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Friday, April 3rd, 2009 at 9:00 am  |  505 responses

Post Up: Agent Zero Strikes

JR and Birdman keep Nuggets second in the West.

by Holly MacKenzie / @stackmack

After the busy schedule on Wednesday nights, I always feel like Friday mornings are so quiet. I guess it’s all good because it’s Friday and the weekend is here! It was also ridiculously warm outside here in Toronto yesterday evening/last night. I spent a good chunk of my day staring at a computer screen and it was heaven to spend the evening walking the streets and feeling Spring all around me.

LeBron’s Cavs lost to the Wizards last night. Uh oh. That could lead to some interesting conversation around here. I kid, but really, the Wiz/Cavs matchups are always entertaining, to say the least. Particularly when we’ve got Gilbert Arenas back out there, in the middle of things.

20:1

That’s the assist:turnover ratio for Gil since his return. I forgot how good he looked out there. It just feels right having him back on the floor. Notice he changed his shoes at halftime of that game? I’d still really, really, really like a Gil sole from the SLAM shoes, if anyone is listening to me.

I wrote a piece on Derrick Rose for my blog over at The Score yesterday. Check me out, I was the first person to ask Rose for a reaction of Chris Paul’s compliments about his game. That was a fun moment, seeing him almost burst with pride when I read him the quote.

Taking this off-topic for a moment, I know I don’t talk about music a lot around here, but I need to say, if you’re looking for something fun, check out Drake’s So Far Gone. I had a friend give me his stuff awhile ago and I said I’d listen but didn’t really listen, then it seemed like I couldn’t ignore it any longer after Baron Davis mentioned him last week, then I got into a friend’s car the other night and he was listening to the album (and asking me why I wasn’t yet on the bandwagon), and then on my walk last night I stumbled over the album I’d added to my ipod a few weeks ago.

Two hours later, I was swept away by Drake.

Okay, back to basketball.

Thoughts are being sent to Maurice Lucas, assistant coach of the Blazers who has just undergone surgery for bladder cancer. Stay strong, Coach Lucas.

Tell me this, how are the Nuggets suddenly in second place in the Western Conference? Okay, I guess it’s not “suddenly”, but wow I didn’t see that happening. O’Leary is convinced that the Nuggets will be facing the Lakers in the WCF. Tell him what you think about that prediction.

Gil wore black shoes in the second half of the game last night. As the friend who told me, texted, “hello, fine.” Love him. Have I mentioned how good it is to see him back on the floor?

The Wizards pulled off the shocker against Cleveland, taking them down, 109-101 as the last-place team in the Eastern Conference took down the top team in the league. With Gilbert Arenas and Brendan Haywood in the starting lineup once again, it was smooth sailing for the Wizards as they led throughout the first half and went into the fourth up 10, 80-70. The Cavs would narrow the gap to six in the final minutes on a three from James, but Washington wasn’t giving this one up. Caron Butler had 25 points to lead Washington as Antawn Jamison scored 19, Brendan Haywood added 12 points and 10 rebounds and Arenas finished with 11 points and 10 assists. Bron had 31 points 9 rebounds and 6 assists and Mo Williams added 19.

The Sixers took down the Bucks, 105-95 thanks to a strong second half at home. The victory put them in fifth place in the Eastern Conference playoff race, as they bumped the Heat down to sixth. While the Sixers found themselves behind by nine at the half and then tied with the Bucks midway through the fourth, they pieced together a 10-0 run that was keyed by four quick points from Marreese Speights to go ahead and didn’t look back. Andre Miller led the way for Philadelphia with 18 points and 11 assists. Andre Igoudala added 20 points and Speights had 21 off of the bench. Ramon Sessions continued to ball for Milwaukee, scoring 18 points to go with 10 assists while Richard Jefferson scored 17 and Charlie Bell added 14.

Carlos Boozer hyped it as an important game, Kenyon Martin left midway through with a rib injury and the Nuggets took down the Jazz, 114-104 thanks to 8 blocks from Chris Andersen and 8 three-pointers from JR Smith. While they trailed by as many as 11 early, the Nuggets got a boost from Smith’s six first-half three-pointers and a layup at the halftime buzzer from Anthony Carter that put them up, 54-43. It was smooth sailing for the Nuggets from there as they nabbed win #50 on the season and a half-game lead over San Antonio for the second spot in the West. Carmelo Anthony scored 23 points and Smith’s eight three’s came on 8-14 shooting from the floor as he finished with 28 points. Andersen added 7 points and 10 rebounds to go with his 8 blocked shots. The Jazz were led by Deron Williams and his 18-point, 10-assist night. Carlos Boozer scored 15 points to go with 11 rebounds, Mehmet okur added 14 points and 15 boards and CJ Miles scored 19 in the loss.

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  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I like the potential this Friday has for post comments. Lebron sucks.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    love the fire. Love the Drake shine, I know some youngbucks today will be talking about that in the comments!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Eboy, what it do playa

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    THE BIRDMAN!!!!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Hello Justin. (Figured I’d keep it level since it seems that you’re on some off the wall sh*t this morning)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    THE BIRDMAN SHOOK HIS HEAD LIKE CASSIDY RESPONDING TO FREEWAY WHEN HE BLOCKED MY BOY CJ MILES OOOOOH GOODNESS. Caps lock is fun sometimes ;)

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Are we certain that the Nugs have a chance to really do something in the playoffs?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    haha Eboy, I am just in a great mood. Great mood. Oh and Ryan Jones is too, Penn State won the NIT. Ballin’.

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    no one gives a fcku about the nit.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Isn’t winning the NIT equivalant to winning Who Wants To Be A Turkish Millionaire?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Ryan Jones a PSU alum definitely gives a cleverly misspelled curse word ;) but yeah, I do get the point. But that’s not why I am in a great mood.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    The NIT is equivalant of giving the 65th best team a trophy too.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Ahhh…….

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    actually its 66th.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    So, i’m wondering if this is a sign of a new Gil that we will be seeing next season? Maybe, because of the knee injuries and the fact it has dwindled his explosiveness, that he will now be looking to be more of a playmaker and less of a shooter? It certainly appears that way. I can see Gil contorting his game into a Chauncey Billups type game, where he looks to incorporate teammates first and take his shots when he sees his defenders slacking off of him.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Also, who is Drake? And did anyone see that Antawn Jamison dunk? Nasty.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Interesting take on Gil, TAD…..although I’m not sure if this is just a byproduct of Gil kind of going through the motions and not pushing 100% and then once next season starts he reverts back to Hibachi style antics.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    TADOne: For Gil to become a Chauncy, Gil would have to play some defense, which, you know, I don’t see happening.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    So uhm, should I start the “this is sort of a bad sign for the Cavs” or should someone else do it this time?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Jukai…..let’s wait……I want to see who is the first one to be that person. James HAS to be here today….doesn’t he?

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com/ B. Long

    Take it away, Jukster! By the way, those green Nuggets jerseys grew on me last night. It was nice to see J.R. Smith getting his J.R. Smith on.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    B. Long, havent seen you in a while. Eboy, can I do it? I’m the biggest douche about LBJ in this comment-sphere haha. Nah I wont do it, too busy drinking the kool-aid

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I wonder if I get a whole bunch of bad ink, would I be able to shoot 3′s like JR Smith?

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com/ B. Long

    Before people start getting carried away with the Wiz/Cavs game last night, just remember that the game was the Wizard’s Super Bowl. I’m pretty sure LeBron doesn’t even remember who DeShawn Stevenson is.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    TAD, you could get the bad ink and end up being Robert Swift. ZING.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Well, actually I was very upset with the Wizards/Cavaliers game but I’m still holdin’ my mouth for someone else to have their moment of glory. A Lakers or Spurs fan deserves it.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com/ B. Long

    I made that same joke once Tad and was almost extradited from Slamonline for being “racist”. Apparently white people are only allowed to make fun of Birdman and Robert Swift’s ridiculous body art. Big games tonight.

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    i cut you like sharp angles, mutilated your frame, i unveiled change that strangled the thoughts in your brain. the second that you aim, ill cover you in flames, and bring you to shame, increasing and doubling the pain…. you caught a jab when you ran in my slaughter path, this thought i draft is harder to understand than an arabic autograph. swing with every part i have, reverse your body chemistry and make you freeze to death in a boiling hot water bath. cast a tsunamis wrath if i have to, make you announce your retirement 20 seconds after they draft you. the reason why men only use 10 percent of their brains is cuz within mine everyones 90 percent is contained. i conjure images thats fighting apparitions off my premises. equivalent to a judge cuz i issue out death sentences.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Beasley has some pretty sh*tty artwork and his shot is pretty nice. TAD might be on to something.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    B. Long, I will make fun of anybody’s bad tattoos. Black, White, Mexican, Asian…any other ethnicity in the league. Good tattoos are just hard to come by on most of these players (and people in general for that matter)

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    B Long: Actually, I think you said someone was as tatted as a Puerto Rican, which is a LITTTTTTTLE different, but yeah, white people.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com/ B. Long

    Three words:Cherokee “Trailer” Parks. There goes the bad ink, good shooter theory.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Eboy, B-Easy has HORRIBLE artwork. It’s like he got the ink done by a friend of a cousin of his (every person who knows somebody with a bad tattoo knows the story… it was real cheap done by a friends cousin yadda yadda)… However, Brandon Jennings, Avery Bradley and Marquise Daniels have great tattoos.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I hate everyone. Just for clarification. Carry on.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Jukai, is it racist that I just laughed at that? Idk I see that it’s off color but downright racist? How many “white people (insert joke about style, athleticism, sexuality)” lines are on SLAM daily? It’s just not that big uh deal in my view. Unless it’s straight up HATEFUL, then I’m like…oooh no you didn’t.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Why do winning streaks always seem to end against mediocre (ahehehem mediocre at best in this case or in other words worst in the NBA)teams?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Juk, TAD, hows about we just grab the pitchforks, the WD40 and the hate mail and rush to Calipari’s house before he moves?!

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com/ B. Long

    @Jukai:That was a different time, a time when Rico had to be destroyed to save all mankind. Dude said he had a Puerto Rican flag tatted on his neck and I said “That’s very Puerto Rican of you.” Oops.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Hisham – it’s called looking ahead. happens all the time.

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    rap homicides beyond imagination, my method for eradication of a migraine headache is decapitation. the number of patients equals too many for tabulation. theyll have to link two calculators up just to complete the equation. im extreme, my holocaust range is stretching so far that the next scene is continued on the next screen. when i want to be left alone, i angrily set the tone. drain my larynx and soak it in ammonia and methadone. on the microphone you need a chaperon. when it comes to spittin you need to do what your girl did to you and leave rap alone.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    & B. Long, hahahhaa. That line isn’t all that bad. That’s like when a whitetrash cat has a confederate flag on his neck or arm next to an i love tat. I’d say “that’s pretty redneck american of you”

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    o i’m sorry it’s about tattoos now. Waiting to see Eboy appear on The Discovery Channel’s Miami Ink to get ink

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Justin: I have a black co-worker and we make fun of our own ethnicities (Jewish, Black) all the time. But for some people, they dun like that. And you gotta respect that. I guess.
    B Long: Yeah, you’re right. I thought it was hysterical but Rico wasn’t so forgiving.

  • http://www.alllooksame.com Tarzan Cooper

    your all a bunch of guinny wops.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Holy christ, His ham, that was genius. Eboy’s gotta get a D-Wade tat on his upper arm or neck, and it’s GOTTA be televised. Lang knows people, he can pull the strings, can’t he?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Jukai, naw I do respect it. I also understand that most of the time on here it’s lighthearted, in no way am I sitting here saying downright hatred is cool.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    I wish I wasn’t white sometimes, ONLY so I could call Eboy a honkey…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    jesus… I was typing about that hisham tat joke then I saw Tarzan with the DEEEP rooted boston “Departed” racial slurs. Wowwwww that got through the censor and I can’t type a curse word?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Oddly, His Ham is pretty gifted. I have a back tattoo from KAT VON D from when she was here in the MIA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Jukai, honkey and cracker are such weak slurs, I don’t even consider them that. White people dont have slurs, all you gotta do is call them irrelevent and they get offended.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    I was thinking the 2006 playoff tree on the foreground with a huge smiling D-Wade in the background with some fiery Miami Heat flames surrounding him tattooed all across his back

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    you got a Kat Von Dutch tat E? Jealousy is coursing through me. I dont have any ink :(

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    It cost me $600, btw.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Wow you guys are fast today

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I was also half hard for about 2/3rd’s of the inktime. I didn’t make the show though.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    half hard? haha because of her swerve?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    She’s fine as fu*k even with all that sh*t on her body, Justin.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    haha gross man.. why didn’t you make the show? didn’t sob in front of the camera about the dead dog you were immortalizing in ink? (treading on thin ice here)

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    The hell, Eboy, what does the status of your manlihood have to do with anything unless you were getting ink around your member?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    naw Eboy, I know. I think she’s downright GORRRRGEOUS. As mos def says… “Y-E-A YEAAA, You can get it”

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy got Shaq’s head on his pelvis with his shaft coming outta Shaq’s mouth

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Naw man……it wouldn’t have been a good luck for my real world lifestyle. Plus….if I’m going to be on tv…..I needs to be paid. They would have done the tattoo for free…..but I would have had to sign my rights over to A & E. I did have to wait 4 months for an appointment with her, though.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    That would have been a good design, Jukai.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Oh wait…….CAVS SUCK!!!!!

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    LEBRICK SHOWED HIS TRUE COLORS BY MISSING THAT 45 FOOT SHOT WATTAT GAYYYYYY YOU KNOW WHO WOULDA HIT THAT KOBE OH AND ALSO MJ WAHT DOES THAT SAY?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I’m seriously starting to think that Jukai has been posting under two different screenames.

  • Ritchie

    CAVS LOST!
    THEY SUCK!
    Lebron sucks!

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    I’m going to get me a tattoo of a dribbling crab.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Wait, Chris Anderson had 8 blocks?! I’m not sure how I missed reading that the first time?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Would it be wearing a crown, Hisham?

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    A&E? Discovery Channel? TLC.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    “A KING DRIBBLES IN WHATEVER MANNER OF CRUSTACEAN HE PLEASES!”

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Hi y’all. 2 things on my mind right now, Denver in forest green. anyone else think that looked a’ight?
    And not sure if it was a rerun or something, but i just finished watching the college 3point/slamdunk contests and had a blast. The dunking was great, especially from the semifinals on, and the right guy won. the cat from New Mexico won with a mix of coolio style(his oversized shorts nearly fell off after every dunk) and with a “i’ma do my business” aura around him. Plus dude had sick dunks off one leg, most on the first attempt. Nba, pay attention. This is how you get 8 guys in a dunk contest and STILL not make it draw on forever. Good stuff.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I guess with Thad out, Speights will be getting a lot oof playing time before the end of the season. I like that.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Dark, I saw that last night. You’re right…..the dude that won was really strong with it.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    btw totally random, but the next SLAM cover is bangin’

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Definitely Eboy.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    TAD, it was kind of hard to miss if you caught the game, he was updating the crowd and tv audience with his fingers after every block.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    wouldn’t that be ironic E, since Teddy/Gaz seem to be the same person (according to some) and keep insulting Jukai/BET without mercy.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Darksaber, the college dunk format is pretty good, especially better than the McDonalds garbage format. It ruined the dunk contest the last 2 years

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    who is it banging Justin?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Yeah, Walsh…..don’t pull that sh*t in a public forum….who is it. Or at least what are his teams colors?

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    i really enjoyed the whole thing, the 3point contest was tight, and the touch of having the girls winner take on the boys champ is a FANTASTIC idea. She nearly won too, the cute (more aww shucks, less woohoo cute) girl from Furman would have deserved it since that showman from Miami was hogging all the limelight. Kinda reminded me of Lebron on AS-Saturday, although this kid WAS participating in one of the events.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    I find it duly bemusing how Teddy can brandish my name angerily in every post yet when I ANNAHILATE him yesterday, I get “Jukai stop the war of words you’re being immature and a meanie!”
    Russ updating me that a serval was a jungle cat was pretty amusing though

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Wow don’t remind of all that shìt that when on on the iverson thread

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Justin you tease…

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    I stood eye-to-eye with a serval in the Rotterdam Zoo just a week ago

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    oh Dark, I tease but you’ll love it.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Where was that Jukai….I’d like to read Russ’s response to you?

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    1: my tattoos are badass and I can shoot the lights out.
    2: I can’t comment on anything else until we diagram all the cavs weaknesses that we learned from the loss to the worst team in the league last night. Of course what I’ll probably here is excuses.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    His Ham: We’re going off topic here. Let’s talk about things that are more normal for Friday morning post-up. Who is more likely to OWN a serval, Lebron James or Kobe Bryant?

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    It told me not to confuse it’s noble race with a mistyping of the word several

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Bryan, i love how everybody makes excuses for a Cavs loss, but decry the Lakers as the worst team to ever be easily at the top of the conference in the history of the game when they lose to a bad team.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Kobe, cause he looks more like a ferret…..which is closer in animal appearance than that of a crab.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Hisham: your post at 10:11? just made me laugh my butt off. thanks for that.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    It also told me that several servals have servants

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Justin……can you point us to the excuses people made up for the Cavs today?…..I’d like to read them….I love the agony of other teams problems.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    if Kobe is a ferret, Jason Terry is a turtle, Bosh is a literal Dinosaur, Sam Cassell is ET, JJ Barea is a midrange paper supply salesman, JJ Redick is a self published author of bad poetry, Charles Barkley is that demon guy from DOOM aaaand Nappa from Dragon Ball Z all in one.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: as the Wizards/Cavs game was on, I spent about that entire time bashign Teddy-The-Bear. It’s all in the Iverson Start/Resign thread. At one point, Teddy claimed he pointed out ‘serval’ things that make me uneducated and a douchebag (how I refused to put Rodman on a 20 list, how I think Dirk is a top-15 pf, how I think Tony Parker is more valuable for his team than Kobe, you know, things I still think) and I asked him how much was a serval. Russ, upset about the whole thing, chimed in that a serval was a jungle cat. I told Russ that only confused me more and asked him how many things a jungle cat could point out, but at that point, Russ was probably taking shooters of Jim Bean and throwing darts at a picture of John Paxson.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Would any of them own a serval?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Both Kobe’s and Bron’s tats are pretty bad, but KB’s crown thingy he got for his wife is especially God-awful. So, yeah.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Eboy, it was partially sarcastic. Sheesh, cant you tell that I am the biggest lakers loyalist in the history of stupidity?

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    @eboy
    Justin Walsh Posted: Apr.3 at 9:41 am
    Hisham – it’s called looking ahead. happens all the time.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I must read that.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    One thing that’s been bugging me for weeks. So Jeremy Pargo’s older brother is in Greece right? Playing for Olympiakos. Well weeks ago i saw Jeremy playing for the Zags and when the announcer stated who he was related to, i immediately thought of Milt Palacio. This led to me being totally unable to remember who Jannero was and in conversation’s i’d be adamant that Jeremy was Milt’s brother. It was maddening. I kinda think because Jeremy is darker and stockier than his bro, i mixed em up bad. Random, i know, but it’s been bugging me for weeks.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Justin: I think the Cavs loss to the Wizards was FAR more showing than the Lakers/Spurs losses, but I’m holding myself back because I’m waiting for James to chime in.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    So was I, Walsh. I knew your were going the sarcastic route.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Boing, thank you. Boing, hello Boing. I will recite the name twice more. Boing Boing. Yes… Yes.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Exactly Justin. Eboy, I didn’t read any excuses to be fair, but I also haven’t seen anyone crying out about how this shows their weakness etc like everyone does with the Lakers. On that iverson thread last nght I have to actually side with jukai(shudder) but I responded nicely to both z and myles I fear it was too late though.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Al Harrington is definitely also a turtle, but of the ninja variety

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Eboy, I figured as much, but just in case… Eboy, my man, please indulge me with this Kat Von D tat- are there pics of it on your…FACEBOOK? haha (the entire commenters union of this site immediately searches “Eboy” into the facebook search box)

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    If you’re talking bad tats,look no further than this year’s Rookie of the Year.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Justin: i’ll love it as in, ” big time Nowitzki fan will love having him on the cover again”? or i’ll love the new cover cause i’m a slam fan? (hint hint…)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Al Harrington looks like Radio Raheem from Do The Right Thing. And in that Protege commercial? His words and mannerisms are eerily similar to the Radio Raheem Love/Hate story.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    Im not sure what your thanking me for, you even what your talking about, but u get a hi-five anyways slugger.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Sam i am is no Extra terrestrial. He is Gollum Jr. Get your facts right, Walsh.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Morning Izzo

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Dark- you know how everyone says the covers are never risky? end of conversation, change the subject and boom boom shamalamadingdong. Okay, so does anybody else think that LeBron is the worst basketball player since Michael Jordan? It really is ridiculous.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Jesus everytime i post a comment, the subject’s been changed twice. i’m getting outta here. just a little more work to do before the weekend starts. Have a good one everybody

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Dark, gollum Jr, hahahahaahaah. I just started giggling like a mother. Boing, Idk I was channelling David Letterman at the oscars when he was all “oprah….umaaaa” and whatnot! Hi-fives?! Slugger?! Oh they like me, they REALLY like me

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    So Kevin Love is finally getting that cover? SWEEEET!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Izzo, morning, afternoon, good evening and goodnight, a la Truman Show. Movies and analagies galore. Lions…Tigers…Bears… OH MY (in the same voice Gary Busey does in Predator 2)

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Slam is taking a risk? So they’re showing both Kobe AND Lebron?!?!?!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    TAD LMAO hahahahahah. I immedddiately started laughing. Like really. Oh goodness. OOOOH lawdy lawdy lawd. Glass cleaner.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    Charles Barkley… Nappa from DBZ… uncannily enough, it fits, Justin.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    oh Juk’siepoo, your fire is just. By the way, funny idea, I had a dream that LeBron and Kobe became best friends like Isiah and Magic. Dead serious.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    o before I go, speaking of bad tats: check out the pic of Arenas. He has Jesus in his armpit!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Joel O’s – at all times, I strive for DBZ plugs. At all times. Ka….Me….Ha…Me…HAAAAASSAN ADAMS :)

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Hmm, risky cover. From a mag that had Holdsclaw, Flip to my Lou, White Chocolate and teeth fletching GP on it’s cover over the years, that’s creating high expectations in my head. ok, i’ll wait patiently, Justin. But if it’s not risqué enough, you are getting….umm, slammed.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Darksaber: Don’t forget about the noir Dirk Nowitski cover that broke sales records in not selling!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I actually saw that Hisham. In his defense, Gil has had a ton of free time.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Darksaber, fair enough. Come on though, back in the day SLAM had Reggie Miller on the cover (who didn’t like SLAM that much if I remember)….

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Hisham:That’s because he’s now able to say “Jesus Wept” whenever he perspires.
    Justin:Hi.Watch the NIT?
    Jukai:Merry afternoon.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Tad, no kidding. Juk, The Sin City Dirk/Shaq cover duo was actually pretty cool for the record.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    risky as in shaq/dirk double covers, zero second round playoff appearances risky? damn i was supposed to leave

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    I need a Denver Starting 5 cover in my life. (With Donthay Jones replaced with JR Smith of obvios reasons)

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Jukai: i swore i’d never admit this to you on this forum, but you just got me BIGTIME. As i was typing my covers earlier, i was thinking about that one, and praying noone would mention it. Gahhhhh….rats!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Boing, is it because Jones was a Duke educated man & Smith went from not even being on the NBA radar for out of HS to murdering a MCD’s game and becoming a first rounder?

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Umm, small mistake there Justin. Tony Gervino and co didn’t like Reginald, and bashed him in the mag, A LOT. You were expecting roses after that from him?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Darksaber: That cover was friggin’ sweet. Unfortuantely, big sweaty Germans don’t sell with the demographic of Slam. Which is a damned shame.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    From an artistic standpoint, the Sin City covers were amongst my favourites in Slam history. Sales be damned!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Dark, probably a fair point. But stop stealing my thunder, I will go super-saiyan.

  • Myung

    Lol, Hisham. I always thought Al Harrington looked like one of the ninja turtles too…

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Hmmmm….so “Watchmen” themed covers?

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @Jukai: It seems Teddy/Gaz got in a post or two as a fake “Joel O” on that thread late last night saying that he was right all along. As flattering as it feels that the omnipotent Teddy who “annihilated and sonned” you last night may see me as a threat, I don’t have the syntax of a clumsy preschooler (and, I have a link to my name) so it was obviously not me.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    I remember that Scoop levied super hard for an AI cover once and it was one of the worst sellers in SLAM history.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Anyone else find it hilarious that the Bobcats might be losing personnel to Appalachian State?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    sheesh i never expected this many questions. OMG ELVIS OVER THERE (everybody looks away, justin bolts like usain) haha jk

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Justin:That was a college cover though.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    @Justin, Ya , that, and because i run with the Nuggets online on 2k9, and i really enjoy killing the d!ick riders who only play with the cavs or lakers and take every shot with kobe/lebron, and JR comes off the bench for like 50 on all filthy dunks in traffic and pull up 3s from 5 feet off the line. It makes me smile.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I need that 20 minutes back from reading Jukai/Teddy The Bears e-battle. Russ’s serval line was perfect though. And AI has been wronged in Detroit…..not the other way around…..anyone that thinks different just doesn’t get the business side of the league.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Oh lord, yet another case of me and the Jukster agreeing on something. Wait, lemme check outside the window to see if any other signs of the apocalypse are revealing themselves…
    Justin-Goku: Do power down, please, i’ll stop the thievery.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    aw I’ve been dubbed Goku. oooh joy. :) Goku has a wet jumper, annnnd instant transmission crossovers ;)

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    E: Iverson has been wronged? Really? That is an interesting take. I don’t want to flood the massage boards about this today, so email me why you think that please. I would love to hear your argument.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    I was in Berlin once, and most people there that are of the Turkish/Kurdish/Iraqi ehtnicity have these really wild DBZ-style haircuts, like OMG he’s gonna go supersaiyan on us AAAAAAAAHHH.But then they didn’t so that was a big bummer.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Joel O: I pretty much assumed anyone who claimed he was right (IE Gaz) was just another Teddy-The-Bear alias.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Eboy:I too would like that email.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    I think I just got a comment in moderation because of the word w e t. In reference to a jumper of course. Sheesh, this must be moderated by Larry Hughes, he hasnt seen the word wet associated with him since he peed himself upon watching LeBron dunk on him in practice with no regard for huuman life.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    ok good weekend everyone. I feel like Teddy the Gaz. I keep coming back!!!

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    TAD/Eboy/Izzo: Forward everything to njl4515 @ gmail dot com so my workday will go faster thanks

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Hisham’s 10:40 post was pretty amazing, just for the record.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    It’s not that difficult to understand TAD/Izzo……you have to see past the results in the win/loss column is all. AI didn’t make the move to come to Detroit….he was sent there. The onus falls COMPLETLEY on the porky shoulders of Joe D and the completely useless ones of Michael Curry before AI is blamed for “complaning” about his current role.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Jukai, it definitely was. Beautiful. I loved it. Thanks hisham

  • Ritchie

    btw, BOBCATS gonna take down Miami tonight!!!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    E: Um, you do know i’m a Pistons fan, right? I have seen this thing from all angles. While I don’t necassarily disagree with you, I don’t really agree with you either. Two loves, but only one right.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    His Ham is so on fire today, it’s ridiculous. But i must say i wouldn’t have liked to see the likes of Bushido (German/Türk Rapper from around them parts) or Sido (German Rapper with a metallic skull mask on) go SUPER SAIYAN ever. Those cats are dangerous enough.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: Yeah you sure are right, we should blame Joe D for making Iverson complaing about getting 20 million dollars for seventeen minutes of work a night!!!!

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    Kamehamehassanadams! Instant transmission crossovers. Mannn. Spirit bomb full court shots?

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Uh oh, between all the Vegeta and Boo references (we are such nerds), i see a pattern developing. The Iverson files have not truly been closed yet, up in here. Save yourselves.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    TAD….I know…..but here’s the thing to me…..AI didn’t force Sheed to be COMPLETLEY USELESS this season…..he didn’t for the hand of therookie coach to play a second tier shooting guard at in starters minutes for most of the season….he didn’t pretend to say he was going to turn into Maurice Cheeks and be the defensive player the Pistons covet at the guard spot. He did him……like he always does…..and the Pistons knew that type of player he was when they made the deal for him. Where’s the discussion?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    “Yeah you sure are right, we should blame Joe D for making Iverson complaing about getting 20 million dollars for seventeen minutes of work a night!!!!” Jukai, this is the view of the typical, unknowing fan. While I always chide you for being dense….I do think you have some form of basketball intelligence. Again……Allen didn’t ask to go to Detroit.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Where’s the discussion??? Um, how about I more or less disagree with about everything you just stated?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Dark, I just effing love how basketball fans ALL know what’s poppin with DBZ

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    While Joe D and Curry aren’t blameless in this(and useless in the case of the latter),is it so unbelievable to expect some good production from a player like AI when you trade for them?AI had his chance(he’s still averaging 36mpg)and it wasn’t working,so he got benched.So I’m not all that sympathetic to AI’s “f*ck you I won’t do what you told me” attitude AI is putting on at the moment.Blame Joe D and the other guy all you want,but there’s no way ALL the onus is on them.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Damn I was writing something up to rebuttal Eboy’s post, but I’m lettin’ this one go. NOT TODAY GUYS.

  • http://www.twitter.com/mansonovic Andy

    Eboy, I just got done reading through these comments and was THIS close to editing Kat Von D’s Wikipedia page to include you on the list of clients. The decision to mention you being half hard at the time was going to be a last-minute impulse decision.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Man, I feel an SKO post coming on. If only I had the time….

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    While, I guess I could stop commenting on here for a day and do one, but what fun would that be?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    did you guys hear that the queen of england is a poisonous snake? the daily show with jon stewart is effing gooold.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    work is done. 5 more minutes before we close up. May is tournament time in our country because then all regular basketball seasons stop. There’s always this one tournament that is three days of non-stop balling and partying, sleeping on the gym floor and everything. We’re entering two teams, very subtly named Two Teams, One Cup. You guys know what i’m talking about.

  • Rashaan

    Holly always great work. I will definitely check out your piece on the score. I like Rose. The new XXL mag they did a piece on him. Heard some joints from him he kinda nice. Nuggets and Lakers in WCF WTF. Im a Nuggets but i dont think they get out the 2nd round.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Speaking of which, where the hell has Tariq been?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    *Doesnt feel like cutting and pasting*

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    TAD…there is no fun in no longer commenting! LETS GET THIS TO A THOUSAND!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    None at all, TAD.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Fun is fun.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Myles Brownnnn ladies n gents!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Myles, I especially enjoyed your debate yesterday. I’m just upset I wasn’t around for it.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @Justin: I saw that. It was hilarious, but the audience’s laughter seemed a biiit cautious. They were like “uh should we really go there?”. Not like it hasn’t been done before, I mean South Park did a lot worse.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    @Joel O’s, yeah it was gooolllden. Love that he had a MONACLE AND Glasses all at once. Oh yeah, and tea in a china cup. Oh good lord i loved it.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    So the people who still think Allen Iverson doesn’t look bad right now: Teddy-The-Bear, Eboy. Hohum.
    Same person?

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Justin has had a few red bulls to many, i assume. Loving the energy Walsh. And just because we love B-Ball, we shouldn’t know our way around Dragonball(s)? what are we, savages? How dare you?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Justin/Dark: I’m glad other peeps watched that cartoon when they were kids. I’m always going to my father during a game “AND THEN *so and so* WENT SUPER SAIYAN AND #*)$ING DROPPED 14 POINTS IN ONE QUARTER” or somethin’ dumb like that.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Ok, even though i’ma sound like a cultural ignorant here, but Eboy, who the heck is Kat von D? Some gorgeous Tatoo artist or something?

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Umm, yeah J. When we were kids…..right. Then.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Holly, you just now heard Drake!?!?!?!? Wowsers. Check out his album before So Far Gone called Comeback Season, pure dope. Sidebar: The “Birdman” is single-handedly winning my BLK category in my fantasy playoffs. I’m not mad.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Jukai, beauuuutiful. Dark, google images Kat Von Dutch. So fine. Oh and yeah, DBZ is the STUFF. and my fire isn’t due to redbulls, it’s due to me freaking about about my transfer admission (whether or not I get into some schools I’ve applied to transfer to)

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Awful smell of nerd from these comments….

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Jukai……your problem (and the problem of many of the commenters here) is that if you disagree with one part of an argument……you are looked at as disagreeing with the entirity of if. That’s just stupid…..as most of those people are. Of course Allen has to shoulder some form of the blame NOW…..when he has nowwhere left to turn accept passing blame……but how does his “little good soldier” routine that he tried to act out for the better part of this season (as it was thouroughly discussed by SLAM’s own biggest Pistons fan TADONE)give him the burden of “ruining his legacy” today? He played a role for 50 odd games….he didn’t mesh well with the team….he’s not the same type of player Chauncey is…..HE DID NOT ASK TO BE THERE….but he did what he does….which is try to be a high volume scorer on a team that needed (and still does) an anchor at that spot. It’s a cop out excuse to say now he’s “quitting” on the team……the team quit on itself back in January, he’s kind of following suit.

  • scott

    Cleveland is going to win the East. The LA Lakers are coming out of the West. Cleveland will knock off LA in the Finals. I am most certain of this and finally all the debate of who is better between Kobe and LeBron can end. LeBron James your 09 regular season and Finals MVP.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    200th! :)

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Eboy 10:34:”And AI has been wronged in Detroit…..not the other way around…..anyone that thinks different just doesn’t get the business side of the league”
    -
    Eboy 11:14:”Jukai……your problem (and the problem of many of the commenters here) is that if you disagree with one part of an argument……you are looked at as disagreeing with the entirity of if. That’s just stupid”
    -
    !?

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Guess they should all retire…

  • scott

    The DBZ movie looks horrible.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Yeah Izzo, and this here Nerd will dunk on your butt. Got a problem with that?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Izzo, I wouldn’t expect you to understand the innerworkings of business transactions and their effect on it’s parties….you’re not old enough to collect paychecks yet, are you? Does Ireland have child labor laws?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Darksaber:The butt part,yes.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Good one Izzo…

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Not to get on the whole Iverson topic again, but I don’t think he ruined his legacy. Quite the contrary—he just reinforced it further.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    E: That….actually….makes some sense. There is a ton of finger pointing going on around Auburn Hills these days. The bad part is that you can make an argument for just about anyone you point a finger at. However, the media likes to be able to pinpoint a certain target and throw their scorn that way because it is easier. Iverson is an easy target.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    And the Zephyrs have a shot at the playoffs, right? They’re what, like 2-1?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Eboy:Great stuff.Almost as good as the :”trust me,I know this” argument.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Justin: ok i found images of the Kat. Not my cup of tea, i prefer hotties with less ink on their skin. I can see the appeal she has though.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Finally, someone needs to sneak into the Q and burn those Godawful yellow “alternate” uniforms.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Whatever…..TAD….I know you (like alot of us) are just dissapointed that AI didn’t pan out the way we thought it might have. He’ll be somewhere else next season….hopefully somewhere his skills will fit. And hopefully the Pistons can get someone in that spot that can make this whole mess disapeer.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Russ Bengtson (t before s, right?) in da hizzle!

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Naah, first someone needs to go into Brons’s locker, and burn those ghastly St. Paddy’s Zoom VI’s he wore with the non matching home uniforms a few weeks ago.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Okay, I’ll bite. 1- The Cavs have not been playing very good defense lately. They are vulnerable to bigs running down the floor and planting themselves underneath the basket. Z can’t catch up and teams are noticing. That worries me. They’ll have face agile and nimble bigs in the playoffs in Pau, Lamar, KG, Powe, Dwight… / 2- Mike Brown doesn’t have a set rotation yet. Sometimes he plays 8 guys, sometimes 10. Sasha might no play for weeks then go on a run of 20+ mins a game. Andy V, Joe Smith, Wally and Sasha should be the rotation. I’d really like for Boobie to not touch the floor in the playoffs and the Cavs have always been known for throwing a lot of bigs at you.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Izzo…..are you still talking?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    To put it in NBA terminology, AI is who he is. And sure, Detroit knew that. They knew he’s a high-volume scorer who likes to dominate the ball and play big minutes and, um, play every game like it’s his last. They also knew he was in the last year of his contract, and if it didn’t work out he’d just come off the cap. At the same time, I guess they thought that after a so-so run in Denver that AI would be willing to compromise his game somewhat and buy into a team concept that had resulted in quite a few deep playoff runs. Oops.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Exactly Russ…..they made a poor assumption…..and AI didn’t play the savior role. I think their poor assumption outwighs his inability to conform to some degree.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    @Izzo:Yes, E’s self contradictions are becoming the thing that legends are made of. I’m starting to see him as Slamonline’s version of Dubya.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    To be fair, AI DID compromise his game when he first got to Detroit and pretty much played that way for a good portion of the season. However, him and Rip just couldn’t find a decent amount of chemistry on the court and Stuckey was, for better or worse, the de facto starter and wasn’t going back to the bench. I always thought that Rodney should have been the one to either stay on the bench or go back to the bench, but Curry thought otherwise. I’m thinking if this was done earlier, then a lot of this mess could have been avoided.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Was Iverson really a failure as a player in Detroit before the injuries?
    I mean, he put up 18 and 5 on 42 or 41 percent from the floor, for a team that plays at the slowest pace in the league.
    Doesn’t that seem about right as far as stats for him?
    I’m not blaming Joe D or Curry. Everybody on the Pistons team failed this year, EVERYBODY.
    But, I think anybody who expected AI to average 25 a game really hasn’t watched the Pistons in about 5 years.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I mean, didn’t 90 percent of the people that discuss/write NBA basketball for a preofession think this was doomed to fail from the jump? Why is it a surprise now that it didn’t and is ending ugly?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    B…..I get paid….rather well, for that type of thinking. Thanks for playing, broham.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    No, I think they’re split more evenly than that. Let’s say you’re a hotshot lawyer at a small firm who takes on every case that comes in. You stay up all night four nights a week, do all your own research, spend every day in court. You lose some, but generally speaking you do pretty well. And a bigger, more successful firm notices and makes you an offer you can’t refuse. They’re in a big building, with all kinds of assistants and clerks and interns and stuff. You get there, and you insist on STILL doing everything yourself, despite the fact that you have all these resources at your disposal, because, hey, this is the way you do things, this is the way you’ve ALWAYS done things, and damned if you’re gonna change. That’s not the firm’s fault. Individual responsibility, look into it.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    boom. roasted.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    The Pistons proably shouldn’t have traded for AI in the first place, but this episode doesn’t reflect terribly well on him, either. Nobody wins. Except Chauncey Billups.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    I think people who say Iverson didn’t compromise didn’t watch enought Pistons games.
    I watched most of the early games, and it was obvious Iverson was shooting less, working harder on defense and trying to just fit in.
    But they wanted him to play the one and replace Chauncey Billups when he first got to the team. Then they had Prince play the one and they ran he and Rip off screens.
    Ultimately the problem is that Iverson’s defiencies as a players were more problematic in the style of play that Curry wanted to play.
    I think NBK pointed out a while back that the Pistons needed to run more and figure out a way to let Iverson get his shots and create offense. We saw it a few times, namely that big Lakers victory, but most of the time the Pistons suffered from an overall lack of effort and lack of cohesion.
    Iverson bears some blame for not conforming, but few stars in the league “conform.”
    In fact, somebody name the last time a “star” conformed on a team. I’d say maybe Ray Allen in Boston, but other than that, I’m at a loss. And even Ray had one of his worst statistical years last year trying to fit in.
    Superstars are used to getting lots of shots, and their games are often predicated on that. Remember Jordan in Washington and how he caused problems with that team’s chemistry?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    I think AI to Detroit was mentally challenged. AI is literally the EXTREME opposite of the Detroit system- how was that supposed to work?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    *Forehead slap*

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    That’s not a fair comparison, Russ. I get what your trying to say in theory…..but the fact that an imaginary attorney tries to do EVERYTHING for a client is desirable, usually. Most people don’t trust their cases in the hands of assistants and paralegals when you are paying top dollar for that attorney’s time….not theirs.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: The problem with you (and a lot of other posters) is that when I disagree with you on one thing, you think I’m disagreeing with you on everything. EVERYTHING you said about AI is correct. That doesn’t give AI the right to whine and mope about it. Is ANYONE ELSE on Detroit threatening to RETIRE if their demands aren’t met? Is anyone else on Detroit crying foul saying they can’t play like that?
    No one but AI.
    Who has every excuse in the world and 99% of everyone on his side and is still crying about it.
    THAT’S what upsets me about AI.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Jordan more or less ruined the Wizards for a decade because of his vast ego and abrasive personality. Of course he also won six championships in his prime and was the best player in NBA history, so I guess you could forgive him that unless you were a Wizards fan. Or Kwame Brown.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    E, AI’s skills fit anywhere. Who doesn’t need a cold-blooded scorer? His perception of the game and his attitude prevents that. AI should be a point guard. He can do it, he has the vision, he has the skills, he can hit teammates. It would be so much easier to make him fit if he wasn’t so stubborn on playing wing. This is just an opinion and I have no facts but I believe that AI would have had way more team success in his career if he would have been a full time 1. Which doesn’t really mean that he would have scored less.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    @E:So did Dubya. Just saying…lol.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: I never saw Iverson try and work harder on defense, but hey, I didn’t watch many Pistons games.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    And someone mentioned AI’s 20 million dollar deal as some piece of a horrible puzzle that AI created….so I think Joe D wanted to see THAT guy….the deadly shooting AI, 20 million dollars worth still-legendary AI in his teams colors and not some watered down version he turned into due to the system and the roster. It just wasn’t going to work both ways.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    If one were to look objectively at the efforts of Allen Iverson and the Detroit Pistons system over the past decade, you’d notice that the former resulted primarily in individual accomplishments, while the latter resulted in an NBA Championship and multiple trips to the Eastern Conference Finals. The one time an Iverson-led team made it to the Finals, the entire team was subservient to him—getting him shots and doing everything he didn’t want to. There was no way the Pistons would all of a sudden drop everything to try that. Not to mention it was almost a decade ago.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Joe D could care less…he’s thinking about 2010. Why? I don’t know. Not sure any star FA’s are coming to the D.

  • Jackie Moon

    Eboy – so, does this mean people who said the Cavs weren’t that great are owed an “apology”? No. It’s just one game. In the same vein, when the Lakers lose two games on the road, it doesn’t automatically make them the next 2006 Mavericks.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    AI wasnt going to fit in in Detroit. He wont fit in anywhere else that has championship aspirations. ‘His way’ has only worked once. Ever.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Can I ask a silly question? Did Allen ever really say he wss GOING to definitley retire? You know……walk away when we all know he can play a couple of more seasons at a productive level. Or was he just throwing words around out of frustration/bruised pride on that particular day? I know the answer…but I want to see If I’m the only one that does.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    You’ll get a kindly worded apology Jackie….once the Lakers overtake the Cavs for best record in the league again. Love, Eboy.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Pride can be a persons downfall, especially an elite athlete.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: You don’t know the answer, idiot. No one but AI knows the answer.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Iverson has made that threat numerous times over the course of his career and now that said time is actually drawing near and its decision time, hes still saying the same thing. Doesnt sound like anyone just throwing words around. Especially someone as stubborn/resilient as Allen Ezail Iverson.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    AI said long ago that he’d retire before he came off anyone’s bench. This was long before he became a Piston.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    So Jukai….you think he’ll hang it up for good in 4 weeks? Explain why he would?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    The peeps at basketbawful are calling him the Canswer. Sorta witty, in a morbid way.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    This was still a very good trade for Joe D. Let’s be real, the Pistons were not going to win it all with Chauncey. They were so blasé and their window of opportunity with that core was already shut. Detroit needed to retool and be a player in the upcoming (09 and 10) free agents bidding war. He had a chance to acquire a very popular guy ($) and mix things up to see if he could work. The Pistons needed scoring and creativity and AI can score and create off the bounce. Makes sense, didn’t work but made sense. AI and Sheed will walk this summer and the Pistons will have TONS of cap space to rebuild around Stuckey, Rip and Tayshaun. Everybody thought it was a good plan then even if AI didnt work out. Why is it not a good plan anymore?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: If he can’t get the right money and the right situation, expect him to take a ‘hiatus’ from basketball next season.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    E, I agree with that. If you were to look at his complete comments, he was just frustrated and speaking out of frustration. However, people only pick and choose what part of the comments make their argument more valid.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    So….he’ll be free of the Pistons in a couple of weeks and will have probably 6-8 teams in the league who would offer him a starting spot and probably 15 others who would give him 35 minutes plus on their squads…..for a decent NBA salary….yet this could be his last handful of games in his career. Seriously?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Iverson told me repeatedly a long time ago—for the OG “Soul on Ice” cover story—that his favorite player in the L was Latrell Sprewell. This is a guy who walked away from a guaranteed $21 million contract because it was insulting. I have no doubt in my mind that AI would walk away this summer without a second thought.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Z…..you are right…..it was a good move for the Pistons future…..definitley.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Please name the “6-8 teams in the league who would offer him a starting spot.” And how many of them would offer him a multi-year deal for more than the mid-level (or even the veteran’s minimum).

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I certainly think Iverson would walk as well. I also think the competitor in AI wouldn’t allow his conscience to make such a hasty decision.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Russ: I’d name them but I can’t pronounce their European names.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    How many teams with championship aspirations would take a chance on Allen Iverson at this point? The most reasonable scenario someone has come up with yet is David Alrdidge suggesting the BETcats, which is a lateral move at best. As long as Iverson refuses to subjugate his game for the good of a team and/or come off the bench, his dreams of winning a title will be just that and these very well might be his last games. He cant have it both ways.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Well….Russ makes a pretty strong statement with that Latrell comparision…..but AI is not the polarizing figure Spree was……I mean….AI is still beloved beyond belief (hello, 2009 All-Star game).

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Russ, I’ll name one- Dallas. Cuban offers huuuge contracts to walking piles of trash (Erik Dampier, Shawn Bradley, Desagana Diop, Raef, and more) why wouldnt Cuban sign AI?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Myles/Russ/TAD/Eboy/Z: you want to know what’s sort of sad?
    Outside of the Cats, I tried to think of where would be a great spot for Iverson to get signed with over the summer.
    I came up with two locations.
    Detroit and Denver.
    No, seriously.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    There aren’t many teams that would have him starting. Charlotte is one. We all know Cuban loves the big name attractions. With Wade more or less running the point in Miami, they could certainly use more scoring punch. Toronto tried out Jermaine O’Neal, so why not AI?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    As several people have pointed out, Iverson has been adamant and clear about how he wants to end his NBA career. And it’s not in the backseat. That was common knowledge well before he got to Detroit.
    Second, I read the comments from Iverson, I didn’t see him threaten anyone. I saw him say that this was a learning experience for him regarding what he is willing to do to get a ring. Some folks are willing to do anything, other people want to do it their own way.
    I can’t debate the point that Detroit had a better run without Iverson than with him. That’s obvious.
    It’s also a ridiculously simplistic way to look at where Detroit was before Iverson appeared and where they are now. Before Iverson, they had very little cap room and were not true contenders in the minds of most fans. Now, they may be a bottom feeding lottery team, but they have rougly $30 million in cap space and a legit young rotation with veteran help. That is a perfect position in today’s NBA.
    I said from the beginning Joe D made this trade for the future. He understood that his team was not going ot win a ring with Billups at the one, and that he was going to be on the hook for Billups’ massive contract for years. So, he shook things up. This year that failed, but he still has a lot of postives to fall back on.
    Finally, I think that it’s incredibly difficult to built a team around a 6-foot shooting guard, but it’s not impossible. Hell, Gilbert Arenas is basically the same player that Iverson is with a better shooting touch and less explosiveness, and the Wizards just committed $100 million to him.
    Iverson can still be an effective number two option, if the team understands his strentghs and takes advantage of them. I don’t think most teams are interested in doing that though because of hte perceptions about his attitude.
    But, having watched many Iverson games, I have seen him do a decent job in Detroit of trying to be a good soldier, I’ve seen far more pouting and BS from the veteran Pistons who didn’t want the Billups trade in the first place.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Jason Kidd + Allen Iverson = Backcourt FAIL.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    No way Toronto grabs AI. A team that depends on a dominant point guard over controlling the ball as everyone else runs around the same lanes that AI NEEDS to run around in? C’mon TAD….

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    And Gilbert Arenas just might be the most untradable contract in the league.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Myles, I know, but this is Cuban, the guy who had over 100 million dollars in his starting frontcourt of Erik Dampier and Diop. He’s not afraid to load up on it.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I’m grasping at straws here, Jukai. Give me some leeway.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Toronto would be a good fit if they had defenders. But, that team is too soft and Colangelo still wants shots for Andrea. However, that would be a good location for AI. He could have Marion’s money.
    Bobcats are a good fit as well, but I said a long time ago that there are not many teams that could fit Iverson into their schemes. This is nothing new.
    However, we shall see if he maintains his hardline stance on starting next season. He could adapt and be willing to play a Manu role. Remember, the problem in Detroit is not just coming off the bench, it’s who he’s coming off the bench behind, and how many total minutes he is playing.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    The Knicks would maybe give AI a one-year “bridge to LeBron” deal, but would he accept that? And I never said he was the polarizing figure Spree was (although judging from these discussions of late, maybe he is), just that Spree was the guy he idolized. He’s driven by pride. He’s made it this far—to icon and sure Hall of Famer—by not budging an inch, and he sure as hell isn’t going to change now.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    You guys are stealing my answers! The Knicks(as someone pointed out earlier)would be a good spot as any. And really….is anyone at this point of his career thinking that AI is going to be on some Kobe/Lebron/Wade type sh*t and just will a franchise to a Finals appearance like it was 2001 again?….I mean c’mon now. He’s going to be a piece in a scheme….it just needs to be the right sort of scheme for it to be attractive to fans and players alike.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Also, no one can deny the gate attraction of having Allen Iverson on your team. With that said, would New Orleans be completely out of the question?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Myles
    I’m not saying Gilbert deserved $100 million, I’m saying that he’s the same player Iverson is, and people still think his game can create success.
    So, why wouldn’t they think that about Iverson?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I know you didn’t make that leap about AI, Russ…..I just said it in context of my comment. No harm meant.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Seriously, what is wrong with Detroit and Dallas?
    Detroit is missing a go-to scoring punch. Andre Miller is a great, big defensive point who can guard the two, Iggy performed well enough on AI’s backseat and the dude probably wont complain to much with his big ass contract, Elton Brand is perfect for Iverson’s drop-off assists to the basket, and Dalembert well, he’s worthless now, so it doesn’t matter. Bring Thad as a sick sixth option off the bench and you have a great team.
    Denver, all the same. Billups, Iverson, AND Carmello? Good lord. I know you think, “where are the shots going to come from” but Iverson can score in transition and if the tempo slows, Billups can control the ball and distribute evenly. I like this team.
    Maybe I’m just finding this ironically fantastic so I’m looking too much at the pros.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Its entirely possible that the book has been closed on both of them this year.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    AI in Golden State. Nellie would have a heart attack 10 games into the season.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Myles, could the Gilbert contract look just as bad as the Allan Houston contract down the road if Gilbert can’t recover?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    On who Myles? AI and Gil?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Russ: You know, I know it sounds ridiculous having Paul and Iverson in the backcourt… but I’d love to see it anyawy!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Philly WOULD be intriguing.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    TAD
    Chris Paul and Iverson is a fail.
    Bobcats, Raptors, maybe Knicks. Philly would be a decent fit if Igoudala didn’t have a massive ego.
    If Nelson isn’t right physcially, Orlando could look into Iverson as well. But that’s far-fetched. Iverson’s size and need to play the two make him a tough fit, but not impossible. I think it’s harder to fit him in if he continues to say he will not come off the bench, period. If he’s willing to come off the bench and still play 30-35 minutes a night, like Manu and JT, then I think some teams will consider him.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Yup and yup.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Eboy, Michael Tillery said he thinks AI could end up in Philly next year.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    I can see Toronto and Charlotte too. NY at the midlevel? AI in Mike D’s offense would be intriguing. Orlando could use him but that backcourt would be way too tiny.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Detroit would have to trade Rip if they were to keep Iverson. Probably fire Curry, too. And not re-sign Rasheed. All that to appease an undersized guard with about a billion miles on him? I don’t see it. AI’s just about the worst kind of guy you could have on your team—an aging superstar who still thinks he should be able to play the same way (and the same minutes) as he did when he was 25. He’s a little Shaq. And I don’t think it’s a coincidence that both of their teams are marginalized.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    No way AI goes to the Magic either, the Magic’s entire offense is based around centering Howard and having spot-up shooters in position to score fast when Howard kicks out. AI has been an awful spot-up shooter throughout his career. Bad bad move. Raptors is a fail, scroll up.
    Knicks and Bobcats are a good fit but on no-win teams. I’m not throwing out Philly or Denver.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    How many teams want to give up 30% of their possessions to a 40% shooter?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I can’t imagine AI playing in an offense that already has Dwight Howard, Rashard Lewis and Hedo. They need a setup point and a strong defensive two who can knock down open shots and slash.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    The Heat could…….no, they better not, actually.

  • https://twitter.com/TheDiesel Anton

    Carlos Boozer’s wife filed for divorce. The last straw was when she asked him to play defense.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    How about the Kings?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Guys, can we make a rule? If you don’t watch teams (IE about none of you watch Toronto or Orlando, apparently) then don’t claim Iverson should head over there. Some of the things you’re suggesting makes absolutely no sense.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Anton: AHHAAHHAAHHAHAAH

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I still like the idea of Phoenix going for broke with All-Star 2000. Nash, AI, Shaq, Grant Hill, and, say, Juwan Howard.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: so do the Kings trade away Martin to accomodate AI or do we want to see Rip/AI 2.0??

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Philly is brilliant. It makes way too much sense to actually happen. / Gil is a 1, that changes everything. AI playing the 2 means that your defense is always messed up because he can’t guard his position. Stan Van Gundy once said that in the NBA, your position is who you’re able to guard. That’s why Beasley and Bargs are bigs, that’s why Corliss Williamson had to play the 3 and that’s why AI should have been a 1.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    I think that Jameer Nelson is actually a less talented version of Allen Iverson with a slightly better jumpshot and less athletic ability.
    I think the Magic have made a mistake by allowing Hedo so much free reign in their offense, and if they give him a big contract this offseason, they will have serious problems.
    If the Magic were smart, they would try to package Hedo with Jameer for a solid four, move Rashard back to the three and sign Iverson. Iverson creates spot up looks for shooter, Kyle Korver, and he creates easy looks inside of big mean because of his slashing.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Well….the Maloofs like to gamble.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: that plan is incredibly, incredibly…. well I just don’t agree with it. At all.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    A 60 win team should trade their younger, more selfless point guard to take a chance on Allen Iverson?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Hedo and Jameer for Boozer?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Myles, I just laughed because of how obvious you make it.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Trade D-will for Chris Quinn and I’d be ecstatic. Quinn seems like a Sloan-type of guy…..

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    GTFOH

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    I think the Magic should not do anything. Jameer is far from a top PG but he fits fine with the Magic. I actually think he’s better at doing his job as a SF than Rashard is at being a PF. Use this postseason as a yardstick to see how far their current team can go, and add a piece or two in the offseason and can contend in the near future.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Jukai, I get every Raptors game. Every single one. Toronto doesn’t play any defense so that’s not a concern. AI would be a GOD in T.O., I’m dead serious. BG wants the Raptors to speed things up and push the pace . There will be enough shots for AI, Bosh and Bargs with Calderon setting up everybody.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    TRADE AI TO THE CELTICS!!!

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Jordan’s still the best comparison for AI. Which is a compliment of course, but the root of the problem. When Mike came back the last time, he would have been amazing as a sixth man, or the second or third option on a good team—he could have won more rings. Imagine if he went to the Lakers and played the three? But he (or anyone else) couldn’t imagine THE BEST PLAYER EVER coming off the bench or deferring to anyone. His ego couldn’t allow it. So they gutted the Wizards of anyone who’d dare challenge him and filled the rest of the roster with deferential types. MJ got what he wanted, stayed the alpha dog, and missed the playoffs twice. Will a team be willing to do the same for AI?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    I watch both Toront and Orlando.
    Here’s what I know abotu both teams.
    Orlando allows Hedo and Jameer far too many opportunities to free lance off the bounce and both of them take way too many shots. Dwight can be effective against wack centers, but struggles when they run the offense through him against big bruisers becuase he lacks lower body strength. So, acquiring a guard who constantly attacks the rim, causing offensive rebounds and easy dump offs, is a great thing. Plus, it opens things up even more for spot up shooters like Shard.
    Toronto has Calderon with the ball, WAY too much. He over dribbles, and takes far too many contested three pointers, in my opinion. He would benefit from having somebody to take the ball handling pressure off him in the halfcourt who could also create more open shots for him. Bosh would love playing with a penetrator who could give him drop off passes at the elbow for open jumpers. Anthony Barker would benefit from the spot up shots, as would Andrea. The real problem would be defense and rebounding, but that’s a problems now. Space the floor, allow Iverson to attack, you still have shooters and a distributor in Calderon. You also can post Bosh against lesser defenders and force the defense to respect Iverson on the kickout and subsequent scramble/slash.
    So, what am I missing?

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    We still doing April Fools?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    I let my feeling be known about Iverson yesterday. All i am gonna say now is: YES YES YES!!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    In Michael’s defense…..his two Wizard years…..at his advanced age….still showed him being more productive than 95% of the two guard in the league at the time. But those years never happened.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Ive and Larry reunited? Yikes!

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    i am in da libary working on my espanoel project on the Dominican Republic. My famous person is Manny Ramirez!

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Allen, you’re being delusional. Jameer is a point. AI is not and doesn’t want to be one. It’s irelevant that he is not as good as AI because Jameer is willing to play his position. They can’t be compared. AI has to be compared with 2-guards and as a 2-guard, he doesn’t fit at all in Orlando.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @Allenp: Interesting comparison between Jameer and AI; I think he’s closer to Mighty Mouse actually, in stature and playing style.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Z: that’s ridiculously dumb. AI can’t play off the ball, dude. I’m sure you watch ALL the Toronto games but you gotta watch more Allen Iverson games. They tried to spot him up shooting at Denver and it failed bad. They tried running him off the ball in Detroit and it failed.
    Sorry, failed is a strong word. It didn’t fail, but it wasn’t really impressive. Wasn’t really helping the team. The Raptors are ONLY good when Calderon controls the ball, the entire team is filled up with people who can’t create their own shots (Parker, Marion) or bigs who don’t need AI in the first palce (Bosh, Bargs). Everyone on the Raps are cutting or running somewhere, exactly where AI needs free reign at. Your point of: THEY BOTH DON’T PLAY DEFENSE SO IT’D BE GREAT is so flawed on so many levels, it’s downright never going to happen.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Overdribbles and takes far too many contested shots? Hmmmm….At this point the only person Id trade Allen Iverson for is Michael Vick.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    That Orlando thing would be great if AI was 25 years old and willing to defer. He’s neither. And playing AI and Calderon in the same backcourt means it’s Christmas every day for opposing backcourts. Which one of them checks LeBron again? Dwyane Wade could pencil himself in for four 50-point games a year.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jameer Nelson has been injured every year in the league.
    He came into the league as a shooter, and has never averaged more than six assist despite playing with one of the best big men in the league and deadly shooters in a wide open offense.
    He’s a bad defender, a shoot first point guard, and he’s injury prone. You’re telling me that trading Jameer Nelson and Hedo for a rebounding power foward with a decent elbow jumper is a bad move?
    Ok, let’s put it this way. Can a starting five of Howard, Nelson, Hedo, Shard and Pietrus win a ring? What’s their window?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I gotta say….with how this day started out in comments….it sure turned into a good basketball conversation.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Looking at all of this and thinking, the two most likely destinations are Philly and Charlotte, for obvious reasons. It is really strange to be talking about a sure fire HOF and being unable to find a willing team to take him on.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    dang skippy E

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    “Ok, let’s put it this way. Can a starting five of Howard, Nelson, Hedo, Shard and Pietrus win a ring? What’s their window?” Allen’s got a point.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: Orlando’s success has come from Hedo and Jameer controlling the ball. The Raptors ONLY win when Calderon overcontrols the ball… their winning streak has Calderon with career high assists. Just because “you don’t like it” doesn’t mean it’s not the correct way the team should go in

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I think that Chauncey Billups is actually a less talented version of Allen Iverson with a slightly better jumpshot and less athletic ability.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Allen, maybe that’s just me, but I’m not comfortable criticizing the shot selection and the decision making of a guard with 50-41-98 percentages and a league leading 4.05 asst/TO ratio.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Charlotte is pretty damn intriguing too….cause they are right on the cusp of being solid…..and maybe one year of AI and a ton of excitement to the squad lifts the entire culture up for years to come……or maybe AI is Poison Ivy 2.0 there too?

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    Toronto doesn’t need another chucker. Sorry, but no thanks. And when your point guard has a 4+ assists-to-turnover ratio, you WANT him to have the ball… a lot. Toronto has a lot of problems but Jose isn’t one of em.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    He will be a Cat. We need him as much as he needs us. Just look at what LB does with disgruntled players. Diaw, Bell, Vlad-Rad, and Diop are all playing out of their minds for LB right now. Put Iverson in their, and we are like the 5th seed in the East with at least 1 all star, if not 2 (GERALD!!!!). BRING HIM!

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Are Iggy and Brand gonna dig having a 5’9 ball hog take away their touches?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    That has to be sarcasm, Russ.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allen, you’re just WAYYYY off here. Orlando has the fourth best record in the league. Why the hell would they trade away their second (Hedo) and fourth (Jameer) best player. I’m totally not feeling you here.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    lmao @ russ

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’d like to know how AI taking shots away from Hedo, Rashard and Dwight would be a good thing. I mean, they’re 55-19 right now, right? Where’s the problem?

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    Good grief I know this borders on the geeky, but Jose Calderon is hitting 98% of his free throws this season. He’s actually putting up Stocktonesque FG% and 3P% numbers too.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Maybe he should come to Minnesota. The Vikings still need a quarterback.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    Does Toronto play defense now? You’re telling me Anthony Parker and Calderon have opposing teams worried?
    I’m not saying Orlando would keep Iverson for ever, but right now, they are not contenders and there team is playing its second best player out of position for the forseeable future. Shard needs to get back to the three, where he is a problem instead of trying to be a four. Hedo and Jameer shoot way too much and most of their shots are long three pointers! Sure, Iverson is a gunner, but he’s not taking a bunch of long threes, which kill your defense and discourage your big man.
    Jukai, playing off the ball does not require you to be a spot up shooter. More importantly, Iverson had good success at the two in Denver even with Steve Blake and Anthony Carter playing the one. Both players actually had CAREER years playing alongside Iverson.
    I’m not saying Iverson is a perfect fit, but I think y’all are overestimating Jameer and Hedo. Hedo is an expiring contract, Jameer is undersized, injury-prone and SHOOT FIRST.
    Honestly, what is Jameer’s ceiling? Do we see him getting much better than he is right now? How? Do we think his body will hold up? I’m not sure about those questions, but I know that if I was the Magic I would want to contend NOW, before Lebron and DWade get all their help in place and Dwight is locked out forever. And before the Sixers and Hawks get their coaching situations together.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    random update for yall, but did you guys know Ty Lawson got caught gambling at a casino in Detroit last night? it’s not illegal the way he did it or anything, but people are freaking out because it’s “OMG THE PLAYER PLAYING THE BEST IS GAMBLING IN THE FINAL FOUR AND HE’S AN AMATEUR ATHLETE OMFG”

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Bobcats are probably the best fit. They’ve got LB—the one guy AI’s been willing to listen to—and a cast of characters who all make more sense as beta dogs. And if he doesn’t work out, they can always feed him to Sean May.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    55-19

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Jukai, Russ : it’s already X-Mas for opposing backcourts. The Raptors hneed someone to create O from the wings. The Raptors would not need to spot up or run him off the ball. They would need him to break down defenses from the wings in the halfcourt offense. Which is exactly what he has been doing his whole life. He would fit BETTER with Philly, that’s for sure but I can see Toronto working and by working, I mean being exciting and making the playoffs. Every team doesn’t play for a championship, it’s absurd to believe that anyone can win it. There’s like 4 teams who are serious contenders every year. Not winning a chip is not a failure for an organization.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Maybe the Zenmaster can convince Ive that he is bringing more to the Lakers by playing on the second squad. Phil:” So you see Allen, it’s like the team is yours, but you just go in later in the game. Shoot all you want”. Sold!!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Nice.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    That’s why Russ get’s paid for this sh*t! Oh man…..I’m fu*king crying at my desk right now.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    I’ve watched Calderon, and I don’t like his shot selection. Honestly, I don’t think he should be starting, but since everybody loves him, it’s whatever. I think Calderon is overrated, despite his gaudy numbers. When I watch him play, I don’t see him leave his imprint on most games. Every once in a while, he’ll kill, but a lot of the time he’s just out there.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    That’s actually not that crazy either, Zee.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Zee: Brand never got touches anyway on Phili’s offense. The problem would be Iggy. I’m not sure how much he’d dig that. If Iverson came back to Phili, it wouldn’t be the line-up that kills them, it’d be chemistry.
    The top five (and probably only) teams that I can think of Iverson signing with:
    1) Bobcats
    2) Phili
    3) New York
    4) Detroit
    5) uhm…. damn…. damn =/

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’m not denying that the Raptors need help at the 2, but AI? Seriously? I mean, sure, if you want to MAKE Chris Bosh leave.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Has anyone considered that Terrance and Philip will be starting in the backcourt for Toronto before AI would be willing to move to effing Canada?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’m also pretty amused by the Gilbert references, as the Wizards have been pretty much a total fail.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai and Russ
    Orlando needs a real power forward, NOW. This Rashard at the three thing is horrible. Can you imagine if Dwight had somebody like Lamarcus Aldridge? Somebody with that skill set? Crazy.
    The Magic need to figure out a way to get a power forward who can rebound, shoot jumpers, and defend. Their two best assests are Hedo and Jameer because Shard’s contract is ridiculous.
    They don’t have to get Iverson, but if they want to suceed, I think they need to get a four from somewhere.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Toronto is horrible to Bosh as a whole (the fans I mean). Knowing them, they could cheer Bosh getting traded, then be totally fine with AI driving the raptors to 6-76

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Z: It’s no surprise that when Toronto wins, Calderon’s minutes and assists are all higher than when they don’t. I like the way he leads, I like the way he runs the team. Your team CANNOT create offense, but Iverson is not the answer. Iverson can FIND people if he can’t score, he cannot create scoring opportunities. Sorry sir.
    Allenp: You’re so wrong I can’t even start.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Co-sign Allenp.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Russ, I’m sure Joe Dumars is tickled at that possibility….

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Comparing the ’01 Sixers to the ’09 Cats: PG- Felton/Eric Snow, SG- Iverson, SF- Aaron McKie/ Gerald Wallace, PF- Diaw/Ty Hill, C- Dikembe/ Okafor

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    And the Raptors are on a roll of late. Awesome.

  • http://mynameinblue@blogspot.com Hisham

    This thread IS going to make 1000.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Allen, you’re missing the point. AI is a 2, stop comparing him to Jameer. Jameer works because he brings the ball up for them and knows his role. He’s shoot first but he is hitting 50% of his shots and 45% of his 3s. Shard at the 4 works because it stretches the defense and Howard covers for him on the boards. The Magic ARE a contender with Jameer and they will be for the upcoming years. They are part of the NBA elite and have no use for AI.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    A Terrance & Phillip reference is like a breath of fresh, Canadian air!!!!!!

  • http://mynameinblue@blogspot.com Hisham

    With both Teddy AND Jukai in here

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    My point on the Wizards references was that apparently there is a market for 43 percent shooters who average 6 assists.

  • Gaz

    Al is better than Jameer.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: I’m not denying that the Magic need a legit four. I think giving up both JAMEER (yes, a SHOOT FIRST point guard because the offense runs through HOWARD, not the point) and HEDO (the most clutch player on the team, yes, clutch) is too much for anyone outside of a super star. Those are both great team players who really do much more to the team than you realize. Jameer, while his injury problem is duly noted, is the best slasher on the team but also realizing he’s strong enough to score with contact. He’s not great at creating, but runs the break with enough proficiency that it doesn’t matter. I have no idea what your hate for Hedo is, he’s a great shooter and that’s what Orlando is built around.
    Getting AI is ridiculous. This is Howard’s team. AI would stall the kick-in-kick-out offense, UNLESS AI took a more off the ball approach with less minutes. It’s the only way it’d work. Even still, I don’t get rid of both Hedo and Jameer. One or the other.
    I mean, they have 55 wins!!

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Wasn’t it all good in T-Dot a year ago? They won their first playoff round, we’re all hyped like they were gonna do something….and now baby momma drama.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allen, have you ever been this critical of a 55 win team before??

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Basketball is too rigid with its formations. In football, you can choose to play with one or two strikers. Why couldn’t you choose to play with one big? Shard plays the 4 because you need someone labelled as a PF in an NBA starting line up. Essentially, the Magic are playing 4 dudes outside. And it’s been working for them. No need to change the system.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Z: We disagree on Toronto, but I’m with you 100% on the Magic thing. I’d keep building around the juggernaut, not change it.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    The St. Joe’s Jameer Nelson > Orlando Jameer Nelson?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Can we at least wait until 10PM EST before deciding whether to blow up the Magic? Or better yet, May?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    If you think Orlando is a serious contender, then that’s on you. I think they have a gaudy regular season record, and that’s it.
    Jameer is the point guard and he averages five assists. His shooting percentages have skyrocketed this year, and that’s impressive. But, was that aberration, or proof of what he’ll be moving forward. I don’t know.
    I think that Joel O is right, Jameer Nelson looks a lot like Damon Stoudamire.
    I don’t see the point in commiting to a core of Shard, Jameer, Hedo and Dwight moving forward. Of those four players, I would keep Dwight and Shard because of their talent and contracts. Hedo’s contract is expiring, but I think the Magic will stupidly resign him to a big deal. Jameer got his big deal last year.
    Look, there is NO WAY the Magic sign Allen Iverson. This was purely conjecture on my part regarding the team’s problems and how they are going to solve it. I’m shocked that so many of y’all think a core of Shard, Hedo, Nelson and Howard is a good idea.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    feed him to sean may…. Wow, Russ.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    You know what the Magic need to win a chip? They need Dwight to have actual moves on the block. It’s mind boggling that he’s putting up 22 a game and he doesn’t have a go-to move. What does he do during the summer?! He doesn’t have 3 hours in his day to work on a reliable jump hook?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    I have never had much good to say about the Suns. Their record masked a bunch of core problems that I thought would prevent them from ever winning a ring. Of course, I could have been wrong, but I wasn’t. Same thing with the Mavs, when they were winning 50 plus every year.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Z, It wouldn’t hurt for Dwight to work on his free throws either. But that won’t happen.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Well I’d also argue that their core problems was referees working for the mob, terrible lopsided basketball rulings, and always getting the Spurs in the playoffs, but yeah, you were so right man.
    You know the Magic have a chance of getting 50 wins, right?

  • Jukai

    I agree Allenp, after reading your comments. Allen Iverson IS better than the entire Phoenix Suns roster.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    getting 60 wins*

  • Gaz

    Good afternoon everybody.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com/ Moose

    Hibachi! Gilbert lighting it up!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    I think Dwight Howard needs to change his shooting form altogether

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    Dwight is not the problem.
    Have you ever noticed where Dwight gets his touches and how many touches he actually gets in a game.
    He’s getting the ball too far out on the block. He’s getting most of his easy dunks of carooms, not great passes.
    Let’s put Iverson aside for a minute and actually discuss Orlando as a team.
    Four three of the team’s starting five moving forward do not defend particularly well. Of those three, Jameer and Hedo appear to have reached their ceilings and have reasonable contracts. Remember, Hedo has been in the league for quite some time, and while his shooting has improved some, his game now is pretty much the same as it was in Sacremento with a little additional confidence.
    I’m not saying Jameer and Hedo are bad, I’m just saying that neither of them truly understands what their role should be on a team with the best center in the league. I don’t care about Dwight’s lack of great moves. He’s not as horrible as I once thought. What he suffers from is a lack of touches.

  • Jukai

    I agree, Allenp now that I’ve actually read what you’ve written. Allen Iverson IS better than the entire Suns roster.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Allen, it’s not a good idea, it’s an excellent idea. Jameer’s is not the best pg in the league but he does his job. Are you holding Mo Williams low assist numbers against him too? Jameer fits their system, moves the ball around and attacks the rim when he has to. I don’t see the point you’re trying to prove with Orlando. They’re not as good as the Cavs or the Lakers but they’re better than 25 teams in this league. How are they fvcking up? And NBA teams often understimate the advantages of a core playing together for an extended period of time. The team is built around Dwight and they put in pieces to complement him. I don’t know what’s there to criticize.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    The suns didn’t rebound or defend well. Both skills become increasingly important the further you go in the playoffs.
    The ref stuff and the Spurs were a problem, but the real problems, in my mind, were defense and rebounding. Strangely, the Spurs have traditionally done both of those things well.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Hey can you guys just find my comments on the ai thread yesterday especially you z.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    And, um, bringing in ALLEN IVERSON would give Dwight MORE touches?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Well, I’d say the real problem was the refs working for the mob, the lopsided NBA rulings, and the Spurs, but we look at different things, Allenp.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    newsflash- yall know how we said Lil Wayne is shooting his own people like how he’s gonna lose his fans and everything? He’s suing all the mixtape DJ’s that ever made mixtapes of him- INCLUDING DJ DRAMA. DJ Drama produced the dedication 1,2,3 and a few others WITH Lil Wayne and now he’s suing him for it. Wowwwwww. You gotta be kidding. Lil Wayne is screwed now, he’s going to lose looooads of fans

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    The Cavs don’t need to a point guard who distributes. That would only mess things up for Lebron. They need somebody who can shoot, and has confidence. Mo Williams fits the bill.
    The Magic need a distributor. Or, they need a scoring point guard who can dominate pretty much anybody. Jameer is neither. What they really do not need is a shoot first point, and a three who thinks he should be jacking long three pointers off the bounce early in the shot clock.
    The Magic have a good record. That’s wonderful. Personally I think their record is a result of Dwight’s committment to killing himself on the glass and on weakside defense, with a small assist to Jameer’ improved shooting.
    I think the Magic do not take full advantage of Dwight and I don’t see it happening until Jameer and Hedo change their games.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Justin: LIl Wayne has fans?

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com/ Moose

    ^Dedication 2 is the ish.^

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Worst-case scenario: The Magic give Jameer his starting job back next year, he gets hurt again, and they offer Nash the midlevel in the Summer of ’10. I’d rather pair him with Dwight and ‘Shard than AI.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com/ Moose

    400.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Justin:Good?
    Reading this discussion was pretty great.I tried to contribute and couldn’t(for the better some might say)by the time I was done typing,what I wrote about was two topics ago,at least.Everyone deserves a chest bump.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    And, as a Bulls fan, I would LOVE to have Orlando’s ‘problems.’

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    Moose, and DJ Drama DID dedication 2. that MADE his career hot and he’s SUING him

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Proof Allenp has never watched the Magic:
    -Magic do not need a point guard who can distribute. Team is working through Howard much like how LA worked through Shaq and Houston worked through Hakeem. Fisher and Cassel/Jet do nto distribute THAT much better than Jameer.
    -Jameer proved this year he pretty much CAN dominate pretty much anyone. If you believe this year was a fluke, that’s one thing. I don’t. So there you ahve.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    His lack of post game is the cause and not the effet of him not getting enough touches on the block. Getting the ball too far out is on him, he’s the one sealing his man. He gets a lot of points on his guys lobbing the ball over the defender fronting him, so it’s not just O boards. I didn’t say he was a problem, he’s their foundation and the main reason they’re such a great team. Without his rebounding, defensive presence and attention he draws inside, their system could not work. But he could improve certain aspects of his game and as the superstar of the team, of course he’s going to be judged more. Hedo, Rashard, Jameer they’re just pieces in the puzzle. We know what they are and we know their ceilings.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Has anyone noticed the odd routine Dwight and Hedo do when the opposing team has someone on the free throw line? Where they talk to the ball and smack it? I though I was seeing things the first time they did it, but they ALWAYS do it. WTF?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    I don’t think Iverson is the long term answer. The long term answer would be a point guard who knows his role, hits shots and feeds the big man the ball. Also, a defensive minded two guard who can hit open threes. And a power forward who likes to rebound, defend and make jumpers. Those are the perfect pieces.
    Iverson is a stop gap that frees up cap space until that point guard comes along, and possibly gives you a chance to contend. It’s a remote chance, but it’s a chance.
    I think committing long term to Shard, Hedo and Jameer is a massive mistake. I could be very wrong, but I don’t see that core producing a ring unless Dwight takes a MASSIVE leap forward.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Sorry, shoulda said Green/Fisher

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com/ Moose

    Yeah, JW. And I love Drama’s little yelling thing that he pulls…..saying random stuff. Nice.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    If I had the best rebounder in the NBA on my team, I wouldn’t worry so much about guys taking too many shots. And, um, when he got hurt, Jameer was shooting 50 percent from the floor and 45 percent from three. I’ll take that 17 days a week.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    The real benefit is packaging Hedo and Jameer for a decent big man. The Magic need one of those desperately. Hedo and Jameer are the pieces to do that. Iverson is the stopgap, the long term plan is to dump him for salary cap space and get a decent point and two guard to pair with your frontcourt talent.
    Why doesn’t this make sense to people?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Izzo….if you weren’t dru……oh, forget it. Jukai….when you say dominate and Jameer in the same sentence are you talking about creatine pill bottles?

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Allen, you do not get Orlando’s game at all. The 3′s are by design! They WANT to shoot 3′s early and as often as possible. Everybody ont that team that’s not a 5 is ENCOURAGED to shoot 3′s, that’s what they do. Jameer’s job is to bring it up and initiate the offense. The offense is based on ball movement not dribble penetration.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    The best places for iverson are either in charlotte with that backstabbing c*cksucker larry brown or in new york where he can get shine back playing in that offense and being the unquestioned go to guy.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    His shooting percentages were off the charts…
    And he played 42 games this season….
    I could be wrong. Jameer could continue to blossom, improve as a distributor and he and Dwight could be a great duo. But, I don’t really see it in him. I think he’ll always be solid, never truly great. He’d be fortunate to have Sam Cassell’s career, without the rings.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’d rather have Jameer than AI at this point. Straight up.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Eboy: sorry, I guess I imagined him averaging 17 points on 50/45/88 percent shooting.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    co-sign Russ@1:08

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Jameer just doesn’t give off the aura of destroyer of worlds or anything like that. He’s solid like Allen said….but he ain’t no lead guard to a title…let’s be real.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Even if they DID trade Hedo and Jameer for a traditional four (which I think is insane), they’d be better off turning the point over to Rafer and drafting or signing a young backup/heir. The only way I see AI on the Magic making any sense is if Dwight retires to pursue a career as a real superhero.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com/ Moose

    MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    You say stuff that has no basis in reality sometimes.
    The Lakers run the triangle. The triangle’s sole purpose is to create scoring opportunities for a post player, while maintaining spacing and ball movement. It’s BUILT for a big man to dominate.
    Kenny Smith passed the ball to the post and hit open jumpers. He did not take contested shots off the bounce. He spread the floor and moved the ball.
    Jameer is not that guy. He’s most effective when shooting. Only, he’s not the type of scorer that can carry you every game. Dwight needs better and more frequent touches to improve his confidence and establish his rhythm.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Those are dominant numbers Jukai….really?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Was Kenny Smith a lead guard to a title? Was B.J. Armstrong? Was Derek Fisher?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    The Magic’s offense is what it is because of the pieces they have, not because that’s just Stan Van Gundy’s philosophy.
    If they had better pieces, they’d have a different offense, in my opinion.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Yeah….I hope Russ isn’t trying to throw Dwight’s name in there with Hakeen, Michael or Shaq. Please. He wouldn’t do that…he’s too schooled in the game to say that.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Russ was trying to fool us, a couple of days after the fact….I got it now.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Another guy that wants to post up alongside Dwight is the last thing on SVG’s mind. They play with one big and that has been their plan from day 1. You want them to blow it up and play with two bigs and a point that sets the table for everybody because you’re want them to play a conventional style of ball.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Russ
    Is Jameer Nelson equivalent to Kenny Smith or B.J.?
    Is his game the same, does his success come from the same things?
    Is he an effective player without being a scorer first, distributor second?
    Can he be effective deferring consistently to Howard?
    This is the same problem Igoudala had in Philly. Certain players needs lots of shots and touches to be effective. Other players do not.
    You have to decide whether your player is worth all those touches. Is his ceiling high enough that he warrants dominating the ball and taking a lot of shots.
    I can see why people say Iverson doesn’t fit that bill. My opinions are obviously biased when it comes to him.
    But, I think y’all are delusional about the Magic’s team.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Z…..a team built around three point shooting is never going to win a title in this current NBA culture, at least anytime soon.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Dwight’s 23 years old. Twenty-three. Are you saying he’ll never be at that Hakeem/Shaq/Timmy level? Has he peaked? Is this all he’ll ever be? I just love the idea that the Magic should ditch a guy who’s just starting to blossom because he doesn’t give the ball to the unpolished 23-year-old rebounding machine yet. And I love the “fact” that apparently Jameer isn’t a lead guard to a title. Why couldn’t he be, if Dwight develops into what everyone thinks he can?

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    @Justin, the fans in toronto are horrible to Bosh? Huh?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    P.S. 55-19

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    E, why does he need to be lead guard for them to win a title? Can’t he just be a very good point guard playing on a great team? They have the 4th best point differential behing Cle, LA and BOS. They’re just fine. You guys want them to blow it up because they’re not as good as Cleveland and LA? Really?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Obviously the Magic would be much better if they had a starting lineup of Chris Paul, Dwyane Wade, LeBron James, Dwight Howard and Tim Duncan, but that’s probably not going to happen.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    Where did I suggest somebody to post up with Dwight?
    They need a four that allows Dwight to avoid guarding the best big man, that spaces the paint by being able to hid mid range jumpers, and who helps Howard on the glass. That’s it. If they can get that without trading Hedo or Jameer, they need to make that happen.
    I would trade Hedo or Jameer for somebody like Lamarcus Aldridge. I think trading both of them would be worth getting somebody like that. They are not the long term solution, so why hold on to them?
    The point is to win rings. Everything else is just making money. The objective is winning rings, and I’m not sure the Magic can do that with their current core.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    Bryan finally said what I was thinking the whole time I was reading your discussion. I can definitely see Allen in NY next year considering next season doesn’t even really count for the Knicks anyway. It would be the perfect risk/reward scenario for them. Pick up AI, let him have free reign in D’Antoni’s run’n'gun offense, sell some jerseys and tickets, and if it works-great! If not they’re plannning on blowing the team up and bringing in a couple of big name free agents in ’10 anyways so no big loss. It would have to be a one year deal though.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: He shot 50/45/88. 50/45/88. He played 30 minutes a game, and took ten to twelve damn shots a game. What in the world are you looking for for a “more efficient shooter who will shoot let and give it to Dwight more.”
    I really think you didn’t watch enough Magic games with Jameer playing.
    Eboy: If someone can shoot 17 points while making more than half of them playing only thirty minutes a game while the offense is evenly distributed, than yes, you’re dominating.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Hedo shoots 40 percent from the FLOOR!

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    Russ, you can repeat your valid argument all day, when was the last time you saw someone cant thier mind and admit flaw on here? Also i might like AI on the HAWKS instead of Bibby let AI and Joe take turns running the point.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    change*

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Well….let me ask the question Russ. Pretty simple actually. Of the three guys you referenced….did any of those guys start their careers (and a few seasons in) still have little to no offensive skillset or go to move? I know the numbers Dwight put’s up….but he rebounds to no end on that squad due to the shot selection the Magic employ and he get’s tons of put backs for points….so it’s not like he’s fouling cats out with his post moves.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Hedo is also clutch as sh*t.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    The Magic just need to keep doing what they’re doing and keep developing Courtney Lee. After this season they could be the favorites in the East for next three years.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    Your sample size is 42 games…
    Plus, it’s not just about numbers, it’s about how you get your stats. I’ve watched enough Magic games to know that Jameer is most effective when he’s looking to SCORE first, dish second.
    Do we think that’s the best way for Dwight to develop? It might be, but not if the Magic also have Hedo who has the exact same mentality!
    One of them has to go and the Magic need to get Shard off that four spot. Pronto.
    Instead, they are going to sign Hedo to a long term deal and lock in that core long term.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    So I guess they should get rid of Dwight, too, since obviously he’ll never be the best player on a champiosnhip squad. Man, 55-19 ain’t what it used to be.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    Do you guys realize hes not actaully superman? He put up monster numbers for a 55 plus win team. How can u knock that?

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    I mean, God, Jameer had a great season. Whenever there was a fast break, Jameer never made a mistake. Jameer was the best damn slasher on the team, using his speed, which was above average for a point guard, and his STRENGTH, which is superior to most point guards, to get buckets by the dozens. He was, in all essense, the Magic’s “Mo” guy, not because he’s as good as Mo, but because he was the guy that could break from the system and score when the team needed it. Dude fit so damn perfectly in Orlando that it’s just insane to think that he could be traded.
    YES I’ll admit the possibity that he coulda just been having a great season and we will never see that again. Trade high, I know that philosophy. I’ve seen enough of Jameer to give him another chance.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    How about they don’t change a damn thing and keep growing and improving together? Dwight is still getting better (which is scary), Jameer is still getting better, they just found a pleasant surprise in C. Lee, they have a young guy in Gortat that’s really playing well without anyone noticing and could back up Dwight for a while, Pietrus is a lock-down defender and a good spot up shooter for them and he’s still young. Pieces need to be added, blowing up the core is ridiculous.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’m gonna go do some other stuff before my head explodes. It’s been real.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Allenp: YES!~ Score first, dish second! That’s the way the team is suppose to be built!!! He dishes in transition (that’s how he gets his SIX ASSISTS A GAME) but he is NOT SUPPOSE TO BE CREATING OFFENSE! That’s not Stan Van Gundy’s game plan! It never will be!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Gosh…why is this so hard? Z…..no I don’t think the Magic should blow up the ship…..but Dwight is NOT a dominating offensive presence that will seal wins with his play on that end of the floor. Jameer is also NOT going to crush teams with his play on his own. The Magic are a solid team…..with good pieces….but unless they get Dwight legit help on the block….they are not a threat to take out the other top conteding teams is all.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Or inversely,Eboy,who was the last player to dominate and put up these type of numbers with little or no offensive skillset?Imagine what he can become when he does develop these skill,which is entirely possible.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Hey Russ, you never answered my question from yesterday. How many assumptions can a serval make, in general?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    451 comments so far. Dang we are doing WORK today in these comments! What’s the next topic!?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Can we at least wait for the Magic to get blown out in the playoffs before reconstruction starts?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    And just cause some of us disagree doesn’t make the conversation invalid.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    justin, how exactly do the TO fans treat Bosh so horribly?

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    ‘They need a four that allows Dwight to avoid guarding the best big man’ / Why?! Dwight is first and foremost a rebounder and a defender, that’s what makes him special. I absolutely want him to guard the best opposing big.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Good day Russ.
    And I think constantly repeating Orlando’s record is a cop out.
    They are 55-19.
    The Suns once won 60 games. Did we all think they didn’t need to make some changes as well?

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    And the 2001 Sixers finished at 56-26…

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Of course it’s possible, Izzo….and damn, I hope he does, cause I really like his game….but it just hasn’t blossomed….in any capacity….to this point…so it’s just weird that some thinik he’s a lock to a title history without that. He is the focal point of the franchise…not just a role player.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    Z, did u catch the last 2-3 mins of the magic/raptors game the other day? Im guessing you didnt.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    Since no one replied the first time I’ll ask if this makes sense to anyone else. Bryan finally said what I was thinking the whole time I was reading your discussion. I can definitely see Allen in NY next year considering next season doesn’t even really count for the Knicks anyway. It would be the perfect risk/reward scenario for them. Pick up AI, let him have free reign in D’Antoni’s run’n’gun offense, sell some jerseys and tickets, and if it works-great! If not they’re plannning on blowing the team up and bringing in a couple of big name free agents in ‘10 anyways so no big loss. It would have to be a one year deal though.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    boing, on his personal facebook alone, he’ll post something nice like “I’m glad we got a win tonight, I love my team” and literally hundreds of replies like “you suck we hate you, go back to the states” and “why cant you win us more games, you suck this year” and stuff like that. It’s RIDICULOUS. Without Bosh, the Raptors right now would be ATROCIOUS. And the fans still hate on him, boo him ALL the time. Ask Holly MacKenzie if you don’t believe me. or JE Skeets of BallDontLie/The Basketball Jones. They’ll tell you, it’s sick.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Z
    Hakeem rarely guarded the opposing team’s best big man.
    You know why?
    Because that’s how you foul out…
    I’ve never said Orlando was a horrible team. I’ve never said they’ve had a horrible year.
    I said their team is about to commit long term to a faulty core and that will likely hurt them in the future. I could be HORRIBLY wrong.
    But I could be right.

  • http://where-basketball-b-longs.blogspot.com B. Long

    Chris Bosh would make a better 3 than he does a 4.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    change pieces =/= blow up team.
    Changing pieces = trading role players, signing another guy in the off-season, maybe switching around one of the four main guys on the team.
    Blowing up the team = changing TWO OF YOUR MAIN STARTERS WHO PLAY 30+ MINUTES for relative unknowns and changing how your team is run.
    Big difference.
    55-19.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Chris Bosh and Dwight Howard together would be the perfect frontcourt.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    E, Dwight is not a dominating offensive presence… YET. He’s putting up 22 a game with no moves, nothing. Bigs take time and there is nothing that can make me say that he won’t be putting up 28 a game at his peak when he will have 2 or 3 go-to moves. Orlando is not the favorite to win this year, but they’re still effin good. Why couldn’t they win a championship in 2 years? Keep the core, tweak it, work with it. Hedo is not indispensable to that team but he fits, he could be replaced by another piece, I’m not arguing that. But trading him and nelson for a 4 makes no sense.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    Justin, those kids are probably 14 years old and watch to much Stephen A Smith.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    Do you think the Magic will be contendes with a long term core of Shard, Hedo, Jameer, Dwight and random guy?
    If so, please explain your answer as succintly as possible.
    I’ve given all my reasons why I don’t think it will work. You explain to me why that core is championship material.

  • http://sfdjilf.com Jukai

    Referee blows his whistle:
    Hakeem did guard the opponents big man if they were in the post, he guarded Shaq ALL the time. Hakeem simply didn’t come out to guard people like Ewing because they were too far out of the paint, and he wanted to anchor the defense. Minus one to Allenp.
    Continue!
    Also, on a side note, I’m not sure if Shard, Hedo, Jameer, and Dwight can win a championship. I’m positive trading away both Jameer and Hedo for Aldirdge and signing AI would make the Magic a far worse team for the next two-three seasons.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Got stuff to do, I’m out. We’ll have to agree to disagree on this one Eboy and Allen. You say they need to change up the core of the team and their identity, I say they need to tweak it and let the team develop. The Suns are not a good comparison because they couldn’t play defense, Orlando is giving 94 a game which is very very good. What I see is a team on the rise: they won 40 two years ago, 52 last year and they’ll win 60 this year. They’re progressing just fine.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I don’t think they need to kill the core…but Dwight needs a big to help him….and that’s undisputable if they want to be serious contenders.

  • http://mindyourbusiness@getalife.com Allenp

    Jukai
    You’re absolutely wrong about Shaq and Hakeem. You didn’t watch the Finals when they matched up. Search online for a recape, and you’ll see.
    Otis Thorpe did a HUGE amount of the dirty lifting for Hakeem in the post and Hakeem regularly took a break to avoid guarding the best big man…
    Good discussion, and it’s cool that y’all think I’m crazy.
    In recap, the Magic need a real power forward and they should not sign Hedo to a long term deal, establishing a fault core for at least three seasons. This is my thesis.
    I think Iverson would work for one year until better pieces become available, I could be horribly wrong.
    Oh well.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Justin Walsh

    @boing it’s not just kids. It’s people in Toronto overall. I mean yeah, he has loyal fans in toronto, but he also has huge hate groups that just cant stand him as a player

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Um, all ya’ll are stupid. Ok, back to work.

  • http://neworleansbasketball.blogspot.com Caleb

    “they won 40 two years ago, 52 last year and they’ll win 60 this year. They’re progressing just fine.”

    True dat.

  • http://neworleansbasketball.blogspot.com Caleb

    The public is stupid.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Hate groups!! Wow.

  • TheRealJukai

    I think Gaz has been impersonating me. This is the real me. Allenp, I agree with you, Allen Iverson is totally better than my entire Phoenix Suns roster man.

  • http://bielasiakville.blogspot.com/ Jesse Bielasiak

    Next person to say something about Drake is going to be shot. by me. p.s. it’s pretty good, but Kid Cudi still rocks Drake’s s***.

  • http://slamonline.com TheRealJukai

    Gaz, stop it.

  • http://slamonline.com TheRealJukai

    I can’t even use the “Jukai” moniker anymore guys. It won’t post because Gaz has been taking it. Listen up, Tony Parker is the best player in the league.

  • http://slamonline.com Gaz

    LOL Jukai, calm down mate.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    I’ve been saying that for weeks b long. Yesterday I had people agree finally. The knicks lack a big time scorer which ai can fix. He can show other teams he still has it and leave or wait a year take a paycut and play with the unselfish superstar of the knicks choice. Its win for everybody.

  • http://double-technical.blogspot.com Zee!

    Jesse you need to get off the dope. When Cudi isn’t whining that he is going to retire, he’s making half decent sing-songy music. Drake ethers Kanye Jr any day of the week son.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @Justin: I’m glad to say that not one of those Bosh haters. Those idiots should just go watch the f*cking Leafs and keep kidding themselves.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    *I’m* not one of them, I mean. Gah. How can you jeer at a guy who keeps on fighting for rebounds with the team down by double digits? You measure a man not only by his actions in success, but by his actions in failure. Chris *never* mails it in, never in the dozens and dozens of losses and struggles over his entire career.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    this place is getting bazzarer and bazzarer by the day.

  • https://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    Lost is so messed up this season.

  • http://nicekicks.com MeloMan13

    DAMN RIGHT! nuggets been doin their thing, u ppl better recognize. how can u not love Jr and Melo??? know if only we could get rid of anthony carter,
    and Drake is RAW. he reps t-dot to the fullest

  • http://nicekicks.com MeloMan13

    he was in the show Degrassi

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBQEmmgDl9I Boing Dynasty

    …and pocket 20 thousand to be anywhere they ask me.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @Jukai: This fake commentor thing is getting out of hand. Bereft of the ability to make even semi-intelligent arguments or infantile insults anymore, he’s resorted to impersonating you and I.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com Hursty

    You know Rajon Rondo was the lead guard for the Celtics last year right? I mean, there can’t be much difference between him and Jameer right? Damn.
    Oh, and yes he was Melo. He was the kid that got shot.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Yeah, break up the Magic. They dont have a chance.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Theyll sign T.I. before they even think about A.I.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Beating Cleveland in the regular season doesn’t mean anything, BLOWING them out by 30 must mean that they can hang… at least. After this game, there’s only 4 losses between the two teams.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Oh, and take it for what you will but all of the Cavs worst losses of the season have come against every other championship contender.

  • http://www.realcavsfans.com Anton

    True, Cavs have lost a lot of important games against elite teams on the road. No excuses. A major weakness is interior defense, hopefully if/when Ben makes it back it’ll improve.
    But at the end of the day, playoffs is what matters. Cavs swept the season series with the Spurs in the 2006-2007 season, and we all know how that worked out in the Finals.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Joel, I’m not Gaz, idiot. And read my AI comments, arguments you could now answer. Wow you are stupid.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    **you could not answer.

  • http://www.mynameinorange.blogspot.com Hisham

    Myles Brown Posted: Apr.3 at 9:55 pm
    Theyll sign T.I. before they even think about A.I.

    that made me laugh out loud

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