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Tuesday, August 11th, 2009 at 10:00 am  |  157 responses

J.R. Smith: ‘I’m Not a Gang Member’

Smith attempts to clear his name following accusations in his local paper: “I’m not a ’hood guy,’ Smith said. ‘I’m not a street guy. And I’m not a gang member’… ‘J.R. grew up in the woods of Millstone,’ his father, Earl, said. ‘There’s no Bloods. There’s no Crips. The only gangs were the deer.”’

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  • rikson

    Journalist: “Then why do you look like one?”

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    “I’m not in any gangs, that’s krap. I don’t kare what krazy people think.”

  • rikson

    aha

  • ngoiekafita

    If those deers are more than 5, can we say they’re a gang?

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    He shouldn’t even have to make this response.

  • ngoiekafita

    If those deers are more than 5 strolling the park, buyin’ 40 ounces, can we call ‘em a gang?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    But a bunch of people that dont even know you say you are! Would they lie to me to get their (important) cause and names in the national spotlight? Noooooooooooooooo not them!

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    bryan, yes he does, he painted himself in that corner. we know he’s not a gang member, he’s just a dumb-ss that’s fascinated by mobsters and forgot that kids actually look up to him. betcats, you’re missing the point. him being or not being a gang member is not the issue. the issue is that young blacks have to stop glorifying gang banging.

  • Izzo

    (1)SLAM has been Blood affiliated for years. ‘Krazy Mad Moves’ anyone?

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Whatever you say z.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Yeah Z, tell them what’s up! Kome on guys, kool it on taking krakks at the media!

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    hard to not notice that at no point in the article does he ever explained why exactly he changed the c’s for k’s. i hope he gets his ish together though. he is an incredible talent.

  • Izzo

    I for one, am outraged. From a publication such as the Denver Post, home of Woody Paige, I expect my casual racism a little more endearing.

  • Izzo

    SLAM has been Blood affiliated for years. ‘Krazy Mad Moves’ anyone?

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    I guess I better talk to my cousins about calling each other kool kats. And all the other fun misspellings that shorthand has become.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    bryan, i know that you don’t believe that those misspellings were random and had nothing to do with trying to emulate how bloods write. i know that. / izzo, i didn’t get the racist angle on this one. care to develop?

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    No z, I won’t be joining you on your soap box.

  • Izzo

    Would Ben Handgloten be asked if he were a gang member if he couldn’t spell? Irrelevance notwithstanding. Or even Cherokee Parks, who’s almost certainly in some sort of biker gang.

  • riggs

    so because he got tats he wanted to look like a gang member? riiiight.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Only like 70% of people that I know type “lik dis or dat kuz they kan and its supposed to be kute or something” do I think it was intentional? Sure the guy is a high school graduate he’s just typing like every other tweeting moron under 25 in america. So no I don’t think he was typing in blood code. More like youth of america I’m an idiot code.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    well, we’re going to have to agree to disagree. i think it was very intentional and that he perfectly knew what he was doing. the fact that he DIDNT use that argument (it’s just generic slang) and acknowledged that he made a mistake prevent me from giving him the benefit of the doubt. still glad he got called for it.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    I said the cause was important Z. I also am saying now these people are on some McCarthyism type-sh!t if they can go around and silence peoples voices just by making acusations that are very sketchy at best.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    You assume these things based on nothing though. You’re as much a sensationalist as these journalists are. You have no scoop, no inside track no firsthand knowledge of jr smith his family or his backround. But newspapers are in the sh*tter and they have to scour twitter for stories so they don’t go out of business and then print anything to stir the pot. Well they have you to thank for proving the tactic works. You and people like you are going to save print media. Way to go.

  • seppo

    even if he wrote in blood code. so what? he didn´t commit a crime or anything. certain apsects of gang culture are interesting, cool and entertaining. some people just can´t relate to it or wont admit it.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Rikson
    I see your hood peeking out in your first comment.

  • http://www.slamonline.com John D

    Wow, seppo. I hope that wasn’t serious.

  • Wdavid

    Trying really hard not to hate, but it baffles me that the Denver front office continues to put up with all the distractions Smith causes when all he does is hit 2-3 threes a game and not play defense.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    I like how people are making this seem like JR Smith was using K’s instead of C’s in his twitter posts because he can’t spell.
    Wow!
    That’s just downright ignorant.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Hey Bryan, if I go around flashing gang signs, would you give me the benefit of the doubt that I wasn’t in a gang because you have no scoop, no inside track, no firsthand knowledge of my family and my background?
    I mean, ignoring the fact that I’m a tall, doofy white guy.

  • eastside

    I live in denver, i’ve seen jr smith out numerous times in the clubs like dc10, safaris, the loft, etc.. dressed in all RED dickie pants, all blood homeboys, i’ve even seen him throw up the B with is ARMS in a nuggets game after hitting a three in the corner in the playoffs. He yells suu woop so much in the club with his boys its not even funny. Not hating or anything, but once you put yourself out there like that, what do you expect? Then try to deny it? Just my thoughts…

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I wonder if the deer did ‘trot-bys’ on the hunters?

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    TAD, that was a really weak one, even by your standards

  • Forrest Crunk

    Bryan, don’t be naive. This news item is based on the fact that throwing up the B and replacing the C with Ks when communicating, these are things that Bloods do. Someone noticed and made the distinction. When you are a professional athlete who does these things, then you would be well served to respond to these very obvious accusations, when it involves criminal organizations. It’s not like people are grasping for straws trying to bring poor JR Smith down, he did it to himself in this case.

  • http://www.hoopsvibe.com/nba/overdribbling/index276 chiqo

    much ado about nothing.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    It’s Tuesday. What you want from me?

  • e

    home come the media dont go in on stephen jackson like htis he is clearly a blood and does not try ti hide it in any way

  • e

    home come the media dont go in on stephen jackson like htis he is clearly a blood and does not try ti hide it in any way

  • Forrest Crunk

    Also, let us not forget the fact that JR was just in prison, it’s possible that he was showing respect to the Bloods for holding him down while he was in there.

  • Young C

    Assuming that JR Smith did it just because he cant spell is more racist than assuming he did it on purpose because hes affiliated with a gang. Just because he didnt go to college doesnt mean the man cant spell.

    By the way BET, nobody silenced him. He silenced himself when he couldnt even properly defend what he wrote. If what he did was really all that innocent he we would have just made an explanation or ignored it and kept his twitter account. But then again, it is strange that journalists have nothing better to do than look at peoples twitter accounts.

  • Izzo

    Jukai, you’re being silly. That’s unlike you. I hope it’s because he can’t spell and not that it’s because he’s unwilling to spell correctly, that’s far worse.
    People, there are far more valid reasons to dislike JR Smith, they are pretty plentiful, this is stupid and not one of them.

  • yo son

    its a problem when people are analyzing text messages and making something out of nothing.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Izzo:
    Do I think that he’s in a gang?
    No.
    Do I think this is an easy way for less racially accepting people to pick an easy target?
    Yes.
    Do I think journalists are scratching at nothing to break down a smart, innocent black man?
    JR destroyed Carmello Anthony’s car because of his reckless driving. Undetered, JR Smith killed his friend in a car accident because he’s a “cool dude” and refused to wait for the guy infront of him to move up. After “showing” remorse, he got three more traffic related tickets. JR Smith attacked a WOMAN in a nightclub, spitting on her and trying to grab her and ripping her dress.
    Now JR is throwing up “signs” during televised NBA Playoff games (gang related or not), and he’s replacing his c’s with k’s (gang related or not) to be a ‘cool dude.’
    And everyone is suddenly SHOCKED the media is trying their best to break down this dude? They feel BAD for JR Smith? No way!
    The media is not “grabbing at nothing” here. Replacing your c’s with k’s is what the bloods do, and whether JR Smith knew it was gang related or not, he was doing it on purpose. He should get crap for it. It’s well deserved.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Bryan, saving the print media? Really? Way to go about circumventing a topic. Bring the media in there! JR Smith is a tool, he has a long list of fvck ups to back up this claim. There is no reason for me to give him the benefit of the doubt. And I STILL believe that your ego will not allow you to admit that you know very well deep down inside that those K’s were a reference to gang banging. You mean to tell me that JR Smith had no idea that those K’s meant? The kid slang argument is BS when you look at posts like this one: “I just Kame home. … I kouldnt have done it with out yall”. COME ON.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Now if your point is that we shouldn’t care about gang-related tweets. Fine, that has some validity to it. But to pretend that he didn’t ‘know’ they were gang-related is, at best, naive, at worst, freaking stupid. Glorifying gangbanging is whack. Call me a preacher, whatever I don’t care. The end.

  • Izzo

    I’m not accusing JR Smith of being a nice fella, but in my opinion this is the worst kind of reaching sensationalist journalism there is. TMZ is a step up from this sh*t. Perez Hilton would question the ethics of this.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Izzo: HE WAS SWITCHING OUT HIS C’S WITH K’S! He either was imitating the bloods, -OR- more probably, he knew it was a cool, urban way of writing and had no idea where it was from, and decided to write his blog right that. It is NOT reaching sensationalism. It’s simply sensationalism.
    Is JR getting more flak for this than he probably should get? Of COURSE he is.
    But once again, the media, as an entity, is TIRED of this guy and being harsher on him BECAUSE of his f ups always in the news. Vick was almost castrated for going to a strip club. Is goign to a strip club bad? No! But he’s Michael F’in Vick and he slaughtered dogs for fun! He’s going to get more slack for it! Same with JR!
    JR needs to be smarter, but that seems impossible for the dude, so this is going to happen. I’m not mad at Denver Post for portraying him out to be a ‘gangster’ at all. He DESERVES it for thinking he’s a cool guy flashing gestures at the crowds of LA and writing like that in his twitter articles.

  • Izzo

    I disagree.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Jukai: I didn’t say he couldn’t spell, I said he is doing on purpose I just disagree its referencing gangs. As for your gang signs thing, I only know of 100 myspace pages where assh*les from this hick town throw up gang signs in their pictures cause its “hilarious”. I don’t think its funny but those guys don’t have to explain or justify their actions and remind me or anyone else that they’re not in a gang. You guys are all playing right into the stereotype of a young black male using slang and getting tatted up means gangbanger. This is exactly why we still have a racial divide in this country , I like how you all conviently gloss over izzo’s point about how no one would say anything cherokee parks about something like this. Its all in perception, and the reason I brought the media up is because they have no facts or evidence and they’re just spewing stuff to circulate papers. Jr smith makes himself an easy target but it doesn’t make him any less a victim of racial profiling on this point. And I find it obscene. I have arms covered in tattoos and wear a black bandana everywhere when I’m not working, am I a part of folk nation or the gangster diciples? And better yet does anyone ever question it? Of course not and why is that? Meanwhile an admittedly slightly stupid 24 year old black basketball player misspells words and has to explain his actions to a media and fanbase that has already made up their minds about him. Where’s the f*cking justice?

  • Rich

    Anyone remember the show “NBA Rookies”? They followed JR Smith in his rookie season. He was just a regular kid that grew up in the suburbs, didn’t have one tattoo, middle class family, his father made sure JR had his stuff together to get in the L. And after his rookie season, dude just acted like a clown. That’s why I look at him like a joke. Dude probably never been to a hood never heard a gunshot. He just trying to act hard all of a sudden because nobody gonna check him for it. How could you run around trying to look hard, and then when you get your card pulled, you playing like you don’t know what they’re talking about? Studio gangsta. NBA gangsta, for real. Look at Larry Johnson (NFL), same thing. Middle class, no hood in him, good school, and when he got big, you tried to act like a gangsta.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I think JR Smith believes he’s in a gang the same way Lil Wayne believes he is in a gang.
    I think neither of them are making good decisions.
    However, being a gang member, or former gang member, is not the worst thing in the world. Sometimes cats make bad decisons and grow from them.
    Unfortunately, I don’t think that is the case with JR Smith, and I think his parents, witty one-liners aside, might want to look themselves in the mirror.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Bryan-
    FACT: The Bloods throw up Bs as a gang sign
    FACT: JR Smith threw up a hand gesture that looked more like a B and less like a three
    FACT: The bloods replace C’s with K’s in their writing
    FACT: JR Smithw as replacing his C’s with K’s in his writing
    I mean, how is this not f’ing proof?
    Once again, do I personally think he was trying to imitate the bloods?
    No. Probably not.
    Do I think he was tryign to look COOL knowing that the bloods do it, or trying to look COOL knowing it was a cool, urban thing to do?
    Yes.
    And I never said anything about the slang JR uses or the tattoos he has. Never once. You brought that in, buddy.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    And once again, Bryan, I’m not a FAN of this sensationalism, because you WILL get people just like the commentator ‘e’ who will shout that Stephen Jackson is also a blood when Stephen Jackson donates hundreds of thousands of dollars a year trying to fix up his area and other lower income areas. You will get crazy bigots who don’t freaking research and just shout “HE’S IN A GANG! KICK HIM OUT OF THE NBA!”
    But JR deserves a LOT of the flak he’s getting. Stop saying it’s cause he “wasn’t spelling words right.” It’s cause he was spelling words like he was in a gang.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    You and z are absolutley impossible .

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    And I do not think it is ironic at all abou how you and Izzo are accusing Cheroke Parks of being in a biker gang cause he’s got tattoos and hangs out in lower income white areas. Not ironic even slightly.
    Great job guys!

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    He’s trying to imitate the Bloods.
    It’s obvious.
    However, you made some GREAT points about the double standard employed–ahem, cough, Birdman–by the media.
    Think about what “Birdman” looks like. Think about the fact that the “bird sign” he now uses was something he stole form a New Orleans rapper (Baby of Cash Money) and was used to signify the fact that narcotics where going to be coming to the hood, or that pigeons were being released by lookouts to warn of cops coming.
    And think about how many kids now throw up that sign because a cat who was busted for a serious drug problem uses it in every game.
    And then think about the fact that not only has Birdman not been chastised, they have done halftime reports lauding his comeback and championing his “wild” antics.
    That’s the problem here. Selectice anger and outrage.
    And people like Rikson who like to equate black skin and tattoos with thugs and gang members, but hate the idea that somebody else would judge them based on their skin color and mannerisms.
    Funny how that works.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Look I don’t care what any of you say. I don’t think he owes anyone an explantion for his typing. That’s the bottom line to me , he doesn’t owe me or you or anyone an explanation.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jukai
    You missed the point of the Cherokee Parks mention.
    Cherokee Parks fits a certain stereotype based on his dress and tattoos. However, nobody rushed to label him with that stereotype, while that exact thing is done to black athletes.
    Nobody likes racial profiling, but people consistently justify doing it to other folks while becoming upset when it happens to them.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    He explained it because it wasn’t going away. Nobody “owes” anybody an explanation for anything. But, you give people explanations because it makes life easier.

  • Izzo

    Jukai: You’ve been around here for more than two weeks, right? And you still believe my Cherokee Parks comment to be serious? Unless you knew it was a joke and are clutching at straws.
    I don’t think he’s in a gang, he probably just like to think himself as a gangsta. He’s an idiot.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Allenp: Actually, Izzo said he “was probably in some biker gang.” That’s probably Izzo being his usual sarcastic self, but I felt like I should point it out. Cherokee Parks really only became the embodiment of white trash when he became irrelevant and left the big stage.
    Also, Birdman got so much sh*t before his comeback, it’s not even freaking funny. that dude was one of the most hated dude’s in the NBA. But everyone loves an underdog so now people root for him.
    You make a lot of good points about the double standards that the media has, it’s impossible to debate, but I think JR Smith is getting a lot of this crap because he’s JR Smith, and if he had a clean record (IE not attacked a random woman in a nightclub, not killed his friend in a car accident and got his lisense suspended twice afterwards), he wouldn’t be getting the media CRAP that he’s getting now.
    I’ll say once again, a lot of racist journalists are taking advantage of this, and it’s sad and it’s sick. But I can’t defend JR Smith and call him a victim, and say “oh man he was just mispelling words.”
    I actually think YOUR TAKE on the situation (realizing JR is causing the problem himself but also shaking a finger at the media) is probably the best take on the situation so far, Allen.

  • Izzo

    Allenp: I think your Birdman analogy is more fitting in the case of Michael Vick. People were far more willing to give Andersen and that baseball guy(Hamilton?) a second chance than they were Vick. In one case, you’re branded for life, in the other, you’re branded until you’ve apologized.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    If it makes the whole birdman thing easier, Allen, I hit a game winning shot from the left side (against my brother and his friends in a pickup game at UVM’s gym), and I started bobbing my head and throwing upside down threes, just like JR. So yeah, I’m imitating his asinineness just like people imitate Birdman’s.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Perfect example ,allenp. I always thought the same thing everytime I heard an announcer saying “and the fans lovng the birdman and he returns the love with his birdman sign” . Maybe jr smith is imitating the bloods I happen to think there’s a chance he’s not. Especially since at this point blogging and typing shorthands have become so skewed there’s no telling where he picked up this iLingo. I just don’t buy into the fact that just because he’s a millionaire he should be held to a different set of rules than anybody. I know a lot of people disagree and that’s fine I don’t believe that pro athletes should have any higher expectations on him than you or I. He’s not the president, he’s not a senator or a cop or a judge. He’s a basketball player. If a player chooses to use his public persona to further a cause or speak out that’s fine, but if another player doesn’t and just wants to be a regular dude who tweets like an idiot and acts like anybody would when he’s out with his boys that’s fine also.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    My problem isn’t that he explained himself to make his life easier , its that he was being badgered and that it wasn’t going away until he explained it. If he wanted to clarify great, but the media forced his hand by recklessly calling him a gangster. Any man would have to stand up for himself my whole point from the word go is that it shouldn’t have been an issue.

  • Tommy Patron

    AllenP-Did you mean Birdman hasn’t been chastised for the “birdman sign” or just in general?

  • tm

    i really dont think the problem is with jr its with the culture that promotes and glorifies gang affiliation as well as illegal behaviour. im not talking about the nba im talking about mainstream american media, rap, movies, video games. yes you can consider it art but at the same time you are promoting something that goes against what you preach. now dont get me wrong ive watched every gangster movie, fell in love with rap because of nwa and have played all the violent video games. i have also been around drug dealers and illicit activities, but something within myself allowed me to not get sucked into a lifestyle that is very desirable to alot of people. he may be a millionaire but that doesnt mean if some guys come up to him and offer him things he couldnt get with his money like fear, because it isnt respect its people being afraid of you, i can see how he could get sucked into that life. is it a bad thing that he is in the public eye and affiliated, perhaps but isnt it also then a bad thing that you have 90 percent of rap artists in the public eye and affiliated. how about having people talk about being christian and catholic when they persecuted and killed on such great levels that its unreal to think about today, but thats viewed as a good thing. this is just a reporter who was bored and said hey this is something interesting to write about who cares, its not like jr is the only player we would think is affiliated. wasnt there a big thing about ai’s armband covering up gang tatoos. hey they are the people they want to be if they want to be affiliated let them, its not as much fun as it seems, maybe he will realize that when he gets a gun pulled on him or shot or stabbed because those are not fun things. let the kid live his life because if this is about not promoting bad things to kids than we have way more to worry about than just jr smith.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    I’m sure no one remembers when Rose got some minor flak for flashing a gang sign in a photo. He immediately said “oh, sorry guys I’m not in a gang” and the media was like “OKAY JUST CHECKING.”
    Probably no one even remembers it.
    Was it BS that people even THOUGHT he should get crap for being a young black man flashing a gang sign when a bajillion people do it on MySpace and Facebook?
    Yeeeeep.
    Did the media continue their tirade after Rose, with his squeeky clean image and nice-guy attitude, apologized?
    Nope.
    Does that make more sense about what I’m trying to say?

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Good points from everybody, really. Yes, there is a double standard but it’s not always (only) racial. I’d bet that if it was Baron Davis’s or Kevin Durant’s (role models) twitter, this story has no legs. JR Smith is a notorious fvck up, let’s not underestimate that fact when analyzing how he is treated by the media. Derrick Rose flashed gang signs at a party at Memph U but didn’t catch much heat because he’s D. Rose. He apologized for doing something immature and ppl moved on. JR Smith is no D. Rose. Of course, there’s a double standard. Chris Andersen’s tattoos and antics are called eccentric and not thuggerish. But to me, and I might be wrong, this is really about JR and JR only.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    I think JR Smith is actually being treated like a regular dude.
    Like a regular black dude.
    People have different expectations of different folks based on a whole bunch of issues. JR is just the latest in a long line of examples.
    That said, Jukai and Z have extremely valid points and I have not problem with the way they have been expressed. JR Smith has made terrible decisions, kind of like Pacman Jones, so I understand him catching flak
    But, like you said, you can’t go to Defcom Infinity when some athletes with bad reputations mess up, but consistently issue passes to other athletes with similar reps. It’s just a blatant problem.
    Jukai
    Actually I don’t remember Birdman getting blasted. I remember some drug jokes, but nobody accusing him of being the scum of the Earth, or wondering about his parents or the pathology in his community. Nobody talking about how his actions were a sign of the rot in his community.
    Pretty much the standard response when a black dude gets popped.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Beat you to it Z. You owe me a coke.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Tommy Patron
    He hasn’t been chastised at all for the Birdman sign, despite it’s narcotics ties.
    He received some chastisement for the drug arrest, but it was mild.
    I would compare it to what Brad Miller got when he was busted for testing positive for weed for the THIRD TIME a while back.
    There were stories about what led him to drugs, how his life went wrong, the wasted potential. Nobody was rushing to condemn him and talk about how this is a sign that his parents and community didn’t raise him right.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jukai
    Rose has been called out for making “stupid” decisions despite only getting a speeding ticket and flashing a gang sign.
    I think the media attention he’s received has been OUTRAGEOUS when you consider the infractions he’s accused of committing. I mean, the were discussing his character on draft night because of the speeding thing. His character! And now it gets brought up every time anything happens with him. The gang sign was just another step.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Allen: Uh… I think you’re overreacting a bit there. I remember the speeding ticket brought up in ‘question’ format (IE will it effect his draft performance) and people would unanimously answer ‘… why would it?’
    The gang thing disapeared almost instantly.
    Rose is pretty much viewed as a smart, nice kid in the NBA. Maybe I don’t read the publications that are still bashing him and I’m a bit ignorant on the matter, I just remember him getting a small amount of crap for it but after his apology, all reporters sort of said “alright, yer a good lad, just go run along and don’t go causin’ no trouble!”
    Stupid things always get brought up during draft day. I know this is a much worse infraction, but remember JJ’s DUI where he was just a hundrendth or two out of the legal limit to be driving? People pretty much witch hunted him. In the end, it resulted in nothing.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Allenp, I only disagree in the sense that any regular black dude doesn’t get called a role model and told about how kids look up to him everytime he doesn’t cover his mouth when he sneezes.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    I’m not totally arguing with you though– if JJ had flashed a gang sign in a photo, people would have laughed and called him “JJ Red(loves)dik” again, instead of gone after him for being in a gang.

  • http://www.sprint.com/pre dma

    I think the correct quote was “I’m not a gang member anymore.”

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Is Jose Calderon a blood? He throws up the same B that Pierce got fined for and Smith is apparently repping. Have they gone international? That health care would be quite useful. Such enterprising young men, those bloods.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    If jj redick threw up a gang sign it would be “haha look at that frat boy he’s so clever, he’s not in a gang he’s so pasty and clean cut”. If charlie ward threw up a gang sign , he would be thrown under a microscope in a heartbeat. And I’m absolutley the LAST person to blow the whistle on race issues but this has racial undertones for sure.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Myles wins.

  • Tommy Patron

    AllenP-That’s what I figured. All those stories WERE extremely kind to Anderson’s Mom, et. al. However, he was banned from the league. I’m not sure how much more chastised you can be.

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai
  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    I do agree though, that the Pierce gettign fined thing was ridiculous and probably racially motivated

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Tommy Patron
    I was mainly talking about the media reaction to these things because that’s where the real problem lies. I had no problem with how David Stern or the Nuggets handled the situation.
    Birdman should have a job, he should be allowed to move on with his life, he should NOT be called a horrible human despite his love for stupid hand signs.
    I think people need to pay more attention to how decisions are made by many mainstream media sources, particularly ESPN, and then ask themselves if they don’t see an ulterior motive.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Myles, I see your angle. But would you agree that what Pierce flashed to the Hawks bench WAS a gang sign?

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Allenp:
    I agree with you wholeheartdly on most things you say.
    The problem is, JR Smith IS a horrible human being. The gang signs have nothing to do with it. It’s a problem here, since some journalists ARE going out of their way to hate on JR for being a black youth associated with gangs (“his parents raised him terribly, his community is all gangs”) but others just hate JR for being JR.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    Pardon the term but espn in particular seems to want to “white up” sports. Every white nba player gets called larry bird so white suburban america can relate all the while they play up these thug storylines so they can have some good vs evil drama. On the other hand they don’t focus on players who give back to their old communities or even black athletes who grew up in the burbs. Except when its grant hill or ray allen who get accused of not being black enough. Its deplorable.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Jukai, I would have to disagree on this one. Especially with Pierce being from Inglewood, you can’t tell me that he thought it was something else. C’mon now. Deshawn got fined in the same playoffs for making the throat slash gesture. No menacing gestures directed at opponents, that’s the rule. And that’s why JR never got fined for the hand signs after his 3-point shots. It wasn’t directed towards an opponent. Let’s not mix issues here.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Grant Hill and Ray Allen get accused of not being black enough? By who?! That’s totally news to me. Are you sure you’re not just saying that to drive your point home?

  • Izzo

    As a hypothetical segue: what would happen if it were revealed that he was a member of a criminal gang? Is that grounds for banishment from the NBA?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Shia: stop watching ESPN. Problem solved.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    How is Ray Allen not black enough. WTF Bryan.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    By people who equate being black with being hood.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Izzo: I’m not sure how Stern would prove that unless JR was accused of something criminal involving a gang or mob. And yes, he should be banished if found true. No question.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    I don’t anymore tad, except pti which I know is sacreligous but I like that show and that’s it. I check out first and ten when scoop jackson is on there otherwise I wanna beat the sh*t out of skip bayless. My basketball news source is slam followed by hoopshype and that’s it. Espn jumped the shark long ago.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    bryam, try realgm too. they’re really up on the trade rumors and whatnot.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    @Z Um, no. If you see what Im getting at, why would I agree that what Pierce flashed was a gang sign any more than what Calderon did? Why is it when Calderon does it, it represents a three pointer but when Pierce does it, it represents a gang?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    You are ABSOLUTELY on track with ESPN.
    I would suggest checking out the website Sports on My Mind and viewing the archives of a cat named Charles Modiano, who goes by the name MODI. He documents ESPN’s efforts in extreme detail.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Personally, I no longer watch ESPN and I no longer visit there website. I have also removed the NFL and, gasp, the Madden video game series from my life. I couldn’t tolerate certain things any longer.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    And actually I wasn’t exactly talking about espn, I’m talking generally about conversations I’ve had with some friends that I have here who say “ray allen is an oreo” and other vulgar things I won’t repeat. Espn wouldn’t actually dare to print those things, but if you think promoting grant hill as mr nice guy in the late 90′s and ray allen the same way in the 00′s wasn’t an appeal to white america you’re dead wrong.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Myles
    Honestly, I think you could make the case that Calderon was flashing a sign for Barcelona, given his ties, and that Pierce was flashing a gang sign given his ties. Nothing in Calderon’s past says “bloods” while I think Pierce has talked about gangs being a regular part of his youth, although he’s never said he was a member.
    I don’t think gang signs need to be flashed at basketball games. Period. But, dammit, neither
    does the “bird sign.” Or “the shocker” or whatever.
    Strangely, the one player who is an admitted “Blood”, Stephen Jackson, does not flash any sort of game signs. Seems like the cat who actually lived that lifestyle to some degree has a different perspective.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    I wasn’t talking about espn calling grant hill and ray allen not white enough is what I meant.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    By the way, this has been a very good discussion and I appreciate the point of views that have dominated it.
    We may not all agree, but the disagreement has been cordial and mainly we’re arguing over nuances and degrees. We are not shouting at each other, which is always a pleasant surprise. I may blog about this whole issue.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Oh come on, Myles! Pierce was walking toward the Hawks bench (dead whistle, with a scowl on his face after being taunted by Horford) threw up a B and walked away. It was intimidation. You don’t see ANY difference between that and Calderon (and countless other black players) flashing the 3-point sign after a made 3? Come. On.

  • Izzo

    Jay Bilas’ commentary is pretty much the quintessence of everything Bryan is talking about here. Always alluding to, but never coming outright with the stereotypes, prejudgements and casual racism.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jay Bilas said Josh Smith would be an absolute bust…

  • Izzo

    Jay Bilas also said during a high school all star game that Dwight Howard would be a Kwame Brown type player.

  • http://lastknickstanding.blogspot.com Bryan

    They way jay bilas attacked josh smith when he got drafted was a disgrace, but luke jackson was a PERFECT fit for the cavs. Seriously what was the basis for that? Jay bilas on black players “good athlete, still a lot to learn and not as skilled as you would like with a low basketball iq but decent upside” jay bilas on any white player ” great understanding of the game ,underrated athletically, high skill level and great fundamentals and feel for the game with a very high basketball iq”

  • Izzo

    Jay Bilas on predominantly white mid major team some time during last year’s tourney(conference):”You look at them, the all look like they have high GPAs and are solid students, but they can play too”

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Allenp, it’s been a nice discussion to follow from the sidelines too.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I actually didn’t realize Bilas was that bad. Thanks for the info.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    I understand the differencees in the two situations, but you cant convince me that they wouldnt be viewed differently even if they were identical circumstances. Its obvious what the difference is. Lets not avoid it.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    This whole JR Smith and gangs issue is pretty pointless and stupid, in my opinion.
    See, I get your guys’ points on the media and its subtle stereotyping. But I dislike when people bring real issues like this up over examples that don’t have much to do with the issue at all. Kind of like that Harvard Professor/Cop beer summit story.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Bryan, I don’t care about his tats. And I don’t care if he really is a gang member. But by writing like that on Twitter and throwing up signs after games and whatnot, he’s not helping his case a whole lot. How is that racial profiling if somebody raises the question?

  • Tdot
  • http://slamonline.com Ben Osborne

    Good stuff, everyone. I definitely want SLAMonline to stay off of Allenp’s banned list.

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    I wish Jay Bilas would run into Zach Randolph’s posse in a dark alley.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Tdot wins.

  • Izzo

    I think Jay Bilas thinks the name of Zach Randolph’s posse is ‘Dark Alley’.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Brad, you mean Ruben Patterson?

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Tdot: Amazing

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Ben: Notice how the discussion stayed between myself, Z, Izzo, Allen, Bryan, Tommy Patron, and Myles. All intelligent (especially the first dude) posters who have proven they can debate and give each other credit for the points they make.
    I really think a registration system for the comment section would do amazing.
    Also, I had no idea Jay Bilas was this bad, but that’s also cause I stay away from listening to Jay Bilas

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    would do amazing… yeah, and I had just patted myself on the back for being intelligent

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    Jay Bilas is the new Billy Packer. He says stuff all the time that I’m like “This motherfu(ker knows he’s on TV, right?”.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    Jay Bilas is a tool. A complete moron. Myles: Are black players judged differently? Abso-freaking-lutely. Were JR tweets and PP’s hand signs gang-related? Abso-freaking-lutely. It doesn’t have to be either/or.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    speaking of the media’s picking and choosing of athletes: one of the NHL’s rising stars, Patrick Kane, got drunk and BEAT UP A TAXI DRIVER FOR NOT GIVING HIM THE CORRECT AMOUNT OF CHANGE. This is not a joke. Patrick Kane; a player who is regarded as the future of his team, the Chicago Blackhawks, and a millionaire commited this atrocity. The cab driver was given $15 to cover $13.80 worth of fair, but didnt have $0.20. For not providing Kane with the $0.20, he was punched in the face, grabbed by the throat, and had his glasses smashed….What if a NBA player did this? His reputation would be destroyed, he would lose any endoursement deals, and David Stern would have to throw a press confrence announcing a long suspension. What does Kane get? A BUNCH OF ARTICLES DEFENDING HIM and NO action from the NHL. NO labeling. This doesnt even have to be true to be aplicable. Who remembers what happened to Kobe over r@pe alligations? HE LOST EVERYTHING AND WAS ATTACKED BY THE MEDIA FOR MONTHS, and the casual Kobe hater (like myself) who dislikes him for other reasons (like myself) still throw it out their to this day. Are you telling me assault and battery is not as bad, if not worse then r@pe?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    *This doesnt even have to be true to be aplicable = the cab driver could have made it all up, but the media not crucifying Kane like they do others is wrong and smells of racial bias.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Or how Ron Artest was thrown under the bus for fighting with fans… Fans that threw cups of beer at his face and were ganging up on him. Yeah.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    *This doesnt even have to be true to be aplicable = Even if the cab driver made it all up (which is extremely unlikely), the media not going after Kane just based on alligations the way they go after black athletes (like Kobe) on the same type of thing (alligations/pending legal case) is wrong and smells of racial bias. I just felt i had to clarify/had another comment but it disappeared.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    my first comment showed up!

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Ben Rothersburger might have r@ped somebody…its a very sketchy alligation but it could have happened and their is a investegation/lawsuit. Does he lose all his endourcements and become Public Enemy #1 for a couple months like Kobe? NO.

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    What alternate universe did I fall into where BETcats is defending Kobe?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    i am using him as a example. I think the media should destroy everyone’s reputation equally, not go extra easy on some and extra hard on others.Metophorically speaking reporting shouldnt be like hamburger, where athletes are condiments and you get to chose which ones you put on it. At this point however, it is, and the black athletes get the worst end of it.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    and what alternate universe did i fall into where B.Long is Brad Long and has a slamonline link? Doing big thing their, but dont forget where you came from!

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com Blinguo

    People forgot to mention, Olympiacos/akos gets their C’s and K’s replaced more than any other words published anywhere. Type it into the SLAM (google) search there and see. Truly Gangsta.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    “Ain’t No Half-Stepping”.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    BET
    I see you.
    Oh, and Shannon Brown got a story on ESPN when somebody reported they INTENDED to sue him over some sexual shenanigans, but Big Ben couldn’t get a story for a week because it would hurt his reputation and the allegations might be false, according to Vince Doria the head of ESPN news.
    So, nobody was concerned about Shannon Brown’s rep? Or was ESPN just convinced that Shannon Brown must have done something since he fits the profile?
    Just so y’all can think about it.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    When Allen just mentioned “Big Ben”, I immediately started to g00gle Ben Wallace to see what he was being charged with, and then I remembered there are two Big Ben’s.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com Blinguo

    BET is correct, Dick’sSportingGoods hasn’t pulled their Ben Roth cleats spot. Mike Vick’s leaving court with a distant look on his face, from whichever coming or goings is on repeat. Not to throw any more cards into the hat, I’d assume if they were still running them, they’d pull the old David Ortiz spots on arrival – simply for being positive on a test 6 years ago, and nobody will know anytime soon-not even him- what he tested for. but that’s a bigger can of worms, and long running witch hunt, MLB.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Babe Ruth was a even bigger a$$hole to his teammates then T.O is today. I watched a documentary where one of them told a story of Ruth PEEING ON HIM in the shower. Just walking up behind him and pissing. But we only choose to look at Ruth’s greatness in baseball. Why cant the same be done for Owens in football?

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com Blinguo

    Babe Ruth Kelly? This guy sure wasn’t a Micky Mantle. He’d hold a lantern in a cabin bare handed and blister his whole hand up because if he dropped it, everyone would burn down.
    -
    Nobody knows with TO after his tearful (un?)intentionally comedic “he’s my Quarterback” Mexico trip-Romo-Simpson-Gate after he murdered every QB he ever played for in his rise to checking his stats. Now he’s on reality shows, yelling at soap stars, scripted or not, so he’s not coming back from (or to) where he wants to be anytime soon.

  • http://fdjsklf.com Jukai

    BETCATS: You’ve gone f*cking insane. You’re comparing BABE RUTH’S CONTRIBUTIONS TO BASEBALL to TERREL OWENS CONTRIBUTIONS TO FOOTBALL?

  • http://fdjsklf.com Jukai

    I mean, JORDAN F*CKING PUNCHED TWO OF HIS TEAMMATES N THE FACE AND IT WAS SWEPT UNDER THE COVER!!!
    That’s what happens when you’re THE BEST IN THE PLANET!
    Plus, every documentary I’ve seen shows Babe Ruth getting tons of crap.
    I mean, that comparison was so far off base and ridiculous that… man, how insane!!

  • Yesse

    So is J.R. just trying to clean his name or just saying, that if he is a blood he isnt a gang member, because thats not a gang?

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com Blinguo

    And yeah TO was catching up to Jerry Rice, but likes TV time more than record breaking. TO never FUBAR’d like Jordan, nor could he have when he never continued onto dominance. Ho Grant can’t eat, on the plane in front of me, for playing like garbage our last game, freaking Ho’

  • TUESDAY

    J.R. Smith JUST NEEDS TO GET HIS A$$ TOGETHER. HE HONESTLY DOESNT REALIZE HOW GOOD HE IS ON THE COURT. MAN COULD BE THE NEXT BEST THING IF HE’D STOP F**KING AROUND. AS FOR THIS GANG BULLSH*T JR NEEDS TO REALIZE THE SMALLEST SLIP UP LIKE REPLACING THE C’s WITH K’s ARE OBVIOUSLY GOING TO GARNISH SOME ATTENTION ESPECIALLY WHEN UR A YOUNG BLACK MAN. AS WELL AS THE “3″ SIGNS HE THROWS UP IN GAMES C’MON JR YOU GOT PPL ROOTING FOR YOU.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    there’s an undeniable double standard with the nba, of course. when baseball players clear the benches, they’re having each others back. when nhl players went into the stands because fans threw beers at them (sounds familiar?), journos defended them for not allowing abusive fans to do what they want just because they paid a ticket. when there’s a brawl in basketball, it’s the scariest moment of the decade and we reach for socioeconomic justifications. thems the breaks.

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    i’ll give one thing to david stern, though: he knows that his league and its stars have to be squeaky clean to be marketable in our environment. sadly, it’s a fact. america IS afraid of allen iverson. i don’t think it’s an accident that the nba is the league that’s the most active on a community-level. basketball without borders, read to achieve, etc. they HAVE to. they NEED to show the big tatted black dude with the rows doing positive things for the community in order for him to not be perceived as a thug. shannon brown has to do more than dan dickau to get the benefit of the doubt. it’s not fair, but that’s how it is. stern understands that. there’s a gap between the nba players and the people wealthy enough to be regular consumers of the product.

  • vic21

    yeah, and Scalabrini is not an Albino.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    this felt like the same 4 people were saying the same four things…

  • rikson

    Bu we all know about the double standards – and so does Jr! Why would he get all the inks?! If he wants to fight those standards thats fine (somebody really should)… But the way he acts, it seems like hes reprecenting the image, that all this gang stuff is cool – and thats NOT fine! Wether he is in a gang or not doesnt really mather…

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Jukai, how crazy am i? Babe Ruth is #3 in homeruns. TO WILL be #2 in touchdowns. TO WILL be #2 in about 4-6 catogories when he retires, as well as 1st in a few things…whats so far fetched?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    and the media might cover Jordan’s a$$ jukai (although Sam Smith’s ‘Jordan Rules’ is basically one big attack on MJ) but it just proves my point that they pick and choose what the difference between good and evil is.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    and the media might cover Jordan’s a$$ jukai (although Sam Smith’s ‘Jordan Rules’ is basically one big attack on MJ) but it just proves my point that they pick and choose what the difference between good and evil is.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    ^double post party!!! DPP!!!

  • http://djsklfl.com Jukai

    Babe Rush:
    3rd on all-time home run list with 714
    10th on all-time batting average list with .342
    2nd on all-time RBI list with 2,217
    1st on all-time slugging % with 0.690
    2nd on all-time on-base % list with .474
    1st on all-time OPS with 1.164
    4th on all-time runs list with 2,174
    6th on all-time total bases list with 5,793
    3rd on all-time bases on balls list with 2,062
    Also, I mean, let’s not forget about the seven championships he won.
    And the fact he didn’t do steroids.
    I figure you really don’t watch baseball, BETCATS, so I’m letting it slide, but… god… that was really really stupid…
    And your point seemed racially motivated. Jordan, to my knowledge, is black. If you had a generic “the media picks favorites” message, then yes, thank you Mr. Obvious.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    lets not play stupid here Jukai. Terrel Owens isnt done yet, so i cannot get you his ‘career rankings’ because his career is not over. But all you need to know is that he is the 2nd greatest wide reciver all time behind Jerry Rice. And he didnt use steriods either, although in Ruth’s age steriod use was not a problem so you had clean pitcher vs clean hitter compared to the juicing pitcher vs juicing hitter of today; point being: he didnt face anything unatural, Terrel Owens plays in a league that is FILLED with steriod users. Buts lets not get sidetracked on steriods. Racially motivated? YES, IT IS ABOUT RACE. The media picks favorites, and race is a factor! Compare the way the r@pe charges against Kobe were handle to the way the same charges against Ben Rothersburger are currently being reported on. Compare Jamal Tinsley with Patrick Kane. Is anyone labeling Kane as a ‘no good thug that should never play hockey again’? Yes Jordan is black, but he is also universally loved by everyone including white people. For a lot of people in the media, the demeanor of black athletes (the sterotypical 22 inch rims, sagging pants, loud music) is a big turnoff and will be a motivating factor to VILLANIZE them so that parents will not let their children act like them/shelter their children from them by finding other sports. Because no white-middle class mom wants their son saying ‘yo whats up’, even though in REALITY that would never happen, in the medias mind it would, so vilification MUST occur. It is also why the NBA lost a lot of white fans. White parents took the NBA of Portland Jailblazer fame out of their childrens life in recent years. I know this because i go to school with white people, am friends with white people who are HUGE college basketball fans but HATE the NBA because that is what they were taught. The media is just trying its best to be a ‘aide’ in the process of teaching children to stay away from those society deams ‘wrong’ by nature: ie hip hop athletes: ie BLACK ATHLETES.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jukai
    How is Babe Ruth going to be considered the best baseball player when he played no defense and didn’t play against black people or hispanics?

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