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Tuesday, July 31st, 2012 at 9:00 am  |  159 responses

Lakers to Run the Princenton Offense Next Season


by Marcel Mutoni@marcel_mutoni

In 2012-’13, the Los Angeles Lakers will be a significantly different-looking team from the one that we saw last season. Not only is Steve Nash the new point guard in Tinseltown, but the Lakers are also implementing a different offensive scheme.

After Kobe Bryant suggested the change over the summer — and with the aid of Eddie Jordan, who is expected to be hired as an assistant coach by the Lakers — the legendary Princeton offense is making its way into head coach Mike Brown’s playbook. Bryant seems to believe the tweak will be a highly beneficial thing for his squad.

Per the NY Daily News and Yahoo! Sports:

Bryant broached the idea of changing the offense with Brown three weeks ago in Las Vegas because “I thought it could be something beneficial to us. To his credit we sat down and talked about it. We all agreed that this could be something that could really help us.”

At 33 years old, Bryant needs edges this season, and the prospect of returning to the discipline of an offensive system in the post-Phil Jackson era holds appeal. “It’s a great offense,” Bryant said. “It’s exactly what we need. It takes us back to being able to play by making reads and reacting to defenses. It takes a great deal of communication, but that’s where we’re at our best: Reading and reacting as opposed to just coming down and calling sets. Calling sets make you vulnerable. There’s so many threats, so many options, it’s very tough to defend. Against the type of defenses that teams play nowadays, they load up on one side and are constantly coming with help from the weak side. The Princeton offense makes it very, very tough to lock in on one particular player. From my experience, those types of principles – ball movement, changing sides on the floor, everybody being involved – those are championship principles. That’s championship DNA.”

Kobe Bryant is particularly excited about how this new offense for the Lakers could help get Pau Gasol’s groove back. Bryant claims that Nash’s playmaking coupled with the Princeton scheme are right in Gasol’s “wheelhouse”.

These are desperate times for the Los Angeles Lakers — with an aging and very expensive core — and that calls for dramatic, sweeping change on all fronts.

It remains to be seen, however, if any of this will result in a return to NBA championship contention.

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  • Jake

    Lakers to be eliminated in the first round? Awesome…ugh.

  • Fat Lever

    HAHAHAHAHA, oh man, now Eddie Jordan has made his way to LA? With news of Mobb Deep’s break-up, I’m going to quote a song from them that applies here. It’s the start of your ending.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    So Brown can not even run a simple offense but he expects all of us to believe he can run the Princenton offense?

  • Basketball_iQ

    Go warriors go celtics

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    Smart move by Brown. He obviously reads the Shock Exchange’s comments on here. The Princeton offense will finally force Horry Jr to pass the ball so Pau Gasol / Andrew Bynum at the same ____ time can get more touches. Expect OKC to make a similar move to take the ball out of Westbrook’s hands.

  • pposse

    and why aren’t the lakers running the triangle offense any more? Could that not have been a suggestion? Did Kobe not just win five rings with the triangle??

  • Heals

    Correct if I’m wrong, but along with ball-movement and more touches for more players on possessions, isn’t the Princeton O notorious for being VERY deliberate/time-conscious. Fewer overall offensive possessions (if my critique is correct) doesn’t seem like the best remedy for a team with guys who want to score, thrive in isolation…

  • http://www.slamonline.com spit hot fiyah

    ^well less possesions might not be a bad thing for a team that is kind of old

  • http://juan.garcia@computershare.com PutUrMomma2Wrk

    Heals… Only KB and Bynum thrive in iso situations. When DH takes center stage that will not be the case. Only Kobe will be affected but at this stage of his career that’s exactly what he needs as he can no longer carry a club on his shoulders. He needs help. A lot of help.

  • T-Money

    yeah… i’ll believe it when i’ll see it. nash running around probing the defense and kobe geting his iso’s from the elbow don’t sound too princeton-y to me.

  • T-Money

    Kobe Bryant can’t think of a better way to enjoy Christmas than to be spending it with Carmelo Anthony and the Knicks.
    “We actually might win on Christmas Day for the first time ever,” Bryant says.

    I’ve always believed that’s why Kobe gravitated toward Melo and not Bron or D-Wade or even KD now: he doesn’t see him as a threat. Melo is to Kobe what Chuck was to MJ. A dear friend that you can mess around with anytime you want and who will take it. And say thank you.

  • http://www.fullc0urtpress.com KHOLIDAY

    Anyone else notice Kobe said teams can’t lock in on one player defensively?? Sounds like Kobe is suggesting this offense so he can get more clean looks. Princeton offense my @$$! Should just call it the Kobe System.

  • bdogg

    as long as the offense is uptemp’d i do not care what offense is run…not saying we become phoenix circa 2006 but uptempo the offense!!!

  • Phil

    Kobe is an analytic basketball philosopher as well as one of the greatest to play the game. Gotta love this dude.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwhaW2nVVcg RunNGun

    Princeton offense? Look up Rick Adelman.

  • Sérgio

    Uptempo offense? With Kobe, Paul, Bynum and Metta? Please.

  • LA Huey

    Kobe suggested a system that relies heavily on passing. Funny guy.

  • russian guy

    I can see Nash and Gasol without a doubt in the Princeton offense,Kobe when he gets his mind right,but Bynum?

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    To get Horry Jr to buy in subliminally, the new uniforms for Metta, Nash and Pau Gasol / Andrew Bynum at the same ____ time have a picture of a basket painted on the chest area.

  • http://www.slamonline.com AlbertBarr

    OK, ^that is funny shock. LOL

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xC03hmS1Brk Max

    shh

  • SeanMagicJuan

    @Shock Exchange-At the risk of hating your reply,why do you refer to Kobe as “Horry Jr”?

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    The shock exchange is now the cawk exchange. Let me munch on your cawks

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    the idea is good. the actual set, if Brown plan’s on implementing a traditional Princeton offense, is going to be a disaster. idk anyone thinks an offense that features 4 players on the perimeter is a good idea with that Lakers team? Or do you just not know what the Princeton offense actually is?

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    How is the Princeton going to work with a C like Bynum that plays mostly within 5-8 feet of the basket and lacks a mid-range game and a ISO-heavy G like Kobe?
    It’s wishful thinking with a coach like Brown at the helm.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Also…Nash likes the ball in his hands a lot.
    I just don’t see this working because every team comes into the new season talking about how they are going to implement this and implement that and they revert back to their old ways a couple of weeks into the season.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    .An offense that puts Pau Gasol on the perimeter.
    .An offense that turns Andrew Bynum into the primary decision maker initiating the offense.
    .An offense that pulls Kobe Bryant away from the ball until in the least, the second pass (3rd player) to touch the ball.
    .
    .Why this team is not going to run a FLEX is BEYOND me. That offense fits their lineup better then their jerseys.

  • LA Huey

    I remember when the Cavs got 1st go Mo Williams and they said they were goig to run more. They were uptempo in exhibition and they were back to the a plodding half court offense after that. I don’t trust Mike Brown to stick with it.

  • Bt

    ^to be fair to Mike he was probably just preparing for the playoffs when he knew Mo ‘regular season’ Williams wouldn’t show up

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    I like the basis off the idea. It can’t be the traditional Princeton offense though. Bynum needs to work this summer on using his space so he can make good passes out of double teams. If he is going to get first look (I believe) on offense he is going to receive allot of doubles. He needs to be able to pass out. He will average 4 TO’s a game otherwise. They might want to tweak the hell outta it, have Pau as your first option on the elbow or post, Bynum mid base line screening for Pau. Sh*t I dunno. That’s not Princeton at that point. I like the concept, but it won’t work in its traditional sense.
    Here’s to Eddie Jordan being one of the worse head coaches of all time, but hopefully being a championship assistant.

  • Drig

    @nbk…….I was confused with the post……Do you want Pau Gasol to be on the perimeter or was that well-concealed sarcasm aimed at MikeB’s lack of any offensive direction?? Because Pau is best at the high-post with the ball in his hands and making the decisions. Anyways, the Princeton O requires a lot of cutters and movement off ball. Since no player on the Lakers cuts hard ( Kobe only does it at times. Ebanks perhaps? ), I’m thinking it’s gonna end up being a slow shifting triangle. What I’m most worried about is how this O is gonna keep the ball away from Nash and relegate him to being a spot up shooter. IMO, MikeB needs to implement a semi-triangle with heavy screens and PnR play…..But that’s wishful thinking. This is gonna render Nash useless unless the plays are designed in such a way that Nash ends up with the ball and needs to make the decision to atleast 2 viable scoring options on that possession ( something which Metta has an uncanny ability of not noticing )……LAL just took All-in to a whole new level….

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    @SeanMagicJuan “Horry Jr” connotes the uncanny ability to align oneself with teams with “exceptionally more talent than the rest of the league” in order to win a ‘chip.

  • Drig

    @Shock…….and tell me how the 3-peat Lakers were exceptionally more talented than every other team in the L? Or how the ’09, ’10 Lakers were exceptionally more talented than every other team?? Oh wait, they weren’t…..The Blazers, Kings and Spurs were there…….And then the Celts struck and the Spurs were still there……

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Drig – I was explaining why the Princeton doesn’t fit with the Lakers. Not a single one of those 3 bullets is a good thing. If you have Pau where he is most effective (the high post, as you said) AND are running a Princeton Offense, that means you are pulling Andrew Bynum out beyond the 3pt line. The offense doesn’t work with that roster at all, one way or another, Mike Brown / Eddie Jordan will be pulling a 7 footer out to the perimeter (for the second season in a row).
    .
    In order to do what Lakeshow suggests (having Bynum and Gasol play off of one another on the block), and playing to the Lakers strengths (old & new / Kobe & Nash) the team needs to run a flex. It will allow Kobe to catch the ball in good scoring position (short post passes, quick sideline isolation’s, pinch curls), and it would put the ball in Nash’s hands to make decisions (think Utah – who has always ran a FLEX).

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    @Drig the Kings could not overcome Horry, Horry Jr, Shaq and Tim Donahy at the same ____ time. But the Kings came closest to matching the Lakers’ talent. You can read previous threads on here if you want to understand how I came to the “exceptionally more talented” point.

  • http://gmail.com z

    shock exchange cracks me up. too good…kobe’s got some hilarious haters (then again he’s got some pretty stupid fans too, but at least no one takes them seriously–i’m talking about the seed here)

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Your right nbk.
    The only way it (Princeton) works in its traditional sense is if Bynum or Pau are on the bench and Jamison is in at the 4 spot. He is the only one that can truly ‘stretch’ the floor at the 4 spot.
    So the Flex should be more the aim with Bynum and Pau on the floor. Maybe some of the nuances of the Princeton offense implemented with others. They are gunna have to Hybrid this biatch. No way it works with the team currently constructed.
    Brown will have no issue learning(if he doesn’t already know the in’s and out’s) the Princeton offense. Dude is smart as hell. But he’s one of those smart cats who doesn’t think outside the box as much as is needed with a team like the Lakers.
    Brown, should pop some shrooms while coming up with the offensive schemes.

  • pposse

    Drig this own website had Kobe, Pau, Bynum and Lamar Odom ranked in the top 50. What other team besides the Celtics had that much star power in 09 and 10? You could even make a serious case for Metta World Peace getting snubbed out of Slams top 50 list. And I am pretty sure Kobe, Pau, and Bynum were ranked in the top 20. If thats not playing with exceptional talent in relation to what the rest of the league plays with then i dont know what is.

  • http://nba.com GP23

    Princeton offense eh??
    The thing is, they aren’t going to be running it 100% of the time. They didn’t for the triangle and I doubt they’ll do it here. It’s mainly a very safe offense to defer to when Kobe and Nash aren’t running the show. A motion offense also keeps all the players engaged and makes the defenses work harder.
    In a Princeton offense however, you don’t need an elite Point Guard, which is ironic, because they just signed Nash.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    exactly Lakeshow, Brown’s intelligence as a coach is not the issue. It’s his imagination, and his associative skills in terms of putting his team in position to use their strengths. Or maybe he is just not very observant? idk exactly. I know he’s a very very smart guy, i just don’t think he understands how to effectively use his intelligence. And IDK why the F Word you would get Eddie Jordan to design the offense with that team. He coaches in a way that caters to teams whose strengths lie on the perimeter, and even with Nash & Kobe, the Lakers strength is still in their size.

  • http://nba.com GP23

    Shock, my man. Don’t ever call Kobe “Horry Jr.” Ever. That’s like calling Luke Walton “Bird Jr.” It’s mind-boggling.

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    GP23 There are worse things to be called than a “winner.”

  • LA Huey

    I’d pay to watch Mike Brown trip out on ‘shrooms.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Yep, couldn’t agree more. I really don’t like Eddie Jordan. I hope he is better suited next to Brown cause man that guy is an awful head coach IMO.
    I’m gunna slip a LSD tab into Brown’s tea some morning see if he can awaken that ever needed third eye lmao.
    Shock, your weird dude(I really don’t care, keep calling KB, Horry JR. It is truly funny). We went over this…
    Horry Jr’s:
    Wilt
    Russel
    West
    Magic
    Kareem
    Jordan
    Thomas
    Shaq
    Garnett
    Pierce
    Bird
    The list goes on of “Horry Jr’s”…

  • http://www.slamononline.com Redd

    Obviously theyll need to adjust it unless they’ve decided that Bynum can get his wish and become a point-center who will align himself against Rajon Rondo during Allstar Weekend. All in all, it’s quite obvious that the Princeton Offense(which I knew a little about but now understand via nbk) won’t be used in its fullness and they’ll be liberal in its use.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Huey LMAO…
    Didn’t actually think of the consequences.
    He would blow his own mind.

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    Is this the guy who challenged the Shock Exchange to a rap battle and lost? Say it LakeShow “You got the juice now Shock Exchange … you got the juice now.”

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    Is this the guy who challenged the Shock Exchange to a rap battle and lost? Say it LakeShow “You got the juice now Shock Exchange … you got the juice now.”

  • Fat Lever

    Stock Exchange is killing the threads and some of your arguments AT THE SAME D@MN TIME.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    why do you always refer to yourself in the third person? honestly, i know you are a whack job but that is just too weird. you have to be conscious of doing it.

  • bike

    It sounds like what Kobe is really wanting is Pau more engaged than he was last season. They never could get Pau and Bynum to gel so it’s time to try something else.
    Nash coming into the mix merits a change up. If they can somehow maximize Pau and Bynum’s strengths they will be a force.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    bike, do you know anything about the Princeton offense? Because the only way this makes Pau more involved is if Bynum is on the floor less.

  • Fat Lever

    *Shock

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Redd… your an idiot… I mean… Sorry man, but your just not smart.
    “All in all, it’s quite obvious that the Princeton Offense(which I knew a little about but now understand via nbk) won’t be used in its fullness and they’ll be liberal in its use.”
    Think about the last part of that sentence. Common man. Oxy MORON.
    Anyway, keep doing you homie.
    .
    .
    .
    Shock, you know i’d school you.
    I don’t need to fool you.
    OG is in the blood.
    It comes out in a flood.
    Can’t stop the flow.
    Can’t turn off the tap.
    So instead I just RAP, Rap, rap…

  • LA Huey

    Then again, Mike Brown on ‘shrooms might just be a sweatier version of the guy that stands on NBA sidelines today with his mouth agape…

  • LA Huey

    I’d like to amend that last line for you, LS.
    “So instead I just FAP, Fap, fap…” Then you can proceed to drop the mic and saunter off the stage.

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    Let’s give it up for Lake Show everybody … 1/2 of the “Hip Hop Dalmatians.” Out of curiosity, which one are you? Rin or Tin? LOL. Seriously, put the ether away Lake Show, I don’t want it son.

  • http://www.slamononline.com Redd

    Meaning that they obviously can’t use it in its entirety obviously because, if what nbk said is true, it won’t be affective at all if used conservatively. Thus, it’ll only work if they reform the system, didn’t realize that meant I’m an idiot. But it is coming from a guy that can’t use “you’re” the right way, lol idiot.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    i had sex with eddie jordan 7 years ago

  • http://www.newyorkshockexchange.com Shock Exchange

    On that note, the Shock Exchange is outta son! I a book to finish. I gonna go wash my hands with some sanitary soap first though.

  • bike

    nbk yeah, I understand the Princeton offense and you are right – Bynum would have to sit for Pau to be more engaged. That is, in the traditional Princeton mode. I just think Kobe is suggesting that they need to do something/anything different now that Nash is on board. Doesn’t have to be a pure Princeton set.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    if you guys want to know about the Princeton Offense I’m sure there are websites that discuss and cover the basic’s of it. Probably even have images and stuff to illustrate my point. — Obviously, if Eddie Jordan is really a master of the offense (which i don’t believe he is, but i’m not sure, i don’t know him) then he can make some adjustments that either pull the 4 into a usable position, or he can mask the offense to look like a traditional FLEX.
    .
    Before I confuse everyone, The Princeton Offense is very similar to a FLEX, some coaches even refer to it as the “Princeton Flex Offense” – I am only referring to the general, traditional, principles of the offenses. Flex Offenses generally include 2 post players, with perimeter motion that involves different forms of cuts and rotations that always assert the same basic floor positioning (3 up, 2 down) – While the Princeton is similar, it generally has a single post player (4 up, 1 down). There are other basic differences, but those are the most lamen and easiest to understand when trying to differentiate the two.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Ya’ll don’t want me to come hard..
    Eww, nevermind. Now I get it.
    Okay, Fappy fap fap fap..
    nbk, sleeps around with allot of guys? Ya’ll notice. At least they are money makers. Boy gets that dough.
    .
    .
    .
    Alright nuff of all that.
    Jamison actually might be a quiet signing that helps the Lakers almost as much as Nash. (Okay maybe not almost, but allot none the less)
    Jamison is a career 35% shooter from deep. The Lakers have been missing 3 point shooters badly over the last couple years. Jamison is going to come in off the bench and add a aspect that wasn’t there last year. Much like Odom did. While Odom can do more overall, they are comparable rebounder’s and Jamison is the better shooter. He is going to be able to spell either Bynum or Pau with Pau’s versatility between the 4 and 5 it is really going to add a nice dimension to the bench.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Lakers will continue to suck & I’ll laugh, like so: Ha Hah.

  • T-Money

    in any case, like in cleveland, mike brown always ends up with coaching staff matching the number of players on his team and playbooks as thick as the nfl ones. for what? no matter the offensive philosophy, just know that at the end of games he will have the ball in the hand of his best perimeter player 30 ft from the hoop with the other 4 guys standing like statues. in the moment of truth, he’d rather just dump it all on his star and let him save the day.

  • bike

    In a pure Princeton set, all five players should be able to shoot well from the outside. So Bynum needs to work on that 3-point shot.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Redd. Your an idiot. Honestly. How is a team with 3 MVP,s and two hall of famers. The best passing seven footer in the league, and the second best centre in the League. Not to mention one of the best defenders in the league. Are the Bulls going to do better? With The big three of Carlos Boozer, Nate Robinson and Joakim Noah. I’m sure the rest of the east is crapping there pants in fear.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Also the nbk having sex with Eddie Jordan comment isn’t my brother, I checked again. CRAP

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    Lol it’s ok. That is that guy who trolls everyone with little weird gay comments. He obviously has gay sex on his mind

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Mamba take it easy on young Redd.
    On second thought, bahhh, go at him…
    “Lakers will continue to suck”
    Do you just love making yourself look like a complete and utter dunce?
    NO TEAM over the last decade plus has had even close to the amount of success as the Lakers have had.
    You just said the most successful current franchise over the last decade plus in the NBA “will continue to suck”
    If your a dunce you should not be allowed on SLAM. That means you shorty. Must be ‘THIS’ tall to ride this ride.

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    Lakeshow, just to let you know, the Spurs have had the most success over the last decade in terms of winning % and consistent success. The Lakers have just had the most titles. Semantics I know.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    @nbk I don’t see why people troll you so much. What did you do? I know my brother started this and I apoligize.
    @Lakeshow Redd and the Seed are the biggest idiots here. Continue to suck? So your saying that a team adding a future HOF PG makes them worse? So you basically said that Sessions is better than Nash. While we’re at it is Nate Robinson better than Nash too? Wow your stupid.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    There is no one of the Lakers that is among the best defenders in the L.

  • pposse

    MWP is not ‘among’ the best perimeter defenders in the league??

  • http://www.slamonline.com nbk Troll

    Lakers need to go back to that Triangle!! bring in t-mac and iverson too.

  • LA Huey

    Black Mamba once said MWP can cancel out Kevin Durant. LOL.

  • eZ

    Does this mean they will also establish Nash in the post? I heard he’s gonna work out with Hakeem this summer.
    Bynum is actually a great 3pt shooter, Mike Brown held him back last season.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Lakers still suck. Lol, it’s so easy pissing Lakers fans off. Like, damn, I enjoy it. Watching Lakeshow get emotional like a little girl(despite Lakers being one of my top5 favorites). It’s sad, you act like difference of opinion equates to stupidity.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    nbk, I almost mentioned the Spurs. They have a deserving say in the best franchise over the last decade plus. Shouldn’t have excluded them completely like I did, but i was talking about the most tangible obvious success of the O’Brien Trophy. Which the Spurs come close to also.
    Like you said semantics though, because i’m telling a guy who says a team “sucks” that not only do they not “suck”, but actually the complete opposite indeed lol.
    Yo, so I know your not all about ‘your’ Suns, but what are your predictions for next year for them? They obviously are bottom feeders, but they should be fun to watch with Beasley and Dragic.

  • http://www.slamonline.com nbk Troll

    Lakers Starting 5 next Year should be:

    Bynum
    Hill
    MWP
    Kobe
    Nash

    Reserves:
    Pau
    Antwan Jamison
    Ebanks
    T-MAC
    IVERSON

    give it a shot!!!

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Jtaylor I think you might be forgetting Metta World Peace

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Now with that said, much as I do enjoy the Lakers I don’t feel they’re Final contenders. However, if Gasol can drain his shots he’ll make things a lot easier, if Kobe can dribble a bit less for the sake of letting Nash distribute, and Bynum can magically mature & play his role to it’s every intricacy then Lakers will make it. Oh and it’d help if Brown could stop being a wuss.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Redd is so cute when he’s angry…
    No… No I don’t act like difference in opinion equates to stupidity.
    I think a sentence like this does… LMAO
    “All in all, it’s quite obvious that the Princeton Offense(which I knew a little about but now understand via nbk) won’t be used in its fullness and they’ll be liberal in its use.”
    Sorry man, but you really should stop. Your getting exposed homie.
    .
    .
    .
    Black Mamba, i’m as big a fan of Ron Ron as there is. He was a great defender in his prime, but like all, he too has lost a step. That doesn’t mean he can’t be elite at moments. Hell, in the post season maybe I would have him as a top defender. Cancel that, I WOULD have him as a top ten defender in the playoffs. Dude is beast, but he can’t keep up with anyone faster than him anymore(which is nearly everyone he defends). He is more than worthy of being called a good defender, but he is no longer elite/great.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    @Redd. You are a stupid human being. Simple as that.
    @LA Huey. I meant MWP’s defense is better than Durant’s but KD’s offense is better than Metta’s. I will say that cancel out was a poor choice of words.
    @Lakeshow and nbk. The Lakers might have been the best team of the past decade. But they had those years with Kwame and Smush Parker. So ya it’s the Spurs. And Lakeshow, I checked my brothers laptop and he was about to troll you. So I talked to him and the words your an idiot was used often. I told him to post stupid comments under Redd’s name but we both agreed that no one would notice.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I do agree with that Lakeshow. I was talking about a playoff series in that other thread. Which Metta shows up in and gives it all every time.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    NO.
    KD basically had his way with him in the Playoffs.
    This may be irrelevant in the discussion at hand but NBA TV sucks. I’m pretty sure the NBA has countless old school games at their disposal but they choose to recycle the same ole “Bernard drops 60″ and “MJ scores 63″ games. How bout some Bill Walton games? Some Moses Malone games? Some George Gervin games?

  • LA Huey

    I know. I know…just couldn’t pass up a chance to bring up that ridiculously poor choice of words.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    For sure Taylor. Was thinking the same dam thing. (In regards to NBATV)
    In regards to Durant… He schools everyone now’a'days. Bron does a decent job on him, but he still gets his on Bron. Tony Allen doesn’t even stand a chance on Durant. Slow him down, maybe a little. Ron is maybe the third best defender against KD. A few guys can make that claim, but Ron’s name is in the hat.
    BM: I’m sure he’ll get me tomorrow. You can’t always keep him from trolling lol.

  • pposse

    both the spurs and lakers won 3 championships each within the last decade. The miami heat have won 2, and are favorites for the next year. In the summer of 2013 if you pose this same question, the lakers will have only won 2 rings in the past decade (assuming they lose this next season). You can easily make arguments that the Heat with Pat Riley in the front office have been a very good, if not better than the Spurs or Lakers. Obviously the Spurs and Lakers won more regular season games, and championships, but dont forget how close the Heat were to beating the Pistons that year Wade twisted his ribs (first year with Shaq).

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    ok sorry lunch break. got to catch back up.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Thanks for being cool with me through this nbk and Lakeshow. I’m considering setting a passcode on his laptop and IPhone. Then telling him it wasn’t me. What do you guys think? He’s an idiot so he would fall for it.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    ^Tag team, your in.
    Heading to mine now haha.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    . Black Mamba – idk why. maybe my information just pops up the most often?
    . Lake – Phoenix is the biggest (?) in the league to me. They could win from 32 to 44 games depending on how Michael Beasley adapts to being a bonafide 1st option, and the offensive system Gentry puts around him & Dragic. I would bet they end up like 9 or 10 in the West.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Thanks for attempting to do more than SLAM ever would in regards to helping people keep their identities BM.
    If it didn’t interrupt good bball convo’s then I wouldn’t care. It’s a troll, but it is annoying when your trying to comment to someone in particular then that person just goes off on random gay sex jokes and such. So yeah, a pass code would be dope haha.

  • CDaTyrant

    So this means what? O n T-Money u dirty for that melo & Kobe talk.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I really appreciate that Lakeshow. I will set the pass code right now.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Also cosign jtaylor on nbatv. I’ve never seen that Willis Reed 1970 finals game seven. Would love to though. OFF TO YOUTUBE!

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    man i ain’t even mad at your brother, let alone mad at you. it’s just annoying what he does but i’m not upset.
    .
    nbatv plays what gets ratings. it’s still a TV Channel that has to make money. Willis Reed’s 1970 performance isn’t as entertaining as anything with Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, or Magic Johnson — So they dominate the station in the summer (mainly Michael Jordan). – they show the 93 finals all the damn time though, that’s my main complaint. i’ve seen the 93 finals about as many times as i have seen the bottom of my feet

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Ya. I live in Canada so I get nbatv canada so I get crap about the stupid women’s national team and some stupid Canadian tournaments. It sucks. And up here it’s illegal to have ESPN or ESPN classic because those channels being available would clearly put the canadian networks out of business. IM TIRED OF HOCKEY HIGHLIGHTS!!!!
    nbk: I really appreciate that. It shows a lot of character on your part that you don’t hate us.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    that sucks man. i could never live in Canada for that reason alone.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Ya. I would take the 93 finals over stories about Canadian youth players. And when team USA is playing the Canadian networks show crap like the Canadian female fencers. I don’t get american super bowl commercials either

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    oh wow

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    It’s not all bad though. Me and brother (not your troll my other brother) play in the Steve Nash youth league because we live in Vancouver. which isnt great but doesn’t suck. Seeing Nash born here and becoming an NBA star even at 38 gives us confidence that we can all make the NBA.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    I was almost starting to re-think my positions on Canada….
    .
    .
    .
    lol, playing man.
    .
    Beasley could very well have a “great” statistical year next year.
    I expect, easily over 20 PPG. He could snag 8 boards a game if he put his mind to it… So 7 is more attainable haha.
    Gunna say 23,7,2,1stl for Cool Beas. The Suns I don’t see getting any better than a 9 spot either. Dragic will be interesting to watch. Could put up a 16,8,4 year if he’s given the reigns.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Nash was born in South Africa….lol – is Canadian (he grew up there, and his parents are) but he was born in South Africa.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Yeah, i’m thinking the same thing Lake. I just know that if/when (i doubt “when”) it clicks for Beas he could become one of the best offensive players in the whole league.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I will admit I was a little upset with the T-Wolves for not allowing the Beasley deal. But they were such a great under the radar team it didn’t last long. But it looks like they are regretting it because they wound up with nothing when they could have had Fisher. Who I think we can all agree would be great for Rubio and Barea.
    .
    In Canada teams like the Heat, Thunder, and Lakers are only on when the Raptors aren’t. Which due to the condensed season wasn’t often. So instead of Lebron I get Bargnani. The networks seem to think this entire country is Raptor fans while in reality nobody gives a $hit about them.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Nash is South African. Did he spend any time here. Interesting, I did not know that.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Another thing, somebody in my class once said Bargnani was better than Kobe. Two days later I transferred schools

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    He grew up in Canada. He’s full blown Canadian, both his parents being Canadian gave him full citizenship. He was just born in South Africa.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Oh. I understand now. Do you know why he was born there? Were his parents on vacation or something? Not trying to nag just curious.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    His Dad was a pro soccer player. I believe he was over there for that reason

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Lakers fans are mad Emotional, not to mention nonsensical when no one seems to find issue in my comment but u because you’ve disliked me for making u emotional over a website. Now you both should relax with acting like elites on a website lol. Again Lakers are not a factor but OKC is.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Ok cool. I guess that’s why he plays soccer as his second passion and co owns the MLS franchise we have in Vancouver. Went to see his MLS team once. Saw him there. He was leaving the stands so I reached to high five him but instead got his head. Dude uses a ton of gel.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Redd we’ve really lost interest in you. Go back to your parents attic.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    yea, his brother (i think older) is a pro soccer player. Or was. Not a great player by any means, but a pro nonetheless. I’m sure Nash would have gone pro if Basketball wasn’t his first love. He clearly has the genetics and work ethic

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I know his brother. Martin Nash. Played for Steve’s team before the team went pro. I got a tshirt with his name on the back at one of the games. He was ok. Certainly that teams best player. But that’s not saying much.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Lol interest? Then quit replying. Your name shows you’re a Lakers fan girl. You compared MWP to KD. It’d be smart to shut up. Lol I enjoy upsetting douchebags.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    BM, try to remain cool. I know it’s hard with these internet thugs. They just go so hard, lol ;)

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I’m done with you Redd. You’re just an idiot.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    I agree Lakeshow. I have never seen a bigger troll than Redd and I live with one.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Lol Internet thugs? Says the guys who take a thread to heart. K I’m done arguing with Laker fanatics who catch feeling over the Internet. I’ll enjoy watching OKC wipe the floor with LA.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    And we will enjoy the playoffs. But you wouldn’t know about that.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Redd

    Oh

  • http://www.kb24.com The Seed

    It should help Kobe get another ring.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Westbrook is a terror defensively and so explosive off the dribble.
    Davis might be the most athletic center I have seen since DRob.
    Two games in and I have already seen improvements in KD’s defense.
    DWill because of his strength can be an excellent defender when he puts his mind to.

  • http://www.kb24.com The Seed

    KD is playing harder than he played in the NBA Finals to me. Defense, rebounding and passing. Lets be honest about it.

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    Cosign the Seed.

  • Bernie

    KD is my favorite player and okc is my team but I think it’s funny when no one brings up gerald Wallace or iggy on guarding Durant. Those two guys defend him better then even Lebron

  • http://www.slamonline.com J

    on topic.
    I don’t believe this. If they say the Princeton will be “part” of their offense I will, but if it is the main structure of their offense, no. A lineup of Nash.Kobe.Barnes.Jamison.Gasol could run the princeton. jamison in particular is very good at princeton. (Wizard with Eddie Jordan and a Cav with Byron Scott who both are great preachers of this system.) He will stretch the floor and still have some post game in him. but that’s not the lineup they’re gonna ride and die with. This will either eliminate Bynum’s effectiveness or stretch Gasol further more, which as seen last season is not a good idea. And contrary to some belief, elite pointguards can thrive in this kind offense. JKidd with the nets, CP3 with the Hornets and Arenas with the Wizards (though Gil is a score first). So Nash I think will be OK. In general I think this is not fit overall. What in my opinion could work for LA is a system similar to the Spurs along with some FLEX.

  • http://ZOGS1.CA ZOGS1

    MY TURN !~!!!!
    -
    UH
    IT ME,
    STILL THE SAME OG
    BEEN HATED ON BY MOST YOU NlGGAS WHO DONT OWN SKIS
    IN THE WINTER I BURN MADE TREES
    SNOW SNOW SNOW
    MONEY I, BLOW BLOW BLOW
    POLICE, PO PO PO
    SANTA CLAUS, HO HO HO
    -
    #swag

  • LeBrOn 4 MvP!

    yo let me spit the mic, real talk

    east compton wassing up in the hood
    my hood thugs aint up to no good
    ye, rela talk what real talk what!
    area code 2044 to the day i die what!

  • http://Slamonline.com Black Mamba

    ^WTF was that?

  • http://www.nba.com Dacre

    This one is called: lion and tigers and bears oh my.

    Get the princeton offense upside ya head
    If Byn’ won’t know it just put the kid to bed
    Black mamba wants in on another championship
    So Nash comes here to avoid another hip
    But If you don’t bring Phil back we shoulda stayed in Kansas
    See the Wiz of Oz he holding your 2 last chances…

    Toto RIP.

  • HiDef

    Dear SLAM, the comments on here are getting more and more like those on ESPN and every other online forum – childish arguments. Please people, I know I don’t comment all that often, but I read almost everything – can we get back to focussing on sound discussion about basketball?

  • http://www.nba.com Dacre

    Certainly: lets begin with that old chestnut. . . Tim Duncan is not a power forward.

  • HiDef

    @Dacre I completely agree… Put him up there with the best centres of all time. I really don’t know why he’s been so adamant about being a PF. He is, to quote an old article, a Neo.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    Now to get with the effectiveness of having this discussion I can take one of several avenues:
    1. Completely agree thus ending said ‘sound discussion’ and basking in our mutually established opinions of worthiness…. or

    2. Completely disagree and initiate a barrage, head-long into a close-minded tirade supported by a total lack of relevent if not unsound supporting arguments/points/formulae that just end in personal jibes and commentary on ones sexual preferences or

    3. Disagree simply and steam-roll you with routine cut-and-paste statistics/links and articles highlighting Tim Duncans role as a PF ever since he entered the league.
    ——————–
    Tim Duncan is the greatest PF ever to play the game ya pillow biting shirt lifter….

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    The new generation just doesn’t get it……….

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Commenters, I mean.

  • HiDef

    Or… you could just argue your point and we could continue to debate, while mutually respecting each other’s point of view even if we disagree and – dare I say – even change our opinions based on the persuasiveness of the other’s points.

  • Drig

    @ppose…..Bynum contributed ZILCH to the ’09 Lakers. Same with the ’08 Lakers….was clearly hobbled in ’10….So it wasn’t like he was full on 2nd best C in the L Andrew Bynum. Next, LAL had no bench and were probably 6 deep at best for large parts of the playoffs. Third, Spurs had Manu-Duncan-Parker, Celts were there, the Nugs had Melo, Nene and Kenyon and a bench. It’s not like the modern Lakers were the 2nd coming of those Bill Russell celts….

  • pposse

    injuries are a part of the game. Now im not going to sit here and debate Bynum’s role in the 2 chips, cause we all are more than aware that he didn’t produce much in those playoff runs and was hobbled by injuries. Still tho, since Kobe got Pau Gasol, vegas has them always favored or close to being favored to win it all. And besides what vegas thinks (which clearly matters more in the big scheme of things), the LA Lakers were huge at every single position. They had either height or strength advantages up and down their starting lineup, if not both. A player like Derrick Fisher might not be ranked in the top 33 percentile as far as pg’s go, but he more than well makes up for it with his defense (being stronger than everyone he guards) and clutch shooting abilities. IMO the lakers own worst enemies are themselves. Plus they had arguably the best coach ever lead them to victory. Even this year, with a 33-34 yr old Kobe, most betting sites have the lakers at 8:1 if not up to 5:1.

  • pposse

    tim duncan may be the best PF of all time, but he was also the tallest and maybe even the strongest PF of all time too. Did he weigh the most at PF too? idk but for those simple reasons and the fact he got three finals MVP’s should solidify his place; at the same damn time tho, there are other great centers all time where Duncan’s place is hard to judge when compared to. He also guards normally the next teams best bigs too, its like a consolation prize saying he the best PF ever when there are a whole other class of ball players (Centers) that you can compare his game to.

  • Selwyn ( UK )

    What’s the over / under in number of games when this system gets dropped in favour of the usual PNRs and ISOs ? ? Princeton offence only worked well with those old Kings teams with passers and IQs like Brad Miller + Webber + Vlade etc
    Lakers will drop this before Thanksgiving !!!

  • Drig

    @pposse……Not denying that LAL wasn’t talented and Kobe didn’t have help. I would be a fool to say otherwise ( and I hope others didn’t/won’t say that ). However, saying he had the best team every season is wrong IMO. ’08, LAL got Pau mid season after they lost Bynum. Had Vlad Rad starting but the bench actually didn’t make things worse for once. In ’09, Bynum went down again and the bench was pathetic but we managed to get the right matchups and Kobe was superb in the WCF and Finals. In ’10, we got Ron and a hobbling Bynum but again no bench. Fisher was never an advantage for the Lakers except at the end of games. I remember Kobe having to take care of Westbrook and Rondo even back in ’10 because LAL just couldn’t and still can’t stop quick penetrating PGs. BTW, just wanted to know, do you think LeBron had the best team head and shoulders above the rest this past season? Personally, I don’t think so because the team was flawed. If you do think he had exceptionally talented team far above what other teams can offer, then I’d say you’re justified in thinking Kobe had the same. If not, you’re using double-standards.

  • Drig

    BTW, Malone is still the strongest PF IMO. If Duncan is classified as a C, I have a hard time picking him above Hakeem ( the best IMO ), Wilt, Shaq, Russell and Kareem ( except Hakeem, others are interchangeable :P ). Maybe Duncan can push Russell down the ladder but I don’t see how he is better than the top 4 guys. Arguably the best PF ever though ( I still think KG is more versatile and would be a better fit for few teams )

  • AQWORD

    Lobe Tryant must be really happy right about now.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    holy dumb – what is happening to this website.

  • pposse

    when Lebron decided to take his talents to miami i always defended all of his actions; the decision, and the introductions all seemed pretty justified to me. He proclaimed the Heat to win 8 rings, and not once did i disagree with him. I still don’t disagree with him. They should have gotten 2 by now. The only hope as a Bulls fan to stop the Miami Heat is for Derrick Rose to literally be the second best player of ALL TIME imo. The Heat are too raw; i dont know if people are forgetting that Bosh didn’t play much in the Indiana and Boston series or what. The two series he competed fully in they waxed the Knicks 4-1 and Thunder 4-1. I do think the Heat are flawed, but that can get you a victory here and there in the regular season; in the sense they are flawed when competing in series, i think is overblown and nonsense. Their quickness and ability to control games with lBJ in the post, wade attacking, and cb doing whatver else is necessary is just ridiculous. They got three guys that are probably top ten in the league; the one team that can expose this flaw is a team with two 7 footers in your starting lineup who are offensive minded a la LA Lakers. They the only ones that have a chance imo. The wildcard with the lakers is that their coach is not trustworthy. I also remember Kenny Smith saying if you replace LBJ with Kobe on that Lakers team from 2010 that they would win 70 games, I always cosigned that statement and saw where he was coming from when he said that.

  • pposse

    and btw Lebron and co. created a culture in Miami where veteran former stars want to go and play. So pretty much now the Heat because of Lebron’s unselfishness promote high basketball iq guys to go there for less money all in the name of winning.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    The Heat were exceptionally talented.
    Bron, Wade and Bosh form a core that is unassailable. They upgraded with Haslem being healthy, adding Battier and Chalmers taking a leap. Plus, Cole was a good backup for them as well.
    So, compared to every other team, they had crazy talent. I would say OKC is the only other team close on talent in fact. However, the Heat did deal with injuries throughout the year.
    Look, when Kobe won, he had championship caliber talent. There were maybe two other teams if that who could match him.

  • Drig

    @pposse…….Malone and Payton came to LAL for less money for a ring. When Kobe and Shaq were there……Nothing much to do with unselfishness. More to do with where they have the best chance of winning. Also, I’m not a believer of replacing player X with player Y and you’re much much better unless both players have similar games and one is much better than the rest. I’d have loved to see how LBJ would’ve operated mostly from the perimeter and not driven as much into the paint and also be the only viable perimeter scoring threat for LAL that year.( Metta on the post was good. Very good. Metta on the perimeter was worse than that mad girls movie… )Kobe still had ( and arguably still has ) the better perimeter game than LBJ back then and hence was the better fit for the Lakers that year, esp. since he already knew the intricacies of the Triangle O. ( which he did break a lot of times too )

  • Drig

    @Allenp……agreed. That was the only thing I wanted to make clear. They were championship caliber. But there were 2-3 teams which could match them. It wasn’t like LAL were simply much much better than the entire L.

  • Drig

    @Allen……don’t know why I can’t make two consecutive replies at times ( the thing rarely cooperates ) but co-sign whatever you said. I was saying the same thing in my posts as well : LAL was a championship caliber team just like 2-3 other teams were at that point but at the end of the day, none of them were flawless teams. They were beatable. They got the right matchups at the end of the day. ( atleast sans ’08 ) Looks like all of this started with SExchange’s comment about Kobe managing to magically align with the teams with the most superior talent when he was going for a championship just like MJ, Bird, Magic and tons of other legends. It comes down to semantics I guess.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I would say that the team with Pau and Bynum had a great advantage having two quality bigs in a league short on bigs.
    The team with Shaq and Kobe had better talent than everyone, just because they had Shaq and Kobe.
    So for three of his rings, I would say Kobe had better talent than everyone else. The Shaq and Kobe combo with decent to good role players was way better than everyone else, even those stacked Portland teams.
    But, with Gasol and Bynum he just have very good, championship level talent. So did the Celtics.

  • pposse

    when MJ retired for the second time, i like many people from the Chi stopped watching the NBA. I did watch when LA played PHI in the finals, and after the game 1 victory i started to become an NBA fan again. But that quickly went away when LA pulled off 4 straight. Any team with Kobe and Shaq were unstoppable imo. Thats why when they lost to the Pistons i was pleasantly shocked, but the fallout changed the course of NBA history. If it wasn’t for that loss, i still don’t think that i would be paying attention to the NBA cause at that time i believed the Lakers would never lose until both of those guys retired. To this day i still think that Shaq is the second best of all time from what I have seen. I didn’t grow up with Magic and Bird and the older guys.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Anyone else spot that Kobe wants to run the same offense of his greatest rival, the 2000-04 Kings? Either way, if Pau runs the high post, Bynum stays in short corner, and Kobe picks his spots instead of just doing what he thinks is good enough, it could work. Modifications would be needed (float MWP around the wings, preferable stepping in when the ball swings and Nash allowed to penetrate and kick more than a Princeton offense allows) but it could work. Oh wait. Mike Brown. Sorry LA.

  • http://GymAlien.com GymAlien

    I can already CLEARLY see these ever present Laker/Kobe hater’s crying themselves to sleep every night as their favorite team takes it in the shorts from the highly probable “World Champion Los Angeles Lakers” as Chickie baby used to say so often through the years. This team has what it takes. (but as a side note; I just have to hand it to the Clipper GM-this guy is really good)
    GymAlien said so!!

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