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Wednesday, January 27th, 2010 at 10:00 am  |  196 responses

Paul Shirley: Not a Fan of Haiti (UPDATE)

The former (marginal) NBAer turned scribe expressed some interesting thoughts on the devastated country. And our man Dave Zirin took him to task (thanks for the tip, @thefarmerjones): “I had plans to write a political response to this excrement. I was going to wonder why someone would write something so hurtful while people are still digging their own family members out from the rubble. I was going to marvel at Paul Shirley’s ignorance of Haiti’s history. I was going to ask if he knew anything about the crushing debt Haiti has lived under for two centuries. I was going to point out the U.S. occupation of the island from 1915-1934, which left behind a 98 percent illiteracy rate, a broken economy, and a U.S.-trained military schooled in the art of repression. I was going to ask if he had any knowledge of the unspeakable brutality of the Duvalier dictatorships. I was going to write that before he talks about ‘history as a guide’, he should dare read some history like The Uses of Haiti by Paul Farmer or The Rainy Season by Amy Wilentz. I was also going to suggest that he actually try to live on a dollar a day or care for someone H.I.V. positive who has no access to medicine. I wanted to dare him to work for ONE DAY in a garment industry sweatshop. I was going to write all of these things. But instead I think I’m just going to write my own open letter: Dear Paul Shirley, I only wish your father had taken your own advice and worn a condom. Go to hell. Sincerely, Dave Zirin.”

UPDATE: Paul has lost his ESPN gig as a result of his diatribe.

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  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    Ether.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com TADOne

    TADOne: Not a Fan of Paul Shirley.

  • T-Money

    Zirin is my hero. This is so much better than a simple ”eff you, shirley”… (which would still be appropriate)

  • Squirrel7

    Personally, I quite like Paul Shirley, but don’t agree with him on this. However, in your country (I’m English), don’t you champion freedom of speech? Yet when someone voices their thoughts, you call them a jackass? Would the reaction
    have been the same if the article wasn’t endorsing one of your own writers?

  • T-Money

    squirrel: he has the right to say whatever he wants to say. ppl also have the right to call him a jackass for it. freedom of speech only means that he won’t be prosecuted for his opinion not that he can’t be ridiculed. / espn just dropped him.

  • Peter

    Freedom of speech only gives you the freedom to express your thoughts…it doesn’t exempt you from being an ignorant idiot

  • Squirrel7

    Fair enough, I just felt the attack was not so much about his actual opinion, just that he dared to say something different to the majority!

  • http://www.slamonline.com/online/category/blogs/farmer-jones/ Ryan Jones

    Squirrel: What T-Money said. I thought English people were smarter than this.

  • http://www.slamonline.com/online/category/blogs/farmer-jones/ Ryan Jones

    Squirrel: I don’t think the outrage here was that his opinion differed from the majority. I think the outrage was that his opinion is ignorant, shortsighted, and morally indefensible.

  • Roberto

    I like Paul, and even though I may not agree with what he says, from what I have read about and from him, he is a very intelligent person. So when he states his opinion I think he has done some research on it or knew something about it, if not it is just someone’s opinion. There are probably many more people who have this thought and they dont get lambasted because they weren’t paid money to put a ball in a hoop, across a line, over a fence, or in a goal and known by us.

  • ab_40

    Obviously, a set of circumstances such as the one in which Ms. Eltime was living is a heart-wrenching one. And for that, anyone would be sympathetic. Until she says, “I don’t know whose responsibility it is.” I don’t know whose responsibility it is, either. What I do know is that it is not the responsibility of the outside world to provide help. It’s nice if we do, but it is not a requirement, especially when people choose to influence their own existences negatively, whether by having too many children when they can’t afford them or by failing to recognize that living in a concrete bunker might not be the best way to protect one’s family, whether an earthquake happens or not…… WOW what a fool. I know there is poverty in southern america, eastern europe, almost the entire continent of africa, over three quarters of asia and so on. but for the wealthy not to spend just 1 dollar or euro on this is just sad… in this article he lays in on the government and the people of haiti. they didn’t come there they were put there and they’ve gotten proud of who they are and where they live… he probably wrote this just so he could get some publicity it’s the bloggers version of that guy from seinfeld who said the dumb word.

  • http://www.hoopsvibe.com/features/overdribbling chiqo

    zirin’s great.

  • Marcel Mutoni

    Updated the post, kids: Shirley just lost his ESPN gig. Sounds about right.

  • Prentice

    Wow. Just read the post, couldn’t stop shaking my head. I used to read his old blog when he was on the Sun’s, but like Jones said, just indefensible.

    Is the guy retired? Now he is.

  • Kadavour

    Roberto, are you a sheep? What does his intelligence have to do with how reprehensible his comments were? And so what if many others have thought the same, they too deserve to share the circle of hell reserved for this man and his ilk.

  • Squirrel7

    I’m not disputing that most of his comments about Haiti are wildly inaccurate, but doesn’t he make some valid points too, like about rebuilding cities in earthquake/hurricane zones? I don’t know, as my US geography is not all that. But he’s a smart guy, I doubt he’d come out with all that, and risk the backlash, if he hadn’t done any research first, that’s all.

  • Roberto

    As you read on my post I said I do not agree with what he said, and when I spoke of his intelligence and research he may have done I was refering to the questions Zirin wanted to ask him and him possibly knowing the answers. I know this is a devastating time and I have donated myself, and even though his comments are deplorable they are his own thoughts and he does have the right to say them even if they are wrong and misguided.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    You can all gang up on dude and crush his opinion….but there’s merit in some of the points he made. I’ll leave you with a tidbit of information and dance around and punch a wall or something for someone telling you the truth: this is a quote pulled directly from the State of Florida Census report of 2004……..”Of the unofficial number of 1,000,000 Haitians in the United States, 53% of that number are non-registered citizens”. For the dense population that comes to this site…that means that about 530,000 Haitians working labor jobs in this country…not in Haiti, are working tax-free, because they have no way of reporitng income to the IRS becasue of lack of citizenship, not having a work visa, or by just getting into this country illegally. Where is that fair to the majority of working Americans that give almost 35% of their wages each week? This also applies,in greater numbers, to Guatemalens and Mexicans…both of whom make up another huge population of labor workers in this country.

  • Peter

    Eboy get off your high horse…are you going to go and work the jobs that a Haitian or Mexican immigrant is working? Besides illegal immigration is a completely separate issue to what Paul was ranting about…

  • bulletsforever

    While a lot of what he says is ignorant Shirley does bring up some good points. I think most here can agree that all of the donated money should be used more productively than just providing short-term shelter, medical, and food (although these are obviously the priority for now). The government of Haiti and the supporting countries should monitor the millions of dollars coming in and use the money for schools/education that could help improve current issues (poverty, disease) and better prepare them if god forbid a disaster like this occurs again.

  • riggs

    @Eboy: thats all fine and dandy, but what does that have to do with a earthquake in haiti and giving money for aid?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Peter, for your inbreded information, I am married to a minority, my son is half a minority and my fahter-in-law does a terribly demanding laboring job 6 days a week…and no, I wouldn’t want to do any of the jobs that the majority of these people do…but there’s also a thing called motivation to be better than what your limiations are so they don’t have to be in that number. And while it seems impossible in most of their scenarios, this country, for all it’s thousands of faults, allows that opportunity…which is the reason these numbers of immigrants STILL come here.

  • NYC Balla

    He got dunked on by black people for so long he turned racist

  • http://www.slamonline.com/online/category/blogs/farmer-jones/ Ryan Jones

    Riggs is too kind, Eboy. That ish has NOTHING to do with what Paul Shirley wrote. Please don’t try and justify his ignorance with some irrelevant labor statistics, man. The gist of his piece was “I’m not giving these stupid island-dwellers a penny because they made their own bed and now they have to lie in it,” and that has absolutely no f*cking merit whatsoever.

  • http://www.nottherealmelvinely.com melvin ely

    If Paul Shirley’s soul had balls, I want to kick them. I want to kick Paul Shirley’s soul in the balls.

  • KHALID SALAAM

    Old school Ryan is back!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    riggs….nothing…I was just trying to point out the inconsisticies of peoples views about what should/shouldn’t be done for people in need. As other guys above me commented earlier, there are hundreds of millions of struggling peoples throughout the world…not touched by an uncontrollable natural disaster, that get nothing in the way of the relieve effort that Haiti is getting for this tragedy. In turn, the dollars that these people are making here without the ability to be taxed because of their non-citizen status, should automacilly be turned over to a fund to help their own country. Why isn’t there legistlation being written for that action? It would make the 57 million raised by the telethon Friday night seem like peanuts in a months time.

  • NYC Balla

    oh yea and i love guys like eboy that cut and paste “facts and stats” from “sources” and give us this read em and weep smug statement along with it like it’s believable at all. I guess the internet is the only place your nerd ass can state such clowness without a hand reaching out and slapping you

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    ESPN fired him? I figured he’d get a promotion given their recent decision making.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Ryan….what have you given? A few thousand? Ten Thousand? Just a question?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    And no sh*t this has nothing to do what Shirley wrote, he took the ignorant route of trivializing the suffering people. That’s obvious, but there is also a huge problem in our own country that doesn’t get the same effort to correct IT. I was just trying to point out something that affects ME (or we, if you work for a wage here) is all.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Geez Eboy, way to generalize and insult the readers of slamonline. “Dense population”? Really? Who spat in your soup today?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    NYC Balla…you can say what you’d like, I haven’t dealt with interent bit*hes like you for the longest, so you are just a blurb or words, homegirl.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    @melvin ely: candid, succint. I like your style, man. I second that notion.

  • Peter

    “but there’s also a thing called motivation to be better than what your limiations are so they don’t have to be in that number. And while it seems impossible in most of their scenarios, this country, for all it’s thousands of faults, allows that opportunity…which is the reason these numbers of immigrants STILL come here.”…um…exactly? you were the one complaining that immigrants were working without paying tax my man.

  • JoeMaMa

    In a global economy, we enter into a complex system that affects almost every country, through trading schemes that help/hinder other countries, and may even leave others vulnerable to shocks and stresses. Haiti has also been actively persecuted against by several countries, partly on account of rebelling against the French and kicking them out so long ago. It is our responsibility as global citizens to stop merely accepting the status quo and to actively doing something about the problems we face. Sending a few bucks now will help feed people and give shelter and medical supplies, but I challenge the people on here to do something after the fact. We are giving AID, not nation building. If you want to help make this country improve, make it happen.
    Also, I disagree with the guy’s viewpoint, but the other that do, let me ask you: are you the ones buying slave made goods from other countries? Eating food brought in from other countries as a result of predatory trading? Bash this guy, but don’t forget to look in the mirror and ask yourselves some hard questions.

  • http://www.slamonline.com/online/category/blogs/farmer-jones/ Ryan Jones

    Are you measuring my morality by the amount of money I can afford to donate? Do you want to see my tax returns? Are you f*cking kidding me? Just questions, Eboy.
    You are sh*tting all over yourself on this one, homie. Please let it go.

  • http://www.nottherealmelvinely.com melvin ely

    jesus christ that “open letter to Haiti” is getting under my skin. I want to punch this D-bag in the face in the WORST way. I live in a 3rd world country, and until you see utter hunger, desperation, & poverty in the face of people who do not even have the slightest chance in hell to alleviate it…you don’t know sh*t. What gives this f*cker the right to sit in his high horse and F*CKING QUIP at the misfortunes of people who’ve suffered more in one day then he will likely ever his entire blessed life?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    *Eats popcorn*

  • http://www.nottherealmelvinely.com melvin ely

    Saber: thanks man, wish I were in a better mood to appreciate it.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    I can feel melvin’s fury from here. Nicely stated, man.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    @Myles: isn’t it wonderful to see Ryan unleash his anger over the last 24 hours or so? Nearly forgot why i enjoy the man’s work. Never again.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    No Ryan, you Amish dope, I was trying to get to a silly point like “wow, Jones, you donated $1,000 bucks, that’s so great of you and incredibly commendable…imagine if you didn’t have to pay taxes, you might have been able to donate $1,300 instead!” Don’t go all crazy trying to get your pro-humanitarian game on…I know you’re a good dude. And Dark, I wasn’t generalizing, but too many of these big issues that are discussed here are usually just written off as one-subject columns, not to be visited again becasue life moves on. The rude comments that usually go along with them are where my comment came from.

  • http://www.digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    Its nice to have the Slam crew posting again.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    melvin spoke hard truths and I commend the dude.

  • http://www.boogiewilliams.com Boing Dynasty

    These comments should have been closed after “Ether” and Eboy should have stopped talking at “inbreded”.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    I get where you are coming from white hot, but i must state that the “open letter” segment of Shirley’s post got my blood boiling (amongst other “facts”) and your 1st comment read as if you were scolding your fellow commenters, diverse as we are, for being angered by the general theme of that idiot’s “story”. Alright man, please proceed.

  • RedRum

    I cannot believe what he wrote… the irony of the whole thing is that he made himself famous by presenting the rest of the NBA as uneducated jocks, while he was the one reading books and listening to cool music. what an idiot… I have his book, I am going to donate it to a charity for Haiti. I guess someone will now pick it up in case the run out of toilet paper.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Nah bro…..I’m a 1000 percent in the bust-Shirley- in-his-sh*t camp, I was just taking another point of view, which usually gets me in trouble. My bad to all involved.

  • KHALID SALAAM

    This is great and all but can anyone tell me when the Apple press conference starts?

  • http://www.digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    Oh, and Haitians that are here illegally have been granted Temporary Protected Status by the President which gives them the legal right to be here. This is so MORE wages of these Haitians can start getting into Haiti without having to do it on the sly. Hopefully this will will be a first step in dealing, particularly, with Haitian illegal immigrants and helping them either a) get them to legitimacy as workers in America or b) help rebuild Haiti sooner and faster so they could possibly have real opportunity in their own country. I work for a wage and I pay taxes and there are plenty of minorities living and working illeagally in my area and I feel like we should, instead of hating them, understand they are in the same plight as us…struggling to survive in a post-modern global clusterf-ck where day to day realoty becomes more and more depressing. So, I guess my point was that you are wrong Eboy when you say there are Haitians living illegally in the U.S. They are all, for the moment, well within their rights. Good day, sir.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    I don’t agree with Shirley but I’ve been seeing a lot of this on facebook also. We should definitely try to help people who need it we’ve never had umpteen thousands of people die in one catastrophe but I wonder if we did if other countries would step out and have a fund raiser for our sakes. Like I said I’ve donated my Ten because that’s all I can afford and I think Shirley is a jerk*ff for saying I’m not going to help because its their fault. Obviously an earthquake is nobody’s fault and some people don’t have the means to escape places where danger lives. If a tsunami hit Hawaii I think Mr. Shirley might sing a different tune, however I don’t think anyone in this country or any country should feel obligated to donate or feel badly if they’d rather donate to an american cause or even donate to the cause of their own troubles. With that said you don’t have to insult an entire nation and basically mock them for what is a tragedy in the truest sense of the word. As far him saying he wouldn’t give a homeless guy money, good for you Paul. Buy him some breakfast instead. I’m not the most compasionate guy in the world but even I’ve done that on occasion. I’m under the strong belief that just about anybody can change their circumstances if they have the determination so while I can SLIGHTLY see his point he went way over the line of being a good person with a different opinion and crossed into the realm of a selfish jack*ss.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Aaaand KHA for the win…. Come to think of it, has Stevey Jobbs donated yet. He’s about to send his shares through the roof (again) with that Islate thingy.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    Damn, Shia. That was….very honest. Great way to put it, man. Chapeau.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Albert, you are correct sir. I guess I was just thinking (and writing) in the past tense.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Cheryl

    1:30pm EST, Khalid. And JoeMaMa @ 11:37am gets my vote.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Shia, would you not consider 9/11 a tragedy, albeit on a smaller scale (human loss of life wise)?

  • http://www.slamonline.com/online/category/blogs/farmer-jones/ Ryan Jones

    Yeah Kha.

  • http://digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    Eboy, just so you know, I do understand your argument and on some points could even agree with you. It is just so hard for many in this polarized world to make room for nuanced opinions. SLAMonline is not exempt from this. Keep mixin it up…it has been a good discussion.

  • http://www.nottherealmelvinely.com melvin ely

    An excerpt from the blog (I’m sorry but I still can’t bring myself to read it completely–apart from the fact that its already 1 AM here):

    ‘But children are brought into the world by their parents. Those parents have a responsibility – to themselves and to their kids – to provide. They have a responsibility to look around – before an earthquake happens – and say, “I need to improve this situation, because if a catastrophe were to happen, we’d be in bad shape.”’

    Try providing for your children when you can’t read or write, living on less than a dollar a day, and constantly live in mortal fear of your life every waking moment. THAT is what reality is for some of the victims, even before the earthquake; And if you were lucky enough to be well-to-do by Haiti’s very low socioeconomic standards, chances are that quake just pummeled you down to hand-to-mouth levels of poverty as well. But, he’s basically saying: well FU, you made your bed now you lie in it.

    I get some of what he’s saying. Really. In underdeveloped countries, when disasters like this strikes, a large chunk of the aid won’t make it to victims. Some will even go to corrupt warlords or politicians. It’s all wrong, and that’s how it is all over the world. But goddamit, if the problem was so simple it should’ve been solved by now. What’s disturbing, is that this guy offers such a plainview and condescending tone to intone these points. And that’s really what I find most infuriating about all this. (okay I’m done)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Thanks, Albert….I didn’t mean any harm to the suffering (still suffering).

  • http://fashionsensei.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/jackie-moon.jpg Jackie Moon

    Pat Robertson and Paul Shirley stand on the same moral ground. Which is really quicksand.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    melvin, I’d prefer to read your take on his words than other’s involved. Please feel free to continue on, bro.

  • KHALID SALAAM

    thanks cheryl

  • http://theurbangriot.com/ NUPE

    Shirley’s comments were appauling! I think that most people can agree that any money used to support Haiti (or any other country or group) should be used wisely. The need in Haiti right now is great for just basic food, medical attention, supplies etc. Considering all the money that has been donated, it’s just a drop in the bucket from being able to help long-term issues. It cost over $720 million to make the movie Avatar and Haiti, as last I heard, has been donated about $400 million. That’s not a little money, but if you can’t even make a movie with that budget, how can you concentrate on making all the long-term infrastructre and educational fixes? IF Haiti had ‘extra’ billions laying around and just mis-used it, then Shirley’s comments would have more merit. But to say it’s the fault of the people and/or government for thier current conditions of living is misguided at best. On large they are hard working people trying to support families on $1 dollar a day. It would be nice if they could have built ‘better homes’ etc, but when you are having trouble being able to afford food to eat, and doing your max to do so. Don’t blame the people.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Of course I do and so was Katrina and like I said I didn’t see too many other world powers rushing to our aid. As a matter of fact I saw a very similar reaction as the one Shirley is giving a sort of “we had it coming” chorus by some of our citizens actually. So while I personally choose to help out where I can especially for people who have it worse I can see the other, cynical side of the coin. And that side is, no one gives a f*ck about us so why should we give a f*ck about anybody else we have our own problems. I think of course that line of thinking is a very real problem and will eventually lead to a society I don’t think I want to be a part of. But its easy to hate America for having it “easy” but then scream “help us America” when sh*t hits the fan.

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    I’m sure Andre Bauer is a HUGE Paul Shirley fan.

  • http://digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    I would like to hear more from Mr. Ely as well.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Shia, I feel you, and yes, Katrina is still a huge problem for so many affected in Louisiana.

  • http://fashionsensei.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/jackie-moon.jpg Jackie Moon

    When did Haitians become “they”?

    Aren’t they really “us”?

  • http://theurbangriot.com/ NUPE

    I think the world response to helping America is very differnt than it is for helping Haiti. In the case of Katrina, the U.S. had the means to deal with the problem on it’s own. A worldwide relief effort was not necessary because we were equipt to handle it (financially and technology wise). It’s like if I fell down in the snow, I’m perfectly able to get up all by myself so wouldn’t expect (or accept) help just to stand-up and keep walking. However, if my grandmother fell down in the snow, she would need help to get up cause she couldn’t stand on her own. To offer help to the helpless is what makes people great and one could say a ‘moral obligation’. When 911 happened in the U.S. I’m not sure how much foreign aid was received, but I do recall the candelight cerimonies and prarys etc, that were held in various countries throught the world for the U.S. That’s sometimes the only thing ‘needed’ when the other phyiscal/financial items were already ‘covered’.

  • JoeMaMa

    This is not a basketball post, but there’s generally one rule that every religion uses, it’s raison d’etre, if you will – Love Your Neighbour. Now, act accordingly. Help provide short term aid and longer term assistance to help transform lives in Haiti, if you can. And do the same for low income communities in your own neighbourhood (no shortage of places). Like excellence, giving isn’t an act, but a habit. And giving isn’t solely about money, but time and energy as well.

  • http://slamonline.com Lang Whitaker
  • LA Huey

    Myles, pass the popcorn please.

  • Michael

    Can anyoen shed any light on Shirley’s motivation? I mean it wasnt a random soundbite, it was obviously a planned column. Surely he must have realised it was going to unleash a crapstorm and finish his writing career. So again, why write it? It just seems odd to me.

  • tony

    all i can say is im proud of how the US has handled this Haiti situation, ya its not perfect and they can prolly do more, but i have never seen in all my life this many athletes, celebrities, tv networks and people in general so concerned and enthusiastic in efforts to donate , help and raise awareness of the people in need. And the fact that Haiti has nothing to offer politically and economically makes me think that it must be done truly for good cuz without other intentions. I hope this sets a precedent on how the US and other developed countries can help out poorer countries more from now on.-peace

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ Tariqُُ

    I can’t believe anyone would defend this piece of sh*t.

  • http://www.boogiewilliams.com Boing Dynasty

    “I do not know if what I’m about to write makes me a monster”

  • T-Money

    my take: ppl are reaching for angles on an indefensible post.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    I don’t think anyone defended him.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ Tariqُُ

    Bryan:
    It sure sounds like it.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    Somebody needs to put a bullet in Shirley’s Temple

  • TheBestYet

    Eboy, I’ve enjoyed reading your comments for about 2 years now, but I’m sorry- all stripes lost on that one.

    The subject is aid to a 3rd world country after a natural disaster kills tens of thousands in mere seconds and also demolishes the already shoddy infrastructure.

    In all that you there talking bout how they come to your country and don’t pay taxes for the little odd jobs that they do.

    I was born and raised in the Caribbean and as modern and built up as my island is, it is still referred to as 3rd world. Haitians there have a bad name too, the do the odd jobs, get paid very little and live in the shanty towns.

    if a guy cleans your yard/property for 4 hours and gets paid $25, what taxes should he pay from that? Money can’t always be the concern, because I’m sure no undocumented uneducated Haitian will be applying for your job. So where’s the issue there?

    Some comments I’ve read here and on other sites regarding Shirley’s posting have that they should be more responsible, have fewer children and invest in tourism and all that.

    Why? Because the Americans do?

    Not every people in the world live as the Americans do. I live in Europe and can tell you that people are different from town to town, not to mention country to country.

    Haitians are a simple people, the value family and hard work, not 5000 square foot homes and Range Rovers.

    Yes I would prefer to see them live in what we are accostomed to and refer to as “better living conditions”, but I’m just saying, maybe it’s like that because they are ok with it.

    You know the saying “know better, do better”. A lot have never left the rock.

    Anyways, remain on topic.

  • http://slamonline.com Lang Whitaker

    Too far, BETCATS.

  • tomtom

    Eboy just cos u can copy a few stats really don’t make you any more high and mighty than any of the rest of us. You seem to be talking to everyone from a point of view of a school teacher. Yet you insist on making up your own language ‘inbreded’, i get the feeling your not quite as special as you think you are furthermore when you noticed you had made a totally retarded point you backtracked BIGTIME. I’m not going to go on any further than i have because Ryan has covered most of it. All i will say is that asking how much he has donated is a completely crass and insensitive angle to take. Utterly sickening, my uncle is working on relief projects outside the city of port au prince and was injured when caught in an aftershock, i only donated £20 (about 13 dollars) not as a reflection of how much i care. but because its all i can afford. Stop pretending to be a victim of misunderstanding, you are a moronic example of people who crave attention through shock value.

  • T-Money

    ive been reading the comments section on this site for a while without commenting myself so i’ve kinda got to ”know” some of the regulars. with that said, i’m really taken aback by eboy’s stance, didn’t see that one coming at all. disappointing to say the least.

  • T-Money

    From Paul Shirley’s blog comments section : ”I knew there was someone else out there thinking this besides me. I had this same discussion with co-worker the other day. If you have ever lived in South Florida and have been around Haitian people. You will know what I am talking about. 99% of these people are pieces of garbage. They will steal & cheat you any chance they can get. If there was ever a time any person who was supporting them needed any help. They will not give you any help. More likely to kick you when you are down, taking your wallet and removing your kidney to sell on the black market. I read someone that Paul was removed from duty at ESPN. It is sad that people who there own opinions lose a job. Pretty sad.” Ladies and gents, Paul Shirley fans!!

  • http://slamonline.com Russ Bengtson

    Here’s hoping the Sixers sign Shirley to a 10-day and give him the locker next to Samuel Dalembert.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    C’mon lang i was just using word play so i could get a Shirley Temple reference in. Everybody else has already said the ‘smart’ stuff.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Huh? What did I say in support of Shirley (or did some of you just read my initial post and go from there?) I just think (as is my way normally) on the opposite of the majority at times and could see valid points in his incredibly inappropriate column. THAT WAS IT!!!!!!!!!!!! Where is it that now I’m supporting this guys thoughts or trying to criticize the victims there? If I could be Eboy circa 2008 for a minute, “you guys need to fu*king learn how to read AND THEN comprehend WHAT you read”. Just saying.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    If you were Eboy circa 2008 their would be a white hot in front of your name. Calm down my man, everybody got what you were saying, some people like to twist sh!t is all.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    And if donating money is a way of validating one’s concern over the tragedy, I’m covered. Trust me.

  • luv2ball

    If anyone needs to rebuild Haiti it’s the USA and the French. I mean, to read the history of Haiti is sad; but it is the same story of many African countries as well. I won’t get into it here, but do your research. Also, after Katrina lots of countries offered us help, but Bush declined the offers. I can’t believe I used to wait in anticipation for this dudes blog, and I bought his book. I am truly appalled. I want to cosign with Melvin Ely; until you have been in a third world country, you can’t imagine the poverty. I have been to Cambodia, India, Burma, these people are so poor it makes you want to cry. To have the gall to say that these people need to ‘work their way out of the situation” WTF?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I would make a serious comment, but there’s no need. This comment section was quite illuminating.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    Nah BET (glad to see you, btw)cat’s ALWAYS make sh*t out to be more that what it is, regardless of subject matter. This is just another one of those instances. Fu*k it, the site’s better off being silent. Nobody catches feelings then.

  • Joe

    So Paul Shirley said he wouldn’t spend a $1 in helping Haiti……That’s fine, if he’s so worried about whether or not his money is actually going to be put to use, then why doesnt he go down there himself, and get hands-on with the help????? He might be more useful going down, their to help pull bodies out of rubble, walk amongst dead bodies and the starved, while explaining his blog to them, about how they had this coming…………IF he’s doesn’t trust where his money is going, and pretty much puts total blame on the Haitian people then I dont see why He cant go down there, and start educating and teaching all of the now-orphaned children how to read himself “to correct this problem”, and how when they grow up, they should look around, and decide if an earthquake is going to happen and if the infrastructure is strong enough, before deciding to put the condom on, or keep it off.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.com BETCATS

    you are reading into it too much. The guy is just trying to get some efame by being controversial. Paul Shirley is doing the same thing, he has different views from most ‘normal’ people so he decides to share them. Then when you, or anyone responds, the counterattack is that they are being persecuted for their beliefs and you do not have merrit to attack them. Just let it go, i used to do the same thing as these people but i grew up. Now i am a counter-comment insurgency expert and am here to help. Fighting these people is exactly what they want, so do it in a intelligent way (like Dave Zirin) and dont ‘catch a feeling’.

  • http://www.shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com Eboy

    I can’t believe this is the same BET I grew to love who spelled in strange ways and amused me daily with high school stories that needed their own reality show. Good words, BET, I’m going to semi-retire again to keep out of it. Thanks, my man. And keep up the literacy battle, kid, it’s looking tight.

  • Dave Zirin

    The SLAM board never disappoints. I have no doubt that this was a play by Shirley for web-heat. But if you are going to step to the flame, you better bring more than a cocktail weenie.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.co BETCATS

    Im not sure to laugh that off or not. But man, a lot of sh!t has happened since then. I got a lot of wakeup calls and personal situations that made me realized i needed to use my brain or just stop everything and wait for some dumb desision to kill me. I stopped comming here frequently after the Bobcats season preview declared we would win 22 games, which i laugh at now. But dont retire, this site needs people like you, since people like me cant really exsist anymore due to the “comment section rules”. I sorta sold out to these people after those got posted.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Is Eboy really complaining about illegal immigrants when the story is on the Haitian earthquake? The f*ck?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Actually, several other nations gave the United States Aid offers after Katrina, including the country still dealing with the aftereffects of the tsunami. The federal government actually TURNED DOWN AID because it was embarrassed byt he implication that the United States could not care for its citizens, even though the broadcast news was showing that was exactly the case.
    David Zirin said it best. Haiti didn’t become Haiti in a vacuum. That’s like the idiots who assume Africa got all effed up by itself. Or that random inner city USA is all effed up because parents don’t care.
    It’s an easy cop-out pushed by lazy bastards who want assuage their own guilt or deflect blame.
    Bottom line, world history, rather human history, is an inter-connected morass with all of our actions having ripple effects on those around us. Most longstanding and massive problems have a host of causes. The United States has done a ton of good around the world and ton of evil. To pretend otherwise is a sign of laziness or unintelligence. Paul Shirley knows very little about Haiti, but thanks to a national platform provided him by a “sports” network that has a vested interest in keeping people dumb and complacent, he was able to spread his lack of knowledge to millions. And in doing so justify their own misguided mindsets.
    Pretty much the story of human history encapsulated in one small event.

  • Paul

    http://stuffblackpeopledontlike.blogspot.com/2010/01/no-hope-for-haiti.html

    Nothing of what he said was off base. Our own State Department advised against traveling to Haiti in November of 2009 and deemed the entire nation “criminal”.

    Read the post above.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Paul
    So you think Haitians effed up their own country all by themselves?
    Do you now?

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    What bothers me is the hypocrisy of the media and the US’ aid policy. Haiti deserves all the aid it can get, and that is true. Paul Shirley is a f*cking arrogant, typical American G-man moron.
    That being said, how much aid would be spent if Iran were to face a natural disaster?

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    I can’t speak for anybody else but I sure as hell was defending him and if I came off like I was I apologize. I think his piece speaks about his complete lack of character and humanity. All I said was no one should feel OBLIGATED to do anything. He obviously doesn’t which is fine in itself but his writing was completely insulting and rude and has no place.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Don’t even bother responding to Paul. He got his information from a r@cist site that sports a blackface image as its mascot. However, let me say a few words:
    Paul, please shut the f*ck up, get off your sister, and retake history class. I’m still unsure of how you managed to gain internet access from your trailer park, but you sure aren’t using it right. Thanks for shutting up now.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.co BETCATS

    Paul what type of joke is that? What the hell is your point. That is not a question but a statemnt. Ok hati is a hard place to live. But who put them in this postion? Read Allen’s post, or better yet read a history book. Toussaint L’Ouverture, go see who he was and how the french treated him. Imperalistic powers have always tried to screw over the ‘little guy’. They owe it to the ‘little guy’ to come in and help them. When you have the resources America, France, Britian, Russia, or any ‘power’ has you need to use it in a situation like this instead of hording it selfishly. Tha hording is what got hati to the place it is at today. But, it really shouldnt even come down to restitution. HAVE SOME COMPASSION. Human to human. We all live on the same planet. Fu(k the economics issuses. fu(k the race issues. We are all the same species, and need to look out for each other or we will end up extinct. Hatians are our brothers and sisters in the world, to say you arent going to help them is just ___________ (insert desriptive adjective that would get me banned here).

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Co-sign Bryan 12:02 pm. Very well said.
    I do believe that someone with the right determination and perseverance has the ability to change their situation.
    However, when there is absolutely NO OPPORTUNITY TO DO SO in a poor nation like Haiti with an inept government and years of exploitation at the hands of the United States and Europe, you can’t just point fingers and say: “Those Haitians made their own bed, its their fault for being poor.”

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Teddy
    The proper way to deal with stereotypes is not to spew a bunch of stereotypes of your own. It only makes peopel feel justifed in their behavior.
    Eye for an eye leaves everybody blind.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Good point, Allenp. Just thought I’d give him a taste of his own medicine. Nonetheless, you make a good point.

  • luv2ball

    @betcats- that was an awesome post

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Quick question for those of you in America–because I wasn’t living in the US at the time–but how much coverage of the earthquake in Sichuan, China did you guys hear about? How much attention did you guys pay to it, and did you even know much about it?

  • http://slamonline.com Brad Long

    I co-sign everything Allenp said at 3:03. The worst thing about this whole situation is that now people actually know who Paul Shirley is.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Teddy
    The earthquake was covered some, but not as much as the Haitian thing. Probably because it’s easier to get to Haiti from the U.S., and the aftermath was likely worse given the fact that China probably has better building codes.
    I thought that whoever made that point about an earthquake in Iran made a good point too.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Oh, and I wanted to say that I don’t think there is anything wrong with refusing to give money to Haiti, or with mistrusting aid organizations. I don’t think there is anything wrong with saying that Haitians have to take more responsibility for insuring their government works for all of them.
    I think there is something wrong with making that last statement and ignoring the concerted efforts by the Unites States to screw over Haiti. I think it’s wrong to promulgate the myth that Haitians lack the ability to have a competent country.
    I think it’s a damn that so many people living in glasses houses who eff up on their own are so willing to castigate others for their failures. Or hold them to an incredible high standard.

  • Ana

    “I’m not disputing that most of his comments about Haiti are wildly inaccurate, but doesn’t he make some valid points too, like about rebuilding cities in earthquake/hurricane zones?”

    Squirrel, so you’re saying that the next time Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Memphis or any other place in an “earthquake zone” gets hit by a huge earthquake, we shouldn’t rebuild? The next time Florida or Texas suffers billions of damages in a hurricane, we should turn our backs? What about tornado, flood, or drought zones? Volcanoes? Where do you and Paul Shirley suggest we relocate these billions of people?

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Okay, thanks Allen. I was just curious.

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/officerbarbrady what

    I thank Paul Shirley for spewing his stupidity for one reason. Until I read his awful blog post, I never bothered to look up Haiti’s history of exploitation at the hands of France and the USA, and I always used to wonder how a country could be independent for 200 years and not improve beyond that point. I took the time to research it, thanks to Shirley, and now I know. Thank you, Mr. Shirley. Out of your unspeakable douchebaggery, I was educated. Now my only question is how come they don’t teach us about this stuff in school in America.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Also trying to make the point that politics plays more of a role than it should when it comes to humanitarian aid and press coverage.

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/officerbarbrady what

    By the way, I think Etan Thomas should respond to Shirley’s post, if he hasn’t done so already.

  • luv2ball

    @what let’s not open that can of worms about Americans and history :)

  • T-Money

    I’d like to add that the ”condom” argument is a very racist one as Haiti is not over-populated at all. Their population density is on par with most insular countries. Also, there is a HUGE difference between crisis-related aid (always a good thing) and systemic aid (jury is still out). This is crisis-related aid.

  • luv2ball

    @teddy-the-bear I was in Vietnam during the earthquakes in China (actually felt a little of it) the Vietnamese press did not talk about it that much. I was monitoring CNN, USAtoday etc, and I saw pretty decent coverage. I think the BBC had the most though.

  • http://digitalthread.com AlbertBarr

    I liked that Dave Zirin popped in for a post. Nice comments today folks.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Ana
    That was a great comment.
    Don’t forget about the flooding from heavy rains in the midwest.
    The tornadoes in Dallas.
    The droughts in the southwest.
    And the blizzards along the East Coast and Colorado area.
    Bottom line, just about every place in this freaking country is subject to some sort of recurring natural disaster.
    But, just like with Katrina, some folks are worth saving and some folks aren’t.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    What
    They don’t teach you a lot of useful information in elementary school or high school in America. Mainly information that makes America look bad. Wouldn’t want folks to start doubting the God-ordained greatness of America, now would we?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    T-Money
    What’s the problem with recurring systemic aid? Do you realize how much of that we give out a year to certain other countries?

  • Remo Williams

    REAL QUICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    anyone speaking about undocumented workers not paying taxes because they dont have social security or what not…. should konw that is not true.

    The tax system collects its due, even from a class of workers with little likelihood of claiming a refund and no hope of drawing a Social Security check.

    A lot of undocumented workers are TOO SCARED TO ASK FOR A REFUND EVEN WHEN THEY QUALIFY!!

    so take the “undocumented workers dont pay taxes” and throw it away.

  • T-Money

    Allen: I’m Canadian but I know the USAID gives out A LOT of money to developing countries. It’s a debate even amongst developing countries. There’s just few success stories of systemic aid. Emerging countries now prefer to ratify free trade agreements with asymetric provisions and built-in aid (phased out over X years) instead of just getting aid. Korea in 50 years has gone from abject poverty to a booming economy because of increased exports. The problem with most developing countries is that their short-sighted leaders let international companies exploit their natural resources for a few hundred millions instead of nationalizing those industries. i mean how messed up is it to let a foreign company set up shop, exploit your land, have it transformed in their country and then sell it back to you?! but i digress. yeah, systemic aid is a hot topic right now. there’s an ongoing debate between jeffrey sachs and william easterly on the matter that is quite interesting.

  • http://fashionsensei.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/jackie-moon.jpg Jackie Moon

    Might be time to shut down the comments on this one.

  • JoeMaMa

    As a current Aid Worker in the Congo, I’ve seen some difficult things in recent times, but what strikes me the most is how when governance is lacking, inept, or corrupt, the people have to sit and watch infrastructure crumble and health facilities disappear. Either watch it happen or revolt…anyways, Haiti is a classic example of a people who have been pushed, prodded, fought back, and finally violently oppressed, from one government to the next, with health, agriculture, infrastructure, and market access becoming limited or non existent. I hate to say this word, but they are victims. Let’s hope this plight sheds some much needed light on the deeper issues that surround the systems that currently hold this country captive.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Within this thread, I have lost massive amounts of respect for:
    a) Myles, who used this opportunity to make stupid emote jokes
    b) Eboy, who used this opportunity as a soapbox for his own aggravations at the illegal immigrants in his area
    c) Teddy, who at this point I can only assume his a racist himself with all the racial remarks he makes against white people on a daily basis
    What Paul Shirley said was f*cking sickening. Sickening. Katrina and September 11th were both tragedies, but both combined don’t compare to what has happened in Haiti. The country literally will NOT BE ABLE TO PULL ITSELF TOGETHER without donations, and will only get worse than it is in the current state it is being criticized. You people will never comprehend the loss that country has just suffered. And now there’s talk about corruption and illegal immigration? Jesus…

  • that dude

    @Eboy. Nobody gives a f*ck that you’re married to a minority! Gotta love how ignorant people prefix a racist comment with some ish like “my best friend/girlfriend/neighbour/maid is said ethnicity but…” It is unrelated and meaningless.

  • that dude

    @Teddy-The-Bear – there’s such a thing as proximity. Haiti for one, is very close to the continental US and are incapable of aiding themselves whereas Sichuan is only a small part of China. China has significantly more manpower and money to provide aid to the area. And there was a lot of fund raising in South East Asia for the earthquakes.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jukai
    Teddy is understandably angry about the comments by some folks here when it comes to minorities, particularly those of Asian descent. I understand his frustration and at times he lashes out in his anger.
    You choice to label him a racist makes me wonder how exactly you use that definition, since I haven’t seen that type of behavior from Teddy. Yes, he’s a wee bit overprotective of Asians and at times jumps to conclusions without all of the facts, but I haven’t seen him do anything racist. Mostly he responds to insensitive comments with insensitive comments of his own.
    You know, the same way you do when the issue of homosexuality comes up and slurs are tossed around.

  • Jdubbs

    If Paul had half a brain, he’d be going after the biggest welfare recipients in the world -BANKS…who take TRILLIONS from the US treasury and make the same mistakes over and over again (S&L’s, dot-coms, housing busts) while paying their people billions in bonuses and laughing at us the whole time.

    Poor Haitians trying to eke out a meager living and survive is not high on my criticism list. Most Haitians I’ve met (working in a restaurant in Miami a long time ago) were some of the nicest, hard working people I’ve met anywhere.

    Paul Shirley, having been fired from several teams and with no marketable skills, show’s that he’s not only ignorant, but cold hearted as well.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Allenp: This is true, Allen, but if you remember, I was labeled a racist when I did that and stopped promptly. Teddy pulls this crap in just about every other post.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    And yes, it’s very clear Teddy is not a racist and that was an over-exaggeration on my part. I’m really going to reframe from talking about this because it’s drawing the conversation away from the topic at hand, which I find very serious as well.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.co BETCATS

    Jukai, for the second time in human history, i agree with you. I orginally only conforted eboy because he is my e-friend. I didnt read any comments until after i saw what you said. But after reading what he said about imigrants, im not too sure i should have been nice to him. Oh well.

  • http://www.hibachi20.blogspot.co BETCATS

    *i agree with you on everything except calling teddy a racist. He might not be the smartest when it comes to arguing and finding substance to argue with, but he isnt a racist.

  • http://idunkonthem.blogspot.com/ albie1kenobi

    very late to the party, and just read Shirley’s post. the whole post was bad, but that “open letter” to Haitian is just unthinkably offensive. I appreciate the Dave Zirin excerpt in the post. Shirley definitely senationalize his opinion because he knows there’s an audience, but it was just tasteless.
    the more alarming things though are the comments in that Shirley post. i didn’t know (or wanted to believe) such people exist.
    as for all the hoopla on this thread, i’ll have to go back and read them. i’ve skimmed through it and saw some very intelligent comments, but i’m assuming there’re some that’re not so much.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    I sort of agree with you Jukai but a natural distaster like Haiti and Katrina are completely different types of tragedies than 9/11 was and its unfair to compare them. People dying in a natural disaster is as terrible as anything , but on 9/11 people were actually murdered. One was an act of God and the other was just a massacre . To say one is worse than the other is a circular argument at best.

  • Joe

    Ouch.

  • that dude

    As much as I disagree with Shirley’s post, his train of thought is really commonplace. I can’t count the number of times people say they don’t give to the homeless because they know they won’t use the money for any good. Shirley’s post is ignorant, but it is consistent with his logic – he has no idea of the source of Haiti’s situation and yet he passes judgement on them – but it’s the same as the people who say “he’ll probably use the money for drugs.”

  • nycballa

    eboy is straight clownin…married to a “minority” I pity your husband little gal. E-Boy is so perfect a name. Don’t type what you wouldn’t be man enough to do in person. For real, Haitians have proven to be dignifed, resilient, spiritual, beautiful people, Stick to analyzing balls, basket or otherwise.

  • vmcb

    I was pretty surprised when I read Shirley’s piece. I’ve always enjoyed reading his prior work and never expected that he’d have the capacity (or lack thereof), to produce such an ignorant piece. And to sign the letter off with “sincerely, the rest of the world”? This uninformed, no-talent simpleton certainly doesn’t speak for me. No nation should have to face the horrors that Haiti has.

  • Lebron is greater than Kobe

    man that guys a friggin $#$#$ i mean fer real the ppl in haiti suffer through so much crap every day their drinking water suck their living conditions are low, and honeslty shirley obviously thinks they can even afford a condum! most ppl in haiti dont even get taht dollar a day, however we in the U.s. are able to pick not just a dollar but multiple ones simply by lookin on the ground more frequently, i would say more but theyve probly been said int he other 146 comments lol

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Bryan: I meant in terms of the death toll and overall devastation it hit a country economically and socially.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Ok then, fair enough.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    ignorance abounds. haitians are dying and need help. also, millions here in usa are dying and need help. there are starving kids living with their crack smoking moms in the ghetto that most people dont care about. there are millions of homeless veterans that most people dont care about. yes, haiti needs help. but my problem with these things is, they become “fads”. everyone will be saying help haiti until theres a landslide in kampuchea. they need sustained, substantial, effective support; and so do millions right here. but “they” dont talk about homeless, or kids stuck in poverty, and so on.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    Tarzan: I would argue a crisis which killed 200,000+ people and wrecked half of Haiti’s infrastructure isn’t a ‘fad’ but perhaps a ‘crisis’
    I understand the point you’re trying to make, generosity usually only comes along during emergencies, but right now, Haiti is pretty much on the brink of collapse. I mean, this is what is clearly needed right NOW.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    not to mention the millions suffering incredible malnutrition, disease, genocide, etc. in africa. OVERSTAND, much of the poverty in the world, particularly in africa, has been engineered by you know who(dick cheneys, bohemian grove, skull and bones, etc). many of the problems of the world, and america, have been designed and implemented by the controlling elite. ever wonder why the public school system is crap and has never been fixed? they want us as dumb as possible. they want OBEDIENT WORKERS. they want us sitting on our haunches staring at the idiot box as the new episode of american idle is on. emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, none but ourselves can free our minds!

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    I’m sorry if I offended anybody who I never meant to offend in the first place. Obviously I’m not racist–thanks Allenp–but I’m a little offended myself that you would think that, Jukai.
    However, did you take a look at that guy’s link? Blackface mascot for a site that is dedicated to posting content intentionally offensive to black people? You can’t really be THAT angry at me for wanting to mock the guy by giving him a taste of his own medicine.
    Its also amusing to me that BETCATS of all people would judge my intelligence on an internet message board, but whatever, I don’t really care.
    Just wanted to put that out there.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    jukai, no $hit its a crisis and they need massive help now. perhaps, you missed my point.

  • http://www.michaelcho.com M Cho

    Paul Shirley has lost his damn mind. I used to laugh at his occasional articles poking fun at other players, but now he’s become the poster boy for ignorance.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    On a side note: Eboy really said some unbelievable things in this thread:
    “In turn, the dollars that these people are making here without the ability to be taxed because of their non-citizen status, should automacilly be turned over to a fund to help their own country.”
    Are you kidding me? People are in the US as illegal immigrants BECAUSE they are trying to feed their families. Do you think they could survive by having their entire salaries donated for relief in their native lands?
    Get off your high horse here, Eboy. You think illegal immigrants WANT to be in a foreign land working for scraps to barely survive? If you or any other people complaining have NO IDEA what these illegal immigrants go through to feed their families, then please just don’t talk about them.
    And if you aren’t willing to work for the amount that they work for, or put in the amount of work that they do in their backbreaking jobs, then don’t complain about them finding WORK. Simple as that! They don’t owe YOU or anybody else LIKE YOU a freaking thing.
    Why not talk about the amount of labor and services they put in for the citizens of your country?
    You want to blame someone? Blame the bosses who knowingly hire illegal immigrants to exploit them by paying them inadequate wages, all to make a quick buck by skipping out on taxes and basically placing their workers in peonage. I don’t here you saying a thing about that, do I Eboy?

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    I know illegal immigrants here who make upwards of 15 dollars an hour. Which is actually a good wage here. Their kids attend schools funded by tax dollars even though they don’t pay taxes and go to health clinics funded by tax dollars again even though they don’t pay taxes. I don’t want to get into a whole illegal immigrant thing here, but Eboy has a right to find it unfair that someone can work off the books and not be taken to task for it. I’m not downplaying the struggle of those that come here illegally but when I was making 7.50 an hour and the guy in line behind me at publix was cashing personal checks for triple my paycheck I find it hard to feel sorry for his “plight”.

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    And sure the employer should definitely be held responsible because if I applied for that 15 dollar an hour job I’d be turned down because he wouldn’t want to pay me off the books. Its kind of a you scratch my back I scratch yours deal in this stupid town.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ Tariqُُ

    LOL @ Allenp’s 5:49 comment!

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Fair enough, Bryan, but what astounds me is how people find time to complain about illegal immigrant workers, but say nothing about the real criminals who con the country out of MUCH more dollars. White collar criminals and corrupt senators, mayors, governors, etc. con taxpayers out of millions to billions of dollars each year. When that money could have gone to build better schools, fund better healthcare, etc., rich men in business suits are getting richer. I’m not saying all businessmen/politicians are dirty (obviously), but on a when we look at it as a whole, illegal immigrants make peanuts compared to them. Why do we rarely hear about these instances unless its a HUGE STORY about big time player who’s run out of luck?
    If you’re complaining about the use of your tax dollars we can go on and on about other, larger sources of tax skimming–and the biggest culprits won’t be the illegal immigrants. But despite this, its still easiest to just point your fingers at them, isn’t it?

  • http://myspace.com/showbread Bryan

    Its easiest to point the finger because it seems like the easiest problem to solve.

  • http://Www.lkz.ch Darksaber

    A lot of intelligent comments here, loved eeading most of them. Sad that it took Shirley to bring back the cream of the crop of Slam commenters in one post. As a person who grew up in poverty in Africa, went on to be educated in europe and now resides in Asia, i have some perspective on certain aspects of human behavior. Shirley’s piece was ignorant, offensive, non factual and plain stupid. Yet one point in all of that resonated with my experiences in my homeland… where aid money ends up. It is a fact that in poorly governed countries only a small amount of the funds donated trickle down to the common man (if any) and thus it his is right to deny help through the means of donation. BUT as someone so effectively stated earlier, if he wants to help, he could go to Port au Prince and get his hands dirty, like his fellow celeb Alonzo (and others) did. His post backfired on him, costing him his international exposure via espn and has earned him the wrath of a legion of people. I hope it was worth it, Paul. And Teddy is no racist. As Allenp stated, the bear just gets heated when his cultural heritage is insulted (as do all of us) and lashes out.

  • Teddy-the-Bear

    Haha thanks, Saber.

  • http://bulls.com airs

    thank goodness for Allenp

  • MikeC.

    I feel we can all agree that Shirley’s article was incredibly ignorant and all-around offensive, but he did make a couple of solid points that are getting lost or misinterpreted due to his over-the-top idiocy. When he mentioned the woman crying out for someone to be responsible for helping, he was 100% right to say (and I’m paraphrasing here)”it’s nobody’s responsibility to help you, so help yourself”. What we are seeing is the generosity of the human spirit when it comes to helping. Everyone who gave aid in the form of money, supplies or time is showing their generous spirit and caring for fellow humans. If you don’t want to give, or help, then don’t. I had a few spare ducats last week, so I gave through a program that the company I work for organized. Luckily for me, my contribution was doubled by the Canadian government, so I’m doubly awesome by default. I gave a little because I could spare what I gave. One thing that is being completely ignored is that Shirley was fired from his gig at ESPN due to his post, and everyone seems to think that this is a great thing. Being ripped up for spewing ignorant crud is pretty common, and we all pile on. I can say, with a pretty high degree of certainty, that Shirley was fired, not for what he wrote, but because ESPN found it easier to fire him than deal with the ongoing backlash. Rather than deal with the ongoing poopstorm, ESPN can now say “hey guys, that dude does NOT work for us, so leave us out of it.” Shirley had a right to say what he said, and we all have the right to rip him up for it. He made a couple solid points, but he surrounded them in ignorant crapola. He’s not that far removed from the mainstream media. They’re full of sh!t too.

  • MikeC.

    I just re-read my post, and I know I jumped around from topic to topic, but I’ve had a couple brews, so my mind is a little jumpy. My main point was: if you feel moved, then give. If you don’t give a crap, then don’t. Don’t give because you feel you have to. Do it because you want to. And Shirley shouldn’t have been straight out fired for his post, he should have been put on some sort of reality TV show with Sam Dalembert and Wyclef, and he would need to debate with them over the merits of helping Haitians in order to save his arse/job.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ Tariqُُ

    Mike C:
    Here’s the thing though, Shirley made NO solid points. He just spouted some xenophobic, ignorant rhetoric. I do agree with you on one thing though: ESPN did fire him because not firing him would have been a PR nightmare.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    MikeC: Uh… you really should read a book on marketing in corporations or something… I mean… are you really saying you think it’s unfair Shirley was fired? He’s on ESPN to give his opinion. When his opinion is in question, he no longer has the skills to do his job. It’s as if an artist chops off his own hands: should he still be hired to paint?

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    MikeC: What was the point of that woman comment? Are you suggesting we punish Haiti and stop sending funds because one woman was filmed demanding to be helped? If that was not your point, I see no reason to even bring that up.

  • CoolWhip11

    I haven’t chimed in on these boards in a very long time.
    I am not going to take sides, and just want everyone to calm down and quit using this forum to post your political diatribes. I think we can all agree in one thing: that our prayers/thoughts are with the people of Haiti. And if not that, then we all offer at least, a bit of empathy.
    Now please continue discussing basketball.

  • Johnson

    too soon…. too soon…. When you write an article like that its usually months after and is still in bad taste but to write it while there is still massive pain and suffering occurring is just plain. I have my own opinions about the approach of the help and i’m a firm believer in aid with order rather than chaos causing supply drops but when something this tragic happens to one of the poorest nations in the world it really escalates the damage caused and our duty as human beings is to help. I only hope the u.s. doesn’t decide to try and build the Haitians an infrastructure and set up a democratic government in the wake.

  • Johnson

    plain awful* not plain lol

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    teddy, those “white collar” thieves mostly get away with it through bribes, etc. we dont hear about it because they control the media as well. goldman sachs and other financial companies ganked trillions of tax payers dollars, will not return it, and spent it on themselves. what else did you expect?

  • http://www.slamonline.com melvin ely

    CoolWhip: I sincerely hope Ryan Jones hasn’t been offed somewhere and made you editor-in-chief of SLAM. If I want to discuss my political views, and it’s relevant to the discussion at hand, I will do so. Just because it’s a “basketball site”, doesn’t mean we stick to matters pertaining to basketball only, which if I may add is what makes commenting here as mentally fulfilling as anywhere else on the web.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Pardeep

    Man fu*k Paul Shirley. Makes me sick and everything he said was wrong. Why would you even say that ish. These kind of guys never faced hardship or witnessed hardship in their lives thats why they are so ignorant. But Shirley is a dumb mofo that deserved to get kicked of ESPN. He tried to be controversial so people would make a big deal out of something he said but what a FAYG

  • NAS

    He did that to cause a scene, get people to talk about him and get a job at FOX

    As for US relief efforts; its the LEAST the US can do given that they STOLE their gold and screwed the WHOLE COUNTRY over

  • Dre

    Look don’t be idiots and say, “well he makes some good points… he is an idiot. Hitler made some good point. Every idiot out there rambles some valid points here and there. The point is he is very selective in what he says about Haiti as far as history. He leaves out the fact that every other country in the world that was established after crushing some sort of dictatorship or tyrant was met with open arms and adulation. They are given money and assistance by other countries in the world to help start an solid infustructure. Haiti was not given a dime from other countries for many, many years. They have just recently been acknowledged as a country by other countries (including the US) in recent history. This put them very far behind the 8 ball alllowing unscrupulous dictators and people to take advantage of these people. So please miss me with all of that BS about… “he makes some good points”. It means nothing when you leave out the reason that they are in their situation.

  • MikeC.

    @Jukai – Both of your recent posts made excellent counters to my points. My rebuttal: As far as Shirley being fired, ESPN hired Shirley to write opinion pieces and descriptive stories about his basketball odyssey. He writes off-the-wall stuff like Bill Simmons does. It’s not in-depth analysis. I’m not sure what sort of morals and ethics clauses were in his contract with ESPN. If his job description stated that he’s not allowed to write about crazy crap like this, then they can drop his butt. If not, then I find it a little tough to swallow that they hired him to write opinion pieces, then fired him for writing about his opinion. As far as the artist chopping his hands off, if he/she could still do that toe painting thing, I’d at least hire them on a probationary period. Toe painting is freaky-cool.
    As for the point Shirley made about the woman asking who was responsible for helping, I didn’t mean it necessarily as a direct shot at Haiti. I meant it more in macro and micro context. Globally and locally, when something goes down, it’s your responsibility to look out for yourself. If this earthquake had struck Haiti at the same time Katrina hit N.O., or Al-Qaeda flew into NYC, and the U.S. resources were all needed domestically, would anyone feel responsible for helping anyone externally? The world is pretty lucky we only get one major disaster at a time, so we are able to come together and give. Hopefully these disasters(natural and man-made), don’t come at a more frequent pace in the future. So far we’re able to come together and handle it as best we can.
    My bet is that Shirley will go to Haiti, help out a bit, see what’s going on there(which I admit, I have no idea about besides what I see on CBC), write a piece about how great the people there are, and he’ll be back blogging like it never happened.

  • http://shawn-kemps-offspring.blogspot.com/ Tariqُُ

    MikeC:
    “The world is pretty lucky we only get one major disaster at a time, so we are able to come together and give.”
    Yeah, what would we ever do without American benevolence?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Mike C
    I understand your worldview, I just don’t share it. First, as I said earlier, the United States received aid from other countries following Katrina and 9/11. Obviously, we didn’t need as much as Haiti, but we did receive aid.
    Second, I understand why that woman was begging, rather demanding, help. I’ve been on the scene of horrific accidents, seen dead bodies. When people are in trouble, they feel like their fellow humans should help them. It’s their natural reaction. They aren’t thinking about remaning stoic, they are thinking about surviving, and given out connection as human beings they assume that all of us are in this thing together.
    Now, I don’t like moochers, I don’t like people who try to take advantage of other people’s largesse. But, the situation in Haiti doesn’t qualify. These people were responding the same way people on roofs responded during Katrina: “I’m in need, help me.”
    While I understand that some of their own choices led the people in Haiti to be in their present plight, I also see how outside machinations were involved to a much larger and to this point, unacknowledged degree. It seems like Paul Shirley missed that point, as did all the folks congratulating him for his stupidity.
    Finally, ESPN hired Paul Shirley not for his opinion, but because people liked him. He had a marginal position at best with ESPN. After his comments about Haiti, lots of people don’t like him, and his negatives outweigh his positives. So they fired him. Pretty standard procedure for a corporation. Like Tarzan and others, I agree that they made this choice so they wouldn’t have to explain how they could have employed such an insensitive clod in the first place, but they made the right move in the end so I can’t blast them too much.

  • Dan

    my comment never posted… i don’t think

  • Daniel A

    I think it might be irrelevant even to say this because as is any case with a political debate, people will just stick to their guns no matter what. However, I was extremely disillusioned by Paul Shirley’s article.

    one of his comments was this: “What were all those people doing there in the first place? Just as important: If they move back to a place near the ocean that had just been destroyed by a giant wave, shouldn’t our instinct be to say, “Go ahead if you want, but you’re on your own now.”?”

    I have decided to answer this question for Paul. Granted he’s talking about a 2004 Tsunami in another part of the world, but he wouldn’t have used it as an example if he didn’t want to apply it to Haiti. So his question really is “what are all these people doing in Haiti, a place that can have earthquakes and hurricanes?” The answer to this question is quite simple Mr. Shirley – it’s called slavery. They were forced to go there against their will and work. It should be noted that during this colonial period Haiti made France more money than all the 13 original colonies combined brought in for Britain. Now you may say, “But Daniel, slavery ended for them in 1804″ to which you would be correct. Yes that is correct, Haiti was the 2nd independent nation in the Western Hemisphere and the first Black Republic. However, an embargo placed on them by the United States because of the U.S.’s fear that the slaves in their own country would look towards Haiti as a model for freedom incited them to note even acknowledge Haiti as a nation greatly hindered their development. Constant U.S. interventions left them with an unstable political and economical climate largely contributing to high rates of illiteracy. a U.S. backed dictatorship (Duvalier) terrorized and slaughtered its own people. A U.S. backed dictatorship in the Dominican Republic (Trujillo) murdered 38,000 Haitians working in the Dominican Republic. Finally, France imposed a debt on Haiti that Haiti had to actually pay them for their freedom despite winning the Haitian Revolution. This last idea is extremely ridiculous and the amount of money even more disgusting. When the Haitians asked for the money back in the late 90s/early 2000s, the world laughed at them. In the 80s, the U.S. accused them of giving the world AIDS and originally thought that the virus was coming from a type of pig indigenous to the island and a main staple of Haitian food. Naturally the U.S. went in and exterminated all of these pigs, leaving Haitians without a main staple of their diet. They then realized AFTER the extermination that these pigs weren’t carriers of the disease. To make up for it, the U.S. sent Haiti pigs from the U.S. who died rather quickly because of the drastic climate change. It was then found out (see Paul Farmer’s AIDS and Accusation) that the U.S. actually brought AIDS to Haiti when rich guys from the East Coast would hop on down to Haiti for a weekend getaway and buy little boys and have sex with them (talk about colonial impositions of power). Exploitative conditions like these have forced people to work/live in Haiti and have forced them to stay in Haiti where they continue to struggle. That’s why, Paul Shirley, they can’t just get up and go somewhere else. That is also why Haiti struggles. It’s not so easy when the rest of the world doesn’t want to see a Black nation prosper. Thank you to those who read this.

  • renegade

    Being from the West Indies myself, please allow me this opportunity to educate you on the history of Haiti, which would permit all of us you to speak intelligently on the subject unlike Paul Shirley, who is clearly ignorant of Haiti’s history or may I dare say has his own racial or prejudicial tendencies.

    The Hate and the Quake

    Published on: 1/17/2010 by Sir Hilary Beckles

    THE UNIVERSITY OF THE WEST INDIES is in the process of conceiving how best to deliver a major conference on the theme Rethinking And Rebuilding Haiti.

    I am very keen to provide an input into this exercise because for too long there has been a popular perception that somehow the Haitian nation-building project, launched on January 1, 1804, has failed on account of mismanagement, ineptitude, corruption.

    Buried beneath the rubble of imperial propaganda, out of both Western Europe and the United States, is the evidence which shows that Haiti’s independence was defeated by an aggressive North-Atlantic alliance that could not imagine their world inhabited by a free regime of Africans as representatives of the newly emerging democracy.

    The evidence is striking, especially in the context of France.

    The Haitians fought for their freedom and won, as did the Americans fifty years earlier. The Americans declared their independence and crafted an extraordinary constitution that set out a clear message about the value of humanity and the right to freedom, justice, and liberty.

    In the midst of this brilliant discourse, they chose to retain slavery as the basis of the new nation state. The founding fathers therefore could not see beyond race, as the free state was built on a slavery foundation.

    The water was poisoned in the well; the Americans went back to the battlefield a century later to resolve the fact that slavery and freedom could not comfortably co-exist in the same place.

    The French, also, declared freedom, fraternity and equality as the new philosophies of their national transformation and gave the modern world a tremendous progressive boost by so doing.

    They abolished slavery, but Napoleon Bonaparte could not imagine the republic without slavery and targeted the Haitians for a new, more intense regime of slavery. The British agreed, as did the Dutch, Spanish and Portuguese.

    All were linked in communion over the 500 000 Blacks in Haiti, the most populous and prosperous Caribbean colony.

    As the jewel of the Caribbean, they all wanted to get their hands on it. With a massive slave base, the English, French and Dutch salivated over owning it – and the people.

    The people won a ten-year war, the bloodiest in modern history, and declared their independence. Every other country in the Americas was based on slavery.

    Haiti was freedom, and proceeded to place in its 1805 Independence Constitution that any person of African descent who arrived on its shores would be declared free, and a citizen of the republic.

    For the first time since slavery had commenced, Blacks were the subjects of mass freedom and citizenship in a nation.

    The French refused to recognise Haiti’s independence and declared it an illegal pariah state. The Americans, whom the Haitians looked to in solidarity as their mentor in independence, refused to recognise them, and offered solidarity instead to the French. The British, who were negotiating with the French to obtain the ownership title to Haiti, also moved in solidarity, as did every other nation-state the Western world.

    Haiti was isolated at birth – ostracised and denied access to world trade, finance, and institutional development. It was the most vicious example of national strangulation recorded in modern history.

    The Cubans, at least, have had Russia, China, and Vietnam. The Haitians were alone from inception. The crumbling began.

    Then came 1825; the moment of full truth. The republic is celebrating its 21st anniversary. There is national euphoria in the streets of Port-au-Prince.

    The economy is bankrupt; the political leadership isolated. The cabinet took the decision that the state of affairs could not continue.

    The country had to find a way to be inserted back into the world economy. The French government was invited to a summit.

    Officials arrived and told the Haitian government that they were willing to recognise the country as a sovereign nation but it would have to pay compensation and reparation in exchange. The Haitians, with backs to the wall, agreed to pay the French.

    The French government sent a team of accountants and actuaries into Haiti in order to place a value on all lands, all physical assets, the 500 000 citizens were who formerly enslaved, animals, and all other commercial properties and services.

    The sums amounted to 150 million gold francs. Haiti was told to pay this reparation to France in return for national recognition.

    The Haitian government agreed; payments began immediately. Members of the Cabinet were also valued because they had been enslaved people before independence.

    Thus began the systematic destruction of the Republic of Haiti. The French government bled the nation and rendered it a failed state. It was a merciless exploitation that was designed and guaranteed to collapse the Haitian economy and society.

    Haiti was forced to pay this sum until 1922 when the last instalment was made. During the long 19th century, the payment to France amounted to up to 70 per cent of the country’s foreign exchange earnings.

    Jamaica today pays up to 70 per cent in order to service its international and domestic debt. Haiti was crushed by this debt payment. It descended into financial and social chaos.

    The republic did not stand a chance. France was enriched and it took pleasure from the fact that having been defeated by Haitians on the battlefield, it had won on the field of finance. In the years when the coffee crops failed, or the sugar yield was down, the Haitian government borrowed on the French money market at double the going interest rate in order to repay the French government.

    When the Americans invaded the country in the early 20th century, one of the reasons offered was to assist the French in collecting its reparations.

    The collapse of the Haitian nation resides at the feet of France and America, especially. These two nations betrayed, failed, and destroyed the dream that was Haiti; crushed to dust in an effort to destroy the flower of freedom and the seed of justice.

    Haiti did not fail. It was destroyed by two of the most powerful nations on earth, both of which continue to have a primary interest in its current condition.

    The sudden quake has come in the aftermath of summers of hate. In many ways the quake has been less destructive than the hate.

    Human life was snuffed out by the quake, while the hate has been a long and inhumane suffocation – a crime against humanity.

    During the 2001 UN Conference on Race in Durban, South Africa, strong representation was made to the French government to repay the 150 million francs.

    The value of this amount was estimated by financial actuaries as US$21 billion. This sum of capital could rebuild Haiti and place it in a position to re-engage the modern world. It was illegally extracted from the Haitian people and should be repaid.

    It is stolen wealth. In so doing, France could discharge its moral obligation to the Haitian people.

    For a nation that prides itself in the celebration of modern diplomacy, France, in order to exist with the moral authority of this diplomacy in this post-modern world, should do the just and legal thing.

    Such an act at the outset of this century would open the door for a sophisticated interface of past and present, and set the Haitian nation free at last.

    I hope this helps shed some light on Haiti’s unfortunate plight at the hands of the Super powers of the World.

  • renegade

    Being from the West Indies myself, please allow me this opportunity to educate you on the history of Haiti, which would permit all of us you to speak intelligently on the subject of Haiti unlike Paul Shirley, who is clearly ignorant of Haiti’s history or may I dare say has his own racial or prejudicial tendencies.

    The Hate and the Quake

    Published on: 1/17/2010 by Sir Hilary Beckles

    THE UNIVERSITY OF THE WEST INDIES is in the process of conceiving how best to deliver a major conference on the theme Rethinking And Rebuilding Haiti.

    I am very keen to provide an input into this exercise because for too long there has been a popular perception that somehow the Haitian nation-building project, launched on January 1, 1804, has failed on account of mismanagement, ineptitude, corruption.

    Buried beneath the rubble of imperial propaganda, out of both Western Europe and the United States, is the evidence which shows that Haiti’s independence was defeated by an aggressive North-Atlantic alliance that could not imagine their world inhabited by a free regime of Africans as representatives of the newly emerging democracy.

    The evidence is striking, especially in the context of France.

    The Haitians fought for their freedom and won, as did the Americans fifty years earlier. The Americans declared their independence and crafted an extraordinary constitution that set out a clear message about the value of humanity and the right to freedom, justice, and liberty.

    In the midst of this brilliant discourse, they chose to retain slavery as the basis of the new nation state. The founding fathers therefore could not see beyond race, as the free state was built on a slavery foundation.

    The water was poisoned in the well; the Americans went back to the battlefield a century later to resolve the fact that slavery and freedom could not comfortably co-exist in the same place.

    The French, also, declared freedom, fraternity and equality as the new philosophies of their national transformation and gave the modern world a tremendous progressive boost by so doing.

    They abolished slavery, but Napoleon Bonaparte could not imagine the republic without slavery and targeted the Haitians for a new, more intense regime of slavery. The British agreed, as did the Dutch, Spanish and Portuguese.

    All were linked in communion over the 500 000 Blacks in Haiti, the most populous and prosperous Caribbean colony. (Continued below)

  • renegade

    As the jewel of the Caribbean, they all wanted to get their hands on it. With a massive slave base, the English, French and Dutch salivated over owning it – and the people.

    The people won a ten-year war, the bloodiest in modern history, and declared their independence. Every other country in the Americas was based on slavery.

    Haiti was freedom, and proceeded to place in its 1805 Independence Constitution that any person of African descent who arrived on its shores would be declared free, and a citizen of the republic.

    For the first time since slavery had commenced, Blacks were the subjects of mass freedom and citizenship in a nation.

    The French refused to recognise Haiti’s independence and declared it an illegal pariah state. The Americans, whom the Haitians looked to in solidarity as their mentor in independence, refused to recognise them, and offered solidarity instead to the French. The British, who were negotiating with the French to obtain the ownership title to Haiti, also moved in solidarity, as did every other nation-state the Western world.

    Haiti was isolated at birth – ostracised and denied access to world trade, finance, and institutional development. It was the most vicious example of national strangulation recorded in modern history.

    The Cubans, at least, have had Russia, China, and Vietnam. The Haitians were alone from inception. The crumbling began.

    Then came 1825; the moment of full truth. The republic is celebrating its 21st anniversary. There is national euphoria in the streets of Port-au-Prince.

    The economy is bankrupt; the political leadership isolated. The cabinet took the decision that the state of affairs could not continue.

    The country had to find a way to be inserted back into the world economy. The French government was invited to a summit.

    Officials arrived and told the Haitian government that they were willing to recognise the country as a sovereign nation but it would have to pay compensation and reparation in exchange. The Haitians, with backs to the wall, agreed to pay the French.

    The French government sent a team of accountants and actuaries into Haiti in order to place a value on all lands, all physical assets, the 500 000 citizens were who formerly enslaved, animals, and all other commercial properties and services.

    The sums amounted to 150 million gold francs. Haiti was told to pay this reparation to France in return for national recognition. (Continued below)

  • renegade

    The Haitian government agreed; payments began immediately. Members of the Cabinet were also valued because they had been enslaved people before independence.

    Thus began the systematic destruction of the Republic of Haiti. The French government bled the nation and rendered it a failed state. It was a merciless exploitation that was designed and guaranteed to collapse the Haitian economy and society.

    Haiti was forced to pay this sum until 1922 when the last instalment was made. During the long 19th century, the payment to France amounted to up to 70 per cent of the country’s foreign exchange earnings.

    Jamaica today pays up to 70 per cent in order to service its international and domestic debt. Haiti was crushed by this debt payment. It descended into financial and social chaos.

    The republic did not stand a chance. France was enriched and it took pleasure from the fact that having been defeated by Haitians on the battlefield, it had won on the field of finance. In the years when the coffee crops failed, or the sugar yield was down, the Haitian government borrowed on the French money market at double the going interest rate in order to repay the French government.

    When the Americans invaded the country in the early 20th century, one of the reasons offered was to assist the French in collecting its reparations.

    The collapse of the Haitian nation resides at the feet of France and America, especially. These two nations betrayed, failed, and destroyed the dream that was Haiti; crushed to dust in an effort to destroy the flower of freedom and the seed of justice.

    Haiti did not fail. It was destroyed by two of the most powerful nations on earth, both of which continue to have a primary interest in its current condition.

    The sudden quake has come in the aftermath of summers of hate. In many ways the quake has been less destructive than the hate.

    Human life was snuffed out by the quake, while the hate has been a long and inhumane suffocation – a crime against humanity.

    During the 2001 UN Conference on Race in Durban, South Africa, strong representation was made to the French government to repay the 150 million francs.

    The value of this amount was estimated by financial actuaries as US$21 billion. This sum of capital could rebuild Haiti and place it in a position to re-engage the modern world. It was illegally extracted from the Haitian people and should be repaid.

    It is stolen wealth. In so doing, France could discharge its moral obligation to the Haitian people.

    For a nation that prides itself in the celebration of modern diplomacy, France, in order to exist with the moral authority of this diplomacy in this post-modern world, should do the just and legal thing.

    Such an act at the outset of this century would open the door for a sophisticated interface of past and present, and set the Haitian nation free at last.

    I hope this helps shed some light on Haiti’s unfortunate plight at the hands of the so-called Super powers of the World.

  • renegade

    The Haitian government agreed; payments began immediately. Members of the Cabinet were also valued because they had been enslaved people before independence.

    Thus began the systematic destruction of the Republic of Haiti. The French government bled the nation and rendered it a failed state. It was a merciless exploitation that was designed and guaranteed to collapse the Haitian economy and society.

    Haiti was forced to pay this sum until 1922 when the last instalment was made. During the long 19th century, the payment to France amounted to up to 70 per cent of the country’s foreign exchange earnings.

    Jamaica today pays up to 70 per cent in order to service its international and domestic debt. Haiti was crushed by this debt payment. It descended into financial and social chaos.

    The republic did not stand a chance. France was enriched and it took pleasure from the fact that having been defeated by Haitians on the battlefield, it had won on the field of finance. In the years when the coffee crops failed, or the sugar yield was down, the Haitian government borrowed on the French money market at double the going interest rate in order to repay the French government.

    When the Americans invaded the country in the early 20th century, one of the reasons offered was to assist the French in collecting its reparations.

    The collapse of the Haitian nation resides at the feet of France and America, especially. These two nations betrayed, failed, and destroyed the dream that was Haiti; crushed to dust in an effort to destroy the flower of freedom and the seed of justice.

    Haiti did not fail. It was destroyed by two of the most powerful nations on earth, both of which continue to have a primary interest in its current condition.

    The sudden quake has come in the aftermath of summers of hate. In many ways the quake has been less destructive than the hate.

    Human life was snuffed out by the quake, while the hate has been a long and inhumane suffocation – a crime against humanity.

    During the 2001 UN Conference on Race in Durban, South Africa, strong representation was made to the French government to repay the 150 million francs.

    The value of this amount was estimated by financial actuaries as US$21 billion. This sum of capital could rebuild Haiti and place it in a position to re-engage the modern world. It was illegally extracted from the Haitian people and should be repaid.

    It is stolen wealth. In so doing, France could discharge its moral obligation to the Haitian people.

  • renegade

    For a nation that prides itself in the celebration of modern diplomacy, France, in order to exist with the moral authority of this diplomacy in this post-modern world, should do the just and legal thing.

    Such an act at the outset of this century would open the door for a sophisticated interface of past and present, and set the Haitian nation free at last.

    I hope this helps shed some light on Haiti’s unfortunate plight at the hands of the Super powers of the World.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Renegade
    You should have went further and explained how the U.S. purchased the Haitian debt, how they flooded the countries shores with cheap staples and undermined the local economy and how they have abetted various dicators in their attempts to remain in power, while removing leaders who the U.S. did not like.
    Anyway, thanks for adding that to this post.

  • renegade

    Allenp

    Actually I did, but for some reason it did not get posted. Here it is again:

    Continued from my 2nd post
    The Haitian government agreed; payments began immediately. Members of the Cabinet were also valued because they had been enslaved people before independence.

    Thus began the systematic destruction of the Republic of Haiti. The French government bled the nation and rendered it a failed state. It was a merciless exploitation that was designed and guaranteed to collapse the Haitian economy and society.

    Haiti was forced to pay this sum until 1922 when the last instalment was made. During the long 19th century, the payment to France amounted to up to 70 per cent of the country’s foreign exchange earnings.

    Jamaica today pays up to 70 per cent in order to service its international and domestic debt. Haiti was crushed by this debt payment. It descended into financial and social chaos.

    The republic did not stand a chance. France was enriched and it took pleasure from the fact that having been defeated by Haitians on the battlefield, it had won on the field of finance. In the years when the coffee crops failed, or the sugar yield was down, the Haitian government borrowed on the French money market at double the going interest rate in order to repay the French government.

    When the Americans invaded the country in the early 20th century, one of the reasons offered was to assist the French in collecting its reparations.

    The collapse of the Haitian nation resides at the feet of France and America, especially. These two nations betrayed, failed, and destroyed the dream that was Haiti; crushed to dust in an effort to destroy the flower of freedom and the seed of justice.

    Haiti did not fail. It was destroyed by two of the most powerful nations on earth, both of which continue to have a primary interest in its current condition.

    The sudden quake has come in the aftermath of summers of hate. In many ways the quake has been less destructive than the hate.

    Human life was snuffed out by the quake, while the hate has been a long and inhumane suffocation – a crime against humanity.

    During the 2001 UN Conference on Race in Durban, South Africa, strong representation was made to the French government to repay the 150 million francs.

    The value of this amount was estimated by financial actuaries as US$21 billion. This sum of capital could rebuild Haiti and place it in a position to re-engage the modern world. It was illegally extracted from the Haitian people and should be repaid.

  • Dre

    Renegade… a very excellent post and a much better and more extensive elaboration on what I posted.

  • MikeC.

    Tariqُُ Posted: Jan.28 at 11:03 am
    MikeC:
    “The world is pretty lucky we only get one major disaster at a time, so we are able to come together and give.”
    Yeah, what would we ever do without American benevolence?

    I’m Canadian dude. I was just saying that if we get hit by multiple poopstorms at the same time, the people/nations closest to home get the help first. Ex. If someone decides to set off a bomb in Toronto/Montreal/Victoria/Wawa and at the same time an earthquake demolishes another country, my money/time/product donations are going to help the people closest to home first. Since we seem to be lucky enough to only have to deal with one disaster at a time, we’re able to give outside our own neighbourhoods.

  • MikeC.

    We need another Kanye West live TV moment for this: “Paul Shirley does not care about black people”. Maybe we can update it with Seth Rogen standing off to the side looking unbelievably uncomfortable.

  • http://dsjfhklf.com Jukai

    MikeC: I don’t really get how your description of Paul Shirley’s job at ESPN differed from mine. He was hired for his opinion. He threw his credibility into question, and his opinion is no longer valuable. He was fired. This happens all the time.

  • renegade

    Moderator:

    Please delete all my comments with the exception of the first one, which was made at 1:53pm yesterday. When I submitted this original post it was not showing up on the page so I thought it was maybe too long and decided to split up the comment into 3 seprate posts.

    Thanks.

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