Quantcast
Monday, April 16th, 2012 at 8:30 am  |  146 responses

Post Up: All Of The Lights

Carmelo’s 42 isn’t enough to beat the Heat and the Lakers outlast Dallas without Kobe.

by Abe Schwadron | @abe_squad

On a weekend highlighted by some amazing outdoor hooping-type weather in New York City, here’s hoping you made it inside to watch some of the key battles on Sunday. Starting—where else—in the Big Apple.

Heat 93, Knicks 85

LeBron James dropped 29 points and 10 rebounds, and running mate Dwyane Wade added 28 and 9 as Miami overcame a 42-point effort from Carmelo Anthony—but it was James’ defense, not offense, that won this game for the Heat. Over the last 8 minutes of the game, with Bron Bron pretty much exclusively on ‘Melo, Anthony could muster just 3 points on 1-5 shooting, marginalizing an otherwise monster performance. Then again, Anthony played 43 minutes and was the Knicks’ only source for offense—the only other New York player in double figures was JR Smith (16), while Landry Fields, Iman Shumpert and Baron Davis shot a combined 4-18 from the field. Davis looked especially old and slow on Sunday, finishing with more turnovers (5) than assists (4). Chris Bosh led an improved Heat rebounding resolve, with 14 boards to complement his 16 points. Enjoy this one? You might be in for more, since these teams could hook up for a first-round Playoff matchup.

Lakers 112, Mavericks 108 (OT)

The Lakers won a fourth straight game without the services of Kobe Bryant, this time outlasting the defending champions behind 23 points and 16 rebounds from Andrew Bynum and a pair of big 3-pointers in overtime from Pau Gasol—although he may have goten a controversial helping hand from Matt Barnes on the first one. Gasol finished his day with 20 and 10, Barnes posted 11, 11 and 8 dimes while Ramon Sessions scored 22 points and the Lake Show held a 50-32 advantage on points in the paint. Los Angeles fought back from a fourth quarter deficit and completed the 4-game season series sweep of the Mavs, who ousted the Purple & Gold in the Playoffs last year, lest you forget. Jason Terry (21 points) sent the game into overtime on a 20-footer with 55 seconds to go in regulation, but missed what would have been the game-tying bucket at the rim with 5 seconds left in OT after avoiding Barnes mid-air. Dirk Nowitzki scored a game-high 24 points (plus 14 boards) but needed 28 shots to get there.

Raptors 102, Hawks 86

Even with Josh Smith scoring 12 of his game-high 26 points in the first quarter, and even with a 15-6 run to open the second half, the Hawks could never manage to grab the lead in this one—Atlanta trailed by 14 at halftime and never got closer than 7 points from midway through the third quarter on. Toronto shot 55 percent from the field, led by 23 points from DeMar Derozan (8-15 shooting) and a rag-tag crew of D-Leaguers, 10-day contract guys and injury fill-ins. Among the 6 Raptors in double figures scoring-wise were Alan Anderson (16 points), Ben Uzoh and Justin Dentmon (10 points each). Atlanta starters not named Josh Smith combined for just 12 points—Joe Johnson accounted for 7 of those while shooting 2-12. ATL’s hopes of snagging the 3-seed in the East took a serious hit in a game they probably shouldn’t have lost. Thanks Joe!

Magic 100, Cavaliers 84

With Dwight Howard and Kyrie Irving both on the shelf, it wasn’t exactly the star-powered game it might have been a few months back—and the Magic got more bad news on the injury front, losing Glen Davis to a sprained knee midway through this one—but Orlando led from start to finish to officially clinch a Playoff berth. Cleveland shot just 32 percent from the field and turned the ball over 18 times, while Orlando protected the ball (only 6 turnovers) and had 5 players in double figures. Jameer Nelson and Antawn Jamison each led their squads with 21 points.

Bulls 100, Pistons 94 (OT)

It’s clear that Derrick Rose is still in the midst of shaking the rust off his game, but even on a night when the MVP turned the ball over 7 times and shot 9-22, he was ready when called upon, drilling the game-tying 3-pointer with 6.5 seconds to go in the fourth quarter against Detroit and leading the Bulls to the overtime victory. Rose finished with 24 points and 9 dimes, but it was Joakim Noah who was the driving force for Chicago—he man-handled the Pistons down low, racking up 20 points and 17 rebounds, plus 2 blocked shots. Other than Rose, Noah and Carlos Boozer (15×9), the Bulls can thank Rodney Stuckey for helping produce the W, since Stuck missed two free throws in the final 16 seconds of regulation—if he’d made just one of them, the game likely would never have gone to OT. Then again, Stuckey’s 32 points kept Detroit in the game on a night when the Pistons shot 39 percent from the field.

Kings 104, Trail Blazers 103

First things first, guys—Hasheem Thabeet sighting! The former No. 2 overall pick turned trade throw-in played 13 minutes, grabbed 3 rebounds, blocked a shot and scored 2 points on a surprisingly nice oop jam. Despite the matchup of a pair of Lottery teams, this was a low-key super entertaining game. After utterly dominating for most of the night, DeMarcus Cousins (23 points, 7 rebounds) put the Kings up by 2 on a driving bucket with under a minute to play. Portland’s Wesley Matthews answered back with a corner three with under 10 seconds left to put the Blazers back in front. Then, with the game hanging in the balance, Marcus Thornton caught an inbounds pass, took one dribble and pulled up at the elbow for a game-winning jumpshot, part of his 20-point performance. If not for Thornton’s clutch bucket, we’d be talking about Matthews’ huge game (and what was almost a game-winner)—he had 19 of his 31 points in the third quarter, including 5 threes.

Celtics 94, Bobcats 82

How do we even talk about Charlotte these days? Like, if they don’t get the No. 1 pick this year, where do they go from here? Before I digress into philosophical questions that rank right up there with the mysteries of the universe, let’s talk about their latest destruction, this time at the hands of the Celtics’ B-team. Doc Rivers was so confident against the Bobcats that he told his Big Three to stay home—that’s right: Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett didn’t even make the trip to North Carolina. And why would they? In their absence, Boston still had a relatively easy time disposing of the ‘Cats. Rajon Rondo had 20 points, 16 assists and 6 rebounds and Avery Bradley and Brandon Bass each scored 22 points.

Hornets 88, Grizzlies 75

With brand-new owner Tom Benson in attendance, the Hornets improved to 2-0 under his “new direction” on the strength of 18 points on 9 shots from Eric Gordon and 16 points and 11 rebounds from Carl Landry. New Orleans is now 5-2 on the year when Gordon plays, but just 18-42 overall. For Memphis, it was a forgettable night to say the least—the Grizz shot 36 percent, blew an 11-point lead and saw Marc Gasol (11 points, 7 rebounds, 3 assists) leave in the fourth quarter with a knee injury. If he’s out for any extended period of time, that could be trouble for the Grizzlies (obvious alert). Rudy Gay scored 24 points on 9-17 shooting to pace Memphis, but the road boys were outscored 40 to 22 in the paint.

Nuggets 101, Rockets 86

In what was a crucial game for Playoff positioning, the Nuggets used a big third period and domination down low to jump out to a double-digit lead and finish off the Rockets. Denver outscored Houston 60 to 26 on points in the paint and 37-19 in the third quarter. Arron Afflalo scored 18 of his 20 points in the second half and Ty Lawson matched his 20 as the Nuggs won a season-high 5th straight home game—they currently are the 7-seed in the West, just a half-game back of Dallas for the No. 6 spot. Houston, meanwhile, had a 4-game road winning streak snapped and lost their 3rd straight overall, dropping down to the 8-seed, with Phoenix only 1 game behind. Not only that, but the oft-banged up Marcus Camby left at halftime with a back injury.

Line of the Night: I know the Knicks took the L, but ‘Melo’s 42 was still the best line of the day.

Moments of the Night: Marcus Thornton wins it for the Kings, and DRose drills a 3 to take Detroit to OT.

Dunk of the Night: DMC down the lane for the dunk.

Tonight: 11 games on deck, highlighted by a late-night showdown between the Thunder and Clippers.

  • Add a Comment
  • Share
  • RSS

Tags: , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , ,

  • http://www.slamonline.com Jahmai

    Rondo is playing great ball, Avery keeps improving by the day and the Celtics look as good as they ever have. It would be great if the Heat got the Knicks in the 1st round and Celtics in 2nd round. Because if the Bulls face either the Celtics or Knicks I think they will make the finals and I think they can match up with anyone in the West, the only team that’s a serious problem is the Heat imo. (don’t get me wrong, every playoff series will be tough hard fought and probably pretty ugly especially if the Bulls play the Pacers). Drose has had his clutch moments this season along with his FT woes, let’s hope this gets him going a little. I can live with the TO’s right now.

  • ALD

    knicks need Amare back to compete with Miami… They match up better with Chicago……

  • IAMORANGE4EVER

    That was some “signature win” for the Heat last night. So what if the Knicks are without two key starters. Only a Heat hater would bring that up! lol

  • IAMORANGE4EVER

    FYI, I said last night, because that’s when I watched the game on my DVR.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Dagger

    Bynum and Gasol have proven that the Lakers would be a better team if Kobe took about 5 fewer shots every game and tried to pass it inside instead. But hasn’t that always been the case with Kobe . . . .

  • http://Slamonline.com Datkid

    Eric Gordon should go back to the clippers… Or try too. He’ll be a free agent soon right?

  • AsadSaleh3

    DRose is getting back to himself.
    Hopefully, Kobe will come back and get his shots to around 20 a game. It’s better for him and the team. If they had a bench, they’d be a title contender. OKC and San Antonio are too much for them now.
    Watching the Heat play, there’s no good reason why Wade and LeBron should have to carry so much. Their bench is not as good as advertised. Bosh played well yesterday. If Chicago’s shooters make shots, I see them getting past Miami this time around. Boozer, Deng, Rip, Korver, CJ Watson, John Lucas, hopefully those guys will help Rose out with the scoring. Miami is not the prohibitive favorite anymore. They play like they’ve actually won something already sometimes. OKC, Chicago, San Antonio, these teams are hungrier and play harder than Miami. Even the Clippers act like they’re hungrier than Miami. The Knicks were just missing a second scorer yesterday behind Melo. He ran out of gas towards the end of the game.

  • IAMORANGE4EVER

    @Dagger resting Kobe could prove to be a great move (or blessing in disguise if Kobe’s really need the rest) for the Lakers, due to the fact Bynum and Gasol are getting more touches and more confident just as the playoffs draw near.

  • http://slamonline.com/ Abe Schwadron

    @Datkid Eric Gordon is a restricted Free Agent this summer. Expect a handful of teams to go after him (hopefully my Wiz) and NOLA to face a big ($) decision. If he wants, he can turn down a long term deal and sign a qualifying 1-yr offer and become an unrestricted FA summer of ’13 (what Nick Young did this year).

  • T-Money

    miami can still win it all but that team is very flawed. the talk when they got togehter was that it was supposed to make it easier for all them. but they need lebron to run the offense, give them an inside presence, make plays for others, shut down the hottest guy in the 4th and, oh, drop 30. wtf?! and jon barry just plain don’t like the heat. bron had 15 at the half and he was asking when he was going to wake up and get engaged and how shooting 4 free throws in a half was unacceptable. unh?

  • T-Money

    also, melo was doing unspeakable things to battier. now, if battier can’t make it hard for guys like melo and kd (and he hasn’t, at all)… why even play him?

  • jake

    Am I the only one wondering who is going to guard Andrew Bynum in the playoffs?

  • 23

    Was turiaf injured? I hate the inconsistency of the heats rotation. It’s no wonder they can’t find a rhythm

  • http://slamonline.com badnewsballer

    @jake- the only one I see is Perkins.

  • Heals

    Charlotte or not, RR showin he can go 20-10+ (assists) on a poor shooting night and with “no j” as everyone states. He played half-interested in the 3rd-4th and still controlled the game. AvyB just grabbing the baton and running with it is just fun to watch. Greg Steisma, oh my bad, Greg “get that shht outta here” Steisma. @Jahmai, naw man your(???) Bulls will be fine vs Bos. KG has been killing teams with poor C depth and athleticism (not an issue for Chi), Rose gives RR fits and can make him look “timid” at times and PDouble can’t take advantage of Deng like he does with other SF’s. The only reason my C’s look sooo good vs Mia is that on any given night they can match the output of LBJ and DW3 with their stars, then outplay the Mia supporting cast with theirs and a better coach. Those adavntages disappear with Chi…

  • Da-Meat-Hook

    @ T-Money, yeah, Barry was spitting hate at half-time. It didn’t even make any sense. Magic hates on LBJ as well, but at least he doesn’t make it as blatantly obvious.

  • MUBWAR

    t-money every time i watch a full heat game, lbj played about 4 positions, facilitated the ball better than chalmers, got more boards than Bosh and more points & steals than wade. Is it possible 4 someone to continue this road from the regular season to the playoff without a drop?

  • Mike From Spain

    T-money -> good point about Melo and Battier. Melo’s game was a beauty to watch, even though he rimmed a few 3 pt attempts at the end while trying to play hero ball, he was very efficient most of the game and played defense with intensity. He forced fouls on Battier that Battier does not usually commit. Once he got the ball at the 3 pt line and blew by all the defense and laid it up and in. I usually don’t like Melo’s game but I saw why he has fans…

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    Truth guys, Lebron ain’t even playing that well. That’s not an insult, that’s a sign of how great Lebron is if he can play four positions, facilitate the ball, get ten boards an almost hit thirty, but he’s not playing as well as he should. Too much dribbling, too many contested jump shots, too many times he gets lazy and turns over the ball. He doesn’t play with intensity throughout the entire games (nor does, well, anyone on the Heat), he pulling an Oscar Robertson where he does everything throughout the game instead of stretches when the offense gets stagnant.
    I wonder if it’s fatigue related, the Heat were playing at an insane level in the beginning of the season and just slowed down.
    Also, the Knicks need Jeremy Lin. Bad.

  • http://www.twitter.com/hurstysyd Hursty

    Not happy with the effort Houston showed yesterday. They play Denver again in a home-and-home, but still. Lack of intensity killed them.

  • Mike From Spain

    Stiemsma got 6 blocks… filthy! he’s a free agent this post-season, I guess that the Celtics will want to keep some of their FAs , but will they be able to keep all? I think that Ray Allen will walk this postseason.

  • JoeMaMa

    If Kobe’s the winner he purports to be, then he’ll play nice with the bigs and manage his shots in the playoffs. Gasol and Bynum are two of the best big men in the game; they both have size and skills. Sure, Kobe will take the big shots, and he’ll put the Lakers on his back, but he should realize that the Lakers really can win another title if he lets the big guys dominate!

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Nobody is going to mention that the Lakers should have lost that game? Matt Basket-interference Barnes.

  • http://Slamonline.com Datkid

    Cosign T-money, and Abe I’d love to see a healthy EG on the wizards, but personally I want him to come back to the clippers bc I felt like the Blake+EG(with the help of a good coach) core was going to be really special. Plus then they could move nick young to the 3 (or trade him, he doesnt do well at the 3 although that might change w/ cp there.) and bring Chauncey off the bench.

  • ALD

    The Lakers… where championships happen!

  • MUBWAR

    can this be the year? heat vs Lakers? lebron vs kobe? goosebumps just thinking about it.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF30WneDtQc Datkid

    W/o Jeremy Lin, the knicks match up better with the bulls than with miami…

  • http://www.twitter.com/nflem41 Nicolas Fleming

    If the Mavericks miss the playoffs, they have noone to blame but themselves, but I’ll blame Matt Barnes because he looks like Rhianna.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    Yea we should have lost that game yesterday lol but with Kobe out Bynum and Gasol look like the dominant tandem they should have been. Kobe needs to lower his shots to about 3-5 per game. And to whoever asked who can guard Bynum only Perkins because he’s beefy lol

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Can’t tell if insulting Barnes or Rhianna…

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qNzF0mZUPI MeloMan15

    The Knicks need a pg that is steady and doesn’t turn the ball over… times like these when I really miss chauncey

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=rwDluFZQmtQ nbk

    Cosign Jukai.

  • jpm34

    @T-ray, you only want Kobe to take 5 shots a game? Im all for that cuz it would mean the Laker done in 4.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    I meant 3-5 shots less lol could catch

  • jpm34

    Im with you on that thought T. I still don’t trust Bynum to be the go to guy in tight games.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    I agree whole heartly on that man. When you need a crunch time bucket Kobe should still be the guy.

  • http://www.youtube.com/user/officerbarbrady what

    Clearly whoever created the Tupac hologram at Coachella also created a Joe Johnson hologram who showed up to the Hawks-Raptors game last night.

  • Drig

    LAL rising…….If only the Clips lose a game right now…….I’m pretty sure once Kobe comes back, we’re due a bad game before he goes back to being monster Kob’. This injury has proven to be a blessing in disguise. The bench now has confidence. Sessions has a lot of confidence. World Peace has gone back to Metta. And Pau and Bynum have cemented themselves as a top 2 tandem. IF LA can maintain their 3pt shooting ( WHICH WILL BE THE ONLY REASON THEY’LL PROBABLY SCREW UP ) into the POs, esp. when the bench is in the game, LA vs Heat/Celtics, here we come.

  • http://sportsbybrooks.com/boxscores-never-lie-or-exaggerate-on-twitter-30011 Allenp

    Would Lakers fans rather have the team they have now, or the team they could have had with a Chris Paul or Dwight Howard trade? Just curious.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Bynum is shooting 41% while Kobe has been out….. Not joking. He has put up big points. Averaging 22 points, but… on 22 FGA. That’s awful. I love Bynum and he is obviously the 2nd best Center in the NBA, but it’s clear that he is not equipped today to be “the guy.” He should be able to. He will learn to be that guy, but right now he is not. Pau is still soft, but playing allot better these days. The reason for the wins have been Ron Artest and Matt Barnes stepping up big time in KB’s absence. That’s not to take away from the big guys, because they are controlling the paint. But they are not being dominant like they should be. Ramon Sessions has been great also. He has had some bad games, but he is awesome when he’s rolling.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Rajon Rondo has jumped into my top 5 for MVP. Booting out Mr Dwight Howard.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Top 5 nbk? Bron, Durant, Parker, Kobe, Rondo?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Bron, Durant, Parker, Rondo, Paul, – Kobe/Howard are 6/7 depending on how their teams finish up without them.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Darn, I was close. I think it’ll end up being just Bron and Durant though Tony deserves consideration. Sadly, he’ll probably finish 7th in voting.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    How does your top 5 shake out? – I think Parker finishes in the top 5 in the voting. What him and those Spurs are doing is just to big to ignore – (even though they are considerably better with Ginobili, which may hurt Parker during voting).

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    Carmelo loves Sunday games, huh? people are seriously forgetting there are two sides of the court when saying they would take bynum over dwight. bynum offensive arsenal is more advanced than Howards, but Dwight has improved. There is absolutely no competition when it comes to who makes the bigger impact on defensive end though.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    Allenp I like our team now instead of the super team we could’ve had

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    The reason Kobe isn’t in my top 5 despite how immensely important he is to LA is because he has been extremely inefficient this season. He really hasn’t even been the best SG in the league….(cue on the angry mob)

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Dumb.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    what is?

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    You.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Seriously common man. What advanced stats do you have to show today? What do we got? Brandon Roy? Joe Johson actually been the most “effective SG” Blah blah blah. Your kidding yourself if you think there has been a better SG than KB this year. I don’t even think I need to argue it. The numbers speak for them self.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    CP has to be in everyone’s Top-5 over Kobe because of how quickly he turned around the clipps franchise and the fact that LA is now 4-1 without kobe with two of those wins coming agains the best teams in the WC.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    My top 5 in no order has to be Bron, KD, CP3, TP and Rondo at this point. Kobe would be in mine if he wasn’t hurt and the fact that Rondo is more important to his teams success than Kobe. Can’t believe I just gave a Celtic a compliment and the MVP consideration nod. Ta f*ck?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Look at the numbers then.
    .
    Player A: 22.6PPG, 5.0RPG, 4.7APG, 1.7SPG, 1.3BPG, 2.7TOV, .498% (on 8.7 for 17.5) in 33.8MPG.
    .
    Player B: 28.1PPG, 5.3RPG, 4.6APG, 1.3SPG, 0.3BPG, 3.6TOV, .430% (on 10.0 for 23.2) in 38.4MPG.
    .
    Player B is more valuable to his team than Player A so he plays more minutes. Other than that, Player A has just been better. Despite being more “productive” offensively Player B uses way way more possessions, turns the ball over more, and helps his teammates less, and has nowhere close to the same impact on the defensive end of the court.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    Would Player A be DWizzle?

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF30WneDtQc Datkid

    Dwayne Wade is player A. D.wade has been better than kobe since like 09 tho. the only thing kobe does better than D.wade is shoot 3′s and he scores more overall but he’s considerably more inefficient.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Fair I guess.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    nbk, don’t you know by now that fans today only care about who scores the most points as a way to decide on who’s the better player?

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF30WneDtQc Datkid

    me and T-ray said the same thing at the same time lol

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    I have proven to be pretty dumb.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    JT: hence the KD MVP consideration.

  • Otis

    Good to see Rondo starting to enter the MVP conversation. He’s been spectacular since the All-Star Break. And Parker has to be a contender, too, although sadly there’s no way he’s winning it

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Caboose, nah. KD has a legitimate shot/case for that award. I’m talking about people who label Kobe the best player based off the fact that he’s leading the L in scoring. They don’t care that he’s taking and missing an insane amount of shots yet is only .3ppg ahead of the next guy on the list(KD).

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Whoa, whoa, whoa….. Who said this Taylor? Give me a name of a even semi-legitimate source for your claim that some one thinks KB is the best in the NBA today because he score the most. I’ll wait.

  • http://www.reverbnation.com/tray24 T-Ray

    Lol @Datkid

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Millions of kobe/laker fans and a couple of clowns on ESPN.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Haha I know JT, I just think LeBron has brought SO much more this year than KD has. And Kobe is 5th in the race for me right now.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    And my top 7: Bron, KD, Parker, Paul, Kobe, Rondo, Dwight. 4-7 shift daily for me.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Still waiting…

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Ron Artest is playing as good of defense as anyone these last several games for the Lakers. He has been an absolute tear offensively and defensively. He has been guarding all 5 positions and doing an admiral job. He shut down Delonte West after he had 16 in the first half of the game to keeping him to 4 points while guarding him in the 2nd half. He had 5 steals against Denver on friday. Mostly though it’s not in the numbers, he is just shutting dudes down and playing awesome ball.
    Matty Barnes also. He had 11,11,8 line yesterday. He is hitting 50% of his 3 pointers and averaging 16,9,5 on 70% shooting. What do I take from these numbers? Barnes and Artest >>>> Kobe

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Glad to see i’m not the only one who feels its not very close between Durant and James in the MVP race. Unless I’m misunderstanding you Caboose.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    You’re not. If LeBron is Mt Everest, Durant is Mt Ranier, Tony Parker is Mauna Loa, Paul and Rondo are the Appalachians, and Kobe is Mt Rushmore.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Geezuz, people still don’t understand it’s not the BPLA(Best Player in the League Award) It’s MVP. Big, huge, incredibly large, difference. Was D-Rose better than LeBron James last year? Was D-Rose the best player in the L last year? Top 3? No.
    The MVP award pertains to what a player has done, and how his team has been affected by it. It’s not about stats. It’s not about defense. It’s not about offense. It’s a collective of all things basketball related. Durant has been just as good for the Thunder as LBJ has been for the Heat. What is so difficult to understand about this concept I wonder… I could go off on what Durant and LbJ have done ‘statistically’, but that does not matter. The Thunder are the number 1 seed in the West and have 2 more wins and 1 less loss than the Heat. Durant has been as good as any player in the L this year for his team. Period(.)

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    I like the mountain analogy Caboose. I counter your claims though. If LBJ is Mt. Everest. Durant is Mount McKinley. Arguably taller.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    No Lakeshow, just because in your opinion Durant has done as much for his team as LeBron has for the Heat doesn’t mean that is right, or even makes sense. LeBron is who sets up the tempo for the Heat, he’s their best defensive player (at every position), he’s their best offensive player (at every position except SG), he plays PG while playing the same role Durant plays offensively (primary scorer). Durant is the most important scorer on his team, he has no affect on the teams tempo, he has a minimal comparable to LeBron affect on the Thunder’s defense. In terms of affect on their team, LeBron has an extremely higher impact than anyone else in the league. It’s plainly obvious too. Stats are just proof, not the reason.

  • Mike from Spain

    I think that Koobe fans have to acknowledge some facts. One of these facts is that he’s a volume shooter, prone to ego outbursts that lead to ocassional bad shoot selection (even though he’s got a very high BBIQ), and thus he’s not as efficient as some other SGs in the league. You may still like Kobe’s game or personality for whatever reason, (I like watching Kobe’s games when he’s in a good day) but facts are facts.

  • http://gmail.com z

    it’s incredible how polarizing kobe is on this site…ya’ll are arguing over…whether he should be 5th or 6th on the mvp list??? i think even those who don’t like kob gotta admit that once he’s gone, you’re gonna have a LOT less to talk about. so maybe appreciate him for that?

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Jon Barry, Magic, Stephen A Smith, and JRose (thinks Kobe is the most important player in the L). Just to name a few.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Magic’s opinion when judging player’s is just a hair more important than Shaq’s. He’s the same guy who said Kobe Bryant was clearly a better player than LeBron because “he has 5 championships, LeBron has 0″ – which kind of contradicts what he said in 1993, that Michael Jordan was the GOAT. Or how about when he said he wouldn’t have tried to team up, even though he said he would not enter the draft unless he was getting picked by LA. The dude says whatever serves his Ego, plain and simple.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Oh weird. Hmm, never thought about “most important player in the L.” I guess maybe that’s true. He is very, very, valuable to the NBA and basketball world wide. I guess he might be “the most important player in the L.” Now for a category that matters… back to what we were talking about. Best player in the L… Nope, no one thinks that.
    Man, that’s some silly ‘logic’ right there. Durant would be the best player on his team no matter what position he played also. Slap in him at PG, SG, SF, PF, C. He’ll kill wherever you put him just like Bron would. Durant doesn’t control the tempo. Umm, agreed. Just don’t know what that has to do with anything what-so-ever. Defensively Bron has the edge. Offensively Durant does. If were just going to shout random facts at each other that’s cool. Durant is a better closer. Durant shoots the 3 better. Durant shoots the mid range better. Durant isn’t afraid crunch time. Durant is the better 1 on 1 player. Oh and lastly… Durant is the more efficient scorer. “TSP” … True shooting percentage! Ya baby. Going advance stats up on this biatch.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Nah, I meant “most important player to his team”.
    Also, you think KD would be just as great at the 1/4/5 spot as he is at the 3? I’m at a loss for words.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    How does Durant have the offensive edge? This should be a very rich explanation considering LeBron produces more everywhere while scoring at the same rate. There is no way you can logically explain your belief that Durant has an offensive edge to LeBron over the course of an entire basketball game or season. None.
    .
    And, LeBron actually plays multiple position, it’s not that he “would be the best at those positions” he IS the best at those positions. If you are talking about how “valuable” a player is to his team, it’s only logical to say a player who is the best player at multiple positions on both sides of the court is more valuable to a player who is only his teams most valuable scorer. You don’t understand how being the guy who dictates his teams tempo while also being their leading scorer is more valuable then a guy who is only his teams lead scorer? You really don’t understand? And at that, Durant only shoots (.1) more shots than the second leading scorer on his team. (.1)!!!!!!!!!! – So not only is Durant not the primary playmaker on his team, he is barely the primary offensive option throughout the course of a game. And you are arguing he is more valuable than LeBron? Take off whatever goggles you are wearing that clouds your judgement

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Yes. It’s not like he would change his game to be a PG. Hew would just play how he plays now from the PG position. Why we even discussing this. LBJ is a SF. Durant is a SF. LBJ the better distributor, Durant the better scorer.
    That’s just stupid if they think that JT. Kobe means allot to the Lakers, but no more than CP3 to the Clips, LBJ to the Heat, Durant to the Thunder. Parker to the Spurs and Howard to the Magic. He is arguably most important to his teams success, but I wouldn’t put him above anyone of those guys as for as value to team goes. I haven’t heard them say this though. Is this something new or is this from years back?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Durant is a better scorer than LeBron. Not a better offensive player.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    The difference between LeBron and Durant over the course of a game as scorers is marginal. The difference between LeBron and Durant has playmakers is not.
    .
    What does whether or not they would have to change their game to play multiple positions have to do with the fact that one actually can switch positions and the other can’t? LeBron is more valuable than Durant because he does more for the Heat both offensively and defensively than Durant does for the Thunder. The epitome of “valuable”

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    As usual, cosign nbk. And let’s not even get into defense.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Here’s a purely hypothetical question. Say the Bulls trade Rose for LeBron and Bron plays point guard. Is LeBron now the best PG in the league?

  • MUBWAR

    so Lakeshow Durant has the offensive edge by scoring 0.7 more and less efficiently from the floor. .53 from the field .355 from deep and .77 from the FT. Kevin by the way is 50 38 85. So besides FT the offense is a wash. Defensively durant cannot stop guards 4s and centers.

  • http://sportsbybrooks.com/boxscores-never-lie-or-exaggerate-on-twitter-30011 Allenp

    Why are y’all arguing this with Lakeshow?
    I thought I laid it out a while back.
    People have different expectations for LeBron than any other player and hold him to a different standard both because of his potential and his past decisions.
    Therefore, Durant can be worse than Bron at one major part of basketball, defense, and only better at him at one thing, scoring and still be considered the MVP because his team wins games and he’s not LeBron James.
    That’s all you need to do at this point. Win games, put up numbers and not be LeBron James.
    Period. And it will be that way for the foreseeable future. Stop arguing over it like people are going to change their minds.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    No, as long as Nash/CP/Rondo/DWill are still alive and kicking.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Yes Durant is the better scorer by a decent margin. If Bron went to the post more often he would be in the same sphere. But he doesn’t. Durant can score better from everywhere on the floor except the low block. End of controversy.
    Your turning MVP award into, “who does the most on the court.” That’s not what equates to L MVP. LBJ does more overall on the court. True. Still doesn’t make him the League MVP. Durant has been more prolific this year with his offensive exploits than LBJ has with his all around game exploits. Durant has been the more transcendent player. He has done things he has not done before while leading his team to the best record of the two in consideration for MVP. Bron has done all the things he has done this year in years past. Is there something wrong with that? No. But voting for any NBA award typically goes to the player(coach) who is doing new and improved things. Bron was just as good defensively last year. He has always been a great play maker. He has always been a great rebounder. Durant has improved his game immensely this year and even though he is not the overall better player… he is this years NBA MVP.

  • http://sportsbybrooks.com/boxscores-never-lie-or-exaggerate-on-twitter-30011 Allenp

    But, with all that said, it’s not crazy not have LeBron as MVP at this point.
    He regularly fades when it’s time for stars to shine. He’s all but abandoned the one aspect of his game that was supposed to get the most development this year, and his stats, while still awesome, have come back to Earth somewhat, particularly his three point shooting.
    I still think he deserves it more than Durant, but he makes it hard to argue for him whenever he becomes passive at winning time. That’s not valuable. Just like Kobe’s penchant for taking the worst shots known to mankind makes it hard to make a case for him.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Mubby, No, Durant is more efficient. TSP shows us that. Points have nothing to do with it. Durant is the better more confident scorer. He doesn’t rely on rhythm and flow as much as LBJ does. Better shooter from deep and from the line. He’s just better as far as scoring goes. Where it starts to even out is that Bron is so good at distributing that it makes up for what he lacks offensively.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    I really feel some people just look at the boxscore and don’t really watch the games when deciding MVP award.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Finally I can do a good ole fashion AllenP Co-Sign. It’s been a minute.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    Actually, no need to jump in, Allen just laid my thoughts out on his 5:22 pm. The voice of reason, as usual.

  • http://sportsbybrooks.com/boxscores-never-lie-or-exaggerate-on-twitter-30011 Allenp

    You can’t say Durant can score better than LeBron when he shoots a worse percentage on more shots. That’s asinine.
    He can score in a variety of ways. His scoring is often more aesthetically appealing and he’s a better shooter.
    But you can’t call him a better or more productive scorer. Just like you couldn’t say Iverson or Kobe were better or more productive scorers than Shaq or Duncan.
    Efficiency matters.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Well Allen’s right. To many people LeBron isn’t the MVP because “it’s LeBron, this is what we expect, Durant gets it because he happens to be on a better team and is scoring more points…..barely” – the logic-less argument. Lakeshow, the flag bearer. It’s the most valuable player. Not the player who has improved since last year while also being the best player on his team. I am going to continue arguing with people who make logic-less arguments in a comment section. Crazy as it sounds.
    .
    And for the record, I won’t argue with people who have a varying opinion of who should be the MVP, as long as their reasoning is consistent and makes sense. Saying Durant does more offensively for his team is false. Saying he’s a better scorer by “a decent margin” is false.
    .
    If your reasoning that Durant should be MVP was, Durant scores more points while being a better close I would say then that’s fine. That’s your reasoning. I don’t agree with it, because I care more about the entire game than the last 5 minutes and would rather have a guy who contributes everywhere than just the points column. But I am not going to argue with you and try and change your mind. If you are going to say “Durant is the better offensive player, and does just as much for his team” I am going to argue with you, because that is flat out false

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    How is Durant scoring .9 more PPG more “prolific” than LeBron shooting 20% points better from the field, dishing 3 more APG, getting more steals, less TOs while being the best all-around defender in the L? Not to mention, the Heat’s 2nd best player has missed 12 gms and has being outplayed by OKC’s 2nd best player.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    We should lay out the myriad definitions of MVP and see who wins ONLY between Bron and KD.
    -”Best player on the best team” —-Durant
    -”Best player”—-LeBron
    -”Most negative impact on team if removed”—-LeBron
    -”Best statistics”—-LeBron
    -”Best team leader”—-Durant
    -”Most versatile to team”—-LeBron
    -”Most efficient”—-Wash
    -”Best scorer”—-Durant
    -”Best offensive player”—-Wash
    -”Biggest impact on both ends of the court”—-LeBron

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Most efficient isn’t a wash. Not even close.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    LeBron is having one of the 15 most efficient seasons in NBA history. Durant is barely in the top 100.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Jukai, what do you mean “some people”?

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    nbk: I agree with you, but let’s just appease some members of the opposite party right? That way we have something to argue away later….

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    CHI has been the best team this season, I’m not so sure about KD being a better leader than LeBron, LeBron is the better offensive player because of his ability to control the tempo from the 1 spot and LeBron is having one of the most efficient seasons for a perimeter player in history.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Durant’s TS% is .012% higher than LeBron. It’s not enough to wave that stat around like it proves something significant.

  • MUBWAR

    MVP should go to the best player in the top 2 teams in each conference. So Lebron vs Rose(disqualified for missing 2 many games) vs Parker vs Durant. Lbj reigns supreme there

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    i don’t like appeasing people unless they are children and we are talking about December 25

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    I only listed all those things to prove my point: it’s LeBron. Imagine if Bron and Durant traded places on teams and stat lines. KD would be MVP in a heartbeat.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    That’s true Caboose. But then they would have to change their games to be each other. They aren’t, they are very different players. Durant isn’t a play making passer. Bron isn’t a closer. I prefer the greater scorer, and closer personally. You guys prefer the better defender and play maker.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    I just saw a poll on NBA.com and 69% choose Bynum over Howard going ahead. WTF. I know Howard’s antics this season has worn thin on most people but are NBA fans really that dumb? On second thought….they are.

  • The Mauve Avenger

    You know Bynum was mad when Gasol hit his 3s. LOL!

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Seriously that’s pure stupidity Taylor. Bynum still hasn’t proved himself at all. We know he is a good/great 2nd option when healthy. As I said: As the man, without Kobe around, as the first option, he is shooting 41% FG’s… Nuff said.

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    JT that poll pretty much reflects my feelings towards the general fans and media.

  • HiDef

    Consider this:

    Player A: 26.5 ppg 7.0 rpg 5.2 apg 1.5 bpg 1.5 spg 54%FG and significantly better defender than Player B
    Player B: 26.0 ppg 9.7 rpg 2.0 apg 0.7 bpg 0.7 spg 42%FG and killed it in the clutch

    Player A clearly has better stats, yet Player B was unanimously seen as the best player (and rightfully so). I say this not to say Bron shouldn’t be MVP, but that sometimes the logical decision isn’t always the right one.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Who are those players HD?

  • HiDef

    DWade and Dirk from finals last year

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    Neither are LeBron idk what it’s supposed to prove about him?

  • http://www.facebook.com/joe.l.brewer3 BlackPhantom

    Damnit I wish school wouldn’t keep me from the good conversations on these threads, whenever most of the good threads happen…I’m in school. Oh well, sacrifices are a part of life anyway.

  • HiDef

    It proves that it’s contextual. You have to look at numbers and wins, granted, but you also have to consider myriad other things too; expectations, team mates, coming through when it matters most, raising your own game, intangibles.

    Again, I’m not saying Bron doesn’t deserve the MVP, but I don’t think it is as clear-cut as people make it. I expect Bron to win the MVP, and have no issue if he does, but at the same time think it is justifiable should KD or Parker (the only other two candidates in my opinion) win it.

    So, to refer back to what the scenario I mentioned, Lebron plays the role of Player A – logically he should win MVP. KD/Parker the role of Player B.

  • HiDef

    Having said all of this, as long as there is no concrete definition for MVP, results will always incur debate. And honestly, I like it that way.

  • LA Huey

    Dirk was seen as the best player in that series because his TEAM won. Wade was single best player in that series but his teammates didn’t come through like Dirk’s did and they rarely give Finals MVPs to losing players. And people overvalue offense (or undervalue defense, not sure which it is).

  • LA Huey

    But I do agree that the title of ‘MVP’ is contextual and has different meanings for different people. Ex: Chauncey Billups was the ’04 Finals MVP even though, to me, Ben Wallace was the one that gave them any shot at winning that series.

  • HiDef

    Exactly – it’s subjective and contextual and also why it’s not the Best Player Award. Dirk raised his game and his team’s. Thus, most valuable. KD and TP have raised their games and their team’s. Lebron has certainly raised his play (although it has slipped at the wrong time), but has he really raised his team to a new level?

  • HiDef

    Oh for sure, no argument for me if Ben won that one.

  • HiDef

    *from

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    Saying Durant is on a better team is just so downright disingenuous.
    The problem is the logic that Caboose has on his 5:37 pm post.
    -”Most negative impact on team if removed”—-LeBron
    BULLSH*T.
    If Lebron was moved away from the Heat, the team would have Wade and Bosh, Wade would overly dominate the ball, Bosh wouldn’t be pushed back to a third option, and the team would still perform very, very well. The lineup of Chalmers, Wade, Miller, Bosh and Turiaf would do more than fine.
    If you take Durant away from that team, you have a starting lineup of Westbrook, Harden, Sefo, Ibaka, and Perkins. Excuse me while I hold back my laughter.
    There’s a lot of hypocrisy when talking about the Heat, and I’ve been a Heat fan since Lebron has been there.
    Kobe isn’t in the top-5 because the team has Andrew Bynum and Gasol, and they are under-performing and it must be Kobe’s fault.
    Lebron is the front-runner MVP because Bosh and Wade are under-performing and Lebron deserves no blame from it.
    I wont have a problem if Lebron wins the award. If you have a problem with Durant winning it, you need to step away from basketball reference and watch an actual game.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    You do know that proposed lineup of Wade/Bosh as the Heat’s 1/2 option has been one of their worst 5-man units this season?

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    So what’s your argument, Bosh and Wade can’t coexist?

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    Damnit JTaylor, I just checked, that lineup hasn’t even been played this season. It looks like Wade and Bosh usually play together whenever the flailing Cole is in, as well as Haslem who plays an identical position as Bosh. Great find, JTaylor.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    My fault, I wasn’t talking about the lineup you proposed, I was talking about whenever Wade/Bosh are in the lineup (without LeBron), MIA struggles mightly.

  • LA Huey

    Haha. Did JTaylor just get exposed? Jukai getting his J-Rose on…or bluffing.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Of course, they can co-exist. Wade is probably the best playmaker at the 2 while Bosh excels as a 2nd option.
    Caboose is right though because MIA’s offense/defense seems to go into the tank whenever LeBron is on the bench.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    The best lineup without Wade/Lebron together is the lineup of Chalmers-Jones-James-Bosh-Anthony which has a win percentage of 87.5. The next one is Cole-Wade-Miller-Haslem-Bosh with a win percentage of 76.
    Chalmers-Harris-Battier-Haslem-Bosh has a win percentage of 100!!!!
    I think the lineup would be fine.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    The latter half of the season, yeah, the offense has stalled when Lebron sits. That’s partially because the latter half of the season, Spo been doing more cosmetic surgeon to the lineups than what Michael Jackson got. Of course, Wade should get the partial blame.
    But Lebron hasn’t been performing very well in the latter half of the season too. His scoring hasn’t been impactful— he scores the same in the flow of the game, whether it’s during a run or a drought. He occasionally will have his third quarter run, but it wasn’t like in the beginning of the season where he was tearing it up whenever he needed to.
    I really am beginning to think the Heat are just taking it easy so they don’t tire themselves out, but it’s gotta be discounted against him. A big problem is Lebron performing poorly is still the best player in the league.

  • LA Huey

    People focus way too much on LBJ’s flaws in my opinion. They let it overshadow how amazing the rest of his game is. LeBron is a FORCE on defense. Few guys are very good defenders in an individual and team sense.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    LA Huey: he’s the best player in the game. But the best player doesn’t necessarily win the MVP. He’s underperformed, and it’s not all his fault, the coaching is awful, his lineups have been juggled, and Wade/Lebron still aren’t comfortable around each other (and may never be).
    But we can’t give him the MVP by saying “well if he had a good coach and could get along with Wade, he’d easily have the best record in the L!”
    That being said, Lebron’s statistical dominance AND the fact that he really was playing OUT OF THIS WORLD in the beginning half of the season, combined with the fact that Durant started slow, may certainly mean Lebron gets to hold up the trophy by the end of the year. I’m just saying, it’s not a shocker if he doesn’t.
    Also, I don’t know what to make of this… but on 82games, I can’t FIND a lineup where Westbrook doesn’t play with Durant. I’m not even kidding, it’s not in the top-20 most played lineups. The lineup of Jackson-Cook-Harden-Collison-Mohammed got 134 minutes this season… Westbrook has played maybe 15 minutes without Durant this entire season. Wow.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    The Cole-Wade-Battier-Haslem-Bosh lineup which has been on the floor the second most minutes has -29 in terms of +/- while a similar lineup of Cole-Miller-Battier-James-Haslem is +39. So..yeah

  • LA Huey

    I agree with you. I think LeBron’s ahead of Durant but I wouldn’t shocked or outraged that Durant won. I can see a legit case being made for Durant.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    JTaylor: So Bosh and Wade make the team 50 points worse? You’re digging, dude, let it go. All the best lineups are with Joel Anthony, do you think they should play Joel for 40 minutes a game?
    5-man lineups are immensely dependent on who they are playing and how long they play with these lineups. I feel bad for Miller, Battier and JJ becuase sometimes they play three minutes and get yanked. That f’s up the five man lineup ratings.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Like I said I was just looking at the lineup with the most minutes. You can not use a lineup that has played 88 mins because that is not enough of a sample size to predict just how well so and so will play together. You must have skipped the part when I said that Wade/Bosh would be fine if LeBron went to NY or CHI instead of MIA .

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Yeah LeBron could perform better, we know he has the capacity to. But we aren’t talking about maximizing potential when it comes to MVP. If the challenger chef makes his best dish and the Iron Chef is a little off his game, but it’s still better than the challenger, Iron Chef wins.

  • http://fkjlf.com Jukai

    Caboose: Unfortunately, it’s a team game. If Iron Chef Japan, China and France team up against the head chef of Aux Lyonnais and two guys who work at taco bell, and the latter wins the food competition… Iron Chef Japan better have made the best damn dish in the world to take MVP in that tournament.
    That all being said, if Lebron finishes the season as good as he finished against the Nets, the MVP is his. Damn.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Agreed. I won’t be upset if Durant gets MVP, I just really feel LeBron deserves it this year. And Nets, wow. I’ll bet tomorrow’s Post Up breaks 200 comments.

  • Mike From Spain

    Lebron could be a lock for MVP all the years he plays, he just puts better numbers and defense than all other candidates.

    It looks like past MVPs get a bit of a penalty in the vote because there is some perception that the MVPs have to change.

    Do we have stats of OKC without Durant to value how does his team fare without him?

Advertisement