Dennis Rodman Wants NBA Players to ‘Bow Down’ to Owners

Dennis Rodman was around during the last NBA lockout in 1999, and as far as he’s concerned, the owners accepted defeat at the time, and gave the players “everything” they wanted.

The Worm’s advice to today’s locked out NBA players is to “bow down” to team owners in the latest labor fight. Rodman recognizes that it’s the owners’ fault for foolishly signing certain players to the deals that they do, but the players should agree to play ball a little bit here.

His reasoning? Most NBA players haven’t done anything to earn the money.

Rodman made his comments at a racehorsing event in Canada, and the Toronto Sun has the quotes:

As is his custom, the flamboyant Rodman didn’t leave quietly suggesting to reporters, when asked about the current NBA lockout, that NBA players should just take whatever the owners offer and get back to work. “I just think that … the players should bow down,” Rodman said. “They should bow down. In 1999 we (were locked out) and we missed half the season. The owners bowed down then. They gave the players everything. I think the players should do the same thing for the owners because today most of these teams are losing money. It’s not the players’ fault. It’s the owners’ fault. I think they should give a little bit and move on.”

Rodman insists he’s not taking the owners’ side in all of this but it’s apparent he doesn’t believe today’s NBA player deserves the kind of money he is getting. “I don’t think they work that hard because most of the players don’t give a damn about the game. They want the money. I’m not taking the owners’ side, I just think the players should look at themselves. ‘OK, I’m making $16-million or $17-million a year but what have I accomplished?’ Most of the players haven’t accomplished anything. That’s what you have to look at.”

I’d argue that most reasonable NBA fans realize that the League’s owners are trying to give players a raw deal in this labor fight — regardless of who may or may not “deserve” the money they’re currently getting paid.

Ideally, neither side would have to bow down in order to get a deal done. But there’s nothing ideal about the current labor situation in the NBA.

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Tags: Adam Silver, Billy Hunter, David Stern, Dennis Rodman, Derek Fisher, Lockout

Read the SLAMonline Discussion Rules before posting.

http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

So you think Rodman would’ve been in a suit and tie if he was in a negotiating table with owners?
I think Rodman would be in a suit and tie if he were lying in a casket at the morgue.
Other than that…
http://slamonline.com nbk

The NBA players that are overpaid, are overpaid because the guys locking them out CHOSE to overpay them. ANd really, about the clothes thing again? You aren’t going to treat the players fairly because one guy didn’t wear a suit and tie? This isn’t a f*ckin interview, its a dispute over wages. And the NFL lockout was resolved because revenue is already shared, every owner no matter how bad at (football) business they are, makes a profit. (and Football is extremely more profitable then basketball in the first place) Look at MLB, they have the strongest union of any major american sport, and not because they follow a dress code, but because they are united and willing to miss a season to get what they want. (see the 1994-95 STRIKE) – Its pretty stupid anyone argues the owners side of a lockout, its self explanatory who the problems come from. Its a lockout, in a system that the Owners created. Owners choose lockouts, players choose strikes. Basically the owners are punishing the players because they lack the intelligence or self control to remain competitive and under budget. (see Oklahoma City, San Antonio) SO they want to create even more regulations to protect themselves, from themselves.
http://slamonline.com nbk

Do you even know what is included in the BRI Sylvanus? Do you know about the $500M the owners get (that would be part of the BRI) before any money is divided up? Or how about how much money the owners make off of suites, and arena naming rights? Do you realize that the current 57-43 split actually comes out to about 51-49, without even factoring in all of the extra income (suites, naming rights, etc)?
http://slamonline.com LakeShow

What have I ever flip flopped on? F*ckit, i’ll be the bigger man and take Princess LeiakShow!
LA Huey

nbk, don’t forget to mention that some owners actually own their arenas and the money they make renting it out to trade shows, concerts, etc. aren’t included in the BRI. The same arenas that were only subsidized by tax dollars because the public knew it was for their NBA/NHL team.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

Oh and that too. Good lookin out Huey.
http://nba.com GP23

.. and I guess I’m G-3PO
http://www.rich-imaging.com Dutch Rich

Wow, over a hundred comments with everybody mentioned from the players to the GM’s to the owners to the union and the league. Yet No-one of mentioned the agents. When an agreement seemed to surface last week it was the agents in the background that threatened to disband the union and discard Hunter for being weak. While Hunter is looking out for the little guys the agents are concerned about the big contracts and the money they stand to lose if the owners come out on top. Players don’t asses their own worth, when Sprewell tried that he found himself out of a job. There are a lot of visible representatives but this fight is really between the commissioner and the agents if you ask me. And it’s about long money for them. Most players end up retiring to humble lifestyle and the superstars aren’t too worried about dough since the bulk comes from endorsements, and guess what the agents are getting a piece of that too so it’s no wonder they are ready to hold out considering that they are focused on the big picture. These are the greedy ba$tards you need to direct your animosity towards. The players are really victims in that they just really want to do what defines them which is not making money but playing the game they are best at. Give them a break already. You think they agents care about the ticket ushers and their jobs…please!!!
http://www.rich-imaging.com Dutch Rich

A few typos, sorry. One more thing. There is a parallel with overpriced real estate and it’s a win/lose equation.
The buyer doesn’t benefit but those who engage and control the transactions do. The real estate agents and banks profits from overpricing, everybody else loses. In the NBA even Stern (NBA) doesn’t suffer from overpriced athletes but he has a complaining constituency (owners) to keep happy. Stern welcomes the exorbitant salaries as it justifies him to levy huge sums through fines and whatnot and peddle his asset to corporate sponsors and the duped fans, who are both funding the whole charade.
Tuomas

People b*tching about the players know their faces and who they are. The owners, not so much. It’s really (almost) that simple.

And Sylvanus: Yeah, think. That way you might just be able to form one valid argument. It would be the first.
http://bulls.com airs

im so mad i missed this thread.
but if no one called it, im lando.
dcp

rodman is right on target. he has been around, made a lot of money and his perspective should be LISTENED TO. If the season is cancelled players lose, period. Owners will still be rich, but players, most players will suffer severely financially. The owners can easily replace the players with others who want to work for a fairer deal. The way I see, if the players are smart they will accept what the owners are offering and get back to work before they lose everything. Most importantly, once you lose the fan support, there will be no more fuel for the engine to run.
TP

Almost everything Rodman says has at least a half-truth to it.
And his comments about over-paid players does too.

“I told her I didn’t like her music.”
- Rodman commenting on his once-girlfriend Madonna
Justin

nbk, asking someone if they do their job for the money or for fun is an irrelevant arguement considering most of us don’t play a game for a living. And L.A. Huey, why would money for concerts and trade shows etc. be tied in with BASKETBALL related income?
Justin

That’s like saying endorsements and other business ventures should be included in what the players make in relation to the BRI as well
http://Slamonline.com nbk

You still have to think about it like a job. Aka a means to ensuring the future of your family. You know, not all of these guys are being greedy, they are just doing what any of us would, getting what they can.
Feez22

… I think we should all just realise that there won’t be basketball until christmas and maybe further. Period. by the way… the owners are using the excuse of an “economic downturn” and players like charles barkley are buying into this nonsense. its crazy. The economic downturn will last at least 3-4 more years. This deal is for 10 YEARS. the NBA is already the 2nd most popular sport in america and is gaining popularity outside of North America. The owners pretty much are going the way of NHL owners. the difference? the NBA is much more profitable,popular worldwide than the NHL and is GROWING EXPONENTIALLY. yall see the ratings this year? this yrs ratings shattered records. & its been growing for years now. The players will not bow down guys. Its that simple. The old heads are jealous and thats an understatement. i listened to charles the other day on nba tv with reggie and they were like the nba players of today are getting money THEY created because of the success of their era. That may be true. However the old guys before reggie and chuck could have said the same thing back in 99. Revisionist history. Guys & Girls i don’t know what to tell you. Next thing you know the nba will be trying to approve non guaranteed contracts NFL style. The NBA players obviously need to give up some money. NBA players are the most paid employees on average WORLDWIDE. However, they are sticking at 53% BRI bc the fees will bring that to a 50/50 split just like everyone wants. Except the owners… W/E im done with this. I saw this lockout coming ages ago. we were warned. Just enjoy the NFL season for now. Thats what i’m doing… & if you don’t like football well… Tough Luck. I’ll go back to studying for midterms now. peace.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

And the vast majority don’t get any endorsement deals. Like 95%
Justin

95% may be a little bit high. I mean, maybe they don’t get national endorsements but locally they do. And if the players are going to “get what they can”, aren’t the owners entitled to do the same thing? I understand that the owners may not have opened up their books entirely but let’s not kid ourselves into thinking that they aren’t losing money either. A lot of you people are also thinking that it’s just the player salaries causing the owners money. It’s also a lease on the building (if they don’t own it), costs to operate, etc. If there’s a recession or if costs go up who loses the money? It sure as hell isn’t the players. I mean, the players get a food allowance! They don’t make enough money that they can’t buy their own food when they’re on the road? It’s ridiculous
BostonBaller

Usually when you own a company you make more money than your employees right? I don’t have a problem with that since that is how it works in everything but employees make the company run therefore they should get a fair share. In the real world if you don’t like your pay you can leave the company but no player is stupid enough to leave the NBA and millions. (they can play overseas as a full time career if it was just for the love. lol) The owners created most of this mess by signing players who were not worthy to mega deals and now they want to shut the barn do. A player gets a taste of that mega $$ and it’s like a shark to blood. If you are a CSR you get less $$ than a supervisor who gets less than a Mgr who gets less than a director and so on. The same should hold true in the nba…a player who gets no burn makes less than one who gets a little burn and so forth. The owners can’t want a hard pay scale when they broke the scale and players can’t want a bag full of gold when they don’t work the mine.
http://www.kb24.com The Seed

I have been saying this since this dumb lockout started. The average NBA salary is double or triple what it was years ago. These players can take a 10 to 30% pay cut and still feed their kids, pay child support and waste money on million dollar homes and expensive cars. The players need to lose some money to play and understand they work for the Owners, not the other way around. BOOK IT!!
http://Slamonline.com nbk

The players aren’t employees. They are the product. And no, normally the company does not spend more money on their boss then on their product.
http://adventoutpost.com Sylvanus

Wasn’t able to respond to some of these post at 3am sorry or 5am. But BRI are basketball related income which include ticket sales, tv revenue, etc. Anything that the NBA generates. And NBK, a vast majority is incorrect. A lot of these players have endorsements, not as well known as your LeBron or Kobe but they have endorsements. ANd the players are the employees. They work for the team, thus covered by the NBA which is the parent company. And NBK, take your mind away from the players mind and think like a owner. If players make a bulk of the BRI how would the owners make $? Without $, no team competes and if you heard some teams may not survive the lockout meaning contraction.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

Lol your horribly misinformed. That’s obvious from that comment. Google salary cap FAQ by Larry Coon. Or read some of the lockout articles on here. Allen did one called by the numbers, that will be informative for you. Do some research, and then come back and respond.
seriousblack

@ Sylvanus: Dude, you have little to no clue about what’s going on. First off, the vast majority of these guys don’t have very lucrative endorsement contracts. You have no data to back up that claim. To compare the amount of money players make off of endorsements to the amount owners make in areas that they refuse to include in BRI would be stupid even if all players got endorsement deals. The owners’ income will always dwarf the players’. Almost none of the teams that claim to be losing money would be had they excercised fiscal responsibility. It’s not the players’ fault that they took money that was OFFERED. I think it’s pretty clear that former players are definitely jealous of the amount of money they never had the opportunity to make. It’s completely and utterly hypocritical for them to even open their mouths about these guys because NONE of them would have turned down the money if it was offered back then. Nobody put a gun to the owner’s heads and made them sign guys like Mike Conley, Rudy Gay, Eddie Curry to massive contracts. Furthermore, if the money wasn’t there it wouldn’t have even been offered in the first place. Now the owners want the players to pay for their own lack of responsibility. That’s beyond hypocritical. Not only do they want the new CBA to underpay even the biggest superstars, but the owners refuse to honor contracts already signed during the previous labor deal. That means that even the guys who signed contracts as late as LAST SEASON will be asked to give back money on those same deals. That is indefensible, and it further weakens the owners’ claims of losing money. Even if you view the players as employees, you’d have to have serious resentment toward the players to not aknowledge that paying a guy like Lebron a max of $12 million is paying him well below market value. Ask Dan Gilbert about his team’s post-Lebron revenue. No one is saying that every player is entitled to $20 million a year, but to take away the option of making that money is wrong. The hostility toward the players is wrong. And if you doubted the presence of racially tinged negative attitudes towards the players look no further than The Seed’s moronic 11:34am comment. The sibliminals say a lot. They also resemble a lot of the public’s attitudes towards these guys.
http://adventoutpost.com Sylvanus

Hey Serious Black, no one said the players received lucrative endorsement deals. Read again. A lot of players have endorsement deals but are not your Lebron’s and Kobe’s. And your sources are? Oh. I know a few players in the league who are not big stars, however, have endorsement deals. Who compared endorsement $ to owners revenue? Who said that? Everyone on this thread is proving Rodman’s point. And NBK if you heard the interview David Stern had with Stephen A Smith, and the media outlets YESTERDAY, he made reference to teams not being able to survive the lockout. So in other words, there could be contraction. Last year, LeBron made reference to the league benefiting from it because the playing level would be a tad bit equal if few teams were gone. Oh. Parity is another issue the owners are fighting. Only teams like the Lakers can afford to remain strong in financial tough times and other teams. Serious Black you want to throw #’s out there, players are still employees.

Oh and please visit Adrian W columns on Yahoo to get more info. And NBK: horribly misinformed about what? What’s in BRI “Regular-season gate receipts — the money generated by individual ticket sales and all forms of season-ticket plans -” Source: CBS Sports, Broadcast Rights = TV Revenue. When a network broadcast games, thats revenue generated. Oh. And I’m not an accountant so I’m not gonna act like I know the #’s breakdown, and neither are you guys on the thread. If that was the case you would’ve ended the lockout.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

David Stern is a spinster, who works for the owners. You need to do research for real.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

There are numbers available. You don’t have to be an accountant to do simple math.
http://adventoutpost.com Sylvanus

David Stern has valid points and the owners are still at fault for this
andy

from what im reading a lot of people are missing the point of what is holding up the deal. we are talking BRI, not player contracts. we are talking gate money tv deals n merchandise. a 50-50 split for this type of income is fair. after all if I OWNED a team I think I would deserve that money since I am bankrolling the operation. and the other point of increasing the penalty on the luxury tax seems like a great idea. even though im a lakers fan the concept of ‘buying’ a title annoys me. milwuake should have as much of a chance as new york. they tried a dollar for dollar luxury tax but that was not enough of a detterent (dal lal nyc can afford it).
the owners have agrees to revenue sharing to keep a 30 league team going but the players are digging in for god knows what. Stern has admitted the last two CBAs have been entirely in the favour of the players and now in his last CBA he is trying to put in a system to ensure growth for the next decade. The players need to make the concession on these two issues and then go forward from there.
And if players were smart why dont you be smart with your money while you play n then when you finish look to become a part owner in a team yourself. As far as I know Magic n MJ are the only ones that have done that. Hunter should step aside n let Fish handle this, he actually did understand a 50-50 is fair and Wade needs to sit down. Your ass is not paying income tax in Florida and you are a spokesperson for Hublot whos watches go for some ridiculously crazy price so dont whine about BRI n Salary Cap. For all intents n purposes Stern is your daddy, he is the commish of the best bball league in the world that gives you the opportunity to showcase your talent. It is also no ones fault you have to pay crazy child support.
Please notice I did not mention actual player contracts or guaranteed contracts.. this should be the least of there worries because if you are good at ball you will get paid. Period.
http://adventoutpost.com Sylvanus

Everyone is prognosticator behind the computer trying to use numbers they read as leverage for their arguments. Facts are Facts. Rodman’s right. Stern will eventually win.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

Stern will eventually win, nobody is arguing he won’t. The owners get their money, they already make about 50% when you factor in all of the other income from basketball that doesn’t fit in the BRI, their $500M off the top of the BRI stipend, and huge enormous tax breaks. They aren’t responsible enough or honest enough to show a profit. Some cities just shouldn’t have teams, it has ALWAYS been that way. And the league will NEVER have “competitive balance” – parity? Maybe a little more then normal, but no competitive balance. Never. This lockout is meant to ensure a larger profit for the sum of the owners, everything else is just an argument to get people to buy into what they are trying to sell. Which is a system close to that of the NHL/NFL, where the players rights in what should be a free market are restrained by regulations and rules to keep the Owners from running THEMSELVES, out of the league.
andy

@nbk wont shorter contract lengths help the player rights?
http://Slamonline.com nbk

Not for an athlete. It is better to know your future then too have question marks like will you even be good enough in 4 years to get a contract at all, let alone one that totals what you’d get paid in the last years of a longer deal, unless your a superstar. And even then the risk of injury is the really big concern (For Example, Amare was offered the same contract in Phoenix that he signed in New York, but he had to play atleast 40 games over each of the last 2 seasons of the deal to earn his money – so it was non-guaranteed and he declined and took the deal in New York) Owners want to get rid of guaranteed contracts longer then 4 years all together, And for good reason, they can’t help but give guys like eddy curry 6 year $60M dollar contracts.
http://slamonline.com Michael

Sylvanus you alright? You speaking but I’m not hearing
http://adventoutpost.com Sylvanus

^^^ This guy.
Justin

seriousblack, nobody is taking away the option of paying somebody $20M/year…as long as what everyone else on the team is getting paid all fits under the cap. The owners also took the salary rollback off the table.
http://Slamonline.com nbk

No they can’t pay anyone more then roughly $13M starting with 10% increase eAch year for 4 years as the Max deal. So no, under the new deal nobody gonna get $20M a year
curtis

i could almost agree but dennis aint nuthin but a drunkin addict
curtis

if fact how about all those selfish jerks donate to an active service member they aint playin a kids games for a livin
CubicleWorker

Allenp, the more debates you become involved in the more I realize you have no idea at all what you’re talking about. For one, you still haven’t understood the difference between revenue and profit. Secondly, you keep getting caught up on the fact that there are a couple of relatively small income streams that the players aren’t involved in. Keep in mind owners don’t get any portion of endorsement deals. I know you’re going to have some type of logic to justify the difference but seriously, stop posting at this point. It’s ridiculous and I’m no longer acknowledging anything you write about this lockout. At least not until you understand the difference between revenue and profit.
https://plus.google.com/photos/106403650426394352312/albums/posts davidR

you guys seem pretty caught up on the income/revenue part. the REAL problem is the expenses, which the owners have to account for, which affects the BOTTOM LINE.
then again, they won’t reveal what their expenses are, so it’s impossible to tell how bad they are in the negative (if they even are in the negative).
regardless, stop focusing on the part about how much revenue the owners receive. it’s a moot point, and it’s incomplete and irresponsible.
https://plus.google.com/photos/106403650426394352312/albums/posts davidR

in case you guys don’t know the difference:
revenue = how much money you rake in from your business activities
expenses = how much money your business activities cost you
profit/loss = the money left over AFTER you subtract expenses from your revenue.
the owners are trying to imply that even with all the revenue they’re making, it’s not enough to cover expenses.
i’m just speculating, but after cuban came into the league, i’m sure expenses shot through the roof. dallas wasn’t exactly a favorable franchise to play for when he bought it, but he competed by basically pampering his players with extra perks like trainers, nutritionists, private jets, 5 star hotels, etc. well, it also helped that he was able to get this dude named dirk, but yea..
would it be safe to assume that more owners are beginning to adopt a similar philosophy, which leads to the spending increasing by record amounts?
http://www.slamonline.com UNFROZEN CAVEMAN LAWYER

FUCCIN STAR WARS GEEKS
seriousblack

Um Sylvanus, If you have data to back up your claims that most of them have deals please share. Also, it’s not our fault that you don’t consider real numbers valid “facts” the way you consider Stern’s and jealous old heads opinions as “facts”. Read info other than opinion pieces favoring the owners and then we can talk. Same to you Justin. @ Andy: What the players spend their money on is completely irrelevent to this discussion and the issue overall. We’re talking about fair compensation in a labor dispute and you can’t help but bring up whatever stereotypical personal issue you can think of to discredit their position. Thanks. I love how people keep proving my point about resentment towards these guys.
seriousblack

Oh, and cubicleworker just proved my point about idiots comparaing player endorsements income to owners income in areas not counted as BRI.
Brahsef

Rodman’s slave mentality is on great display
http://slamonline.com The Philosopher

“It’s not a war on class… it’s math.”
(Barry Soetoro)
CubicleWorker

“Some of the things specifically not included in BRI are proceeds from the grant of expansion teams, fines, and revenue sharing (e.g. luxury tax).”

So we can do math if you guys really want to…
http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/fines.html#11-12
That link will tell you all the fines for the year, someone can total those if you want…

Next there was no expansion teams so that revenue stream doesn’t exist.

FInally the luxury taxes, players are already getting paid their salary, so the luxury tax is punitive. It doesn’t even make logical sense for players to split that but lets just humour some of you idiots for a second. The luxury cap level is $70,307,000. Four teams went over the luxury cap level for a total of $67M of luxury tax paid.

Lets put that in comparison to the endorsements earned by the top four players: LBJ, Kobe, D12 and Dirk. A total of $66M of endorsements.
Source:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/specials/fortunate50-2011/index.html

I’m not in anyway saying that players should include endorsements in BRI, but don’t make backwards logic statements. If you claim that owners should revenue share to spread the money equally, then you at least have to consider the possibility of players splitting endorsements. I don’t agree with either but you can’t look at one without considering the equivalent on the other side. Once again, feel free to prove me wrong with mathematical facts. But if we’re talking apples and apples, don’t try to call one of the apples an orange and say I’m an idiot. *rollseyes*
CubicleWorker

It’s the same logic as people saying “owners won’t have a product without the players”, if the players don’t have the NBA they don’t have a medium with such a vast exposure to advertise their skill set and make such lucrative endorsement deals.

Dennis Rodman Wants NBA Players to ‘Bow Down’ to Owners

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