Who Will Come off the Bench: Hamilton or Iverson?

Rip Hamilton will re-join his Pistons teammates tonight as they face off against the Charlotte Bobcats. His coach, Michael Curry, as he has been hinting for quite a while now, might have the unenviable task of telling either Hamilton or Allen Iverson that they’re no longer a starter.

Curry knows it won’t be an easy thing to explain to either guy; so far, Hamilton has let it be known (in no uncertain terms) how he feels about becoming a sixth man – Via, DBB:

But I don’t think Rip is hearing any of it. Our exchange went something like this:

So, what’s going to happen when you come back, do you think you will jump right back into the starting lineup?

Rip: “Yeah, that’s the only option.”

Well, there is another option — coming off the bench.

Rip: “That ain’t happening.”

Out-standing!

Would it be too much to ask for a camera to be placed in the room when Curry has to deliver this bit of news to either Hamilton, or even better, Allen Iverson?

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Tags: Allen Iverson, Detroit Pistons, Michael Curry, Rip Hamilton

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http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

A 7 game series is a lot different then a regular season game. Especially when your not even using a consistent lineup. But i realize they can play with anyone, I am talking about winning a playoff series against one of the better teams in the east. Like I said I do not care about making the playoffs they are going to do that regardless its winning in the playoffs i am worried about.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Jukai there is no proof they play better in the half court as a team, and i know what dictates style of play i am not a child. And their half court activities they are good at contradict each other so you have to find something (transition=mismatches) that allows both players to take advantage of their strengths.
http://jamescleaton@ning.com jaymes

Running more really comes down to the individual. If your system is not designed to get out and run off every missed shot (like D’Antoni’s style) then it’s up to one or more of your guards to get out and run instninctively.If AI, Stuck and Rip along with Tay aren’t instinctive runners than it’s a bit late for the coach to implement a new running style.
http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

NBK: Yeah, um, just the fact they have played that way for the last 7 seasons, regardless of the players. And we haven’t used a consistent lineup, why? Trade for AI, injuries, and Stuckey’s promotion into the starting lineup. Oh, and a new coach testing the waters. I’d much rather have Curry trying out lineups NOW then being all Flip Saunders and not trying anything different AT ALL. Figure it out now while it is early in the season. Regardless of who starts, Curry has still been consistent with who has come off the bench since McDyess returned to the team. Mainly, Kwame and Hermann haven’t played. Advantage- Pistons.
justin

ai should definitely start THIS SEASON i mean he ptobabaly wont even be with the pistons next year sine his contract endin but rip will be wit the pistons so he could start as many games as he wants next season
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

NBK, what mismatches come out of transition? Stuckey and Rip aren’t terrifyingly fast in the open court, and Iverson has lost a step. You haven’t thought this through.
Pingback: SLAM ONLINE | » Links: The Dirty 30
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Ok TAD based on what you just said – shouldn’t they try the not 3 gaurd lineup and have one of the two (iverson,hamilton) come off the bench just to see if it works? they have already tried the 3 guard thing. And to say them sticking to the same strategy for the last 7 years when they don’t have their main tempo setter and have installed a (whether in the half court or not) non pg who plays very fast is the right thing to do is stupid. No offense but they have to change something. Stop using your VCR and use your DVD player
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Jukai did you seriously just ask that question? If your in transition as a defense if your not playing zone your job is to pick up whoever is in best position to score regardless of whos man it is. WTF I can’t believe you asked what mismatches come out of transition it does not matter how blisteringly fast hamilton and stuckey are or arent it is about not giving the defense the opportunity to set up. wow
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

have you ever played competitive basketball jukai? have you ever coached? or played for a college team? this should be common knowledge what a fast break does for your team.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

Okay, sooo… By your logic, The Pistons should just run in transition all the time because it’s really hard to defend against, ignoring the fact that the guards (and for that matter, anyone else) aren’t terribly fast and admitting that they play better in the half-court. Okay NBK. Have fun with this conversation of yours.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

you cannot read
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

There are two things that make you a fast break team:
1) Running after a rebound down the court
2) Gambling for steals
the Pistons don’t do #1 very well and the only person who really can do #2 is Iverson, who is trying to cut that down for the team. Regardless, you’re missing the “speed” factor and the “more skilled in the half-court” factor that really is mind boggling.
And no, I’ve never coached and played for a college team. Who the hell are you, Mike Breen?
http://jamescleaton@ning.com jaymes

NBK is right on this one, you don’t have to be quick to run the break, just have a quick instinct and be out and running when a shot goes up.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

i said plainly that they should not run all the time, but they should run. There are 25 teams playing at a faster pace then them orlando, cleveland and boston being 3 of them. And guess what those 3 teams are better in the half court then Detroit. Take the easy buckets when you can especially when your the inferior team
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

No, I DID read, you said you want the Pistons to “run more” and I was basing my last comment off how you explained how “hard” transition defense is. Even though it’s not very hard IF YOU DON’T HAVE A TEAM FULL OF RUNNERS. It’s not something that magically everyone can become good at. The Pistons also WON A CHAMPIONSHIP WHILE DOING IT VERY LITTLE.
Lord, take your adderal then ask me to explain this to you.
http://jamescleaton@ning.com jaymes

Actually you have to have a little speed you just don’t need to be a blur..Nash ain’t really that quick..
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

FUN FACT: There are three teams in the east BETTER than Detroit that run more than Detroit does.
FUN FACT: There are ELEVEN teams in the east that are worse than Detroit that run more than Detroit does.
Guess that means running is bad~!!!! Hyuck!
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

The pistons can do your number 1 jukai- sorry but today your being an idiot. I am saying they should run that means starting to run after defensive rebounds not ignoring the idea. Ignoring the idea is what they do now hence them not being good at it. And gambling for steals is in no way how you start transition it is making other teams shoot low% from the field. Gambling for steals gets you layups, or gives up layups. Transition points are easy buckets, short OPEN midrange jumpers, layups from passing and filling lanes. I just realized how much you don’t know and act like you do.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

Jaymes: Nash was actually quite quick, one of the quicker guards in the league. That being said, Nash didn’t really run the break, he cheated by tossing it halfway up the court with a lob pass. Nash is faster than Rip and Stuckey by a long shot. Nash back in the day MIGHT be on par with Iverson now.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Jukai your a moron- detroit is not running they cannot be good at something they don’t do. And when you change the face of your franchise it is ok to change your gameplan also it actually should come with the territory. But whatever you obviously don’t know what your talking about and are focusing on things that don’t matter.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

NBK: thanks for explaining all these concepts to me. Now explain to me why the 2004 championship Pistons won without fast breaking at all?
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

I don’t like the three guard lineup because it’s too hard on Tayshaun and Rasheed is not enough of a consistent beast to hold thing down alone.
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

Basically, small ball can work well in Orlando because Dwight Howard controls the glass and defense all game long. Sheed won’t do that, which causes problems.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

NBK: When you change the face of your franchise, it is okay to change the gameplan to that which suits the face of your franchise, and considering IVERSON PLAYED IN THE HALF-COURT MOST OF HIS CAREER, I’d have to opt against running.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

Allen, help me out here, I want to strangle this kid.
http://jamescleaton@ning.com jaymes

Nash on par with Ai..No chance at all..
http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

NBK: Jeez man. Same logic: If the Pistons have only utilized the 3-guard lineup for a handful of games before Rip got hurt, then why not see if it can or cannot for an extended period. Curry is putting the Pistons 5 best players on the floor. He is not so stubborn to not sub a big in if it isn’t working. I’m also quite sure that Curry is not going to be stubborn if in fact the lineup doesn’t work to the Pistons advantage over a period of games. You have to give it time to work.
-
As for the running thing: Please understand this, the Pistons DO run. However, they only do it usually off of turnovers, long rebounds, or leakouts. Curry does not tell them “DON’T RUN!” He is aware the Pistons success lives and dies on playing defense, controlling the pace, and exploiting mismatches. Rip is a mismatch because of his tireless running and midrange game. AI is a mismatch because of his dribble drives and unorthodox game. Stuckey is a mismatch because of his ability to get to the rim and his excellent body control. Tay is a mismatch for most 4′s because he can out-quick them. And Sheed is a mismatch because he can post and shoot the 3. All of these are halfcourt traits.
-
Ok, i’m done with this since i’m off work. Have a good one everybody.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Nash is nowhere near as fast as stuckey, and hamilton is probably faster too. I live in phoenix they do not (did not/they don’t run so much anymore) run by throwing lobs up the court they used to run by gettin the ball in nash’s hands immediately after baskets or off rebounds. Regardless of how fast he is when you get the ball up the court with haste and keep it moving the defense does not get the chance to set up and you create mismatches.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

Co-sign everything TADOne said.
Also, to Jaymes: Nash at his prime = Iverson now. Get it?
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

Nash in 2003-2004 was NOWHERE NEAR AS STUCKEY AND RIP? I swear I’m going to swallow a gallon of bleech if this keeps going on.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Jukai- Your starting to really show how dumb you are over and over again – I have said this like 10 times now – what iverson is used to and has been doing his whole career is isolations to create offense – he came to detroit where they control pace an involve everyone to create offense – you want to take advantage of both skills and running is the only way to do that.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

TAD- You have no idea what detroits success hinges on they have never had this team together and had success. Iverson is way different then Billups and changes a lot why don’t you grasp that? And billups is a way better shooter then Iverson and Stuckey which is huge in the half court.
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

I’m still optimistic though. All the Pistons need to do is stay close to Cleveland and Boston and get hot at the end. Remember, iverson is only shooting 40 percent right now after being up around 45 percent for the past two years. His main problem is getting that jumper to fall. Plus, he’s had some knee problems which have hurt him in getting separation. Hopefully he’ll get healthy soon.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

NBK: WHO is going to throw those lop passes on Detroit? Who? Iverson? Does that mean Stuckey and Rip are going to have to decide when to run and when to wait and see if a rebound falls into the other players hands when they’ve NEVER DONE IT BEFORE THEIR ENTIRE CAREER? Stuckey sure as hell ain’t passing in the half-court, that’s not his game. Rip can’t. Tayshun MAYBE but he’s one of their key rebounders. Try convincing Rasheed to do anything, I dare you.
You are stupid. Stop posting.
http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

for once i can cosign Jukai. This is historical.
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

To sum it up (and you can argue with yourself), Detroit should not run more because:
-They are one of the slower teams in the league
-They have been mainly a half-court team for more than half a decade
-Their front court WONT run
-Their backcourt is slower than most backcourts
-Their best player in the full court (Iverson) is also the only player who can PASS in the full court (Iverson)
-Every single player on the team is more effective in the half-court, and they create plenty of mismatches in the half-court
-As TADOne says, they DO run. Every team RUNS. They just aren’t going to do it at every possession, and they’re playing smart and playing to their strengths.
-You don’t watch Detroit basketball and it is VERY Clear.
Good day everyone.
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

Y’all are really going at it.
My two cents:
Pistons aren’t used to running, haven’t had a training camp with Iverson and are all older players. All of these things make it very unlikely they’ll run anytime soon, since that’s something you have to instill in players during training camp, not something you can put in on the fly.
Iverson isn’t great on the break anymore. Back when he was younger, he was a terror on teh wing, but now, with injuries and age, he’s nowhere near as effective and really doesn’t get out and fly like he used to. That was the case in Denver as well. While he can still score on the break, he’s not like a young buck getting out and going on every play. Plus, his halfcourt game is much more effective these days with the midrange jumper he’s added to his arsenal.
The Pistons could run off steals and long jumpers, but their defense and rebounding have slipped in recent years and Iverson didn’t make it any better. So, it’s unlikely they are going to run more anytime soon and that makes sense.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

YOU DON’T THROW LOB PASSES TO RUN IN TRANSITION – TRANSITION BASKETBALL IS NOT TAUGHT WITH LOB PASSES- 3 GUARDS AND 2 REBOUNDERS IS ALL YOU NEED TO RUN. and if stuckey is a good rebounder that is even better because he can grab a board start a break have 3 fillers and Rasheed trailing for an open 3. You have to know how transition works to understand the concept dude
http://fdjslkf.com Jukai

additional point:
-both BETCATS and TADOne agree with me at the same time, and that has never happened in the history of SLAMOnline, so this point must be so ridiculously obvious that it is shameful for you not to understand.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Speed is just whip cream on the sunday – but 3 gaurds and a big shooter is the ice cream in transition it is good regardless
http://thegayestwebsiteever.com Ben

Stuckey isn’t really a great rebounder. He should be, considering how tall he is, but I can’t remember him ever really racking up the boards.
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

NBK
Read my comment
You don’t install a running system mid season in the NBA. There isn’t time with the game schedule and practice schedule.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

You have a 15 year old agreeing with you, I know more about basketball then him just by the fact that I have been playing basketball longer then he has been alive – I don’t know what kind of credentials tad has basketball wise but i am judging by your stance and points youve tried to make that I have also played more basketball (competively and recreationally) then you also.
http://jamescleaton@ning.com jaymes

I get it..But i don’t agree.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

YOU DO WHEN YOU ADD A NEW PLAYER WHO DOES NOT KNOW THE SYSTEM ALREADY AND WILL TAKE UP 40 MINUTES A GAME>>>>>>>>IF YOUR WILLING TO MAKE PERSONEL CHANGES YOU HAVE TO BE WILLING TO MAKE SYSTEM CHANGES AS WELL unless you do not care about winning in the playoffs and just want to get there.
http://www.ravingblacklunatic.blogspot.com Allenp

NBK
Shouting doesn’t make your points more credible.
Point out a team to me in recent basketball history that has changed their whole team philosophy four games into the season. You do that , and you win.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

when detroit gets bounced early again – ends up with a worse record then last year – and is offensively less efficient at the end of the year then your going to be like dmn they should have done something different. As they are now they aren’t winning anything and winning is all that matters.
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

the suns last year at the trade deadline
http://allday-fadeaway.blogspot.com nbk

Here you go name a team that traded their best player midseason for a completely different type of player kept their system and had more success then the previous year.

Who Will Come off the Bench: Hamilton or Iverson?

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