Sunday, November 25th, 2012 at 3:17 pm  |  251 responses

Kobe Bryant: ‘I’ll Be Scoring a Lot More When [Steve] Nash Gets Back’


Kobe’s scoring numbers aren’t way down this season—he’s averaging 26.9 points per game, just one point per game less than last year. But he does expect that number to go up when point guard Steve Nash returns, allowing Kobe the chance to do less distributing and more, well, shooting. Via the OC Register: “Bryant understands how it looks. When he sets up teammates for buckets, the Lakers have been winning. When he doesn’t, they haven’t. Bryant’s pick-and-roll plays are “by far” the best attack the team has, D’Antoni said, while Steve Nash remains out because of a leg fracture. No. 2 point guard Steve Blake might be back from his abdominal strain Tuesday against Indiana, but Bryant had four assists and no turnovers in the Lakers’ hot first quarter against the Mavericks. To Bryant, though, when he sets up teammates and they don’t make shots, then he has no choice but to shoot more to try to rally. ’I've been doing this my whole career, and some nights my teammates hit more shots and that adds up to more assists for me,’ Bryant said. ‘The games we win are when the whole team is making shots. Now, if our shots aren’t going in, then I have to take more of the offensive load.’ Bryant is looking forward to Nash’s return, for sure. Nash will be re-evaluated next week. ’I'll be scoring a lot more when Nash gets back,’ Bryant said. ‘I won’t have to facilitate as much, and it will allow me to do what I do best — and that’s put the ball in the hole.’”

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  • ByAnyMeansNecessary

    Comments like these are why Lakers/Kobe fans cannot be taken seriously. What is it about him that has people so extreme with their love for him?

  • ByAnyMeansNecessary

    Not praising Kobe’s every move on here means that you have venom. You should know this bro.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    because Amar’e has played on teams that win a lot more often than Monroe did.
    .
    Win Shares are simple.
    .
    We will use Kobe Bryant as an example.
    .
    You take the amount of games won by a team in a season (so in this case it’s the Lakers, 2011-12) and split them up among the player’s based on production
    .
    The Lakers won 41 games last season so there was 41 win shares to divy up.
    .
    -(1)Take the amount of points produced (not scored, produced) by a player,
    -(2)Take the amount of possessions used by that player.
    -(3)Calculate Marginal Offense for Each Player (points produced) – *(league points per possession) * (offensive possessions)
    -(4)Calculate Marginal Points per Win Produced (*League Points Per Game* ~ **Team Pace**/**League Pace**) – basically, how much each point is worth for each team in terms of winning and losing
    -Then you Calculate Win Shares (marginal offense) / (marginal points per win).
    .
    Basically Kobe was “only” 3rd on the Lakers in Win Shares despite having the best statistics because he played such a huge chunk of minutes and used such a huge chunk of possessions that the performance of the team didn’t differentiate much with him on the court, and rather excelled with their Bigs, Pau and Bynum because they were so efficient and had such a profound effect on team output

    Ok so it doesn’t sound simple, but it is.

  • Conor

    Kobe would dominate both of them, based purely on prime offensive (Bird is his equal in that regard)/defensive (neither approach Kobe’s lockdown peak) skill metric, and he has been more successful than either of them.

    So, no. Neither Bird nor Robertson are in my Top Five.

  • Conor

    Look at the definition of “fanatic” and it may shed some light on Lakers’ fans alignments.

    Kareem did say that Oscar was the greatest who ever played, but what does he know? HaHaHa

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=509819249 Gaurav P.

    So Kobe can’t eclipse Magic as a player because Magic came first and had a bigger impact on the league in the 80s?

  • LakeShow

    Really? comments like these… lmao
    Your a hoot.

  • LakeShow

    That’s actually pretty close to what I thought…

    So…. Why does Al Jefferson have a higher win share than Steve Nash?

    This is the reason I cannot take the stat seriously.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=509819249 Gaurav P.

    Its not about praising his every move – I am critical of him when he’s stupid (i.e – throwing Gasol under the bus) too. However, every thread I come into on this site, one of you big dawgs (as in, the commenters who are knowledgeable and make intelligent arguments), will be harping/discrediting Kobe for something that has nothing to do with the discussion at hand. For example, earlier in this thread, some troll brought up MJ unprovoked and you piled on the conversation.

    Sure, it makes for a much livelier board, but its annoying as f*ck having to constantly stand up for a player when his every move is mocked, often for no reason other than because of how much some of his fans like him. The same way you feel about some Laker fans always praising Bryant, is the same way I feel about some of you (not all) constantly harping and discrediting Bryant at every possibility.

    Personally, I am a Bryant fan, yes, but I’m not blinded by my fandom. He makes a lot of mistakes and has been dumb quite a few times. But its irksome when Laker fans get criticized as a whole for being too up his a**, when the critics are just as much up his a** the other way. Its a cycle.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    what do you mean? you mean last season? cuz over their career, and in the seasons Nash has played on good teams, it’s not even kinda close. The most Jefferson has ever had in a season is 7.8……..Nash has had 5 seasons over 10. Those 5 seasons equal more win shares than Jefferson’s whole career combined.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    because playing in the NBA doesn’t make you a basketball genius. it doesn’t even mean your opinion should be taken seriously.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    no, because Magic was a better winner who had a more profound effect on his teams success. oh and he was an infinitely better teammate.

  • Conor

    I’ll take theirs over an anonymous internet commentator’s each day of my life.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    awe!!! good for you. – don’t ask a question if you don’t want the answer.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=509819249 Gaurav P.

    What is a “better winner”?

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    do you really need me to explain how Magic was a better winner? Like you need me to outline how Kobe hasn’t won without an all-star big man next to him? You need me to go over Kobe’s tantrum in the summer of 2005? Or Kobe’s whole selfish detonation of the Lakers in 2004? Or you need me to explain to you what Magic Johnson did as a rookie? Or outline how Magic won 5 championships in 12 years, while Kobe is sitting on number 5 at year 17? Magic Johnson retired (well until the brief comeback) when he was 31 years old and still finished with 5 titles. Magic’s career also started 2 years later than Bryant’s did.
    .
    Without any sort of biased perspective it is pretty clear that Magic was the better pro, especially at the height of his powers, while Bryant, obviously, just lasted longer.

  • LakeShow

    My eyes were playing tricks on me…

    How bout with Reggie Miler over Gary Payton?

    What about Ray Allen above Steve Nash?

    Earl Monroe below Chris Bosh?…

    I just don’t understand how it has substance on it’s own as a stat…

    It needs context.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    Are you just looking at offensive win shares bruh?

  • Caboose

    I’m just gonna give up on LakeShow when it comes to Kobe. It’s like trying to convince someone in the 16th century that the world is round, even though we have the evidence for it.

  • Caboose

    Which is why we haven’t attacked you. Look, me, nbk, and BAMN are all happy to say Kobe is top 15 All Time. He is. What we really dislike is irrational fandom, like trying to justify as either 1. Top 5-10 All Time, 2. Greatest Laker, 3. Best Player Since Jordan. From these, 2 and 3 can be argued. 1 is where we draw the line.

  • LakeShow

    “NBA Career Leaders and Records for Win Shares”

    Basketball Reference.

  • Caboose

    I was completely supportive of you until you said Kobe top 5. Would you rather have me mock you for your obviously unfounded argument or would you rather have me logically disprove you? Your choice.

  • LakeShow

    Says the man who can’t go a single day with out trying to make a top 10 all time NBA player look like just another schmuck…

    I gave up on your type years ago. If you can’t see greatness with your on two eyes, and have to dissect everything with a Hollinger statistic… That’s on you.

  • Caboose

    But Olajuwon is. Kid is funny.

  • Caboose

    I’m sorry that I trust logic, facts, and data more than my own subjective, undeniably biased eyes. That’s A LOT of arrogance on you if you think that what you see is the end-all, be-all for basketball discussion.

  • Dagger

    It’s all relative. If we were talking about almost any other player, yeah, sure, those are nice numbers. But we’re talking about a guy who, two years ago, was averaging 23/14 while shooting 60% from the FT line (he’s less than 50% now). His win shares have declined from .236 to .163. As a result he’s not an MVP candidate and his team has been mediocre so far. “Irrelevant” is, admittedly, a bit hyperbolic, but despite his injury I’ve been surprised by how slowly he’s started the season.

  • ByAnyMeansNecessary

    You’re basing it on Kobe being able to score on them? You do know that there are more things to do on the court rather than score, right? This is one of the problems with Kobe fanatics. You’re a good example of a fanatic. The success argument is the same as the rings argument. Tired and weak argument to use. What is success to you? Scoring a lot of points? Taking a lot of shots to score those points? Oscar was a 30, 11, 9 player his first 8 seasons and you think that a guy who was, at his best, just a great scorer and good defender belongs in any top 5 more than he does? Kobe’s most well-rounded season was 02-03 when he averaged 30, 7 and 6. And your only argument is Kobe would dominate Oscar and Bird on offense? Wow. Kobe doesn’t belong ahead of two guys who did more than one thing great. When LeBron is finished, he too will belong ahead of Kobe because he is now more of a great two-way player than Kobe was in his prime. He averaged 30 without even having a good, consistent jumpshot.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    Reggie Miller vs Gary Payton – Payton had a much shorter prime. And Miller played on a top notch eastern conference team as it’s leading scorer for over a decade. Basically, Miller won a lot more games, and did so as the best player on his team.

    .Steve Nash vs Ray Allen – Allen has been on more consistently successful teams, and his prime has lasted longer. Nash for as great as he’s been, has only been an elite(ish) PG for 8 years.

    .

    .

    In terms of Chris Bosh, he has been the only good player on the majority of teams over his career, and the last 2-1/2 seasons he’s played as one of 3 players on his team that even matter. So he, as an individual, get’s an even bigger chunk of Win Shares than he would have on more well rounded teams.

    .

    If you notice, Isiah Thomas is actually 131st all-time, and this represents the overall level of talent on the team around him. He had to share a lot more win shares than he would have otherwise.

    .

    Which is kind of the same situation as it is with Kobe, if he didn’t play with Shaq – Pau – Bynum he would have a much larger chunk of win shares compared to the amount of games his teams have won.

    .

    As you said, the stat needs context. Which is why you only see me (i don’t wanna speak for anyone else, as i see various stats abused ad nauseum) use it in certain situations.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=509819249 Gaurav P.

    OK, to counter your points.

    1. Kobe hasn’t won without an All-Star big…kind of like Magic hasn’t won a title without *HOF* players around him. Kobe’s last 2 titles were won with zero HOF players surrounding him (Gasol might be a HOF player, but he is not Kareem, Worthy, etc). Even when Magic took over a rookie against the Sixers, it had been Kareem who had been the MVP of the series up until that point – Magic finished them off in the final game.

    2. Magic Johnson has gotten head coaches fired and wanted his way as well. He also cost himself his own damn career by catching HIV.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    the guy isn’t in shape yet. it’s pretty ridiculous to expect someone coming off of back surgery who hasn’t ran in 6+months to come in and be the same person he was before. if anything, i’ve been quite surprised by how productive he has been, albeit inconsistently.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=509819249 Gaurav P.

    Well, I mean, he’s sharing the court with 2 other elite players. Gasol is not Brandon Bass, and Kobe is no Pietrus. His numbers were bound to drop.

  • ByAnyMeansNecessary

    Magic was the definition of a team player and leader. He played center in an NBA Finals game and had 42 points, 15 rebounds and 7 assists…as a rookie.That’s why Kobe can’t surpass him. What exactly can Kobe do in your mind to be a better Laker than Magic? Strictly on the court, what can he do? Because another ring won’t do it. Scoring more points won’t do it. He could win 2 more championships and still it won’t be the same as Magic’s 5 because of how they were won.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    1 – no no no you don’t understand. Kobe has never even won a playoff series without an All-Star big man. Magic got to the finals (with James Worthy) with Sam Perkins, Vlade Divac, and AC Green as his bigs…..
    2 – He did catch HIV, but he didn’t end his career selfishly. To say that is 100% ignorant. Which is ironic, because ignorance is why his career was cut short in the first place.

    .

  • LakeShow

    Awesome. Great summary on the ins and out, really appreciate it man.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    no doubt. i’m always here to elaborate on that type of stuff. i just want everyone to understand the advanced stats (especially those that use it, without actually understanding it, or using it in the context it should be) that are floating around. if you don’t like them after that? cool with me.

  • LakeShow

    :*(

  • Conor

    HaHaHaHa

    Where did I reject your answer? I only said that I would side with a professional’s in lieu of a child’s.

  • LakeShow

    BTW it was the all time PER I was looking at when I saw Al Jefferson was higher than Steve Nash…
    If you have time explain that for me, if not, tomorrow works lol.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    What kind of dumbass reply is that? They aren’t professional opinion givers and I’m not a child. But you are clearly an idiot.

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    Gonna have to be tomorrow, I’m replying from my email on my phone while I’m driving home from work lol
    Sent from right behind you.

  • LakeShow

    In your opinion.

    Coming from a huge Magic Johnson fan who is still unsure of who will be the greatest Laker.

    I still think it’s Magic, and might always be Magic, but IN MY OPINION, it does depend on how Kobe goes out.

  • Conor

    I really don’t understand why I’m compelled to explain basketball on a basketball website, but here it goes…

    Offence constitutes: scoring, passing, offensive rebounding, strong/weak-side reads, screening, and positioning. (If you think for half a damn second that Kobe Bryant isn’t superior in those regards to a 6’1″ point guard who had no jump shot & who only achieved those statistics because of the Era during which he played, you’re impossible; Bird is Kobe’s equal offensively)

    Defence constitutes: Scoring prevention, helping, breaking through/slipping under screens (based on reading the opposition’s tendencies), rebounding, positioning, and stealing/blocking when the opportunities strike.

    Kobe Bryant is only matched in inherent, all-encompassing skill – historically – by Magic Johnson (equal), Michael Jordan (equal), Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (equal), Hakeem Olajuwon (equal), Wilt Chamberlain (superior), LeBron James (superior), and Tim Duncan (superior, Popovich has said that Kobe is the best). His contemporaries acknowledge it. Even people who don’t like the man acknowledge it. But to say that he isn’t a top-five talent in the NBA’s history is (@disqus_oxoGJMLagc:disqus) unfounded & illogical. He was greatest of the 2000s because of these factors.

    You may list statistics which support your theories, but I can show you matchups, games, and series which undoubtedly prove mine.

    Here are three:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJNoFs3G91A –

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBtIcczizmk –

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjfxlvvXfSw

  • Conor

    You take Robertson or Bird, and I’ll take Olajuwon completely comfortably.

  • LakeShow

    This was meant for your post a couple comments above lol.

  • Conor

    They’re paid to either coach or compete for their respective livings while you elect to comment with subjective vitriol. Sounds like a child to me.

    “don’t ask the question if you don’t want the answer” … When did I write, “@disqus_rOeXXBD2qs:disqus, I never asked for YOUR answers”? Ah! I fail to see it!

    A “professional opinion giver” would be an “Analyst”, which West, Goodrich, Shaq, and Johnson all have been. Good effort, kid.

  • Conor

    Best player, by decade: 60s (Wilt), 70s (Kareem), 80s (Magic), 90s (Jordan), 00s (Kobe).

    I’d take Olajuwon over Wilt, Russell, Bird, Walton, Stockton, Malone, Erving, Shaq, Robertson, Ewing, Robinson, Duncan, James, and Durant in a heartbeat.

  • Conor

    Kobe did equal work with Shaq in two of their three championships (see: Shaq calling Kobe “the best in the world” in 2001), so if you discredit the first championship, that still leaves Bryant with four.

    Equal to Duncan & Shaq… more than Bird, Wilt, Walton, Stockton, Malone, Erving, Roberton, Ewing, Robinson, James, and Durant… and he’s more talented as an individual talent – offensively & defensively – over the course of his career than any of them… provide me your logic.

  • Conor

    *6’5″

  • Conor

    Sorry, meant this one (Nuggets): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFbLiuFHbT0

  • http://twitter.com/sooperfadeaway nbk

    - I’m paid to compete for my respective living.
    - Commenting on a website and commenting to a reporter are no different. It’s just a comment. – If you think they are paid for their opinion and not just to be a former player infront of a camera, fine. They are analyst and they know everything. As Magic said, LeBron will never win a title. They are always right.

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