumping off Deron/Baron (Roy All Star again last year, Deron not). And if anyone is going to do that again, next season -that unnamed Rookie of the Year- would be the one to do it. And now I’m done talking about Rose.

  • neaorin Posted: Oct.2 at 9:59 am
    Dear SLAM crew, In retrospect, giving Russ the admin password to the site so he can move things around might not have been the best thing to do. PS: I hate Derrick Rose right now, I don’t care how good he is.

  • neaorin Posted: Oct.2 at 10:02 am
    And JJ got robbed. He should be top 15.

  • Hussman25 Posted: Oct.2 at 10:08 am
    This list is becoming a little unpredictable??? OJ in the top 20? Probably… but deserved? Up for debate…

  • Furious Posted: Oct.2 at 10:13 am
    How high is Derrick Rose going to be! This is getting ridiculous

  • Hussman25 Posted: Oct.2 at 10:13 am
    The top 20 should now be including mostly all-stars, so anyone who is not an all-star and gets in the top 20 from this point on is “suspect”…

  • josh Posted: Oct.2 at 10:16 am
    Simon S.Y Lawy Posted: Oct.2 at 8:21 am
    Top 3 SG … ……………. Nope, he is top 4-5. Kobe, Dwade, Roy, JJ, Manu Roy is better than jj, by quite a bit.

  • andre Posted: Oct.2 at 10:16 am
    Is Rose better than Joe? Probably not (yet). Will Rose have a bigger influence on his team and the league this season? Definately. Without Gordon, Rose can te the ball and distribute, will have gaudy numbers, and will likely be an allstar. JJ is sick (and slick), but plays on a loaded team with plenty of firepower. He goes down, Atlanta will be alright. Not (cough) top eight, but alright. No Rose in Chicago means no hope in Chicago…

  • Lang Whitaker Posted: Oct.2 at 10:23 am
    Derrick Rose is going to be a top 20 player…in 2-3 years.

  • Tzvi Twersky Posted: Oct.2 at 10:30 am
    Why the hell did the Celtics trade him during his rookie season? That one still hurts.

  • Orlando Woolridge Posted: Oct.2 at 10:30 am
    Its starting to piss me off that people need to mention Rose after every one of these posts. I’m a huge Bulls fan and I love Rose, but damn, I’m going to have to stop reading the comments if I want to sustain that love. Joe Johnson is just sick and I think you’d have to be missing something to rank Rose ahead of him at this point no matter what the criteria are.

  • tavoris Posted: Oct.2 at 10:34 am
    Tzvi, it was because he wasn’t gonna EVER get any minutes playing behind Pierce.

  • Simon S.Y Lawy Posted: Oct.2 at 10:46 am
    Lang just said, in 2-3 years …
    so, no D-Rose …

  • Furious Posted: Oct.2 at 10:46 am
    After reading 270 comments on the Nash post about Rose vs Nash, I would be SO happy if Rose doesnt even make it.

  • josh Posted: Oct.2 at 10:54 am
    rose = overrated

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 10:56 am
    I’ve joined the Derrick Rose might be a bit too high bandwagaon. Just saying. Rose is coming up within the next few picks, I promise.

  • niQ Posted: Oct.2 at 10:57 am
    I don’t know if everyone realizes but, JJ is not goign to sign an extension with the Hawks. (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=rotowire-oeohnsonntersontract&prov=rotowire&type=fantasy) So, your claim that JJ IS THE HAWKS might not be valid next year..

  • The D Train Posted: Oct.2 at 10:58 am
    I believe Russ has said that Rose will be on the list. If based on last years performance, you couldn’t include Agent Zero, B-Diddy or Iverson over him (amongst others). If you base it on what’s to come this year, you can’t have dudes like Rashard Lewis, Josh Howard or Ben Gordon on there without Rose. I LOVE Derrick Rose. I don’t know that he’s a top 20 guy yet, but at the same time he’s got to be in the top 3-4 PGs in the game, right? And isn’t being the floor general a pretty important spot? That being said, maybe Slam should xnay posts with the words “Derrick” or “Rose” in them until he does arrive on the list. That way he’s not hijacking every single ranking…cats like JJ need some love too.

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 11:09 am
    I’m a Joe fan. Top five shooting guard in the league.

  • burnt_chicken Posted: Oct.2 at 11:14 am
    as Lang is my favourite SLAM writer, non-Bengston division, I cringe at pointing out that perhaps no atlanta hawks fan can OVERstate the importance of JJ. In fact, a Hawks fan can UNDERstate his importance.
    Example: “JJ? Meh. He’s no Marv.” ugh. i feel like the nerdiest stoolrat now…

  • Sparker Posted: Oct.2 at 11:31 am
    what i love about joe is his personality

  • Brad Long Posted: Oct.2 at 11:33 am
    I don’t understand Lang saying 2-3 years on Rose. Rose is a legit Top 5 pg in the league right now…possibly top 3. He’s on the list people, just accept it.

  • T Money Posted: Oct.2 at 11:34 am
    @andre: Please read what you just wrote and then tell me if it makes sense.

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 11:34 am
    Brad, everybody for SLAM cast votes. Obviously Lang didn’t include Rose in his top 20. But more than enough folks did. I wonder where Russ ranked him.

  • Teddy-the-Bear Posted: Oct.2 at 11:39 am
    This is getting comical. Derrick Rose ahead of Joe Johnson. I half-expect Iverson to reappear at 19.

  • Teddy-the-Bear Posted: Oct.2 at 11:44 am
    @ B. Long: Ummm Tony Parker, Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Chauncey Billups, Steve Nash, Jameer Nelson, Gilbert Arenas (well, he’s combo but plays 1), and Rajon Rondo (you could definitely argue). Even Aaron Brooks gives Rose a run for his money. So no, Rose is not top 5 just yet.

  • Teddy-the-Bear Posted: Oct.2 at 11:50 am
    But he definitely will be, that’s no question.

  • Klav Posted: Oct.2 at 11:53 am
    I’m in. Just caught up with the post from yesterday…WOW. I guess everybody figured out what I said about kobesbestfriend last week. And uhhh, the Reggie thing on a Danny Granger post, I found it suspect that there were 160+ comments on Danny G.

  • Lang Whitaker Posted: Oct.2 at 11:58 am
    FWIW, here’s my top 5 point guards right now: CP3, Deron, Tony P, Chauncey, Rondo. Nash, Rose, Kidd and Devin Harris are somewhere after them. If healthy, Gilbert and Baron should be in the mix, too. Rose shot 22 pct on 3s last year and only averaged 3 FTs a game. He’s got a ways to go. But what do I know?

  • Clark Posted: Oct.2 at 11:58 am
    I agree. Will Rose be a top 5 or top 3 pg? Probably. But right now, I’d take Chauncy, CP3, DWill, Nash, Tony Parker, easily ahead of this guy, based solely on how productive I think they will be next season. So there are my top 5.

  • PANAGIOTIS VASILOPOULOS Posted: Oct.2 at 11:59 am
    @every body wondering on the D.Rose ranking…: i got three words for you “EXPECTED STATISTICAL PRODUCTION”. The SLAM lists have most often a “fantasy league/video game” mentality which is respectable having in mind the target market(anybody remembering the shaq alltime ranking..??i will never forget it)…Joe is a really good-complete player that is rightfully ranked here. This guy can be great anywhere (unlike leapers like Iggy, Howard, Josh, etc).

  • tavoris Posted: Oct.2 at 12:15 pm
    hmm…a certain poster’s writing style is giving me a case of de’ja vu. Thoughts anyone?

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 12:24 pm
    He’s baaaaaaack!

  • Klav Posted: Oct.2 at 12:34 pm
    ________ Returns…And just for a fact, the Hawks – JJ = no playoffs. Who on their team is a solid enough creator for them? Williams? Bibby? Smith? Maybe Crawford but would he really do that? Watching the Hawks this year just got THAT more interesting. Could the Hawks really make playoffs with Crawford instead of JJ?

  • dial up Posted: Oct.2 at 12:54 pm
    D-rose has almost as bad as d as nash, hence why rondo averaged a trip doub against him. You really think rondo would average a trip doub against Nash??? I think not.

  • niQ Posted: Oct.2 at 12:57 pm
    Did anyone read my first post? JJ did not sign the extension. So there IS a possibility that the Hawks might not be in his plans for the future.

  • Jackie Moon Posted: Oct.2 at 1:08 pm
    I like to watch Joe Johnson play.

  • LexLuther Posted: Oct.2 at 1:26 pm
    LOL everyone needs to hop off DRose’s sack. He’s definitely on the list, he has to be because he, reigning rookie of the year, has more of an impact on his playoff-bound team as well as the league than OJ Mayo does. DRose’s name hasn’t appeared on the list yet stop hating on his game and show some love for the fellas who have been named

  • Ryne Nelson Posted: Oct.2 at 2:15 pm
    Joe Johnson’s very good. And Jackie Moon is very right.

  • Russ Bengtson Posted: Oct.2 at 2:25 pm
    I’ll gladly post my entire list provided every other person who voted does as well.

  • PANAGIOTIS VASILOPOULOS Posted: Oct.2 at 2:27 pm
    Jackie Moon is my favorite poster in SLAM.(hope this doesn’t get you into trouble pal…)

  • niQ Posted: Oct.2 at 2:29 pm
    @Russ. That’s an awesome idea!

  • PANAGIOTIS VASILOPOULOS Posted: Oct.2 at 2:30 pm
    i’ll post mine even if i didn’t vote!!!! (and it will be a world list list, not just NBA…)

  • dutch Rob Posted: Oct.2 at 2:42 pm
    ill take cool Joe over Rose anyday
    JJ can even play PG and play it well

  • Justin Walsh Posted: Oct.2 at 2:45 pm
    Russ, I’d gladly provide my list as well. I’m totally open with the whole accountability mantra.

  • Myles Brown Posted: Oct.2 at 2:50 pm
    Joe Johnson is going to look great in a Wolves uniform next year.

  • Myles Brown Posted: Oct.2 at 2:52 pm
    And Id like to personally apologize to Joe-and Lang-for forgetting to put him on my list.

  • PANAGIOTIS VASILOPOULOS Posted: Oct.2 at 2:54 pm
    cool M.J story provided by another Johnson (Eddie)…
    http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/johnson/2009/10/01/nightmares-of-training-camps-past/

  • Spaceship Jay Posted: Oct.2 at 2:56 pm
    Granger and Joe Johnson are close calls to me.. I think the only thing I’d be able to give Johnson is veteran experience.

  • davidR Posted: Oct.2 at 2:59 pm
    as dope as that cross on powe was, you can see he clearly tripped over joe’s foot. at least he knocked the open 3 down

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 3:05 pm
    Spaceship
    Joe’s handle is way better than Granger’s. Mid range and scoring saavy are as well. They both shoot to many jumpers though.

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 3:06 pm
    And if the Slam staff is willing to release their lists, that sounds like a great idea before we do the number one and two picks. Or, after the list is completed. Looking over the complete rankings should be illuminating.

  • Justin Walsh Posted: Oct.2 at 3:17 pm
    All I can say is, my list is far different than the final list, as I’m sure any other Slam Staffer’s list is different.

  • Myles Brown Posted: Oct.2 at 3:20 pm
    Meh. Aint no shame in my game. And mine was pretty similar to the final list.

  • Spaceship Jay Posted: Oct.2 at 3:25 pm
    Allenp; Iv’e seen Joe’s handle, it’s Sade ballad smooth. When I say veteran experience I feel like that’s a HUGE edge. Being on the court and knowing when to do things is a lot more important than knowing how to.

  • Allenp Posted: Oct.2 at 3:50 pm
    Spaceship
    I agree. I guess I disagreed that it was a close call as to whether Joe Johnson is better than Granger.

  • Justin Walsh Posted: Oct.2 at 4:30 pm
    Mine was similar in the top…15-20. but spots 50-35? Nah…Way different. Not to say it’s a better list, just my view of the NBA. Truth be told I tried to put Sun Yue on the list, but Kobe gave me the scowl.

  • Maurice Garland Posted: Oct.2 at 6:17 pm
    Derrick Rose is to this comment section what Lil Wayne is to rap blogs.

  • airs Posted: Oct.2 at 6:47 pm
    im a drose fan to the fullest, but yeah he’s gonna be way too high.
    and lang, you’d never be better than drose. not even in your dreams

  • Teddy-the-Bear Posted: Oct.2 at 8:19 pm
    Joe is top 15 in my book.

  • Teddy-the-Bear Posted: Oct.2 at 8:20 pm
    And him and Granger surely aren’t lower than Derrick Rose…

  • Lazaruz Posted: Oct.2 at 8:23 pm
    Too low

  • northcyde Posted: Oct.2 at 8:54 pm
    JJ probably should be ranked a little higher than this, but it’s hard to really nit pick at him being listed at #20 . . unless “you know who” is ranked ahead of him. JJ is the truth, offensively and defensively. He just needs to become a more consistent shooter, and take over games in the 4th a little more. He is the 3rd or 4th best SG in the league though. ( somebody said Manu . . lol . . chile please ) And speaking of “you know who”, when will people stop talking about him possibly being on the list? If “you know who” isn’t listed within the next 2 picks, people will just have to assume that “you know who” isn’t on the dang list.

  • Afonso Posted: Oct.2 at 8:56 pm
    if d rose is top 20 this list is just nonsense… but he should be like 50 though instead of maybe ray ray, the shooting legend, but next year he might strugle a litle bit… ohh, and B7ROY should be number 5 right behind LeBeast, Kobe, CP3 and D12…also Gasol WAY AHEAD OF STAT

  • Afonso Posted: Oct.2 at 9:14 pm
    MY BAD ROY SHOUD BE 6TH BEHIND DWADE AS WELL

  • Lang Whitaker Posted: Oct.2 at 10:33 pm
    As I told Myles on Twitter, Joe will sign with Barcelona before he signs with the L-Wolves.

  • Shem Posted: Oct.2 at 10:42 pm
    This is way too high hes atleast top 15, and if d rose does make this list.. this entire top 50 is a joke! I was questionable with al jeff but hes not better then JJ. But back to JJ, I do think he should be higher then Paul Pierce, KG, Tony Parker if hes coming but we ll see how the rest of this list pans out. Brandon Roy will be behind guys like kobe, wade, gasol, cp3, howard, lebron

  • airs Posted: Oct.3 at 12:26 am
    youre guys’ requirements for this list are so weird.
    its based on projected 09-10 rankings right??
    i don’t think its that far-fetched then to say that drose will have a breakout year, possibly top 20 caliber at that.
    thats why gilbert is even on this list, correct?
    look what rose did with a bunch of C list players and a newbie coach.
    with that timid rookie attitude gone im sure he’ll be bustin dudes ankles every night.
    the hate for drose is way unjustified as well.
    but until the ppl see this guy on a national showcase regularly, i guess he’ll just have to prove you guys wrong in the playoffs. again.
    p.s. Rondo sucks.

  • dma Posted: Oct.3 at 12:57 am
    while i’m not complaining about johnson.. i don’t think gasol should be higher than johnson.

  • Hursty Posted: Oct.3 at 5:40 am
    Joe Johnson is a beast. Top 20 indeed.

  • Joe_king Posted: Oct.3 at 6:44 am
    Beasley turned up yet?

  • Adam T Posted: Oct.3 at 7:51 am
    Video says it all, Lang

  • Lebron_fan Posted: Oct.3 at 1:53 pm
    izzover.JJ is underrated, he definitely deserves to be in the top 20.

  • Josh D Posted: Oct.3 at 3:42 pm
    JJ is better than 20!

  • black pinoy Posted: Oct.4 at 1:28 pm
    before anything else i wanna say im an NBA fan so dont expect any bias from me // id say what rose did last season isnt enough to land him this high.. he should be somewhere near mayo or something // BUT again, this list is for this coming season.. rookies would usually get a should leap in their game on their second year .. and rose is getting this spot simply because the writers (ME too) think hell be this big for chicago this season .. and we all couldnt tell coz the season hasnt even started yet.. and now that gordon is gone rose is gonna have more time with the ball.. im pretty sure he worked on his D and his J this summer.. so please yall need to stop hating on rose .. lets just wait till the season starts.. if think you guys know it all then why dont you try to play for the bulls or try to strt your own top 50..

  • HARD LUCK Posted: Nov.23 at 12:57 am
    Joe is most def closer to 11 or 12, yall crazy or just dont hoop one!

  • SLAM ONLINE | » 30 Teams, 30 Days Posted: Mar.25 at 2:17 pm
    [...] as I wrote the other day, everything revolves around Joe Johnson. As it should. When you have one of the top 15 players in [...]

  • Robert Quezaire Posted: Apr.23 at 6:04 pm
    Bill I don’t really see your point, I think he is quite right in this article

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