Thursday, March 24th, 2011 at 8:50 am  |  217 responses

Post Up: Nugs Upset Spurs

TPU witnesses the excitement live from Denver.

The Post Up was fortunate enough to have our man Ryan Jones live on the scene in Denver, who offered to dish out his notes as the lead recap in today’s TPU. His words sum up the top game below, with Adam’s shorter recaps for the other contests following behind. And a huge thanks to Ryan for reaching out to contribute—always welcome.

by Ryan Jones & Adam Figman

Denver 115, San Antonio 112

I had barely reached my seat at the Pepsi Center on Wednesday night when a Nuggets fan sitting behind me asked for the score of the Knicks-Magic game. I briefly wondered why he cared. Then I remembered.

From what I can tell, Denver fans these days hate the Knicks—by which I mean Carmelo Anthony—as much as they love their Nuggets. Especially these Nuggets. If you’ve watched Denver since the trade, you know they’re a youthful (if not actually that young), fast-paced bunch of gunners, currently averaging a League-best 107.6 points per game—a point and a half more than Mike D’Antoni’s ’bockers. These guys are easy to root for.

The Spurs aren’t so popular in the Mile High City, Manu Ginobili least of all. He was booed enthusiastically every time he touched the ball, and in the early going, a lot of those touches resulted in three-pointers. Thanks to Manu’s hot-shooting first half (and Gary Neal’s eventual team-high 25 points), the Spurs took a 4-3 lead in the opening minutes, built it into double digits, and held it until midway through the fourth quarter.

That’s when the Nuggets, relentless all night, if not quite as efficient as the visitors, finally caught up.

Denver came away 115-112 winners, getting 27 points from Al Harrington and a clutch jumper from Wilson Chandler with about 30 seconds left to seal it. The game felt a bit silly at points—the teams shot a combined 25 of 53 from beyond the arc, including 6 of 8 from Gary Neal—and the Spurs’ various double-digit leads never felt remotely safe. The whole thing was a blast.

It’s hard to imagine the Nuggets keeping this up, of course, but you can’t blame their fans for riding the wave. Playing a San Antonio squad missing the hobbled Tim Duncan (not that that’s an excuse; TD was healthy last week when the Spurs lost by 30 in Miami), Denver saw its bench outscore its starters 63-52. George Karl will know he can’t count on that sort of production when the Playoffs start.

But for now? The Nuggets are 11-4 since Melo left, with wins over the Celtics and Spurs. They lack a star but are making up for it with fan favorites like JR Smith and that slew of forwards—Harrington, Wilson Chandler and Danilo Gallinari—who all seem capable of going for 25 or 30 on a given night. And who takes the last shot in a tight game? The answer seems to be “whoever ends up with the ball.”

The Spurs, meanwhile, still have the League’s best record, and their 8-4 mark in March is solid enough. But their last five losses—to the Bulls, Grizzlies, Lakers, Heat, and now the Nuggets—have all come against playoff teams, and none except Wednesday’s game in Denver was particularly close. I’m not sure what it says for the Spurs’ postseason chances, but the implications aren’t great.

The only thing Wednesday night’s game left me certain of? Nothing you didn’t already know: The Western Conference playoffs should be nuts.

Orlando 111, New York 99

On the other side of the country, the Knicks confirmed the fact that, thus far, Denver has gotten the winning side of that little deal the two teams made a few weeks back. New York continued its now-two-week stammer, falling to the Magic at home after Orlando shut them down with a strong fourth quarter. As would be expected, Dwight Howard (33 points, 11 boards, 3 blocks) beasted, and every other Magic starter scored in double figures as well. Carmelo Anthony played modestly and led the Knicks with 24, but it was Amar’e Stoudemire who didn’t come through at all, scoring only 13 on 6-20 shooting from the field.

New Jersey 98, Cleveland 94

It took an extra session and 23 rebounds from Kris Humphries, but the Nets pulled out the win against the Cavs in Ohio. Ramon Sessions dropped a game-high 21 in the loss.

Philadelphia 105, Atlanta 100

The Hawks don’t seem to realize they’re in the middle of a Playoff push. Philly hosted them then sent ‘em packing last night, defeating the ice cold, Josh Smith-led Hawks (Smoove went for 33 and 12) behind a well-balanced offensive attack. All five Sixer starters and two bench guys scored 10-plus, and the team shot 48.8 percent from the field in the efficient W.

Memphis 90, Boston 87

Despite the rough news that Rudy Gay won’t be playing anymore this season, the Grizzlies have maintained focus, and last night took down the No. 2 team in the East by using said focus. Somehow Memphis won despite nobody on its squad scoring more than 13, but Zach Randolph & Co. did indeed solidify their grasp on the eighth spot out West. Looks like the Celts are hitting that pre-Playoff, rest-up point.

Indiana 111, Charlotte 88

The Pacers did the same as the Grizzlies out West, rolling through the Bobcats and upping their advantage on the team behind them by three games. Danny Granger scored 33, while Roy Hibbert put in 13 and snatched 12.

Miami 100, Detroit 94

The Heat have been off for a few days, but they came back solid, er, solid enough to get a win against a generally lifeless Pistons group. They rallied late to earn that win, led by Dwyane Wade (24 points) and Chris Bosh (23).

Sacramento 97, Milwaukee 90

With the exception of that whole leaving-Sacramento thing, it is an interesting time to be a Kings fan, because we’re starting to see that they’ve got some exciting up-and-coming talent. Marcus Thornton (27 points), specifically, has been playing great, putting up great stat lines night after night, win or lose. (Mostly, um, lose.) Beno Udrih added 25 as the Kings took down the Bucks in Milwaukee.

Oklahoma City 106, Utah 94

As of now, the Thunder have to look scarier to future Western Conference opponents than the Spurs, no? OKC took down Utah last night, receiving a combined 60 points from Russell Westbrook (31) and Kevin Durant (29). With Serge Ibaka (15 and 13) and a still-getting-used-to-the-new-team Kendrick Perkins in tow, I’d wanna avoid the  Thunder as long as possible if I was, say, the Lakers.

Houston 131, Golden State 112

Yes, the Rockets dropped 131 points straight on the Warriors’ collective domepiece. How? Well, Kevin Martin‘s 34 points, Courtney Lee‘s 25 and Luis Scola‘s 20 certainly helped. Houston dominated this high-scoring affair, shooting 51.1 percent from the floor and rolling past the Warriors.

Phoenix 114, Toronto 106

This game will probably get no media love (including here), but come on, this is absurd. After last night’s triple-overtime craziness, the Suns flew home around 3 a.m., then come out (way) less than 24 hours later and faced the Raptors—and won! Wild. Aaron Brooks stepped up off the bench and led Phoenix with 25 points, allowing Suns’ vets like Steve Nash and Vince Carter to spend just 20 or so minutes on the court.

L.A. Clippers 127, Washington 119

For all that he has accomplished, until last night, Blake Griffin still hadn’t notched a triple-double. He finally knocked that off his list of goals yesterday, putting up a 33-17-10 stat line in a double-OT thriller in L.A. It won’t get much attention, but John Wall put up a nice 32 points and 10 dimes in the loss. Hey, you want the limelight, gotta get that W. Props go out to Blake for his first triple-double.

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  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    If John Paxson thought for more than one second about Noah for Howard he should be smacked in the mouth. Hard.
    Yes Noah is a better passer, yes he’s an all around nice guy, but GTFOH.
    Dwight Howard. Just because I don’t htink he’s MVP doesn’t mean I can’t see he’s hands down the best big man in the league and would be absolutely unstoppable with a point guard like Rose throwing him virtual alley-oops off his missed drives to the rim. Can you imagine how much easier Rose’s game would be if big men had to decide whether to leave Boozer or Howard to help on his drives? Can you imagine the open looks he would get on his jumpers? The ability to rest in games and not be forced to jack so many shots?
    Are you people high?
    JTaylor
    I think you misread my comment.
    Rose is special.
    Paul is special.
    That’s why they do what they do. Normally, short people don’t do what they do. It’s abnormal because they are in fact special.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    Dope Voltron reference, E.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    The folks at adidas would definitely salivate over a Rose/Howard pairing.
    Ultimately it’s a moot point. It’ll never happen.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    No, it’s not a “no-brainer.” Not at all.
    Joakim can do so many more things than Dwight Howard can. He’s just way more versatile of a player. I could care less about blocked shots and dunks and both guys cancel each other out on rebounding, IMO.
    I also don’t care about guys co-existing either even though that is valid in some respects, I don’t think that would necessarily apply in this situation.
    The way I see it, Joakim will eventually start knocking down that ugly jumper. Dwight can’t do that. Joakim can guard guys all the way out to the perimeter. Dwight can’t do that. Joakim is an excellent passer. Dwight is not. Joakim can hit FT’s. Dwight can not. Joakim can bring the ball up the floor if the situation calls for it. Dwight can not.
    Those things matter more to me than anything else that Dwight brings to the table. I’m not saying that Joakim is a better player, because he’s not, but his skill set trumps Dwight’s easily in my eyes and that’s more valuable to me.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Joakim must have greased Crawford’s palm with some good herb or a stay at his pops mansion to make that comment.

  • http://slamonline.com AllBall

    Honestly, this is ridiculous.
    Dwight for Noah?
    As Allen said, if John Paxson even thought about saying no, he would be an idiot.
    BC, I respect your opinion a lot, and share a lot of opinions you have, but this is just ridiculous.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    I’m sorry, but I’m just not into that, “But it’s Dwight Howard!” nonsense. I’m not “superstar crazy” like that… Not at all.

  • http://google J-Ro

    The main diffrence might be that Dwight Howard might demand the ball more than Noah. I dont think Noah cares about how many shots he’s taking. Dwight already complains about his touches, imagine him being second in command to Rose? Not gonna work.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    I do have to say BC is indeed not “superstar crazy”.
    Honestly, the only time me and him ever really “went at it”, if you can call it that, on here is last summer when we disagreed on whether or not we needed another superstar on the Bulls to make a push for the title this season.
    My argument was if we didn’t land LeBron, Wade, Bosh, Amare or Boozer we’d be SOL.
    His argument was “F that. Long as we got Rose, Noah and Deng we good. Just gotta have solid pieces around them”.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    B Crawford Tripping, I would trade almost any body in the league for Dwight. And D Rose aint a dumb player Im sure he would get Dwight as many touches as he needs or wants.

  • T-Money

    “Would Howard accept playing lesser minutes to help Asik’s development? Management has made it clear that Asik’s a part of the team’s future for many years to come.” BAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH. Ha.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    Laugh now, feel stupid later, T-Money.
    Though based on some of the outlandish sh*t you say on here at times, you should be feeling stupid now too.

  • bull22

    no zoom, its not OBSSESSION. i just cant stand overrated teams like the KNICKS and HEAT. as long as those two ARROGANT MIAMI HEFFERS AND NY HEFFERS dont win the TITLE, iam a happy camper.
    FEELS so good that my predictions on those BUMS was dead on! hahahahhahahahahhahahahahahahaha

  • http://bulls.com airs

    asik’s that dude, man! and i like that nickname, where’d you hear that from? all ive heard was ‘turkish delight’

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Hold up.
    Dwight Howard can’t hit jumpers?
    All those bank shots he’s been hitting this year would beg to differ.
    But, let’s clear up some other stuff.
    Dwight can score with his back to the basket on pretty much any big man in the league. Noah cannot.
    Dwight has definite most moves, Noah does not.
    Dwight is a an all-word rebounder, Noah is really good, but not on Howard’s level.
    Dwight has proven to be injury proof, NOah has not.
    Passing is clearly Noah, but all that other stuff is moot.
    Why would the Bulls need Dwight to bring the ball up the floor? If he’s doing that, something has failed miserably.
    It ain’t about who is a superstar, it’s about who is the flat out undeniably better player, who CLEARLY makes the game easier for the super star already on the team.
    And Dwight complains about shots because he only gets 13 shots a game! He’ve averaging 23 points on 13.5 shots! On four fewer shots, Noah is averaging 11 fewer points!
    But hey, Bulls fans love their team. Good for them.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    Your name is “bull22” and you go on about heffers.
    That’s an obsession, alright.
    A bovine obsession.

  • Bruno

    let’s see who’s gonna argue what Allenp said

  • http://bulls.com airs

    if somehow, some way that trade comes up, i think the bulls would ultimately end up with howard, and i’d be perfectly happy with it. but i honestly think the bulls can get it done now with what they have

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    airs, the color commentator everybody loves to hate, Stacey King.
    Although I think he got it from a fan’s sign in the stands.
    Against the Kings on Monday after his one-handed dunk, King just exploded and yelled “ASIK AND DESTROY!!!”
    I was rolling.
    People see his 2.9 ppg and 4.0 rpg and think I’m stupid for saying dude will be a solid, solid pro and quality backup center.
    But he will be.

  • http://bulls.com airs

    stacey kings growin on me, i’ll admit he was annoying at first but its nice to see an enthusiastic announcer now. tom dore was boring as hell, but johnny redd norm van lier were always cool dudes

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Dwight Howard DOES NOT have post moves. He has a spin move that he uses to go up for the lob. The rest of the time he’s just putting his shoulder into his man and trying to move him out of the way. That doesn’t count as a post move in my book, but you can call it whatever you’d like.
    And his FG attempts are almost identical to his rebounding numbers which means he’s just grabbing boards and then dunking the ball back in. So the REAL reason why he’s only getting 13 attempts per game is because he has no post game to speak of and his back to the basket game is, meh, at best.
    The Bulls don’t need Joakim to bring the ball up, but don’t act like there aren’t times where the big man hasn’t had to bring the ball up past half-court in certain situations either. Whether you want either of them doing that is irrelevant to the fact that one can and the other can’t.
    You didn’t WANT Shaq bringing the ball up, but he could if absolutely had to.
    So it is about a “superstar” because you’d rather focus on what Dwight Howard can do as opposed to what he can’t. I didn’t say that Noah was better, I just said that his skillset was and I place more value on that than anything else.
    And that bank shot, please. Miss me with that. It’s decent, but if he isn’t in a certain position to shoot it, it’s irrelevant.

  • bull22

    i find it amusing how i have critics, whom when their team loses, they have to pull something out of their rear because they cant really attack my chicago bulls! but i feel your pain, life at the bottom of the river sucks… hahahhaha

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    If you’re referring to me, bull22, I can assure you my team is not “at the bottom of the river”…unless yours is too.
    Because it’s the same team.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    And excuse me on the rebounding point because those aren’t all offensive rebounds he’s grabbing. Still, my larger point is that there is a reason he only gets 13 shots per game. Especially when he’s supposed to be the focal point of the offense.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    I miss Johnny Kerr.
    MJ highlights wouldn’t be the same without his voice.
    “BULLS WIN! BULLS WIN! BULLS WIN!”

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    No, you said:
    Joakim can do so many more things than Dwight Howard can. He’s just way more versatile of a player. I could care less about blocked shots and dunks and both guys cancel each other out on rebounding, IMO.
    What’s funny, considering where you’ve stood in the LeBron vs. Kobe debates, is the value you’re putting on versatility now.
    Apparently, you also haven’t noticed that Dwight’s post game has expanded amazingly this year. Dude hits jump hooks, he makes step throughs, and he still has the same power game. The reason why he’s averaging a career high in points is mainly because he’s improved so much as a scorer on the block.
    As for you saying blocks and dunks don’t matter to you, WTH? Dwight Howard is the most intimidating inside player in the league right now because of how he locks down the paint on both ends. Surrounded by soft, finesse players, he has the Magic as the third best defensive team in the league according to basketball reference. THIRD!
    I ain’t even gonna argue this, if y’all really believe there isn’t a huge, MASSIVE gap between Dwight Howard and Noah skill wise, and that the Bulls would be fools to get the YOUNGER, more talented player, then what can I say?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    BC
    Because his teammates are complete idiots! They shoot an insane number of long jumpers.
    Go to hoop data . com and look at Howard’s shot locations. He’s clearly shooting more jumpers than he’s shot his entire career, yet still have an incredibly efficient shooting year. And that’s despite the issues with how that team plays.

  • T-Money

    Enigmatic. What are the outlandish things I’ve beens saying? (and you’re debating a point that no one is refuting: Asik is a solid back-up center, the relevance of a solid back-up center when talking about Dwight IS laughable though)

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    To be fair, their coach is the idiot who tells them to jack up all those shots.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    This turned into a Joakim vs Dwight debate which wasn’t the original point of the conversation. Would you trade DHow for Jo was the argument and I said that I would not.
    And if Dwight is so refined on the low block as you claim, then why are his shot attempts so low? Its not like he plays with a ball dominant perimeter player that just shoots and ignores him.

  • Michael

    co sign Eboy, i dont think I can take bulls fans seriously anymore. I can believe Noah/Howard is even being argued.

    BC, Blocks and Dunks dont Matter?? are you serious? Noah is nice but Howard is putting up MVP numbers this season and his teammates dont even give him the ball.

    I mean Howard is putting up more points on a higher field goal percentage and getting 3 more rebounds a game and more blocks.

  • Michael

    The point BC is that they arent evenclose enough to consider not making that trade because of team chemistry.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    My bad…. That question was answered.
    In any case, I think SVG knows his players better than anyone. If he coaches his guys to shoot from the perimeter over feeding D12 every time down, he has a good reason for it.

  • Michael

    I know bulls fans are passionate bout they team an all but dam. I would trade either Lebron or Dwade from the heat for Dwight.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    As dominant C’s go, none of them has ever had as low a number of FGA’s in history as Dwight Howard. There’s a reason for that.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    His team shoots the most three pointers of any team in the league!
    That’s the reason. They have surrounded him with four players who shoot lots of jumpers and don’t dump the ball inside. It’s the most common complaint about Orlando, everybody notices it!
    Last year, I could possibly see your argument, this year, hell no. The leap has been that big.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    I understand that but you’re missing my point. WHY do they shoot so many 3′s with the most dominant big man in the game?
    Essentially you’re saying that SVG doesn’t know what the hell he’s doing. He would rather his team continually shoot a lower percentage shot than feed the post.

  • JTaylor21

    “Joakim Noah can do so many more things than Dwight Howard can, his skill set trumps Dwight’s easily in my eyes and that’s more valuable to me” Really?
    Where the hell is Nancy Reagan when you need her; JUST SAY NO!!!!!!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    Bryan just stop it.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Nobody can answer the question tho. Don’t worry guys, if I were superstar crazy, I wouldn’t want to answer it either.

  • http://slamonline.com zoom

    No way Noah is a better fit ANYWHERE than Howard. Howard has more post moves, is a more dominant rebounder, and he’s a slightly better defender. I love the hometown kid, but no one can seriously take him over the game’s one and only dominant center. Gotta love the loyalty of Bull’s fans though. Now that’s what I call ride-or-die.

  • http://slamonline.com zoom

    BC: That has a lot to do with the players he has. JRich, Arenas, etc. Since when do most of those guys NOT hoist up a bunch of shot from deep? I’m not sold on SVG doing the best job possible there either. I consider it bad coaching when Dwight Howard, who’s a PROVEN 1st option, can’t get more than 13 shots. Based on his ppg he’s pretty efficient in that area.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    As far as the BULLS go, I’ll take Joakim and what he brings. That myopic ‘superstar’ ish is for the birds.

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    T-Money – I’ve done enough digging in the archives for a day.
    The point I was trying to make is that the Bulls love what they see in Asik and are committed to playing him more and more in subsequent seasons.
    I’d have to think that would be the case whether Noah was the starter or Howard.
    Granted, if the Bulls did have Howard, I could see Asik being more expendable than he is now however.
    And I take back the calling you stupid part.
    That was unnecessary. My bad.
    @AllenP – I can definitely see the gap in skills and talent between Howard and Noah. My argument is Noah brings more of the intangibles.
    And they’re both 25 years old. Same high school class. Different paths after high school. Noah went to Florida. Howard went to…Florida.
    You get the idea.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    Yes, I’m saying Stan Van Gundy doesn’t know what the hell he’s doing.
    Just like Shaq said Stan Van Gundy doesn’t know what the hell he’s doing.
    Lol.
    And, if Hubie Brown questions why the Magic can’t get the ball to Howard, I’m going to stick with Hubie Brown.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Enigmatic
    Actually Noah is 26 according to basketball reference but that’s quibbling.
    My argument has always been about skills and how he impacts the game.
    The intangibles thing is fine, I know that’s the argument Bulls fans make. I don’t agree, but that’s the argument most of y’all make.
    Bryan Crawford has made a SKILLS based argument. I know you see that. Nobody in their right mind would make a skills based argument that Noah is better than Dwight, for the Bulls or anybody else.
    Maybe he’s better because he’s such a great guy, but not because he’s a more skilled player.
    That’s it.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    So ball handling is not a skill. Shooting is not a skill. Passing is not a skill. Lateral quickness/foot speed is not a skill. None of these things count when it comes to bigs. Just (limited) post moves, dunking, and shot blocking are the only “skills” that a big man is allowed to possess and be acknowledged for. OK, got it…

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    Allen, 26 years and 27 days!
    And I see what you’re saying about BC basing his argument on skills.
    I do think Howard’s skills trump Noah’s.
    But as stupid as it sounds, I’m happy with Noah.
    Zoom – I gotta disagree with you on Howard being a more dominant rebounder.
    Statistically, Howard has always had better numbers.
    But WHEN HEALTHY, Noah is up there.
    He was leading the league in rebounds earlier this year before when he got hurt.
    He was also battling Howard for the rebounding title a lot of last year until injuries derailed him.

  • JTaylor21

    That myopic ‘superstar’ ish is for the birds,
    says a guy that bathes in a tub full of “roses”.
    Well in that case; pelican fly, come on pelican!

  • http://nobulljive.com Enigmatic

    All I have in this world…

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