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Tuesday, November 3rd, 2009 at 9:00 am  |  294 responses

Yep, Allen Iverson is Already Upset

by Marcel Mutoni / @marcel_mutoni

A few weeks ago, I wrote a completely insane season preview for the Memphis Grizzlies. The gist of the piece was that this year was going to be an absolute disaster for the team — well, even moreso than usual — and that Allen Iverson would be one of the main culprits.

Thing is, though, even I didn’t truly believe that things would unravel so quickly in Memphis. And, well, guess what?

The sweat had barely dried off his braids following his first game in a Grizzlies uniform last night, and A.I. was already mad about the amount of playing time he received in the overtime loss to the Kings.

From the AP game story:

After missing the first three games while recovering from a partial right hamstring tear, Iverson played only briefly as a reserve, scoring 11 points in less than 18 minutes. He said he had no problems with his hamstring, but had a big problem with the playing time he got from coach Lionel Hollins.

“Go look at my resume and that will show you that I’m not a sixth man,” Iverson said. “I don’t think it has anything to do with me being selfish. It’s just who I am. I don’t want to change what gave me all the success that I’ve had since I’ve been in this league.”

There are a few more angry quotes here.

Allen Iverson, ladies and germs! I can’t wait to hear how Michael Heisley, Chris Wallace and the rest of the geniuses in that front office end up rationalizing all of this.

This.Shall.Not.End.Well.

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  • thomas

    he’s so full of himself and what he has accomplished in the past… ridiculous… it ain’t about scoring titles A.I., it’s about winning games/ championships… time to grow up fast Allen or you’re faster out of the league as your crossover was during the 96/97 campaign…

  • thomas

    And he actually is just a sixth man at this point in his career…
    what is it that he can do that Mayo can’t do (at this point in their careers!)

  • http://myspace.com/brandnew Bryan

    Trade him to the knicks.

  • max

    He’s rite. Let him start, it hasn’t actually hurt a team to let him start, but it did hurt teams to not let him.

  • sab

    bla bla bla. this is just media sh1t-stirring. iverson will come back strong.

  • http://allanzuss@yahoo.com Mendel

    He deserved a start

  • Foobar

    People buy a hammer and try to use it as a screwdriver…let him work his magic.

  • Michael

    he should be starting over mike freakin conley, mayo/iverson/gay/randolph/gasol is a very potent starting 5.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    He has a REAL problem with seeing his career PPG numbers drop doesn’t he. I honestly didn’t think I would be saying this, seriously…..

    BUT IS A.I. STILL RELEVANT TO THE NBA IN 2009/10?

  • CRAMZY

    I watched that game on league pass…and it was painful watching him get 4 minutes in the first half, and play the majority of his minutes with Steven Effin Hunter and that Caroll dude who just throw it up/turn it over anytime they sniffed the ball.Just didn’t feel right. But this is on him. He knew the situation. He knew this was not a good look for him. He had to know….it’s the damn grizzlies!!!

  • NUPE

    AI is right, he should start along with Mayo. The team isn’t winning and AI makes them better. The best predicter of future performance is past performance. There is nothing in AI’s history or age that even remotely suggest he should be coming off the bench behind Conley. If they were 4-0 I’d say AI can stay on the bench with fear of ruining team chemestry etc, but that ain’t the case and sense AI is clearly better than Conley, it’s time to start him. However, as a coach I’d be less inclined to start him if he keeps talking like this.

  • you already know.

    Iverson should be playin alot of minute. Iverson still pound 4 pound one top player in the league. The Media stay hatin on Iverson. True fact Memphis will not make a playoff run if Iverson is not getting minute on the court.

  • you already know.

    Iverson should be playin alot of minute. Iverson still pound 4 pound one top player in the league. The Media stay hatin on Iverson. True fact Memphis will not make a playoff run if Iverson is not getting minute on the court.

  • giogolo

    Bwahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahhaha
    DUMB Grizzlies Management.

  • riggs

    thats what he gets for even choosing to sign with the grizzlies, why the hell didnt he go back to his old coach, you know the guy he played so many years for and knows how to actually use him?

  • http://www.gmail.com rushmelo

    man iverson’s still got game…he’s still the scoring machine that he is
    its just that last year with detroit, spoilt his reputation and confidence because he couldn’t fit into that system.
    i guess he should start with mayo
    he must get atleast 32-35 MPG
    grizzles starting five should be
    C. M.gasol
    PF. zach randolph(man’s 25-10 for life!)
    SF. rudy gay
    SG. OJ mayo
    PG. allen iverson
    and they should play mike conley as the sixth man with ample minutes
    actually on paper the grizzles are pretty talented
    they have hamed haddidi,hakim warrick to play the 4
    jaric n williams as guard
    and hasheem as 5

  • PArsons

    Allen Iverson should also check his resume and read the part about the championships he’s won and the number of finals he’s been to. Don’t get this twisted I am an Iverson fan (flew from the Uk to see him play in Philly) but if he does not recognize the good old days are gone then he will have to learn the hard way.

  • Jas

    Conley is garbage. Start Iverson.

  • Renato

    First of all given how badly the Bobcats need points (yesterday game was ridiculuos, they scored 19 points AS A TEAM in the first 16 mins!!) Larry . could actually use him.

    Second and last, if u were A.I. would’nt u feel disrespected if someone started Conley ahead of u??? Come on the guy has had 2 years with virtually no competition on a poor team and he hasn’t showed neither a glimpse of an all-caliber PG .

    START A.I. FOR GOD’S SAKE!!!

  • http://www.gmail.com rushmelo

    man iverson has to start
    its just that last year he did not fit into detroit’s system
    doesnt mean he cant score
    he is still who he is
    the answer to everyone’s questions

    they should start him with Mayo at the guard spot
    and yeah!
    give him minutes!
    about 32-25
    he’ll average 22-24 a game
    along with his regular 3.5 boards and 6 dimes
    and what he brings to the court that is most precious
    EXPERIENCE!!!

  • Nigel

    AI is my favorite player, and I don’t feel he has completely regressed as a player but he needs to calm down here. It’s only your first game. Hollins is still trying to figure out this redundant roster he has. I’m sure he’ll work you in to some good minutes later on.

  • Nigel

    AI is my favorite player, and I don’t feel he has completely regressed as a player but he needs to calm down here. It’s only your first game. Hollins is still trying to figure out this redundant roster he has. I’m sure he’ll work you in to some good minutes later on. I just hate to see his image diminish when he does this.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Cheryl

    One of the things I love about Iverson is his honesty, right or wrong, he will share his emotions. It’s just not the right time in this situation. He probably will start, but if the coach felt he needed to ease AI into the rotation, then Iverson should be okay with that. He had a partially torn hammy, for goodness sakes. If after 3 or 4 games and he’s still only getting limited minutes, then say something TO THE COACH, behind closed doors. He’s gotta know how this will come off in the media. He’s been here before, many, many times. He should take a cue from Gil, and let his game speak for him.

  • ENDS

    Damn. One Game and he’s already complaining

  • mike

    i am so sick of hearing about this guy – he needs to face the fact that he is not a game changer anymore – grizz should be starting conley because he is the future and they need to show confidence in him

  • Sam

    Iverson deserves a start. He is immense! Have the grizzlies learnt nothing from Detroit???? Besides, we know its about winning games and not scoring championships. Thats what he’s moaning about! The fact that they aint winning games, but they still bringing him off the bench!! He may be a bit old, but he’s still an amazing player. GO AI!!!

  • whooo!

    Iverson’s ego is just outta control. he’ll never see the logic of coming off the bench, no matter how it’s based on injury concerns. yeah yeah, call him a warrior or competitor, i call it straight selfish. he made that whole scene in Philly when he was asked to come off the bench following an injury, and he went off saying he’s not bench player. that same week, Tim Duncan came off an injury and was brought off the bench to ease into game-shape – not one word of complaining. Iverson constantly reminds me of Chappelle’s “When Keeping It Real Goes Wrong” skits.

  • ENDS

    Im just glad he has his Braids back. He Should be Grateful Memphis was the only team giving him an opportunity

  • http://www.manutd.com Z

    I can’t take AI’s back on this one. At no point did the Grizz tell him that he was going to start. In fact, I kinda remember Hollins saying that Conley would keep his job. This is not a Detroit situation, he wasn’t blindsided this time. Yeah, you can argue that he should start for them but the fact remains that he perferctly knew what he was getting into this time around.

  • Brian

    The Grizz were up 12 or so points when AI came into the game and up 3 when he came out in the first half. AI is always the victim.

  • Cam

    Its amazing that iverson fans still refuse to see the absolute obvious
    1.He is 34
    2.He hasnt wona scoring title in god knows how long
    3.this isnt a one season thing with detroit its happening again
    4.he is well past his prime he isnt one of the quickest point gaurds anymore that was his trait speed

    anyone who wants to add more go right ahead

  • JDH21

    Iverson is still a great scorer, but at this point his best role is off of the bench. If he was really that concerned about his scoring numbers he would realize this. Are you going to score more points playing with Steven Hunter or Rudy, OJ and Randolph?

  • Judy

    Ai should be the starter. He is very competitive-he wants to win. I’m for him. I’m sick of reading this crap from the media so I don’t think I will anymore.

  • http://www.twitter.com/Th3_R3al_Chris Th3_R3al_Chris

    A.I.’s right. If the Grizzlies want to have the best chance of competing then they should let him play.

  • AL29

    Surprise! That malcontent who 29 other teams rejected is now causing problems with his new team. Iverson is probably still a great player, but he hasn’t helped a team play well since his MVP year.

  • http://www.twitter.com/Th3_R3al_Chris Th3_R3al_Chris

    Everyone can hate on him. BUT, Memphis signed him only to sell tickets and not to allow him a chance to showcase his abilities. It’s not wonder the organization is in shambles.

  • http://www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Hey, i hear Olympiakos Athens is still looking to part with some money… (sorry Spanny…)

  • http://www.another48minutes.com Gerard Himself

    I can only add one thing: uh oh

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    It is getting harder and harder to defend this guy…

  • http://www.myspace.com/mcnarrative Kieran

    Grizzlies is a bad fit man, you cant play AI, Rudy, OJ, and Randolph way too many chuckers! Iverson needs to realise that he has 2 choices for the rest of his quickly diminishing NBA career. He can play for a rubbish team, get minutes and keep up his scoring average and win nothing. Or accept a secondary role.
    He would be perfect coming of the bench for any contender/there abouts that struggles scoring with their second stringin the game. That way Al would still get to be Al, but in a positive way.
    Really dont want him to out like this, he is so much better than that.

  • CSP8

    If you’re that much of an effective player you should shine coming off the bench or starting and be so effective that your team has no choice but to leave you in (ex. Jason Terry). But if you need no less that 35 minutes to make a difference, then im sorry thats not efficient enough to start demanding things.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Come on, seriously!!! He pulled the same ish in Detroit too! First game back from an injury so he gets reduced minutes. I’m sure the plan isn’t to play him that little in the future. He was hurt, missed a decent portion of the preseason, and hasn’t played a real game with his teammates yet, but he expects to start and get 40 minutes? WTF??!?! He may still have game, but maybe you shouldn’t piss off management after your first game of the season a$$hole…he just continues to expose how big of a d!ckhead he really is and that last season wasn’t exclusively the Pistons fault.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    I wonder why 29 other teams passed on him?

  • Mack

    Chris Wallace is stupid, I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. This isn’t a video game, having 4 players that need shots to be effective and happy will never work. Memphis would have fared better just stopping with deals after getting Randolph. Maybe Charlotte and Memphis should have worked out a deal to send Raymond Felton to Memphis for Allen Iverson? Seems to make more sense.

  • Mack

    Iverson is no doubt good, but his shoot-first ways don’t work anymore. He says “I don’t want to change what gave me all the success that I’ve had since I’ve been in this league,” but look at the roster you have. OJ Mayo is a stud. You don’t take minutes away from him. Mike Conley isn’t that great, but at least he’s a true point. If you want things to work like you said they would at that press conference, then you HAVE to change. Becoming more of a playmaker and passer is not a bad idea.

  • Orlando Green

    What a Looser

  • http://slamonline.com Chris O’Leary

    Maybe AI can join the circus and be The Amazing 30 Points On 30-40 Shots Man, going from town to town playing one on five until he’s had his fill of individual success and is ready to retire. Really, he should take a buyout and play in Europe.

  • Bk

    The new big baby…he is now the Answer on how to screw up a team. I shall now enjoy watching this debacle with glee.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    This is unfortunate and unsurprising.

  • http://hibachi20.blogspot.com Moose

    We talkin’ about PRACTICE??

  • JDub

    @ Cramzy

    I too watched this game last night on league pass and I was shocked that he only goy 4-5 minutes in the first half. I was like WTF. Everybody on here is saying that he’s selfish but why should he expect coming off the bench when this time last year he was 3rd in the league in scoring and still would be at least top ten if it wasn’t for a bad trade on his behalf but it did benefit Denver (gotta a true point) and cleared cap room for Detroit to go after a big name free agent……..namely Lebron in 2010. Come on……..MIKE CONLEY starting over A.I.??? GTFOH. Just because you guys don’t like him personally still doesn’t mean he want still drop 25+ on your favorite team. Your skills don’t diminish that fast in less than 6 month time. Prime example, I think Kobe is probably a b*tch in person but because I played college basketball, I do realize he is the best player in the world…….no not athlete (i.e. Lebron) but player. My personal feelings has nothing to do with his game as matter fact most of the players probably are assholes to some degree. Bottom line…..ALLEN IVERSON is not a 17 minute per game player.

  • slawson

    Wayno pretty much nailed it on the head… AI is a better option the Conley, but WTF? indeed! You miss the first few games with a torn hammy, you are not integrated with the team yet (oh yeah, that’s right… it’s not about practice!) but expects to be the starter. I don;t think AI is going to take over any games at this stage of his career. If he had his head on straight, he could be a valuable 6th man… like Jason Terry or Rasheed Wallace. So why is it that a nutcase like ‘sheed is okay with it, and AI is not?

  • The Burner

    trade him to sonics, oh wait…

  • jdote

    Yooo slam i thought u had love for A.I.. how come the media hasn’t atleast mentioned this quote from last nite..“If we’re winning games with me in that (reserve) role, I would be a (jerk) for fighting that,” Iverson said soon after pointing out: “I came off the bench and we still lost.”… that don’t sound reasonable for a former mvp to say, who had one subpar season to sai.

  • DJK

    Because Sheed still gets more minutes than A.I. Iverson played 18 minutes, mostly with scrubs who wouldn’t see the court on other teams. Playing well too. He went 5-9 with a 3 and an assist. If he were playing poorly then he could be pulled. Pretty sure they were up about a point with 5 minutes left before they pulled for Conley. Look how that turned out.

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    Bad look, AI. I also see his suffers from being painfully honest, much like Vince Carter circa John Thompson Interview.
    Definitely, he should be starting.
    Definitely, he has a right to be frustrated.
    But it’s been one game, the move here should have been to keep it to himself. Then after a few games if he’s still on the bench, talk to the coach. Closed doors, man, closed doors.

  • tavoris

    well, the Grizz DID lose last night. And the comments-when looked at EVERYTHING he said-sounds like he was frustrated about the questionable substitution patterns during the game. He DID say that he has no problems coming off the bench if the Grizz are winning. However, Conley is an inconsistent mess at PG (as he’s been ever since he got drafted).

    On a side note, I am VERY impressed with Marc Gasol so far this season.

  • http://realcavsfans.com Anton

    Memphis lied to him!

  • cramzy

    if he could get the minutes, just 25-30, he’d be a lot happier, i’m sure of it. What’s killing him (and me) about this bench stuff is the 18 minutes and being pulled in crunch time with the team up…especially when you factor in that Conley is ass cheeks. That being said, it’s one game, and AI would do himself a big favor by just chillin out until he gets a few more games under his belt and it’s clear that the team is better when he’s on the floor. He stays giving the detractors ammo.

  • Cizzo

    Just like I said earlier this year, Cancer or maybe full blown Aids, A.I. is trying to sabotage my young Grizzlies, Get his ass out of Memphis if he can,t except his role, A.I. I understand being heated about the lost, but your only concern is stroking your own ego. I hate to say it, but the end is closing in on you fast, at this point in your career it’s time for you to be teams first, finally make the younger player around you better!

  • ab_40

    wow AI actin like a lil girl… who knew. If they got any balls in memphis they should let him play 5 minutes in each of the next two games just to make a point. He isn’t the star of this team. and he deffinetly isn’t the best player. stop whining and start playing please… thank you

  • Chris

    Does Allen Iverson understand the concept of aging? I’m not saying he’s washed up, but at some point you can’t just say look at what I’ve done in my career I deserve to start, at some point it becomes about what’s best for the teams future, and what’s best for the teams future is to play OJ mayo as many minutes as he can handle.

  • Darko

    Trade him!!!!!!

  • http://www.garrettelliott.com Garrett

    If there’s anyone in AI’s life that he actually listens to, they need to look him in the eye and say, “YOU’RE OLD! Come off the bench already!”

  • http://staticseth.blogspot.com/ Seth

    Dear Philadelphia 76ers, please take Iverson back and start him. You’d be satisfying Iverson, Philly fans, and everyone else who is sick of hearing about Iverson’s drama. Oh, and you might generate some ticket sales too. Peace, Seth.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    One of the worst (maybe THE worst) BASKETBALL PLAYERS (not showmen,shoesellers,etc) of all time.Simple as that.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    go check his post game comments, the guy is plain and simple _________!!!! IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!IVERSON!!!!STARBURY!!!!
    @Darksaber…..:why not in ALBA instead…???? just think about his reaction when he finds that even there he cannot be a starter..!!!! By the way: Iverson cannot be a starter in a top-10 Euroleague team. GUARANTED.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    @Chris…..: you know what is the first thing you need in order to perform the “function” of ‘understanding’ ? Iverson doesn’t have that….this is a sad truth that becomes with every day passing clear to everybody, even kids that learned about the game only through video games….of course those who know, were able to figure this out since 1998. The guy simply doesn’t get it (even the simplest-most basics….)

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    This isn’t even a big deal. Why is SLAM endorsing these TMZ-like stories? Let him play before calling him out on some quotes that mean nothing. If you honestly believe that Iverson should play 17 minutes a game behind MIKE CONLEY then you obviously know nothing about basketball.

  • k3v1n3o5

    Wow,that didnt take long did it?I still see Iverson as starter,but I dont see any team that would start him,either because the teams pg is young,and growing(Chalmers),or because the team has a veteran LEADER,despite his game slipping(D-Fish).The only two teams where A.I could start would be the Bobcats,and the Kings.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Kevin, you make no sense. Iverson wouldn’t start over MARIO CHALMERS, but he could start on the Kings over prospect TYREKE EVANS? Wow…

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    @Teddy — agreed that he shouldn’t be playing 17 min behind Conley. But this is his first game back from injury. His reaction is not acceptable here.

  • Ryan.T.

    I was honestly pissed off when Iverson sat for the 2nd half of the 4th quarter, and all of overtime. Actually, he got to go in for the last play of regulation just to be a decoy… And he was put in the last 30+ seconds of overtime, when the game was clearly out of reach. And in case you guys didn’t notice the Grizzlies ended up losing by double digits. All in all, the Grizzlies couldn’t score when needed. People can say what you want about Mayo or Conley “deserving” majority of the minutes, but the truth is they couldn’t carry the team to a win last night & most likely won’t do it in the near future as well. IVERSON IN THE STARTING 5!!!! Oh yeah, why are people complaining about his age when he can clearly still light it up??

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    any discussion of the shoeseller being a starter on any top-40 bball team in the world is pure comedy!!!! keep them coming,please!!!

  • http://www.stonesthrow.com/madlib Michael NZ

    I can’t stand the guy, yet I STILL didn’t expect this after one game. How stupid am I? The Canswer.

  • http://fjdsklf.com Jukai

    ahhahahaha…. Man… I just pity this dude now.

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    The Greek Ambassador does not disappoint as he now extends his commenting streak to 73429 consecutive cartoon-related articles. Say what you want about his ideals, but the guy has heart!

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    at the same time real players (top-50 all time specifically) not only came from the bench but do ANYTHING (even kill bats with bare hands!!!) and then downplay the whole thing with modesty. “When you can’t dunk anymore, you have to find a way to make it into the news,” Ginobili said. That is the words of a great MAN,not just a great bball player. Do i need to explain you why the shoeseller would never have tried such a thing, further more downplaying it after succeiding (he would propably would have asked for a better shoe deal…)….?? MANU>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>J.R.HOLDEN>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ME>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>IVERSON.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    @tealish…..:73431 (A.I. is such an inspiration).

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    ok, i ain’t over A.I. (he would propably have scored already 3 baskets before i moved my left foot,even in my ‘prime’) but he is nowhere near Holden….

  • RipShow

    Dimitris: Anyone can sell shoes. You’re just a plain ol’ Iverson-hater. He’s one of, if not the greatest scorer in NBA history, and his name didn’t become an adjective for crossovers from just selling shoes. Come on. Get a life.

    That said, AI should probably be thanking Memphis for even signing him, seeing as nobody else was exactly hopping to. Remember, his contract is only one year.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    @ tealish: Whatever Iverson says the media is going to jump him for it. When he says he thinks his team will do well, the “experts” scoff at him. Seriously, these stories are getting really, really banal. He shouldn’t have reacted the way he did but SLAM/media going berzerk like Iverson is commiting some sort of felony is getting tiresome. Plain and simple.

  • Adam

    Iverson should learn how to throw a pass or facilitate an offense, then he can talk.

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    @ Teddy — I get that the media doesn’t like him. Trust me, I’m a fan and I know how he’s been treated. He’s the type of guy the media loves to ride when he’s successful, but the moment he suffers any set back, it’s an elated no holds barred type of deal.

    But that’s not the case here. SLAM is simply covering a story. This *is* newsworthy. And it’s not as if they put this article as their front page item.

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    @PANAGOPOULOUS: Don’t sell yourself short.

  • Tommy Patron

    @ caps boy – Describing Ginobili as top 50 all-time lets folks know all they need to about your basketball acumen.

  • JD

    A.I!You’re not All Star/MVP/Superstar any more get that
    into your head!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • jrb

    hahahaha, this is hysterical!!! I love AI!!! :)

  • Tim

    He is right but he used the wrong forum to vent his frustration

    He should of learnt from the piston debacle last year

    but a team with
    Iverson
    Mayo
    Gay
    Randolph
    M.Gasol

    Will be deadly.. just no depth really

  • http://www.alloutblitz.com Cordeazy

    Tealish: Forget it. Convincing Teddy that Iverson has done wrong is like convincing Myles Brown to buy a pair of Zoom Lebron V

  • http://sjf.co Jukai

    Whoops, that was me, not Cordeazy… I fell for the SLAM database curse!

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Do you think if Manu Ginobli had come out and said “what the HELL is this 35 year old Michael Finley doing starting over me, check out my resume CHECK OUT MY RESUME!!!” anyone on slam would have defended Ginobli? Hohum…

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    This is clearly Michael Currie’s fault.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, you’re making urself appear spineless (along with the greek guy) when you have YET to own up to your errors in the articles from last week that CORROBORATED AI’s perspective in the Detroit situation (remember you out-and-out said AI was lying). Don’t do it to yourself, dude.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Jukai FTW (4:59 & 5:03)

  • Shem

    I hate to say it BUT maybe if you signed with charlotte or miami you would be starting .. im pretty sure he d get the nod over raja bell/raymond felton OR mario chalmers

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris: What are you talking about? AI’s perspective was “he was told he was a starter” AS was Rip. Both whined about going to the bench. Rip got sent to the bench. -THE TEAM STILL LOST-. Rip, who has a ring with Detroit, wanted to start again. Players started turning on Iverson. Iverson asked his coach, “Hey, you gonna bench me?” THE SOLE ERROR WAS THAT THE COACH SAID “NO IVERSON I’D NEVER DO THAT TO YOU AND INSULT YOUR PRECIOUS PRECIOUS EGO LIKE THAT.”
    Coach sends Iverson to the bench and Iverson fakes a back injury because Iverson has to pad his stats.
    I’m not sure why these ‘revelations’ about Curry telling Iverson he wasn’t going to bench him suddenly put Iverson in the clear for faking injuries and not trying to help Detroit in “any role he could” which is what he said at the beginning of the season.
    And if that’s all said and done, well, did ANOTHER coach lie to him about his playing time? For chrissakes…

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Besides, who you calling a wimp, you were the one who blatantly added star players to the teams that Iverson played against in his Finals run to make the teams seem like they were tougher for Iverson. That was both horrendous and historical at the same time.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, you’re hopeless…I’m about as done with you as I am with “the other guy”.

  • tavoris

    so go back to your pseudo-witty, yet intellectually shallow comments with the greek dude. Have fun trolling for laughs.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    please let me be the other guy, please let me be the other guy, please let me be the other guy…Tavoris, I believe you sir are the hopeless one with your “allen iverson is jesus christ and can therefore do no wrong” posts every 5 minutes. How do you defend this guy when every other time he opens his mouth he makes a complete a$$ of himself and comes accross as a fussy 3 year old? He says this stuff a.) after not playing a SINGLE GAME with his new team b.) after coming off an injury and c.) after he said he’d do anything for the team blah blah blah…give me a break dude.

  • tavoris

    Wayno…I didn’t defend him about this. I think he shoulda kept his mouth shut. But garbage minutes did NOT get them a win. Ant BTW, I didn’t see your face in that other article either (search for “Rip Hamilton: Michael Curry’s a Liar” if you missed it).

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    I TOLD YOU SO I TOLD YOU SO I TOLD YOU SO! As soon as Iverson signed with Memphis, i told everybody this team was going to implode, that the guard rotation would either leave out Conley and hurt the future or leave out Iverson and hurt the present. I also said Iverson and OJ couldnt coexsist. I WIN

  • tavoris

    show me one occasion where I’ve even come close to saying AI is the best player, top-5 player, top-10 player, top-20 player. I’ve never done that…EVER. You misunderstand me despising the spineless hate some of you spew for jock-riding. If you did something other than troll AI articles, you’d know that I stan for Duncan, just like I stanned for D-Rob in the 90s.

  • tavoris

    and wayno, the greek troll is “the other guy”. you are so-not on my radar one bit. get over urself.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    If Allen Iverson was coach, Allen Iverson would make Allen Iverson sit on the bench and then Allen Iverson would complain to the media. Allen Iverson would also double compulsory practice time and restrict player entourages to 64 people. Allen Iverson and Zach Randolph would go on strike.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    awwwww, you broke my heart Tavoris…go recheck the article about RIP, I was talkin there too son.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    lol @ Izzo

  • Anneliese

    He just came back from injury… why would he play 35 minutes? That makes no sense. AI is one of my two favorite NBA players (ever) but he’s gotta chill out with the complaining. But the coach should also have told him that he would not play a lot in this game. Your players should know where they stand and what their roles are.

    AI is human. He had a horrific experience in DET; he anxious to forget it and start playing. But he’s gotta say the right things and go about it in a seemingly mature, veteran way. He’s not a bench player (yet) but that could be the case one day. I bet when he’s on his last legs and has a chance for a ring, he might see it differently. This year on this team, he knows he won’t win squat; he just wants redemption.

  • tavoris

    go re-read what you wrote, dude…u were busy backpedaling, not standing behind ur earlier comments.

  • tavoris

    Ultimately Wayno, if the label fits, then wear it proudly.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    um, definitely not backpeddling, but whatever. I said what I’ve said the whole time.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I’m not f*cking posting here anymore if my comment is not in the top 5 comments! I know my worth is so much more than some jibberish in the bottom of a message board. Slam lied to me!

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    Jukai……:don’t know what you’re planing to do with Tavoris but if in any way you scare the kid out of this forum then i’ll seriously come after you(no kiding)….when he mentioned Dale Ellis ,one of my favorite players of the 80′s, at the (pathetic) Bucks squad that A.I. faced in the 2000 conf-finals, he gave me so many feelings at once (like “woahhou,somebody here knows Dale,….how nice and intense the 80′s were,….what a nice shooting form Ellis had,…..somebody is including Ellis in the 2000 Bucks?……is there something wrong with Google….?? is there something wrong with the whole internet…?? should i sell all my internet stocks tomorrow..????? is this actually somebody from the site intentionally & constantly using this nickname just to have me respond to hilarious comments…???? …am i losing my sightseeing,or am i just dreaming….????…..) that i don’t think i can handle losing it…..LONG LIVE TAVORIS (or whoever from the SLAM staff has such comic talent)!!!!!!

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Hi Izzo.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Spanny: You’d probably get winded walking from where the taxi drops you off up to my doorstep kid.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    I’m still waiting for all the 40 Bars lyrics I posted on here to show up. I guess the gregarious use of the b-word and the n-word puts it through a steady moderation process.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Co-sign Tad.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    @Jukai…..: i didn’t get it. (honestly, i guess it’s an insult but i’d like to know what that means, i liked the carrot comment back in the day)

  • k3v1n3o5

    Teddy,He wouldnt start over Chalmers.There was barely any interest from the Heat in Iverson,but Riley said NOBODY was going to start over Chalmers,because the Heat werent goin to put a one year rental in the starting lineup over a guy Riley sees as the Heat’s starting point guard for a long time.Riley first has to see what he has in Chalmers before thinking of setting out for a point guard in 2010.Iverson interferes with those plans.Chalmers also plays D,and shoots efficiently,something Iverson doesnt wanna do,nor will ever want to.Lastly,The Heat are a playoff team,with the opportunity to be a championship contender next season,while the Kings are not even close.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    man, i have to give at least this to A.I.: he is bringing out the “best” of my kindergarden…i mean, tavoris checked, Allenp checked, Teddy checked, Jukai cheched, TADOne checked,Eboy….Eboy….where is Eboy????!!!!

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS or whatever screenname it is you go by now: i have a new found respect for you. Anyone who defends Tavoris (-Denzel Washington voice- My man! -Denzel Washington voice-) is cool with me.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Felton-Iverson-Wallace-Diaw-Chandler would have worked out great. Iverson would provide scoring (the one thing the Bobcats are missing). He could play as long as he wanted, take as many shots as he wanted, and played for his favorite coach. But instead he took the 3 million over Charlottes 1.5 million and proved to the world he still felt he had to be payed ‘decently’ instead of going to a team where he could win. Allen Iverson: I am saddened to see you rot away on the bench of a lottery team, but just know it is all your fault.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    WoaaaohhOU!!!! BETCATS liking me!!!! i will call this the miracle of Tavoris!!!!! and we ain’t even near Christmas…i wonder what this kid can get me under the tree….Eboy’s underwear maybe…??( i want the one with the broken hearts Santa Tavoris!!!!!)

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    and i sure as hell am not on any kindergarden team. Best believe i am leading the 3rd graders to a win. I am in a league of my own. “Troll, or comment with the intention of creating problems. Trolling includes, but isn’t limited to, baiting people to flame at you, encouraging people to leave the site, spamming and using alternate IDs” I wonder why this isnt being inforced today….

  • RipShow

    The thing I don’t get it how people actually think Zach Randolph makes this team better in any way. Didn’t anyone see that footage of him trying to do a crossover, losing the ball, retrieving it, and then airballing a three? Come on. And putting AI, Mayo, Gay, AND Z-Bo on the court with just one ball is a task.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Y’all arguing about the same stuff again?
    Season is 82 games long. It’s sad that AI felt the need to say this his first game back, but I guess that’s the lesson he learned in Detroit.
    I never supported signing in Memphis, I thought Charlotte was a better move, or off the bench for a contender.
    Some cats have to have things their way. That’s life.
    He’s still my favorite player of the last decade, that ain’t gonna change, and I’m not going to participate in gratuitous bashing.
    This was a bad move. Life goes on.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I actually say the Grizzlies beat the Raptors the other day and they had decent chemistry. I can see why the coach would bring Iverson off the bench since he was hurt, and I can see why Iverson would be pissed at 18 minutes.
    It was a dumb situation to get involved in and he made his bed so now he can lie in it.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Oh, while we’re at it, Thabeet REALLY is awful.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Allen, i agree, but since i am a Bobcat fan first and a Iverson fan second i felt the need to put him on blast for his choice.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    i am about to see 2 Euroleague games this week live, i will give you the update (i know you want!!!!).

  • http://www.digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    Thabeet is REALLY-REALLY AWFUL.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Spanny: There is a weekly Euroleague post on SLAM, do it when that shows up.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!
    IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!! IVERSON!!!!! STARBURY!!!!!

  • tavoris

    BETCATS, i don’t kno why he thinks I’m goin anywhere…I have stood by EVERYTHING I’ve said all along(unlike the backpedaling Wayno, the truth-spinning Jukai, and the infamous troll-of-many-names), and have never resorted 2 flaming or name-calling. The dude is REQUIRED to do media post-game. Of course they are gonna ask him questions (that he has to answer) that will make him go off…that’s the reporters JOB. if he declines to respond, he gets fined 25K. if he answers with a canned response, then everybody KNOWS he’s lying. If he answers honestly, then he’s hurting the team. Of course I wish he didn’t spaz, but it happened. Conley is not playing like a starting-caliber PG. Actually, he’s playing like a 3rd stringer. Mayo says he wants to play the point (and he is more efficient than Conley at that spot anyway)). Why is there even a question in Hollin’s mind about the rotation?

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    its simple Tavoris, because Hollins is a idiot and has to deal with 3 big egos. Just like Micheal Curry was a idiot who had to deal with 3 big egos. Notice both situations involve Iverson…

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Lionel Hollins is outclassed just like Michael Curry was. Iverson just happens to be an unfortunate tying bond. However, Hollins will get more of a chance in Memphis than Curry got in Detroit because the owner is not very smart.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Didn’t this whole thing start when someone asked about Iverson’s leg and Iverson responded with: “I had no problems,” he reported. “I had a problem with my butt at this point, from sitting on the bench so long. That’s the only thing I’ve got a problem with.”
    PLEASE correct me if I’m wrong, I read that on NBA.com which isn’t always correct. But if it is correct, then Iverson brought the entire thing, and those people who do NO WRONG (such as Tavoris) will have to back down about the whole ‘answering reporters questions’ thing.
    Maybe Dale Ellis was answering the question?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Dear AI, U mad. Love, everyone.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    @BETCATS…..: the only one who is not an idiot is A.I.!!!!!
    @Jukai…….:i prefer an A.I. post to do it ,it is more fitting, a perfect match: bball parody(shoeseller) together with bball rapsody (Euroleague ball )!!!! something like YINGYANG!!!!(google it,)

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    If their is one thing we can take out of tonights discussion: it is that i win. My opinon trumps all. It can be merged with everyone else’s and accepted by everyone else. Anyone who stands in its way shall be considered a barbarian and conqured by I, the Roman Empire of commenting. I win. Lets leave it at that. Outro

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Well, at least they’re not gonna lose Rudy Gay for nothing over all this. Oh wait.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, let it go. u r a troll like ur bf Spanny (aren’t you the only one that uses that pet name for him?). As I stated earlier, he shoulda kept his damn mouth shut. I’ve said it twice today. Geez…

    BETCATS, I’ll offer a HUGE apology to Jukai and Wayno if Iverson isn’t starting-and helping-the Grizzlies by the end of the month. I don’t see Conley as anything more than a PG that can come in and not turn the ball over. He doesn’t create for anyone, he doesn’t defend well, and the Grizz haven’t been an effective team with him leading them.

  • http://www2.gsb.columbia.edu/faculty/jstiglitz/ DIMITRIS DIAMANTIDIS

    Dale Ellis!!!!Dale Ellis!!!!Dale Ellis!!!!Dale Ellis!!!! this is a good opportunity for you to read about the great Dale Ellis, if i remember correct he scored over 50 in a triple overtime opening game(?) or so….i learned it after a week (back then we had no internet) and i was amazed (mostly about the final score i think)

  • tavoris

    Russ, I’m flabbergasted in why they don’t think Gay is worth $50 mil…but then again, they don’t have to extend him yet (cuz he’s gonna get low-balled when the cap goes down again next summer anyway)

  • tavoris

    Jukai, really? they got VERBATIM quotes off an unexpected rant without media present? really?

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris: As I said, I wasn’t positive, but please don’t interject because you aren’t either. From how it read on NBA.com, someone asked about his leg, and he said “my leg is fine but my butt hurt from being on the bench” and that’s when the media was like “er, were you unhappy being on the bench?” and Iverson started complaining. A lot of his complaints was about the media having the audacity to even ASK him if he was willing to accept a reserve role.
    Getting the entire interview verbatim would quell this.
    Also, was that actually you who wrote that 7:12 post?

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    I’m not sure whether Gay gets lowballed. There’s a lot of teams desperately slashing capspace to sign Bron/Wade/Bosh, and once they all sign, that money’s gonna have to be spent on someone. Rudy’s in that next tier. I’m sure the UConn Pistons would like to find a way to add him.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    A.I’s infallability/ being the worst person who has ever lived is another one of those weird ‘only exists on SLAMonline’ consensous viewpoints.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    I like Gay but even that would be too many UConn players for me to handle….

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    This place takes on it’s own life, Izzo.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    It’s cool how you bash Iverson than conveniently take yourself out of the argument and look at it through a window, Izzo, that’s a great trait to have.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    If any of the people on here like Jukai or Wayno had played basketball in their life at a high level and started and been the best player on the team you would know how AI feels and why he is getting screwed over. I know how it is if I knew I was better than someone and he was being started over me I would be pissed too. But AI needs to patient he can’t mess things up right off the bat because I am preety sure Hollins is going to start him soon anyway. This probably just pissed Hollins off more now and he might try getting back at AI by keeping him on the bench a bit longer. Still though, If this was Denver in 07-08 AI would come back from the injury and start and get to play his way. But since Detroit made it seem like it is okay to bench AI he has to settle for what most Superstars like him think is a joke. AI played preety well though shot 5 for 9 in 17 minutes playing a NBA game for the first time in 6 months and still putting up 11 points. AI used to sometimes score 11 points in 35 mins last season which goes to show just how many touches and chances AI really got there. I would still start AI though because AI in 17 mins almost did what Conley in 35 did.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Its just really not a big deal at this point. Its his first game and he’s just come off an injury. The Grizzlies lost with him riding the pine and I don’t see them shafting him after they’ve seen what can happen (ie Detroit). Really, it was probably just a misunderstanding that he and his coach can handle without SLAM/media trying to ride him to another empty headline.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    Question about Gay: will he restricted or unrestricted?

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ TADOne

    * he be

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    BETCATS Posted: Nov.3 at 5:44 pm
    I TOLD YOU SO I TOLD YOU SO I TOLD YOU SO! As soon as
    Iverson signed with Memphis, i told everybody this
    team was going to implode, that the guard rotation
    would either leave out Conley and hurt the future
    or leave out Iverson and hurt the present. I also
    said Iverson and OJ couldnt coexsist. I WIN
    ___
    One game does not a prediction-come-true make. Lets
    see who’s starting and co-existing in 2 weeks time hey?

  • tavoris

    Jukai, indeed it was me. I don’t see any evidence to the contrary, since you have yet to own up to how emotionally charged ur opinions of anyone that disagrees with you is. I’ve seen you spew something negative about ANYTHING positive that appears on this site. Frankly, it’s repulsive. And pretty yellow-bellied in light of the fact that another Piston corroborated AI’s version of the Detroit situation. I kno others dance around calling you out, because you do provide a measure of comic relief…but ur perspective is the equivalent of a dark cloud over a miserable man. That is all.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Seriously though…first game with a new team coming back from an injury…how is this an injustice? Please, just one AI fanboy answer that question for me?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    -? +.

  • Papou

    JUST LOOK AT THE AMOUNT OF COMMENTS ON THIS THREAD!

    START IVERSON NOW!!!

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Hey Wayno, do you remember this:
    tavoris Posted: Nov.3 at 6:57 pm
    BETCATS, i don’t kno why he thinks I’m goin anywhere…I have stood by EVERYTHING I’ve said all along(unlike the backpedaling Wayno, the truth-spinning Jukai, and the infamous troll-of-many-names), and have never resorted 2 flaming or name-calling.
    -and have never resorted 2 flaming or name-calling.-

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    Wayno it is only one game but you really think Micael Conley is in Iverson’s league? Have you ever played basketball for a team?

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Pardeep: No, no one does. But wouldn’t it make more sense for Iverson to come off the bench and annihilate the team’s second unit?
    I’m not blind either, it makes as much sense to start Iverson and bring OJ off the bench… although OJ IS Memphis’ future.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    Because if you did you would know the best player or a guy who has been the best player for so long does not sit on a bench behind the new guy that is not as half as good as he is. Think about it AI has always complained and spoke the truth he is as real as it gets and the last time AI was having fits like this the 2001 Sixers went straight to the Finals because of AI and Brown so if it wasnt for those arguments and those problems they went through none of that would happened. Coach Hollins can do the same thing and have some success if he just listens to Iverson for once because last time AI wanted to play his way and the coach disagreed but than agreed to try it out Iverson ended up with his best season ever.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    Jukai man. Trust me if you played basketball for a team you would know you do not send a player with half of AI’s resume to the bench helk you dont even think about doing that but a guy with that resume being sent to the bench for anyone other than Kobe,D-Wade is wrong. OJ wont go to the bench AI will play point and Conley will go to the bench.

  • tavoris

    wayno, i actually agree with you. i don’t think anybody but he expected to get significant minutes in the first game back. Additionally, he shoulda kept his mouth shut.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Pardeep: I have, man, but I was never the best player so I guess I don’t have that sense of entitlement. Let me ask, do you think Manu deserved to be sent to the bench when he was averaging a sizable number more in every statistical category than Michael Finley?
    I mean, this has nothing to do with Iverson’s resume, it shouldn’t, ever. It should do with what is best for the team. If bringing Iverson off the bench is the best for the team, they should bring him off the bench.
    I’m not sure if that IS best for the team (honestly OJ can get hot so fast, maybe OJ should come off the bench and AI should start) but I don’t get this ‘resume’ nonsense.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, is calling you a troll considered name-calling-especially since you do the things that are in the definition? In my book, that’s calling a spade a spade. Deal with it.

  • tavoris

    don’t compare Manu with Iverson. 1)Manu has ALWAYS had two other All-Star caliber players on his team…two players who are actually sure bets for the HOF. 2)Manu started his career as a reserve. 3)Manu ALWAYS is on the court in crunch time.

    As usual, your comparisons are flawed. try again.

  • tavoris

    it makes MORE sense to move Mayo to the point. He wants to play there. And he’s good enough a playmaker to succeed there.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris: You’ve called me a wimp, yellow-bellied, intellectually void, and said I was Spanny’s BF with negative connotations.
    And your points with Manu are pointless. Who cares if he has always been with two all-star caliber players? You don’t think Roy and OJ are better than Iverson at this point? What does STARTING your career have to do with anything, outside of an ego?
    If you want to know, I -DO- think Iverson should be playing in crunch time, I think he should be getting 30 minutes a game. I just think he should be doing it coming off the bench. I think 18 minutes or whatever he got was only harmful to the team, but I think it was mostly done because Iverson was a) injured and b) unfamiliar with the system of Memphis.
    Jeez.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    pardeep you have never played basketball for a living, making millions of dollars so you have no idea what the situation is. and from a basketball perspective given AI’s DEFENSIVE issues, due to his age, it makes more sense to bring him off the bench. That is if you care more about winning then “keeping what got you this far going” no matter what iverson thinks, what he is complaining about is selfish. Unless your one of those people that think iverson and oj can add up to a dependable point. more then anything this is just sad…..like someone said earlier he went into this situation knowing via press conference that he would be coming off the bench…grow up AI be humble

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Mayo SHOOTS EVERYTIME HE GETS THE BALL! How is Mayo a playmaker? How does it make SENSE to play him and Iverson at the same time?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    tavoris to me is just one of those people. they don’t know what their talking about, and refuse to get educated

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    NBK: Co-sign. He doesn’t really know what he’s talking about, but has no problem making things up to augment his argument. Some of the things he says are ridiculous. I respect a lot of AI fans like Allen and Pardeep (I respect Teddy but when he talks about AI, he goes a bit in the crazy zone) but Tavoris is beyond help. Truly.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    I think Iverson can be an insane scoring point guard or he can take the Steve Nash role and average 17 and 11 and try making a run for the MVP in a different kind of style but still being the main focus. I can see that. AI averaging 22 and 12 and not needing many minutes to do it. Or if he still can try averaging 28 which I still think he can do but it would be much harder at this age at that position in this situation. But AI playing SG would be nice because people always talk about how he needs a back court teammate who can guard bigger players for him and Mayo would be that guy.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, I didn’t call u a wimp. I said that your collusion with the greek guy was making you “look” spineless. and my comments were about your comments. The only name i’ve directed at YOU (and not your all-hating persona) is troll. If you can’t discern the difference between someone attacking your argument-as opposed to someone attacking you-then you probably need 2 brush up on your conversing skills.

    Further, if you don’t realize that players who are accustomed to starting games, is that they are used to coming in RIGHT AFTER warming up and playing, as opposed to cooling off, and then being asked to come in and contribute immediately. Some players thrive in that role (Ginobili), while others don’t. Just because Iverson appears fit for the 6th man role doesn’t mean he’s built for it. And Mayo-when playing the point last year-was pretty good. Don’t get into the media reports about how few assists he averages. Look at him play. Dude is NOT selfish-he’s just a considerably better shooter and scorer than EVERYONE on the team. Additionally, the only other scorer from last year (Gay) is more a finisher than a creator.

  • tavoris

    nbk, what have you said that would educate anyone? Ever? Jukai, we had a similar discussion about Reggie’s situation-when you went on a flame-a-thon, only to later be WRONG. How quickly we forget your “education”…

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Pardeep: That’s true, Mayo has size and that would certainly help AI at the two… but there is still a) an issue with two score first combo guards being in the game at the same time and b) an atrocious lack of bench scoring.
    Iverson can’t play for 40 minutes like he used to, why not let Rudy and OJ score at first, then bring in Allen off the bench and let him go buck wild against the second units. Of COURSE have him in at crunch time because AI is a vet… I just think a bench (not reserve) role is better for Iverson.

  • tavoris

    @ Jukai-also, you were WRONG about the Detroit situation(as Hamilton has corroborated AI’s account of last season)but, you’ve yet to show your face in that thread to face the music.

  • Manny

    I agree with Pardeep about AI situation but damn he should have just gone to Charlotte or New York and none of this would have had happened.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    Yeah that Mayo at the point thing can go two ways but the whole coming off the bench thing I still dont feel now is the time for AI. Maybe come off the bench for a contender in 2 years and he doesnt have a ring so he goes to a contender where he can get good minutes. Obviously AI would be a good scorer off the bench because hes one of the best scorers in the league when he gets minutes so I think he should just argue his way in to the starting line up trust me it will work.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris: Stop using the term ‘troll’ because you don’t have a clue what it means, just like you don’t have much of a clue on basics of basketball. I already admitted OJ would be better suited coming in and providing a spark role off the bench, but your refusal to see that OJ and Iverson should probably play as sparingly together as possible makes me question whether you can even COMPREHEND this.
    And I’ve already admitted my being completely wrong in the Reggie Miller case. Where were you in admitting that perhaps Iverson was more of a whiner in Detroit than you let on with THIS new evidence coming to light?
    I still have not read any report that suggests a reporter ASKED Iverson about his bench role… only that Iverson himself brought up the issue when asked about a totally different question.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Anyway, your comments are insane, irrational, and look like they’re written by a two-year-old. Sometimes the grammar disappears in them, further providing evidence that a two-year-old is somehow typing up these comments. The comments also show a clear love for Iverson closer than your average “fan” of you get my gist. What? I’m not insulting you. I’m talking about your COMMENTS. Stop trolling me, dude!

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    I mean, this is insane, once again Hamilton saying “yeah AI was told he wouldn’t come off the bench, so was I” DOESN’T FREAKING VINDICATE AI from faking injuries and acting like a total tool bag when Curry was seeing if AI off the bench would help the team. Your love for AI is so blinding.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, if you don’t realize that reporters are gonna ask him this EVERY NIGHT-just like they have asked him this at EVERY OPPORTUNITY since Jan-then you dont have a clue about sports reporting.

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Tad: Restricted.

  • tavoris

    Mayo doesn’t need to come off the bench either. If he does, then they have NOBODY to guard the 2. Mayo wants to play the point-and ANYBODY would be an upgrade over conley at the point. Mayo can initiate the O-and guard the 2. Where would that NOT work? And we’re not gonna go in depth about the Detroit situation in here, when we’ve discussed it in there ad nauseum. Send ur comments-if you have anything to say other than “my bad” over there. And there’s a handy definition of troll right below the comment box. inciting others to flame at you (check) is down there, dude. And you do it. As I statd before, I love basketball (which includes ALL players), and I stan ONLY for Duncan. I am in this discussion because you find it your mission to drag AI’s name with your envy.

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Fine Tavoris, report me to Ryne and ask for me to be banned but stop bringing it up and whining every two seconds. Or at least send me your address so I can keep sending you tissues for all your tears.
    I’m not going to ‘go over’ to whatever article you’re talking about, you can discuss it here or nowhere.
    Mayo does control the tempo, but Mayo also likes to overly control the ball and take a couple of shots to warm himself up. He passes, but it seems more in the Arenas “Oh I don’t have a shot but someone’s open” vein. I know, I know, those basketball beat writers agree with me and even though they’re PAID to write about basketball, they’re always wrong as you pointed out, but really, watch a game or two.
    So, guess what Iverson does: control the tempo but also overly control the ball and take a couple of shots to warm himself up.
    So if you think putting them together would be more beneficial than trying to play them at different times, you obviously see the world in a different color than me. A far stupider shade of color.

  • tavoris

    we’ve already discussed it. moving on. So, under your flawless coaching scheme, Conley should start? you know it hasn’t really worked out well for the Grizz with him manning the point. Also, with two good scorers, shooters, and athletic finishers, he didn’t even average 5 assists last season. Or the season b4 that. I’d think they’d have more success playing their two best guards, as opposed to frustrating one and playing another that isn’t contributing much. But then again, I’m irrational, and playing a mediocre PG is a sure-fire way to WIN.

  • tavoris

    beat reporters write to get their ‘ish published. Of course they are gonna try to get “the quote” that makes their article get more attention. Doing anything otherwise makes no sense. That’s precisely why Jordan used to-and still does-call reporters “you people”. He hated hearing the same questions over and over-just like every celebrity hates hearing the same question over an over. I’m 100% sure EVERYBODY who writes for Slam can corroborate that.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    whats the point of starting Iverson…..what advantages does it give the grizzlies? after what 8 months off? name the advantages….the reasonable ones

  • Ghoul

    if the dude kno’s how to win i say start him over michael conley. A.I scored 11 points in limited playing time just think how that game would have turned out if he started

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris: Conley isn’t very good, no, but once again, when you have someone controlling the ball like OJ/Iverson, you just need Conley to bring it up and control some tempo. He is a good passer, and as you noted, assists don’t mean everything (unless you are trying to make a point, of course).
    But once again, the point isn’t who is good and who isn’t, the point is who is going to work well with each other.
    You wouldn’t understand.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    i never said don’t give iverson minutes.. i said why start him? there is no rhyme or reason he should start accept for things that happened in the past. and its not like conley isn’t gonna get better. iverson wont no matter what

  • tavoris

    so, using ur argument, how well are Conley and Mayo working together?….since I don’t understand. How well are Conley and Gay working together?…in case you haven’t realized, the Grizz got their butts handed to them most nights. Their best option at PG was freaking Marko Jaric. Before that, Kyle Lowry was taking his minutes. Conley is consistently outplayed, and one can’t say AI and Mayo won’t work, especially since they haven’t played much together yet.

  • tavoris

    nbk…who’s talking to you? Conley is good at what he does-running fast and dribbling well. Everything else that a PG needs to do is a challenge. He seems like a nice enough guy, but he’s really the worst starting PG in the league. Why is a change in the rotation NOT necessary? Memphis didn’t do too well with the rotation they had last year. why would Memphis sign Iverson, only to have him NOT on the court with Mayo or Gay? That, my friend, makes ABSOLUTELY no sense from a basketball-leadership-or financial standpoint.

  • giogolo

    ah..u guys make the whole comment section worthwhile to read..

  • tavoris

    nbk, the point is that Conley is EXACTLY the same player he was at Ohio State. By now, you have an idea as what his ceiling is. And it looks a lot like Brevin Knight.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    actually that brevin knight comment sums up your level of education of NBA basketball. good work

  • tavoris

    nbk. how old r u dude? do you even know Brevin Knight’s career arc? do you even know what career arc means? come on…

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Playing all 3 guys together is not for the grizzlies benefit first and foremost

    they all serve the same purpose on offense (atleast they believe so) to score.
    you cannot say allen iverson will do a steve nash and average 17 and 11 because if he could have done that he would have in denver

    playing all 3 of them together also takes shots away from each of them, while taking precious scoring out of the second unit

    please tell me i don’t know what im talking about again without a reason. it really helps your cause

  • ktokyo

    HATE TO SAY I TOLD YOU SO!!!! God, that felt good. It’s hilarious how far some people will go to defend this guy. I’ve been saying this for AT LEAST the last 5 years. He’s selfish. Period.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    22…and look at brevin knights PER MINUTE production. he is a 12 and 10 guy per 36 minutes his whole career. except in Utah, where Deron Williams resides. frustrating ignorance

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    career arc…. when has a career arc been relevant anyways. ofcourse i know what it is. but brevin knight and mike conley are not anywhere near the same player. they don’t even play a similar brand of basketball.

  • tavoris

    nbk, what does that matter if the first unit is getting outscored by EVERY TEAM THEY PLAY? Kevin Martin dropped 48 on them-and they lost. Melo dropped 42 on them-and they lost. Of course a team should want to have bench scoring. However, it’s not necessary-and plenty of teams have won titles without a double-digit scorer coming off the bench. Actually, the only two in the last 25 years were Detroit of the 80s and San Antonio. If the starting 5 are competing-and playing BIG minutes, the bench scoring isn’t an issue.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    and brevin knight would have averaged 11 assists and 2 stls with 2 to’s on this grizzlies team

  • tavoris

    nbk…ur 22? hahahahahaha…sure Brevin has good per minute numbers. That’s why he’s had a long career as a BACKUP. So how does conley-who possesses INFERIOR stats-meant to start?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Yeah tavoris because allen iverson is gonna improve their defense? lol they are still gonna give up the same amount of points actually more if he starts. they are a bad team. your acting like allen iverson starting would make them good. dont be an idiot

  • giogolo

    Seriously this may end well if:
    1.either iverson comes off the bench but for 26 minutes at the most for both PG and SG duties.
    or
    2.Relegate Mayo at starting PG while going back to SG and when Ivy rests put Mayo back at SG.

    Works only IF: 1.Iverson accepts to be dynamic and pass( he done this druing all-star games actually) and move the ball around.
    2. Somehow, OJ learns the idea that playing some point will actually help him develop as a player and realizing this will only be a year unless his Jackass owner knows much better.

    Ivy still can play though his ego doesn’t really know how to and the young grizzlies may learn a thing or two about..scoring.(u guys tell me pls.)

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    BREVIN KNIGHT HAS STARTED OVER HALF THE GAMES HE HAS PLAYED IN. Tavoris your so dumb dude

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    The Brevin Knight comment really proves how insane Tavoris is. I’m letting this one go. Tavoris is stubbornly stupid. He’s judging things that happened last year ignore the fact that the team did not have any options to go to for bench scoring, and Gay/Mayo struggled to co-exist together LAST year… but yeah, throwing in Iverson to that Gay/Mayo combo will really help them co-exist.
    It’s so stupid, it’s like talking to a toddler who knows he is right about how he saw that dinosaurs still exist on one of his sunday morning cartoon shows.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    This isn’t an all star team. This is a lottery team. ALLEN IVERSON WONT DEFER SHOTS PLAYING ON THE NUGGETS IN THE PLAYOFFS>>>>>>ALLEN IVERSON COMPLAINED ABOUT PRACTICE!!!!>>>>NOW YOU PEOPLE THINK HE IS GONNA PASS ON THE GRIZZLIES?>>>>>>>AND WHY WOULD YOU RISK MIKE CONLEY’S CONFIDENCE FOR A GUY THAT IS ON YOUR TEAM AS A LAST RESORT?

  • Shem

    Who cares about AI’s resume!? The grizzlies are a rebuilding team, unless AI will take them to the finals and god i hope noone argues me on that there is no point in starting him. They are looking towards the FUTURE. AI isnt young and once again they probably wont make the playoffs and for sure pass the 1st round. If AI starts then that setbacks the developement of either Mike Conley or OJ Mayo. Yes AI is better and I can almost guarantee that Mayo and Conley wont have half his resume when their in their 14th year but starting Iverson doesnt help anything and he should retire. If he signed with CHARLOTTE OR MIAMI he would almost for sure start over Felton/Bell or Mario Chalmers. By the way, the grizzlies not giving gay 50 mill is stupid. Watch this off season he ll make 60 plus for a team like new jersey

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    and tavoris don’t waste your time saying anything else. your too stupid. get me banned whatever. ill be back different name wont make a difference. but your an idiot

  • tavoris

    nbk, you probably don’t even remember when Knight was drafted. are you really 22? do you realize that you come off like you’re 12? Jukai…you’ve been relegated to the sidelines, jumping in on comparisons that you don’t agree with, while offering NO FACTS to support your claims. Sit down, because it looks like jock-riding.

  • tavoris

    nbk, why would I get you banned? you fools get urself banned without input from me. Jukai is the only one that e-mails the admins.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, many biologists and paleontologists consider bird to be “living dinosaurs”. Again, u fail. Try it on someone that doesn’t know better.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    so metaphorically speaking me being 22 means you know more about the NBA? Does that make you better then me at basketball as well? Are you over 39? cuz then you’d definately be a better coach then erik spoelstra. I come off like im 12, you sound ignorant. either why i’d rather be 12 and right then 60 and wrong. or however old you are. get a life, if your older then 22 and are still arguably with someone like age matters on a website that is younger then the person your arguing with then you genuinely have nothing better to do and i feel bad for you.

  • tavoris

    oh yeah, and crocs too…

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    and actually birds are considered the “direct descendants of dinosaurs” college teaches you meaningless stuff, too bad i’m still there huh. and you understood what jukai meant, be over the age of 22 and act mature prick

  • tavoris

    nbk, you come off as 12 because everytime u disagree, its the same song. “you’re stupid, I pwn’ed you, I win, FTW” or some other ‘ish that’s intended to elicit daps from your other acne-plagued cohorts. However, if you haven’t 1)played 2)coached or 3)experienced that game-or life-then you don’t possess the experience necessary to ground your often-valid arguments in FACT. In case you haven’t noticed, I’ve been agreeing with you a lot lately. However, whenever you disagree with me, it’s the same childish ish.

  • tavoris

    and I knew exactly what Jukai meant. she goes to great strides to go against EVERY SINGLE comment I have EVER made, so I was merely giving her more ammo to rant unnecessarily over.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    It’s not like the Grizzlies management didn’t know what they were going to get when they traded for AI. Why go for AI when you’ve already got OJ, who brings the same things to the table? Why bring an aging veteran guy on a young team which needs to play their youngsters as much as possible? This was a silly acquisition and a marriage of convenience from the get-go.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    I have been playing organized basketball for 19 years. how much basketball have you played in your life? at a competitive level…. and you admitting you have been agreeing with me a lot lately means you believe someone who comes off as 12 can be right. i never say i own you or any wierd ish like that. if you say something stupid, i point out how your wrong WITH A REASON, then i say your stupid. its a simple pattern.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    @joel O’s – thats what we said when they signed him

  • tavoris

    nbk, I’ve been playing competitive ball for roughly the same period. I also have coached AAU, High School, and Division I college bball. I do believe people of any age can b correct, and my comments about ur maturity have nothing to do with your accuracy. Its the presentation of those messages that have you concerned about being banned

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    well im not concerned about getting banned hence my willingness to admit that your an idiot. if you have coached d1 i really hope is was more of a specialy thing, like shooting. why don’t you stop worrying about my approach to this message board and work on your knowledge of the NBA. cuz mine goes back to about 1979 in pretty good detail

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    As someone who wants to see AI’s career go out with a bang, and not a whimper, this is disheartening. Last season, he proved that he can’t fit on a stacked contender. And by the looks of it, he’s already showing that he can’t fit on a bottom-feeder. At what point does AI realize that the doubts are not about his resume or his playing ability, but about his effect on team chemistry? His behaviour over the past season – and this one already – just proves his doubters right.

  • tavoris

    if u r 22, then how does ur knowledge go back 30 years? hahahahahahaha…good nite

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    its called espn classic, videos from the NBA store. and a general obsession with basketball as a kid. My 8th birthday present was ESPN Classic, think about it

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    So what now for AI? He’s only got a few more years left. If he continues down this path, nobody’s going to sign him next year, and he might be out of the league for before the season’s over. Talk cheap, and his complaining won’t change anyone’s perception of him. What he HAS to do right now is play the good citizen in Memphis, like GP did with the Bucks and the Celtics, and try and impress a mavericky contender. A very bad start, sigh.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    @nbk: Yeah. Still ridiculous that things’ve unravelled so quickly, though.

  • Chris Baggio

    Has been and always will be a douche.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    i mean yeah. i gave iverson like a game and a half off the bench. but really there was no way this was gonna work. not with the biproducts of 3 of the last 4 drafts being wing players. its called a broke franchise aiming for ticket and jersey sales. im pretty sure iverson is still top 10 in that category

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    tavoris Posted: Nov.3 at 9:19 pm
    nbk, what have you said that would educate anyone? Ever?

    tavoris Posted: Nov.4 at 12:03 am
    nbk, …….. In case you haven’t noticed, I’ve been agreeing with you a lot lately. However, whenever you disagree with me, it’s the same childish ish.

    so i am only wrong when i disagree with you? hypocrit? brevin knight comment really pushed me over the edge man. i shouldn’t have reread this conversation….i’ll admit this is out of anger but man o’ man please tavoris for the betterment of us all. please stop

  • http://www.myspace.com/penny2pac Penny the Great

    It’s funny readin all the comments, and listenin to all the haters. They sound like white guys who love the game but don’t obtain the skills required to be even consider a good player. This is no different then Lebron not signning the contract ex. with Cleveland; Kobe askin for a trade B.PG. (before Paul Gasol); D-Wade ain’t happy, so if they start shippin him around to no contenders, is his career depleted? You guys are so busy sayin Iverson’s career is over, when there hasn’t been a caoch of any kind of caliber to even coach him. Look at them before they coached Iverson; Larry Brown never saw the finals until Iverson; Mo Cheeks, ??? (be for real); and the list goes on to a bunch of people who are jobless now. Until he stinks up the court, I still say he can play and start. Blame the front office and the remaining white people for the Grizzles poor play (who I may add never been good), not the black talent (where this game would be shit, if they weren’t playin)…assholes!

  • http://www.myspace.com/penny2pac Penny the Great

    I wrote something else earlier, but don’t think it’ll be placed. So I just want to add, Allen Iverson has lead his team in mins. assists, points, every year he has played except the one in Detroit. Started every game, except in Detroit. Scored 40+ every season, except in Detroit. The season before Detroit, which is only 2 years ago (2007-08), there was only 6 other people who had more assist them him; CP3 (starter), Nash (starter), D. Williams in Utah (starter), Kidd (starter), some dude in TOR (Jose C.) and Baron Davis (…iownknow). As i take a look at scorin only Kobe and lebron finish with better averages of that year…two years ago. In steals, Iverson finished 8th, over Kobe and Lebron. And minutes…let’s just say he lead the league.

  • rikson

    I watched the game on LP, and have to say that AI maybe the player, whos game suffers most from getting older! He was playing agains SAC and had NO chance to penetrate… just on Layup off an illegal screen! No way Iverson can be effective, if he is a jumpshooter… its over – I guess!

  • rikson

    “Who cares about AI’s resume!? The grizzlies are a rebuilding team, unless AI will take them to the finals and god i hope noone argues me on that there is no point in starting him. They are looking towards the FUTURE. AI isnt young and once again they probably wont make the playoffs and for sure pass the 1st round. If AI starts then that setbacks the developement of either Mike Conley or OJ Mayo. Yes AI is better and I can almost guarantee that Mayo and Conley wont have half his resume when their in their 14th year but starting Iverson doesnt help anything and he should retire. If he signed with CHARLOTTE OR MIAMI he would almost for sure start over Felton/Bell or Mario Chalmers.” GREAT POST -> completely agree!

  • http://yankees.com tealish

    @Penny — guys don’t care. The media definitely doesn’t. The story right now is that he’s done. You better run with it or you won’t get to play with the cool kids.

  • George B

    SELFISHNESS ASIDE, IVERSON DESERVES 30 MINUTES PER ON THAT TEAM

  • Sam Z

    AI should start he can get the job done better than conley and it gives conley an example of how to play the point better. he shouldntve left ohio wen he did. he didnt gain enough experience in my opinion. and iverson can still do what he always has been able to do since forever! score!

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    I dont want to take a side per say. It’s interesting reading
    your comments back and forth and trying to work out what is
    being said/agreed upon disagreed upon. Tavoris, you don’t
    really expect me to believe you ‘coached’ Div 1 do you?
    As in stood on the side lines and called the plays out type
    caoching…? and div 1 under 13 girls??? Sorry it doesn’t
    buy you any cred. The question is: Where are the Grizzlies
    at if your giving AI 30 mins a game….? Would they care to try
    it out? Who knows…to either question.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    I can answer something though: Why Conley doesn’t average much more
    than the 5.0 apg mark. It’s because he doesn’t really create his
    own shot, so he doesn’t draw defenders away from his shooters.
    They can stay at home on their own guys…you look at players like
    your Nash’s, Parkers and CP3′s they create for themselves which
    inturn creates for their team mates. AI is like that, BUT one thing
    is particularly different for him, his FG% is just that little bit lower
    so it requires more shots for him to get up the numbers he likes…
    See he still wants to score 25 a game, that requires ALOT of shots
    on it’s own, and that will stifle OJ who needs/wants shots along with
    guys like Rudy Gay who is effective and should get looks, along with bigs
    like Gasol who should get more plays this season also.
    Its just a tough situation whereby the older veterans you WANT to adjust
    and sacrifice, wont. AI should have a chat with Lamar Odom, Rasheed Wallace
    and see what they try and bring to a team this season.

  • tekno

    AI – What an insufferable fool!

  • tavoris

    nbk, jus because you said something that someone agrees with, doesn’t mean u educated anyone. That only means your comment echoes something I’ve felt as well. & why were you mad? I’m not. @Dacre, get at me off-line 4 my resume. Happy 2 provide it.

  • Ralph

    As Jordan said, there is not I in team, but there is an I in win!!! AI should have played those crucial minutes, If Hollins did play him there would be a W in the column instead of an L….

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    Tavoris’ AAU team must be the worst team on the planet.
    “Hey, shooter a and shooter b, I want you to go in as guards. That point guard who tries to distribute the ball, he’s no good, you guys both go in and shoot”
    “Uh, okay, who should control the ball more?”
    “What? Go out and shoot it!”
    What in the WORLD was that talk about dinosaurs? Tavoris is definitely in his teenage years. I’ve never seen someone so disgruntled and in near tears about something like this.

  • The Wize

    I was watching some random highlights of Iverson games throughout his career (those youtube compilations of all the points)and on this evidence there really wasn’t too much difference in the way he was getting his points in Denver from his rookie year even! I think he can still do it but he obviously needs the ball in his hands A LOT. I do think the media has waited a long time to tear him down and Detroit was just the opportunity. Good point about the hammer and the screwdriver whoever said that too.
    PEACE

  • http://sfjdo.com Jukai

    At this point Tavoris is just struggling to maintain his fantasy internet alter-ego (his fantasies can swing all the way to Allen Iverson beating Dale Ellis and Danning Manning in the Eastern Conference Finals) and it’s getting a bit sad to watch.
    For this team to be most successful, OJ Mayo or Allen Iverson need to come off the bench and provide some relief bench scoring… as well as alleviate the struggle of the “who shoots when” problem.
    If AI really can’t perform off the bench (system player) and the coaches deem that they don’t want to bench OJ because they want to give him minutes, then fine, bring them both up as starters. But if we’re talking about “winning now” (and not building for the future, which is what Memphis really should be doing but I dare not bring the wrath of Iverson fans down upon me any further), then having a bench scoring wing would be the way to succeed.
    Dacre: What’s hysterical is that earlier in this mess of an argument, Tavoris said that Mayo was actually a great passer and his assists (lower than Conley’s) shouldn’t matter because it only tells half the story. Now Conley is pathetic because he only averages five assists. In reality, it’s all about what “Tavoris” needs to maintain what he considers “real.” It’s sad.

  • http://joeloholic.wordpress.com Joel O’s

    Fans =/= critical thinking

  • ClydeSays

    Isn’t AI coming off injury? Are they just working him back into the lineup? If Hollins didn’t discuss that with him, or the fact that he’d come off the bench, that’s on the Coach.

    AI is who he is at this point. A bunch scorer who needs the ball in his hands. Given the offseason bs with Curry & the Pistons you’d think Memphis would at least let him know how they’d want to use him.

    AI’s been one of my favorite players to watch. Seeing him talk or play himself out of good situations into bad ones has been hard to watch & def. not entertaining.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Wow, I went home and missed all the action! I must say, Tavoris’ dinosaur lecture was my favorite part…seriously dude…wtf??? On a ground breaking note, Tavoris agreed with me! I’m so happy that coach approves of my message…in all seriousness though, at the end of the day, I don’t have a problem with AI starting on that squad, they’re a trainwreck as it is, so why not? How you can expext Z-bo(needs the ball alot to score), OJ(needs the ball alot to score), Rudy(needs the ball alot to score), and AI(needs the ball alot to score) to all play in the same lineup and be successful is beyond me, but sure, go for it, it’s freaking Memphis. Start the cantankerous superstar and make him happy.

  • tavoris

    Jukai, do yourself a favor and search for every occurance of the word “great” on this page. At no time did I say that Mayo was a great passer. Again, yet another instance of your twisting the truth to fit your fallible arguments. Check urself and let it go dude, cuz u r making urself look bad. Wayno, are you also nbk? Why is always ONLY you three who attempt to turn every disagreement into a flame war?

    The fact that I have coaching experience doesn’t matter, because when is all said and done, the best players on the team NEED to play together. It’s up to them to make it work. To say that Mayo, Gay, and Iverson cannot coexist is STUPID. They haven’t played together yet.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Y’all are really, really crazy. Man, this is wild.
    Tavoris is right about one thing, Iverson is going to get these questions after every game for the rest of his career. Either he learns how to handle that, or he might as well retire.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Sorry coach, your attept to reduce the number of people who think your posts (not you) are moronic has failed. I am not nbk at all. Looks like I missed alot yesterday after I went home though…my favorite was coach’s lecture about dinosaurs…classic…

  • tavoris

    Allenp, isn’t it this wayALWAYS whenever wayno, nbk, or Jukai are involved? Everyone who says something that disagrees with their infinite knowledge is pegged as stupid. I find it interesting that whenever Iverson is mentioned on this site, those three show up WITHOUT fail. Except of course, in the article that completely rebuffed all their arguments about Detroit.

    Unfortunately for him (Iverson), it’s a question that has no right answer-if he is honest when he answers. His best bet is to just say some random ish that doesn’t offend anyone. Either that, or come out and make Memphis a better team. Can he do that? Who knows. But I think speculating about it before seeing the results is foolish, because I think-from seeing him play over the last 4 or 5 years-that Mayo is more than capable of running the point.

    @wayno, I never know…it’s all good tho. have fun

  • Nbk

    Lol at Tavoris – I’m still waiting for someone to tell me what advantages there are to bringing mike conley off the bench instead of Allen iverson?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Nbk
    Conley can’t shoot.
    As such, he reduces space for Rudy Gay and Randolph to operate. Besides not being a dependable shooter, regardless of what his percentages say, Conley is passive and isn’t great at getting in the lane. so, he’s not opening up drive and kicks for OJ, he’s not creating opportunites for Rudy Gay, and he makes it easier to double team Randolph.
    Conley, right now, is a bench player. A nice bench player, but a bench player.
    They should move OJ to the on like he ran at USC. He’s big enough and scrappy enough to handle two guards and he makes excellent decisions in my opinion when he runs the one. He can hit spot up jumpers, he can drive and create, he’s flat out a better point guard than Conley. Iverson is still probably the best two guard on the team despite his decline.
    So, if I’m a coach, I put the team that puts the most pressure on the offense on the floor at the same time. This isn’t a veteran team where you don’t want to upset roles. Start the best five and let them do their thing. You bring Conley in to run the one when you want to slide OJ and rest Iverson, or when you jsut want to go with a smaller lineup and let OJ rest. Conley might get his confidence up going against backups since he clearly isn’t equipped right now to handle most starters.
    Iverson, with his dribble drives, puts pressure on the opposing team and creates handoffs and dumpoffs to post players who like to hang around the rim. Plus, he creates offensive rebounding opportunities.
    There, that’s why you start Iverson and not Conley.
    Happy?
    Still doesn’t justify him popping off though after one game.

  • tavoris

    Allenp…thanks. Lets see if Jukai decides to rebut you (I doubt it).

  • nbk

    Iverson hasn’t shot higher then 34% from the 3 point line since 99-00. and he shot .341% don’t try and say he is a better spot up shooter then mike conley. Generally Iverson is lucky to shoot 30% from behind the arc. Ill give you that he is a better play maker then conley, but what he provides Memphis they already have in OJ Mayo. YOu people are acting like Allen Iverson starting will make the grizzlies compete. this team wont win more then 25 games no matter what. And you cannot try and say he creates offensive rebounding opportunities, especially considering if an offensive rebound is given up it is the defenses fault not the offenses skill. Add in that Iverson will still complain as a starter due to a lack of shots.

    Don’t kid yourselves into thinking the Grizzlies signed Iverson to make the team better anyway, its called revenue. The future for the grizzlies is conley oj and gay, and the attention paid to the team this season will be because of iverson whether he plays or not, but he doesn’t make the team any more competitive starting or not

  • nbk

    actually iverson has shot better then 34% three times my fault, .345 in denver in 07-08 .341 in 99-00 and .341 in 96-97. either way, mike conley is a better spot up shooter

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    NBK
    I thought you asked for reasons why Iverson should start over Conley. I provided them.
    Iverson is better shooter period, which is what I said. He’s a better creator, which I said, and he’s draws more defensive attention, which I said.
    Iverson and Mayo form a backcourt that provides scoring at both the one and two, you don’t have a serious drop off in defense because Mayo is equipped to guard twos.
    Iverson creates offensive rebounds. You and I both know that because of his dribble drives and the help required, his teammates see way more offensive rebounding opportunities. Is that a failure of the opposing team? yes it is. Does it happen? Yes it does.
    I’m not trying to defend Iverson’s outburst because it was stupid and I think it was a bad decision. However, to act like Iverson doesn’t provide the Grizzlies with a better starting five than Mike Conley is asinine. Sure, he could be effective coming off the bench, but why would the Grizzlies play him there if they have a way to start him and it improves the quality of the team.
    I can see the argument that Iverson runs with the second unit and gets all the shots, but I don’t think that maximizes the Grizzlies talent.I haven’t watched many Grizzlies games, but in the ones I’ve seen, they have really solid talent if cats come to play.
    But, that’s a big if.

  • nbk

    I am not arguing that he would not make their starting unit better. I am saying bringing him off the bench would be more effective for the grizzlies as a team. him or mayo. iverson cannot gaurd 1′s or 2′s so by starting him your taking a lot out of your defense. conley is a far superior on ball defender then iverson, especially at this stage in iverson’s career. If iverson wasn’t the new guy on the team and mayo had more time to develop at the point then i would agree that after SOME TIME with the grizz iverson should start. but given iverson and mayo’s propensity to shoot more then pass, having both in at your pg and sg to start a game is like shooting the rest of your teams rhythm in the foot. And once again Conley is a much better spot up shooter then iverson. Having iverson on the bench also allows OJ to develop more then if they played together. Its not like your building for the future and iverson is gonna be there next year, this is a one time thing, why risk that on a guy that wasn’t happy on a team that had just been to 6 straight conference finals?

  • tavoris

    Allenp, he did ask for that. I dont know how better you could have explained it.
    He doesn’t agree, and it’s cool. However, there’s no way to justify that something will NOT work, when they haven’t played together yet.

    the Detroit’s 6 Conference Finals argument is bogus, because they got their butts handed to them in the last 3 conference finals they appeared in-by 3 different opponents. It’s called “fools gold”

  • tavoris

    and I guess he didn’t see Kevin Martin run roughshod all over the Grizz the other nite. They beat the Grizz with a team that’s about 1.5 players deep.

  • nbk

    tavoris your a flat out moron. 6 conference finals is fools gold? he is on a team that hasn’t been to the PLAYOFFS in that long. And what does Iverson playing have ANYTHING to do with Kevin Martin? And in a sense i did agree, that IVerson would make their starting lineup better. but it won’t help make the TEAM in better. Seeing as how basketball is a team sport where winning is the goal, why not make your whole team better. you should understand that being a “d1 coach” and all. you liar

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Jukai: Re: your Nov.3 at 7:38 pm post: I have this amazing ability to be able to have two thoughts at any given time, for instance: while I think AI is a generation defining and amazing basketball player, I also think he creates 95% of his own problems and calls victimisation too easily. A frustratingly great player who defined his own legacy. Whether you see that legacy as being good or bad is pretty much what every AI debate is about in a way.
    When did this place get so myopic and black and white?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    NBK
    You and I disagree on what would make the team better.
    I look at a starting five of Iverson, Mayo, Randolph, Gay and Gasol, and I see no players that any team can take for granted.
    I also see a problem with a lot of cats wanting to get their shots.
    Personally, I think Mayo’s best shot at greatness is being combo guard. Kind of a more athletic Chauncey Billups. But, I think people want to put him solely a the two because he likes to shoot. Yes, he does like to shoot, but his size makes him more of a problem at the one, and he has way better point guard instincts than somebody like Stuckey.
    I like Mayo at the 1 and I think they probably made a mistake in getting Conley.

  • tavoris

    nbk-I’m a moron, and they LOST to the worst team in the league doing it YOUR WAY. If you want to accept that, then cool.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Izzo
    I agree with a lot of your last comment.
    Iverson creates a lot of his own problems. I don’t about most of them, but a lot of them. However, I think that his actions are exacerbated by the role the media slotted him to play early in his career. It’s hard to tell where Iverson’s foibles end and the media machinations begin in my opinion. They are joined at the hip.
    Even this recent blowup was a result of reporter saying “Hey, Iverson only played 18 minutes, that might be a story.” I understand that urge, it’s what you’re taught to do, but let’s not pretend that controversy wasn’t the goal of this line of questioning.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Izzo

    Allen: I believe the line of questioning was the reporter asking him had he any problems with his hamstring and then AI complaining about playing time.(I’m open to correction here). That’s how I understand how it went down. If that’s not creating the problem I don’t know what is. Maybe the hunger for controversy was the motivation here, but it was a story.
    It’s besides the point anyway, if SLAM had just posted a article merely reading “Allen Iverson” this comments section would have ended up the same.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    @ allenp – i thought they would have traded Conley right after they drafted mayo, but since that pau trade it is not longer about what they are doing. it should be like a game show, “what would you do with the grizzlies”….. Tavoris your assumptions are idiotic man. I have never once said that what they did with iverson against the grizzlies is right. he should be playing more then conley. he should prolly play 28-32 minutes right off the bat. BUT i do not think he should be starting because I believe scoring is a commodity….its not something you just put out there all wily nily. If you have 2 20 point scorers who both play the perimeter in the game at one time, and a guy that can score 20 in 28 minutes on your bench then your gonna be dangerous (on the perimeter) all game. @tavoris – until you make an intelligent comment shut up dude. allen presented his argument in an organized educated manner, he didn’t make any assumptions, he didn’t try and poke out an unrelated idk what to call it that you do, and he didn’t make any terrible analogies. I have not said one confrontational thing to any of the slam regulars in a long long time. When i first came on this site i was way overly confrontional, but i have stopped taking things personally. but you man, you are making people dumber and i just cant stand for that. refer to a source before you argue, its consistent crap and its starting to smell.

  • http://fjklf.com Jukai

    haha, man, because five separate people have disagreed with Tavoris, we’re all the same people with different names. Lord almighty! And I’m making myself look bad!
    Tavoris, there are no more people posting here, but I’m sure you’re checking this every day: what individual questions do you want me to answer for? You’ll write a lot of nothing and if I don’t respond to one specific point, you’ll go apesh*t about it (you’re a great D1 coach, I’m sure!)
    So, please feel free to ask away, I’ll answer everything honestly and to the point.
    NBK is right about everything he says, pretty much.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    oh and to be clear allen i agree that OJ’s best shot at being a great player in the NBA is as a PG…but that does not mean he should be relegated their next to allen iverson. IMO — Allen Iverson cannot help someone be a better PG, (1) its never happened (2) its never happened

  • http://www.ontarget-graphics.com Sucka Free

    I have watched every Grizz game on league pass this season, and if Conley is there future point gaurd the future looks very dim. 5 games in and he has been out played by every point guard he has faced and he is non existant in the 4th quarter. Not only would I start AI over Conley, but I would also be shopping him for a piece that can compliment Mayo. It is not fair to him to be that good and have teams gang up on him because Conley is not a threat.

    AI should be mad if I had a resume like that and some young dud of a player started over me and we were loosing because he can’t keep up and I was a proven competitor. I would complain to. Mayo, Gaye and any other guys who want to win should set Hollins and the GM down and let them know they fucking off a season and it is embarssing to them as a team and def the NBA…

  • http://www.ontarget-graphics.com Sucka Free

    NBK AI made Louis Williams a better point. He made Eric Snow a better point, and he made Stuckey look like he was a good point guard. All three looked like exceptional player when playing with AI and as soon as he was not playing beside them they looked like peons. Stuckey is shooting 34% from the field and they are getting there teeth kicked in. Last year mid season he was dropping 40 on fools and people were comparing him to great players. Since AI left the Pistons team stuckey has been out played by Will Bynum and undrafted player.

    Snow was leading his team to the finals and playing as AI’s sidekick while they took the league by storm for 7 yrs in a row. They lead the sixers to 1 Finals, 2 Semi Finals, three second round playoff appearances. He averaged 10 and 8 assist. One year removed from playing beside AI he was not good enough to start for a below average Cavs team. To add insult to injury for that wack statement. Carmelo Anthony had his best statistical season and first 50 win season playing beside AI while Nene was out with Testicular cancer, and Anthony Carter was the starting point guard. Melo had his highest scoring average, highest fg percentage and his assist jumped from 2 a game to 4. Of course Melo was a great player before AI, but Iverson showed him how to be elite.

  • http://www.ontarget-graphics.com Sucka Free

    Further more take Iverson out of the equation and any senario that has Conley as your starting point guard over any player that has proven himself to be a All star Caliber player is a recipe for mutany. Conley would only be my starter if I were content with a maximum of 20 – 30 wins and the playoffs are to far out of reach to imagine. Which will be the case by December if Iverson is not inserted in the the starting lineup asap….

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    @ Sucka Free – Rodney Stuckey is the same player he was as a rookie. Before Iverson
    I would say Eric Snow was the same player from Michigan State – Forward
    The Louis Williams argument can hold some water, but i know there are some people that would argue that Louis Williams is a shooting gaurd in a points body. I don’t see how Iverson made Louis Williams better in 50 games, with maybe 4 minutes together on the court average though, actually you have nothing to back that up. But Williams did get better after Iverson left ill give you that.
    This Eric Snow business your pushin Eric Snow was the same pointgaurd from Michigan State forward who are you tryna fool? Iverson didn’t make him better, what Iverson did for Eric Snow was give Eric Snow a player to play with. Their is only a handful of guys in the NBA Eric Snow could have received PT with do to his lack of a shot. And i mean complete lack of a shot. He averaged the same per 36 minute numbers in seattle that he did in philadelphia. And their is no insult to any injury dude, nobody said iverson has never made anyone better, i said point gaurd. I am not taking away what iverson did for melo. but you and tavoris should talk to each other about argument approaches its pretty similar

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Furthermore (hahaha) the grizzlies wont win more then 25 games even if iverson plays like its 2001 so according to your own reasoning there is a reason to start conley. Like ive been saying the Grizzlies did not sign iverson to win ball games, they signed him to sell tickets and jerseys….and get them on sportscenter

  • tavoris

    it’s funny that Jukai, Wayno, and nbk all seem to think I’m moronic for feeling that Mayo and Iverson should start together, yet that just respectfully disagree with other posters who say the EXACT SAME THING.

  • tavoris

    and that Mayo-who’s been pegged as a point practically his whole competitive life (and who’s said repeatedly that it’s the position he wants to play)-cannot play the point. He spent 1 year at USC as a PG that was required to shoot 4 them 2 compete. He spent 1 year as a shooting guard at Memphis-where he spent most of the 4th quarter with the ball in his hands. For all of your hate for Iverson, you are really dissing Mayo’s ability by saying that he can’t play the point.

  • tavoris

    lastly Jukai, you’ve proven yourself just as ignorant and immature as your cohorts (insert your own name here), and I’ll treat u as such going forward.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    blah blah blah blah….more dinosaur talk please coach!

  • Nbk

    It’s not your opinion that makes us call you a moron moron. It’s the way present irelovent ideas, and dumb assertions. Your like the annoying dude that can’t see your own problems.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    NBK
    Steve Blake, Eric Snow and Anthony Carter would all like to have a word with you about Iverson’s ability to make things easier for point guards.

  • MrYC

    first game the guy is already a cancer in the locker room. it doesn’t matter how talented he was or how talented he is, the league is obviously tired of his bitching and child-like behaviour because everyone is realizing that the negatives of AI outweigh the positives. AI, you’re a 34 year old man and you are playing a game as a professional career. show some hint of professionalism dammit

  • Nbk

    I’ll give you Anthony Carter and steve Blake I totAlly forgot about those 2. But like I said Eric snow was the same player his whole career. He made things for iverson easier

  • AKW

    damn, I have no idea what the grizzlies are thinking any way. Why would you sign a guy that needs to have the ball in his hands? The grizzlies were young, they shouldn’t have gotten AI. AI should have gone to a contender also.

    This was nothing but a bad decision on both sides. Also, if AI is going to play for them then he should get more minutes. Maybe not start but def he should get at least 30 mins per game. I mean, seriously? He outscored conley in the first game that he had on his come back from the injury. He’s still a scoring machine and neither Conley nor AI play defense, so that really doesn’t matter much but WHO IS IN THE TOP 10 ALL TIME IN STEALS? yeah, A.I.

    That not withstanding, I know his steals mostly came in his younger years, gambling on defense, and all that, but he is a better threat on the court against a team such as the damn lakers than Conley is. Give him 8 more minutes a game, or 30 minutes a game…why else is he there? They are using him just to sell tickets? AI, demand a trade.

  • Penny the Great

    It’s funny how you people are on SLAMs website, the same coporation that loves Allen Iverson, speakin negative on one of their favorite stars. Kobe doesn’t have as many SLAM covers as A.I. They constantly show him love and will continue. Pretty soon, don’t be suprise if he get’s a cover pretty soon. Will you dedicated readers still ride with SLAM then? Probably not, because you fake, all the way down to the tip of your souls. They don’t do articles on people we should hate. When did Ron Artest get a cover, or anybody who was recently traded…There’s no Bruce Bowen cover, and so on…

  • AKW

    I just think that the man deserves more than one opp at a title run. Those years in philly were mostly wasted on teams with one or two, at most, good players. AI being one of them and then a half a good player beside him. His run to the finals was their best year as a team, obviously. But, philly never tried to put solid players around AI.
    _____________________________
    They did try and keep good players from around him though. Coleman, gone, hughes, gone, stackhouse, gone…all the decent players he had were either forced off the team or retired early on. Even Kyle Kover was shipped out (or he may have opted to leave). When he got webber, webber was already over the hill and injured…i mean, damn. The guy should be in Texas, Florida, or New York, possibly even Chicago. I’d rather him be in La, no not that La, the other LA.

  • http://www.thehecticsite.tk hecticethnic

    first of all ur all h8rs. second of all ITS 4 THA TEAM THATS Y HE SED IT!!! IF HE WERE IN, THA TEAM WOULD HAV A BETTER CHANCE. itz about taking the best option in order to take ur team 2 tha top. if ray allen has an open 3, he would pass it to kendric if hes open simply cuz its tha best option 2 take, same with a.i. I DOUBT MAYO CAN DO HALF OF WHAT A.I CAN PACK!

    and akw is absolutely right

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