Quantcast
Monday, January 3rd, 2011 at 9:00 am  |  294 responses

Phil Jackson: Kobe ‘Screwed Up the Game’ With 1-on-1 Play

by Marcel Mutoni@marcel_mutoni

As the 2-time defending champs continue their season-long struggle to regain their dominant form, frustration has understandably begun to creep into their locker room. Most of it has to do with the aggravating lack of motivation from the team on a nightly basis.

Defensively, the Lakers can’t seem to stop anyone, and when things don’t go well on the offensive end (read: the post players are foolishly ignored), Kobe Bryant will tend to try and take over. This has not worked out well.

Last night, in a blowout loss to the Memphis Grizzlies at home, Bean lit up for 17 third quarter points en route to a game-high 28 … and the Grizzlies’ lead increased dramatically. Afterward, Phil Jackson let the media know that this was not in the game plan.

The LA Times has the quotes:

“I just felt like we had no energy,” Bryant said. ” … So I tried to generate some of that and just get us started, but we weren’t able to carry it through.” The problem? Bryant took 12 of the team’s 22 shots in the third.

“We get behind early on in the third quarter on some stupid plays — poor passing, poor transition defense — and then Kobe has to screw up the game and start energizing the team by going one-on-one,” Jackson said. “That takes the rest of the guys out and as a consequence, that didn’t bring us back in.”

The Lakers turned the ball over 20 times, part of why Memphis had 28 fast-break points.

The few fans that remained inside the Staples Center late in the fourth quarter booed the team off the floor, and Kobe suggested that the media needs to start ripping the team more in their stories (an inevitability that didn’t need Bryant’s prodding.)

The Lakers’ issues are all correctable, and it’s still early enough in the season for them to make the necessary adjustments. One just has to wonder how long it’ll take for the team to finally start playing up to their potential.

  • Add a Comment
  • Share
  • RSS

Tags: , , , ,

  • RobbieJay

    welcome to life, LA.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    The Lakers are destructing as we speak. I wish the Suns were closer to them in the division….

  • JTaylor21

    Phil’s acting like this is something he didn’t know before; the Lakers are bad when kb gets into kome mode and tries to take over a game by literally taking every shot down the floor. It turns the other guys into zombies just other there watching kobe go one on 5 instead of trying to make sure that their most efficent offensive player gets good looks. It baffles me how a team with great post play can consistently jack shots from the perimeter and it all starts with Kobe. But who am I to talk, in La fans eyes dude can do no wrong because they foolishly think he won those 5 rings by himself.

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    The Lakers bomb out through the playoffs. Kobe wants out of LA and teams up with Chris Paul and Dwight in New Orleans….

  • http://www.triplejunearthed.com/dacre Dacre

    …Phil Jackson retires from LA…only to go to Miami to coach his next STAR STUDDED team (that adds Steve Nash in the off season) and win 3 more chips. Kobe never gets another look at a ring for the remainder of his career.

  • http://www.hoopsvibe.com/features/overdribbling chiqo

    ha, awesome. nothing like a coach throwing his star player under the bus.

  • bLeSs1

    Everyone calm down..this is all part of the drama of the Lake Show..has everyone forgot that we were in the same boat last year..

  • AT33

    Kobe is a good shooting guard but people who have put Kobe and Michael Jordan in the same sentance are insane. OK, Kobe has 5 rings, but one has to evaluate all those runs and see how they were won, 3 were all about Shaq, the biggest force the NBA had seen since Wilt. Then Shaq left and Kobe could even beat the Clippers. Then came the Gasol trade and Kobe went from a loser back to a champ, so while he does deserve a lot of credit one should not forget that Gasol carried the Lakers back to championship stardom. When MJ won his 6 rings it was all about MJ and Chicago never even had a great center. They were a good team no doubt but there will never be another Michael Jordan.

  • Overtime

    They are lifeless at the moment, u watch the game and you’ll just notice the little things. A lazy post pass from Artest. Gasol challenging a Rudy Gay three and only raising his hand up after the shot has left the hand. Kobe just plowing into the defence and wanting a call.
    They need to all get on the same page, this is fixable, Miami turned their season around early. The Lakers can do the same, they just gotta act like they like eachother for abit

  • JTaylor21

    The lakers did lose some games last year but they were never blown out this badly vs average and good teams alike. It’s something to lose close games but getting manhandled by bad teams is definitely not a good look.

  • LeBron de Con

    MJ had the same problem as Kobe and Phil knows that all too well. We all know both were/are lethal in the closing minutes of games, but MJ struggled just like Kobe with taking over to the detriment of team play.

  • http://www.fiba.com Darksaber

    Book deal!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    The Lakers never lost home games by blowout game after game after game. Laker fans that think this is correctable with a flip of a switch are living in the past. Oh yeah, since it will probably be a quiet day today, chew on this……for every Kobe lover that sucks his balls in the regular and claims him as the greatest of all time, find me a time when Michael Jordan’s Chicago Bull teams ever got BLOWN OUT, numerous times, on their home floor, in the same season. Michael would have never allowed it. NEVER. That’s why he was truly great and a killer and Kobe will always be viewed as a second rate version.

  • EJ

    They’ll bounce back. Kobe needs to realize that he isn’t the Kobe of ’06 anymore. Everybody on the team expcept for Kobe and Shannon need to find some motivation, and somebody needs to get on Kobe’s face and tell him he’s not the quite the same as in ’06 and his team is also a little better now. Don’t just turn into zombies, like all hope is lost.

  • Hursty

    Ron Artest is playing so bad. So, so, so bad. I think he had 0 points, 1 board and 2 assists last night. Oh, and Rudy lit him up for close to 30 too.

  • JTaylor21

    Umm when MJ actually took over he went out there and dropped 40 or 50 not 28pts on 10-22 shooting. People must not really comprehend how wide the talent gap between both players is. It’s hilarious that people still have the nerve to say that Kobe was better than MJ in anything.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Jahmai

    MJ and Kobe, there’s no discussion. but It’s kind of funny, I know the lakers are playing crapball and Kobe is getting all the criticism, but at the end of last season, kobe was TERRIBLE, the lakers were losing alot and every article said something like ´There ain´t no magic switch to turn on for the Lakers´ , ´Do they think they can just turn it on for the playoffs?´ and they did, same goes for the C´s, the most experst at ESPN had them losing to the Heat in the 1st round. Now I´m not saying Lakers will threepeat, because THIS, what they are doing right now, is not a winning formula. But you HAVE to remember they actually DID turn it on, never forget that.

  • LeBron de Con

    You need to separate folklore from fact. MJ and Kobe were both detrimental to their teams and counter to winning games when they attempted to take them over. It was a constant battle with MJ during his early-to-middle career. Not saying Kobe is on the same level as MJ, just stating fact: both caused losses when they took over games and team mates sat on their hands.

  • underdog

    I wonder why Phil didn’t sit Kobe down, if he so didn’t like what he saw…

  • JTaylor21

    Jahmai, answer me this; were they ever beat this badly at home and on the road like this last season? You can’t “turn it on” if there’s no switch, HC is going to be vital just like in past years. Bos would have been celebrating #18 if they would have taken the RS seriously last year.

  • Mvp23100

    That’s still a big flaw in Kobe’s game after how many years it’s irrational some people think this clown is seeing Bron at what because he’s definitely not making his teammates better dudes a dollar store version of 23

  • LeBron de Con

    Talk to me about Kobe v. Lebron comparisons when both have same number of rings.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Lakers try and pull off a move for Gasol or Odom/Artest/Blake.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    @ JTaylor21 Last year when the Lakers played this poorly, you probably said the same thing: that they could not turn it on, that their regular season play would carry over to their playoff play. When Gasol said he needed more touches, you probably said that Kobe needed to quit jacking shots and pound it into the post. But since they did win it all,whatever happened during their regular season doesn’t matter right? Just like the Heat’s early struggles, pretty sure by February we will not be talking about this rough stretch.

  • JTaylor21

    Of course the kobefanatic answer to anything regarding kobe and bron; rings. Like it’s a one-on-one game out there instead of a combined team effort.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    The Lakers NEVER got blown out back to back to back games at home. Or have this many losses so early in the season. Or be on pace to NOT have home court advantage after the first round. Stop making up history. This is not an overnight problem that’s getting better (like the Heat). They are getting worse.

  • JTaylor21

    Nick, how bout you just answer the question at hand instead of beating around the bush. Did La ever lose this badly to avg. and good times alike last season?

  • http://slamonline.com Kap

    Both yrs the Bulls three-peated they started the season 23-11. For anyone who watched last nite game would know that Kobe scoring run help keep the Lakers in game bc they had just went down by 13 points and he got them within two. It’s not Kobe’s fault that Gasol holds the ball in the post for twelve seconds and then takes a bad shot or makes a bad pass or that Ron Artest forgot how to play basketball. Dudes love to see Kobe struggle so they can say “MJ would never do that”.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Still no one with an answer to when the Bulls were taking blowout after blowout at HOME during their dual threepeats? Anyone? Thought so.

  • http://slamonline.com Kap

    How did Lebron come up? Kobe isn’t a sidekick on the Lakers. Of course Bron wouldnt do what Kobe did because he would just look to Wade to bail him out.

  • http://slamonline.com Kap

    Why is every team of today compared to the Bulls? Also, 3 of their last four have only been blowouts so it wasn’t back to back to back.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Kap, that was one of the dumbest comments you’ve ever made. Stick to your boy and your team otherwise the Heat may just fly back to LA and whip that a*s again. They’re the hot topic of the day cause they’re steady getting their ass kicked. They’re just losing, they’re getting hammered. That’s a huge difference than just dropping games to solid teams in a close loss fashion.

  • http://screwjams.tumblr.com cramzy

    look, im one of those “kobe aint effin with mj” guys but I also read “The Jordan Rules” Mike was being criticized for trying to do it himself and losing games too. Memories fade and when Kobe walks away people will look at the 5+ rings and not remember any of this. That just how it goes. Hell, Lebron haters forget Kobe was trying to bounce outta LA before Pau got there.

  • mp7three

    You all need to re-read Phil’s comments because most of you are not getting it right and totally not getting the sarcasm.
    He is saying the team was sucking in the 3rd Qtr when Kobe took over which was screwed up because while put the Lakers back in the game it also made the others just stand around…so he’s saying Kobe screwed up by instead of letting the Lakers get blown out in the 3rd he actually energizes the team by himself which the rest of the team can’t substain and they lose. Kobe screwing up is keeping the team in the game in the 3rd instead of letting them totally rolling over which they ended up doing anyway in the 4th.

    But somehow most of you along with Slamonline can’t read and certainly can’t understand sarcasm.

  • gp

    Well, there were outside variables that contributed to the Bulls getting off to 23-11 starts at the beginning of the 3rd seasons of their dual 3 peats. In 92-93 they started slow because Mike and Scottie didnt have a chance to rest in the summer because they played until June while winning a ring the season before, and they competed in the Olympics on the Dream Team. In 95-96 they started slow becuase Rodman missed a few games due to injury, and Scottie Pippen was out until February due to an injury. You people need to stop trying to compare Mike and Kobe, because there is no arguement, Mike is the greatest ever. The Lakers look old on offense and terrible on defense right now.

  • http://slamonline.com Kap

    I’m just hoping that the ship is righted before “Showtime” heads to South Beach. Maybe the Lakers will bring some fans to that empty arena of pseudo sports fans.

  • http://slamonline.com Kap

    @gp…Doesn’t Rodman being out injured sound familiar to Bynum being out injured this yr and not being quite up to par??? They don’t look old they look out of sync. The triangle is a delicate offense that requires precise timing and passing which is something the Lakers are not doing at the moment.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    Just like the Kobe = 5 rings; Lebron = 0 rings comparison is unwarranted in this situation, the MJ > Kobe comparison doesn’t have much to do with this either. I think Phil’s comments have been a little stretched to mean he was critical of Kobe’s one-on-one play in the 3rd Q. Phil simply meant that since the team could not get anything to happen offensively, Kobe took it upon himself to generate the offense and as a result took the rest of the team out of the offense and made them watch the game. So ultimately, he got them back in the game (within 2 pts) but the team could not pick it up since they had no rhythm. But of course everyone thinks he called Kobe out for shooting too much.

  • JTaylor21

    What’s even more funny is that the Lakers have played one of the easiest schedules so far and they haven’t even looked good vs bad teams and are still the 4th seed in the west. If laker fans think this is as bad as it gets just wait til they start regularly playing good teams.

  • BillyDWill.I.am

    @mp7three: Did you even see the news conference? I did. There wasn’t a hint of sarcasm in his voice. I don’t understand how you just molded his comments to fit YOUR own explanation.

  • Cizzo

    Nobody has ever won a NBA championship by themselves……….

  • Medd

    Clearly mp7three didn’t see the post game press conference. I did. There was NO SARCASM in his voice whatsoever. I just love how all of you Phil Jackson experts interpret what he said for us, as if you all have some inside track to his mind smh.

  • gp

    @Kap, I honestly don’t know if you can compare Rodman being injured to Bynum being injured due to the fact that Rodman led the league in rebounding and was also an All NBA defender. And on top of that, Bynum misses a nice chunk of games every year, so you would think that the Lakers would be used to making adhustments and playing without him by now. But lets say that you could compare the Rodman/Bynum injuries: Who would you compare Scottie Pippen being out until February to? There is no comparison there because Pau hads been healthy all year.

  • Overtime

    I seriously think the easy schedule hurt them big time. They had a winning streak at the beginning of the year and got into ”we can handle any team in this league without trying” mode…and then found out they couldnt. The problem they seem to have in these games is letting a team (say the Grizz) hang with them, then give them a little lead and then act as though at some point the lead wil jus be given back to them. They dont ever go and get the win!
    Yet, they did have a horrible streak just before the playoffs last year…

  • TrailBlazing&SportingLisbon

    they lookin like sh1t, theyre healthy and getting repeatdly blown out by everyone, at home no less thats not normal…well enjoy, eboy and jtaylor will be all over this sh1t lmao

  • Overtime

    I guess we arent putting up my first comment then Slam? lol
    Jtaylor and Eboy have had good points, this is def the worst ball theyve played in last three seasons. Getting blown out, at home, by teams like the Grizz, is not cool. They all jus look…not bothered really

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    At first I thought L.A. fans were tripping, but this does sound exactly like last year. I remember when Phil gave the EXACT same comment last year. I’m not longer on “The Laker are done” bandwagon. If they had these same problems last year and still won it, they’ll be in the hunt this year until proven otherwise.

  • http://www.kb24.com The Seed

    Alot of people are Hating on Kobe now. For Kobe to be even compared to MJ is great. Because in most people eyes MJ did everything right on the court and never made mistakes or shot poorly or lost games for his team when he was a seasoned veteran by taking bad shots. Some of yall forget the past to easily. Also Kobe was trying to inspire the team to play harder. All the blame goes on Kobe because he is the leader of the team. But Gasol, Artest and Odom are playing like crap. They are missing threes, Gasol is letting Big Z put defensive clamps on him and Kobe wants them to be self motiviated. This team has went to back 2 back 2 back NBA Finals. That’s alot of wear and tear on the body. They should be playing better yes, but anybody acting like the Lakers will not turn this team around is sadly mistaken. I look at this article different, Phil can call out Kobe like this he can handle it, Kobe just wants to win and thats why he told the LA media to start calling out his teammates for poor play, to see if that sets a fire in them. Also Lakers are still six or seven games behind Spurs and havent played well this season yet and have two three game losing streaks against teams they normally kill. My money is on the Lakers and PHIL knows how to get Kobe motiviated to come down hard on his teammates and it will work. BOOK IT!!!

  • http://stapledesign.com Spaceship Jay

    They need to make Pau the number 1 option and switch Kobe to number 2. That’s tough for egos but it is what it is.

  • Mvp23100

    If you watch the press conference you can tell by phils demeanor he meant what he said and how can other players even get a rhythm when he shoots 12 of their 22 attempts in the 3rd

  • briskin

    I know they got blown out by the lakers In la kobes rookie year. That game was funny. Lol

  • JTaylor21

    No one is saying the Lakers are done but it just doesn’t look good right now. Also can someone explain to me how a team loaded with talent can get destroyed at home by bad teams? No championship team in recent memory has ever been dismantled as bad as the lakers have been the past few weeks. You can’t just say they will turn on the switch because it’s not like they are playing with no emotion, they are playing hard but they still get murdered nightly.

  • Vince5

    The Clippers organisation must be loving this!

  • Scott

    Did Phil Jackson die? It is like he doesn’t even give a damn the way he is coaching this year.

  • http://coldhouseplot.com ColdHousePlot

    I’m pretty confident that by now, Phil know’s what words are coming out of his mouth, and the loudest way to say, “Hey, stop shooting Kobe” is to say it to the media.

    The Lakers look slower, out-of-sync, frustrated with each other, and old. And without being a Laker fan, I still bet most teams are hoping they don’t get matched up with the Lakers come playoff time, and the teams that were blowing them out will be watching from their respective summer homes. It’s still early – I like how the cry for Miami was, “just wait and see” and for LA it’s “hate hate hate hate.”

  • http://stapledesign.com Spaceship Jay

    Oh, and Co-sign Allenp, who is absolutely right.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Cosign Spaceship

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    JTaylor
    Man, I was with you for a while, but I distinctly remember Phil giving almost this exact same comment last year. Almost verbatim.
    So, since they are trying to three peat and everybody knows how hard that is, I figure this is just part of the process. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.
    And who the hell would remember game scores from 12 years ago? How can anybody remember what happened during the Bulls three peat when they played in 1998 and we are now in 2011? I mean, who is going to have that sort of memory?
    I do remember Phil and Tex chastising Jordan for chucking, and I do remember hte Bulls losing games.
    Then again, Mike had arguably the second best wing player in the league to pick up his slack, and Kobe’s got Pau. Pau is nice, but he’s no Pippen.

  • http://www.dimemag.com Royal

    Yeah the Lakers suck right now.But they will bounce back….

  • briskin

    The lakers have won 12 games this season by 10 or more pts and have lost 4. I don’t c the problem laker haters lol

  • drew

    i knew this thread would get alot of hits but regarding the lakers’ main problems, it’s bad defense by everyone and poor offensive execution as a whole (pau’s not making shots like her normally does and the whole team just seems to be in a funk which why you see kobe having to gun at times.)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Allen, you need to get a prescription for some type of memory help pill.

  • Jackie Moon

    MJ would NEVER have _____________.
     
    That is why MJ is better than Kobe.

  • Darius

    Well, the Lakers are dealing with some problems earlier, with Phil & Ron. But now Kobe & his 1 on 1. Im pretty sure that it brung them a bit closer. All Im saying is. Artest, needs his performance to improve. More touches for the big guys aswell and Kobe more improved shooting. Because the only person I see consistently every night is L.O. and he has been tearing it up lately. (Dont forget about the bench either)

  • karma

    Hey geniuses, if you actually read the article that produced this quote, PHIL DIDN’T SAY IT AS AN INSULT. Of course, with a board filled with 15 year old’s and Kobe haters, no one is going to bother reading anything. Marcel, you need to do a better job of explaining the context behind the quote rather than look to increase traffic on the site. I’m disappointed.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    The lakers are playing very poorly in every facet of the game. Whats hilarious to me is what kobe and phil said after xmas game, and whats happened since. Lobe promised to get it right, phil had been pointing to the spurs game for a long time. Lakers keep losing. Mavs are in trouble, but only cuz of injuries, and its not toobad. …… Spurs keep rolling

  • Jackie Moon

    The Lakers would NEVER get blown out by a rival team by 37 points on the road.
     
    The 92-93 Bulls would NEVER have gotten blown out by 37 against a rival team on the road.
     
    Oh wait, 11/28/92 Knicks 112, Bulls 75.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Jackie, you’re a dumb guy. This hasn’t changed with the beginning of the New Year. All’s well in the SLAMOnline universe.

  • karma

    ^ Jackie, nice one.

    Don’t worry, JTaylor will now say that it was only one game and not three in a row.

    These idiots like to demean the Lakers whenever possible while front-running and cheering for a team like the Heat when they were hardcore Cavs “fans” last year. If a 27-27 (after December) Boston team can get to the NBA Finals while defeating 2 of the toughest teams in the East, then so can the Lakers in the West.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    I’ll make this game easier for your mental midgets……find me three games the Bulls lost at home in either of their last year of their three peats. Since you know, revisionist history works well when it comes to L.P.P (Lobe Protection Program). I use the Bulls as an example only because the Lakers are the only CURRENT team that can egual the dual threepeat feat if they win it this year. Ignorance obviously doesn’t allow the L.P.P to see this.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Just wanted to let everyone know, there’s 50 games left in the season

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Find me three games they lost *In decidedly lopsided fashion*

  • JTaylor21

    Ok so let me get this straight; losing to the grizz and bucks at home by damn near 20 points equates into losing to a very very good knicks team on the road? Boy you gotta love the logic laker fans go by just to fool themselves into thinking alls well in la la land.

  • slamfan4life

    MJ shot a lot too…………..DONT WORRY KOBE

  • http://stapledesign.com Spaceship Jay

    LOBE! ahahahhaha, I love SLAM online.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    I don’t know, Jtaylor……the Lakers were supposedly going to demolish the Heat on Christmas, you know, because “Kobe was seething since the summer that the Heat got all the attention instead of the Lakers back to back and he would take out his rage on them, Black Mamba style”. One of the morons above me said the exact thing. Actually, about 6 of them did. I guess that loss didn’t matter either. Or maybe Lobe forgot.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    MJ shot over 50%, Kobe shoots under 45%. There is a difference

  • karma

    WHO CARES if they are losing now???

    I think you losers are so used to seeing Lebron James’ teams win in the regular season and flame out in the playoffs that you expect the same from the Lakers. Try again, “mental midgets”.

  • Jackie Moon

    I can play the “pick a thing that another team didn’t” game easily.
    &nbsp:
    You find something the other team/player didn’t do, then find something the other team/player did, and then say the first team would NEVER have done what the second team did!
     
    Kobe would NEVER have quit basketball to play baseball, even for a year. Kobe is more dedicated to basketball than MJ!

  • karma

    Who cares if they are losing games by how much of a margin? How does that have an effect on them in the playoffs?

    I think you these LeDouche cheering losers are so used to seeing his teams dominate the regular season only to flame out and lose in the playoffs that they think the same thing will happen in the playoffs.

    And yes, pointing the Bulls teams out to prove a point is moronic and idiotic. Those teams a) played in an entirely different league and b) had a roster unlike the the Lakers’ roster. You’re better off using the 2001-2002 Lakers for comparison’s sake. BTW if you want a real comparison, the 2000-2001 Lakers won 56 games, struggled i nteh regular season and finished 15-1 in the playoffs. Chew on that maggots.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    ^ did you read that comment back to yourself before you posted it?

  • karma

    Again, since you numbnuts are likely not to read an elaborate response, I’ll dumb it down: if you want a real comparison, the 2000-2001 Lakers won 56 games, struggled in the regular season and finished 15-1 in the playoffs. So yes, it is that easy to turn it on. Chew on that maggots.

  • Riggs

    laker/kobe fans proving again that theyre retarded….

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    I love panic. This is like The Panic Room.

  • Jackie Moon

    Eboy casts his extreme doubts about the Lakers and Lobe being able to win the title for two straight seasons.
     
    The Lakers and Lobe win the title for two straight seasons.
     
    And I’m the mental midget?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    karma, unless Pau Gasol turns black, grows an inch, gains 80 lbs and becomes the most dominant force in all of basketball in the next 4 to 6 months, you just showed why Laker fans are laughed at by everyone else in the world.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    You know you don’t have to keep reposting the same thing over and over again. And your insult isn’t good, think of something else. And maybe come up with something better then the 2000 2001 Lakers who had Shaq and are not comparable to this team

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Yes, you are indeed. The league is no longer revolving around two or three really good teams. There’s about 6 to 8 that can compete for a title this season. Your girls are going to see what it’s like to have a hard road to deal with instead of a golden paved walkway.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Jahmai

    I’m thinking the exact same thing as ‘nbk’, there are about 50 games left and I don’t know why people who hate the Lakers are worrying for them, you don’t. I can’t wait for the playoffs to start! Luckily the NFL Playoffs are starting next week.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Jahmai

    *(you don’t) have to

  • karma

    @ Eboy – No, I’m using it as a reference. In 2001, the Spurs were the best team in a loaded Western conference. The Lakers were….wouldn’t you know it, 4th? My point is, its too early for you Laker-haters to make declarative statements. Don’t question my intelligence Eboy (or nbk for that matter), I’m not one of these youngins.

  • karma

    @ Eboy

    Yes because getting to the 2008 Finals in a loaded West was SO easy. Getting past the Celtics in 7 was SO easy. Beating a 50 win 8TH seed team was SO easy. Think before you speak.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Yes, karma, it’s not to early to criticize any team. Just like it wasn’t too early to criticize the Heat after 17 games? GTFOH with that bullsh*t. You may not be a youngin, but you can’t make a valid point that can’t be shot to sh*t.

  • karma

    “And maybe come up with something better then the 2000 2001 Lakers who had Shaq and are not comparable to this team”

    Yes…and the Bulls are comparable because….they had Luc Longley? Exactly. Shut up.

  • Jackie Moon

    You can criticize any team whenever you want.
     
    But it takes some intelligence to be right.

  • karma

    The Heat were criticized because the team was just assembled in the summer. This Lakers core has been to 3 Finals together and won 2 rings. Its easier to press the panic button on a team that was supposed to demolish the 72 win Bulls.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    you sound like a youngin. And idk how comparing these Laker teams makes sense to you except they both went on 3 peats and wear yellow and purple. All Laker fans are the same, ya’ll think everyone hates you, and that your team is the toilet paper that directly touched god’s a**. I still have LAL makin the finals, but not doing anything like that 2001 team. Be realistic, and nobody hates you, no need to be so defensive, aggressive, or ignorantly insulting

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Only idiots said that 72 win sh*t. Most of them reside on this website everyday.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    whoever expected, or believed people when they said Miami is going to win 72 games is just as delusioned as a Laker fan. If your both, then I’m sorry…there isn’t anything anyone can do

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    they both won back to backs*

  • Medd

    You mean the 2000-2001 Lakers with Shaq? The finals MVP and best player on that team? You mean the 2001 Shaq, who was in his prime?

  • JTaylor21

    All I know is that without HC, La is going to have to go on the road and win vs either Dallas or SA not those cupcake soft zone-playing Phx suns. We all know how on the road Gasol likes to “leave” his skills at home and when that happens; lobe will begin to think his MJ again and start his world-famous chucking routine. Keep on losing to bums and not having HC will bite their a** in the end.

  • JTaylor21

    Say it ain’t so; did someone just compare this laker squad with Mr. I Whip My Hair Gasol as their best post player to the ’01 squad that included the MDE and went on the best postseason run of all-time? May the lord have mercy on your poor soul.

  • karma

    Listen, the only reason I even post on this board (which is once every 2-3 weeks) is because EVERY single Lakers thread, its always the same people talking down the Lakers or Phil or Kobe, for no reason. Every single thread the MJ thing gets brought up, and its never by a Lakers fan, but in the end we’re the ones painted as moronic?

  • jtaylor21

    Okay, yoodles taste better with pink puffs. Sides of Scruff Mcgruff. You think your tough? Not enough. Zooms play rough in Saturn with tufts. Fistacuffts? Rip kim putt. How u ever had the feeling martians ate grass?

  • karma

    Once again, the 2000-2001 comparison was to show you that it is entirely possible to flip the switch and try; I didn’t mean compare the players on each team. Obviously, Shaq and a young Kobe are better than the declining Kobe/Pau combo. I’m saying it is possible for a team to cruise (mentally) through the regular season yet turn it on for the playoffs. The ’10 Celtics did it, and so did the 2005 Pistons to push an amazing Spurs team to 7 games.

  • JTaylor21

    Looks like morons are still posting BS under other people’s name; different toilet, same sh*t, different year, same sh*t.!

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    there is not a single logical person in here that said LA couldn’t make it to the finals. Your defending nothing, you came up with a comparison that didn’t make sense for no reason, defended it for no reason, and are getting defensive for no reason. You might get defensive poster of the year. slams own DPOY

  • Jackie Moon

    Jtaylor, since you are so smart, when the playoffs roll around, just bet all of your money against the Lakers if they play a series on the road. $$$$$$$$. Good luck!

  • Jackie Moon

    And one last thing, rip skip scum pit. The food I had last winter was blood steak. Kobe swam past Fetterbake. Chocolate cookie Lakers have brown boots.

  • Mvp23100

    So when exactly do you hit the panic button like I’ve said they haven’t played championship caliber ball all year And Kobe is not getting any younger taking bad shots and having trouble against mediocre 2 guards on this same board 9 games in the heat were being picked apart so it’s safe to say the Lakers have big problems

  • JTaylor21

    Remember I’m not saying that LA won’t make it to the finals because who the hell really knows what happens come playoff time but their road back to the finals will be a lot much tougher than the last couple of years without HCA.

  • Mvp23100

    Spurs vs Heat would be a nice finals I guess but I much rather see 24 get his head busted by wade and Ron Ron lose his last bit of mind trying to chase Bron

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Jackie, how many titles has Phil Jackson won without homecourt advantage. Go ahead, i’ll wait

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Lakers fans are funny. The fact that they dont see how goofy they look is even funnier. Lobe throwing his whole team under the bus, phil pointing to the spurs game, lobes continued chucking are all also funny

  • mark

    bla bla bla

    This is the same as the heat situation a few months ago. lakers will win the league because they are the best team out there.

  • Jackie Moon

    A lot much tougher? Where did you go to school?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    ^^ haha – they prolly will, but this is different in one very big way, this Lakers squad has been together for a minute. They shouldn’t be having these blame game issues

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    nbk – Utah had homecourt advantage in the finals in ’98.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    When you’re on top, everyone wants to see you fall…

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    1 is that it?

  • kc

    Kobe is a gunner, always has been, and always will be!!!

  • Jackie Moon

    Jtaylor, nbk, I hope the Lakers have a playoff series on the road. You will both be rich after betting all of your savings against the Lakers, since you are so certain!
     
    I will not be betting either way, since I am not certain.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    One, that’s it.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    None, if you count Phil’s time in LA.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    lol I have said on here, and like 75 other pages that I have LA making the finals. If they don’t have homecourt in that series, and I can just bet on the winner, rather then the spread, I will surely bet against LA. unless their playing Orlando – in 20 years, with 11 rings Phil Jackson has only won a championship without homecourt once. How many series without homecourt has Kobe won in his career? does anyone know that answer, is it even 1?

  • http://slamonline.com tina

    the only bright side of this, nvm there is none. GET IT TOGETHER LAKERS!!!!

  • http://slamonline BossTerry

    Yay, Santa finally got the letter I wrote to him!!

  • Jackie Moon

    Nbk – “How many series without homecourt has Kobe won in his career?”
     
    5 road series wins – Supersonics 97-98, Swept Spurs 00-01, Kings 01-02, Wolves 02-03, Wolves 03-04. In road playoff series, Kobe is 5-7.
     
    But for some perspective MJ is 5-7 in road playoffs series, although he has won a Finals on the road (Utah 97-98)
     
    Shaq is an interesting case bc he is 7-7 in road playoffs series (The Lakers portion with him and Kobe is 5-5 for both). But Shaq is comes out worse than both Kobe and MJ, because many of his teams with HCA lost (Magic, Cavs). So Shaq’s team lost more when they were “supposed” to win.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    HCA only matters in the Finals. HCA throughout the Playoffs is overrated.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    nbk – 2002 NBA Western Conference Finals. Third-seeded Lakers defeated top-seeded Kings.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    And for the record, I don’t really care about the Lakers. Just trying to find the answers to nbk’s trivia questions.

  • jtaylor21

    Kobe is a ball hog. Lebron is a demigod. Frogs Love crickets, bears have iPods. Wait til my album drops. It’s gonna be called Skittles, Basketball, and UFOs.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    97-98 Lakers had Homecourt and finished with the 1 seed – but thank you, and that proves that Kobe needs homecourt after the first round, and Phil pretty much needs it to win titles, well that or Michael Jordan.

  • Jackie Moon

    And here’s clarification on that quote from Lakers beat writer Kevin Ding. Taken out of context, it sounds like a barb from Phil, but it’s not.
     
    http://lakers.ocregister.com/2011/01/03/dont-believe-hype-that-kobe-and-phil-are-sniping/46048/

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Kobe needs homecourt after the conference rounds* my bad blindly typing

  • http://www.nba.com Gman

    WTef happened in here.. WAR!!!! MJ > KB so what else is new.

    Lakers will be fine. This team is stacked. When time comes to kick ass I am sure they will be ready.

  • Jackie Moon

    97-98 Sonic and Lakers were both 61-21. Basketball-reference has them playing in Seattle first.
     
    Not sure what this proves, really. You keep changing it the criteria to fit what you want to believe. But OK, if that’s what you take from it, great. I think it’s more telling when you lose WITH HCA, something Kobe and MJ’s teams did not do very often.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Eboy was right, I couldn’t find a single instance of the Bulls being blown out at home during their three peats. On the road, yes, at home, no.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Jackie, my criteria for what? i asked a question. And what are you trying to prove? all I’m arguing is that it will be immensely difficult and unlikely for LA to win a title without homecourt. Your the one making pointless comparisons and meaningless points like that last one. Who doesn’t win consistently when they have homecourt? You think about that before you made that remark

  • JeffOG

    I have a question, of all the people here speaking for Phil Jackson how many of you are just now hearing of his comment? I bet none of you did before you read this blog. Those of us who saw Jackson make the comment don’t need a beat writer or the Slam crew to translate what he meant. Anyway, the Lakers will be fine. I hate them more than anything but even I can admit they are still contenders.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    The largest margin of defeat was 14 at home, and that only happened once.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Allen, you should have trusted me. I’m a 80′s/90′s Bulls historian. Well, a Michael one, but that’s neither here nor there.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Also, when the Bulls lost a game at home back in the day, the usual next day reaction was “how the fu*k did that happen?” This is not a common thread that runs through this Laker championship squad.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Eboy is the guy who gave Pat Riley the idea to retire 23 in Miami….

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Well that was a pretty audacious claim, and when it comes to Lobe and the Lakers you’re not exactly an unbiased source of information.
    Anyway, if any of y’all actually look at Chicago’s performances from those years, they absolutely dominated at home, and weren’t shabby at all on the road. They did get blown out by the Lakers a few times on the road though.

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    The Lakers should be contracted and the season should be shortened to 40 games! It’s all over!

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Am I the only one of the regular commenter here that remember how dominant the Bulls really were? I mean ass-kickingly dominant from season to season? Not just pointing to one game here or there to try and put up invalid points as they were “vulnerable” as most do?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    The only time the champion Bulls weren’t dominate was when Michael was in Birmingham.

  • JeffOG

    Until Phil Jackson himself “clarifies” his remark, no one else’s explanation is valid.

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    I remember the Bulls not having much competition.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Well, I think time had dulled my memory, plus you were already an adult when the Bulls were dominating while I was a pre-teen and teenager, and many of the commenters were babies or unused sperm.
    I knew they killed everybody, but I didn’t realize how complete it was.
    Then again, Mike rolled with Scottie. This cannot be ignored. Kobe has not played with anyone like that since Shaq.

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Jay

    rumor has it the Lakers are in very private talks with Allen Iverson, Mitch Kupchak was spotted in Turkey yesterday at a Besiktas game!!!!!!!!! AI on LA? what yall think

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    Kobe would NEVER have drafted Kwame Brown. And NEVER have signed again to the team he owns.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    “and many of the commenters were babies or unused sperm” One for the SLAM Hall of Fame! LMAO! Yes, Scottie’s role could never be understated.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    This years lal are the 07 heat. Satisfied, fat, getting old, other teams are better, etc. Its the perfect storm of non title contention. ………. Spurs continue winning. And a scary thought for the rest of the league, they look to be improving on defense. ….

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    You mean you remember chicago so thoroughly destroying everyone it didn’t seem like competition? Because if i’m not mistaken Michael prevented top 10 players at every position from getting a title during the 90′s – Barkley, Ewing, Malone, Stockton, Reggie. Lets not for GP, Shawn Kemp (not a top 10 PF but amazing at the time). Michael had plenty of competition

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    As much as Michael helped, many of those guys stood in their own way. Like Barkley. And Malone. And Ewing. And Reggie…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Mr Brown, I would say that the two Utah teams were pretty rock solid with two HOF players. I don’t know if the Lakers were old and not ready for what the Bulls brought, but they were had a champion pedigree with Magic. The Suns were hugely talented the year they were in the Finals. The Blazers had a ton of talent too. The Sonics may have been the easiest win of the 6 since they really were light after Payton and Kemp. But to undersell who the Bulls had to go through in the East? Please. The Ewing Knicks, finally getting past the Pistons, later against a strong, defensive minded Heat squad and a really solid Pacer team that Bird coached. You’re just trying to shortchange like you normally do. I understand why you do it, but it’s not a sound arguing position.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    All that being said, beating the Celtics last season in the Finals was the toughest win Phil’s teams have had to endure in his time in LA. There’s no doubt they earned it even if Kendrick Perkins disagrees.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    How did Barkley stand in his own way? He had an MVP season inwhich his team made the finals, and they took that bulls team closer to a game 7 then any team they ever faced

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    As hard a worker as Money was, Charles was just as well, lazy. He never matched MJ’s intensity or focus. Scottie said as much when the Rockets blew up. As clutch as Money was, Malone was just as not. He’s widely regarded as a choker. “The Mailman doesn’t deliver on Sundays”? Game 6? Drexler was defeated before he even stepped on a court with Michael. Mike was on him ever since he showed up at Dream Team practice with two left shoes. Mike never had a true peer like Bron or Wade and never faced as complete a team as the Celtics. This doesn’t mean Mike wasnt sh*t but it is easier to dominate when your competition is fundamentally flawed.

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    The best team Mike faced in a Final were the Sonics. The best team in the east were the Knicks. Neither of them could handle today’s Celtics. The best player during Mikes reign was Malone, who is no LeBron. There was an SI cover asking were the Bulls so good they’re bad for the league? Despite the presence of two other sixty win teams, the league was watered down and there may have been competitors but not competition.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Myles, Myles Myles
    Don’t you believe LeBron is fundamentally flawed? And since Wade is beneath Bron on your list, he would be flawed as well, correct?
    I think Mike and Scottie were so good, they made teams that dominated everybody else look bad.
    I agree with all the faults you named, but every Hall of Famer has flaws, Mike just took full advantage of those flaws. You could argue that last year’s Celtics team had its best player on one leg, had a point guard who couldn’t hit the side of a barn with the a jumpshot, had a sharpshooter who lost his range, and had a slasher/scorer who got locked up by an elite defender. And, we all know KG isn’t known for riding the clutch bus even if I think he’s improved in that area.
    I think the biggest difference was that Mike was always rolling with the second most complete player in the league as his sidekick. After Jordan, Pippen was the best two-way player in the league outside of Hakeem. And we will never know what would have happened with Hakeem thanks to Jordan’s dalliance.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Everything you said is very true. No arguments. But I think EVERY champion, probably in every sport, can cite some sort of point/counterpart that can be argued into giving that particular champion some sort of competition edge, whether it be familiarity with a particular opponent, some sort of weird ability to play exceedingly well on another teams home field/court or just off the charts intangibles, like Michael’s foam at the mouth killer instinct.

  • tony knorr

    wow @ jackie moon. you are a class act. calling out mike for trying to full fill a dream that his father and him had together after his dad was brutally murdered. Kobe does not have more dedication to the game of basketball than mike. Hell no one on earth loves the game more than mike. Kobe is as dedicated to basketball as it gets but so is mike and a few million other people on this earth but to say that mike is less dedicated just for trying to do his pops proud is just retarded.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Whoa.
    Hakeem was the best player in the West. Period. After Mike, Hakeem was the best, and I’d argue that David Robinson might have been better than Malone.
    Hell, Pippen was better than Malone given his versatility and defense.
    Sonics were weak after Kemp and Payton. Hershey Hawkins on Jordan? Come on now.
    Suns were the most talented team, followed by the Blazers, at least on paper. Lakers were the weakest team Mike faced, and neither of them was as weak as the Nets and Sixers, who Kobe got in the Finals when he had Shaq. I think Orlando is a step below the Suns, Sonics, Blazers, and Jazz.
    Kobe has five rings, to get those five rings, he’s only really beaten one serious team in the Finals, and he also lost to that same team when all of its players were healthy. He also lost to the second best team he’s faced, the 2004 Pistons, and I’m not sure that Pistons team was truly better than the Knicks team that Mike had to beat in the East.

  • Donn

    Is to late to get Ariza back?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Oh my bad, that Pacers team the Lakers beat for ring number one was a serious team. I mean, they had just finished taking Jordan’s Bulls to seven, two years before the Lakers beat them.

  • http://www.twitter.com/TheDiesel Anton

    Kobe’s just helping his teammates get involved by creating lots of opportunities for offensive rebounds.

  • http://nationofmillions.ca ciolkstar

    SPURS >>>>>>>Lakers

  • Diesel

    Eboy is the only one who remembers how happy the villagers were when the found a cure for small pox. Just kidding buddy. I remember how dominant the bulls were. U were shocked if they lost a game. I had so much confidence in them that the scottie pippen led squad that made it to the conference finals didn’t surprise me.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Diesel, I was actually one of the test subjects for the vaccine.

  • http://thetroyblog.com Teddy-the-Bear

    Scottie Pippen was definitely not better than Karl Malone…

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    if all you care about is offense, sure

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    It’s only January 3rd, but Allenp’s “unused sperm” comment is the early favorite for COY (comment of the year).

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Scottie not better than Karl Malone? Now there is a debate worth having. Not MJ vs Kobe vs LeBron.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Exactly NBK.
    Although, to be fair, I should have said you could “argue” that Pippen was better. It’s not clear cut given how outstanding Malone was at rebounding and scoring.
    But Scottie’s overall game, particularly his defense, cannot be ignored. As much as Jordan’s legend has grown since he retired, Scottie’s has been diminished. People don’t understand that Pippen was a sidekick, but only because the best player on his team was the absolute best player in the league (all respect to Hakeem though.)

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Here is a question?
    Was Pippen, in his prime, better than a prime Dirk? A prime KG?
    If your answer is “yes” then that right there explains exactly how much “help” Jordan had on his way to becoming a legend.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Scottie > Prime Dirk —– Scottie = Prime KG. But scotties is 300 times better then KG in the clutch

  • JTaylor21

    Whoa Whoa slow your roll AllenP, I know that we both agree on a few subjects but I’m calling BS on the Pip being better than Malone tip. I regard Pip as a Top-5 SF and the greatest defensive player of all-time but better than Malone he was not. People tend to underrate Malone a lot because he didn’t win the almight ring but no one can deny the numbers dude put up. No one player was dominant as long as Malone was other than Kareem, to put up 25+ppg and 10+ rpg for damn near 13 straight years is downright filthy and even a player many regard as the GPFOAT never came close to achieving that kind of sustained dominance.

  • Jackie Moon

    nbk- Of course, it is harder to win with HCA. But you asked a question – how many series has Lobe won without HCA, and asked if it was even one. Then when I show it is five (same as Jordan), you say, well Lobe needs it for conference finals and above. How convenient. That’s what I mean by changing your criteria. It was five times what you thought, and still, not good enough.

  • ClydeSays

    Pretty sure KG never refused to go back in a game. Pick up ball, high school, AAU or the NBA.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Scottie wasn’t a prolific scorer like Dirk, but did everything else better (considering he was a SF and Dirk’s a PF with SF skills). I think he was probably equal to a prime KG in overall talent, with a bit more clutchness. If KG or Dirk played with Mike, what would their career resumes look like?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    KG and Mike put the league on lock, no doubt…
    Mike kills Dirk by year three and is sentenced to life in the federal pen.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    JTaylor
    I respect what you’re saying for real. As far as scoring, Malone is in the same conversation with Jordan, Kareem and Mike. For the record, Wilt isn’t in that conversation because nobody talks to Wilt about scoring. He’s like E.F. Hutton.
    I think Malone wasn’t clutch, and he wasn’t clutch his entire career. I think he wasn’t a lockdown defender and I’m still shocked at how easily Rodman got in his head.
    Plus, it cannot be overlooked that the most iconic play of Jordan’s career came after a Malone miscue.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    I didn’t think anything, I asked. Your delusional if you think I was trying to disprove anything or fit some kind of criteria. I’ve been very consistent on my View of the Lakers since before the season started. I have them getting to the finals and if all teams are healthy, losing. That’s all that I have said about LA, there is no criteria or good enough or whatever your getting defensive about

  • Jackie Moon

    *without HCA

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Pippen refused to go back in the game because he wasn’t the type of cat to jump in Phil’s face and curse him out on the sideline.
    It was disrespectful for Phil to draw up that shot for Kukoc, I don’t care if he made it.

  • JTaylor21

    Prime KG > Prime Pip. People forget that sota KG was an all-around beast and put up numbers comparably to only Larry Bird, the only difference being he was a better defender than bird. Just imagine if he had spent his prime years on a team like the 08 celtics; whoooo that team would have won 70gms easily and KG would have put up 22/15/7/2/2 without breaking a sweat.

  • Jackie Moon

    Your words – “that proves that Kobe needs homecourt after the first round, and Phil pretty much needs it to win titles”.
     
    That is what happened, but it doesn’t “prove” anything, really. There could be other reasons those teams lost, besides not having HCA.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Pippens wife is friends with glen rice s wife.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    KG’s early numbers were bananas, but he would have had to adjust playing with Mike. I don’t think it would have been tough. The only problem was that back in the day, the league was STACKED as far as bigs, but a little lighter when it came to dominant wings. That’s what made Scottie and Mike so hard to deal with.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Allen, gotta disagree with you on that one.
    Pip’s refusing to go back into the game was insubordination at its finest.
    It was smart of Phil to draw up that play for Kukoc. Pip had already burned the Knicks for 25 in the game. Having Kukoc take the GW showed how much faith he had in The Waiter and he knew it would throw NY off guard.

  • JTaylor21

    AllenP, I understand that Malone wasn’t the most clutch cat out there but it wasn’t like Pip was making anyone remember Jerry West out there. That one sequence when he refused to go into a game because PJax called the play for Kukoc was downright disgraceful. You don’t do that no matter how disrespected you may feel, imagine if Wade or Bron decided to sit out a final play because Spo ran it for EHouse? The media and fans would have shredded them to pieces.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    lol as i said i meant after the conference rounds for Kobe. And for Phil I said to win titles or he needs Michael Jordan. – And proves (in the way i meant it), means its a fact, which as of right now it is.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Eff that Bryan.
    If I’m the best player on the team, and I’m KILLING, I get the ball. Those are the rules.
    I don’t care how much we’re down by, I get to take taht shot. Pippen earned that shot toiling in Jordan’s shadow. Phil knew how Scottie felt about Tony, and about his contract and about his place in the game alongside Jordan. That was Pippen’s moment, and instead of it leading to redemption it led to further pain.
    Riddle me this, if MJ had hit for 25, you think Phil is drawing up a play where Jordan is the decoy?

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Damn allen, no23 is so good he made your list with his first and last name. …… And who is ef hutton? …………. What if, somehow, kg joined tmac in orlando in 2000?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    And Kukoc was a better shooter lol

  • EJ

    Why are MJ fans always getting upset with the Kobe vs MJ comprassion, when they always bring it up??

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Lol @ Tarzan.
    I messed up on that one. You need to google E.F. Hutton to get the allusion.
    But, the catchphrase for Hutton was that when he talked, people listened.
    If TMac and KG had joined forces, and TMac committed to defense, then we would have multiple chances to determine who was better between Garnett and Duncan in the Finals, and we would have seen how Kobe fared against a near equal in the Finals as well.
    It would have been epic.

  • JTaylor21

    Put it like this would have the 91-93 bulls been better with KG than they were with HoGrant (Damn right), Would the late 90s bulls be better with KG than with Rodman (not as much because I don’t think that KG could have pulled off the defensive gem Rodman had on Malone). They would have been way better offensively but they would have suffered a bit on the defensive end due to KG’s lack of girth. Also was prime KG better than 90s CB34 or 90s KMalone?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Dennis neutralized Shaq in 96. THAT was huge.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Back up, I remember how dominant those Bulls teams were. Come on now, I watched every game. But I was also 14 when they won their last title…

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Allen, MJ is no decoy, you know this.
    Also, I understand that was Pip’s moment, but Phil also took a gamble as well. He ran the risk of going down 3-0 in the series.
    Interestingly enough, that play actually made Kukoc into the player he ultimately became.
    Tarzan not knowing who EF Hutton is = unused sperm! LOL

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Because its a bad comparison, that is hard to translate because their physical appearance, style of play, system, and success are all very similar. But Jordan’s impact completely dwarfs Kobe’s. Thats not to say Kobe isn’t a great player, or one of the best ever, but the comparison as a serious “Kobe could be Michaels equal” is out of the question ridiculous.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Damn, Enigmatic… I was 14 when they won their 1st one.
    I’m old.
    Not as old as Eboy, but old just the same.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Man in that series, Kukoc only got the double figures ONCE. And he scored 12! It was his rookie year in the league, he was not killing, and for the season he shot 34 percent from three. In comparison, Scottie had been killing hte whole series, and shot 33 percent from three.
    Scottie deserved that shot.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Ill check out hutton. And thats why I asked cuz I thought that duo would really challenge lakers and spurs. But what happened, happened, grant got hurt,. And kg lost in the first round many times……… Jtaylor, kg had things on defense that rodman didnt, but he was still da kid then, and didnt have his complete tool box yet.

  • Jackie Moon

    Fast like a Nascar! Vroom vroom in ya boom boom

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    4, I was 4 years old when the Bulls won their first title. That’s crazy to me

  • Jackie Moon

    Re: Kukoc taking the last shot.
     
    How can you argue the decision given the result?

  • Hursty

    Love AllenPs comment at 4.51. So on point, except for the height disparity which is hard to cover with elite swingmen in today’s League and lack of superior 2 way players.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    It was blatant disrespect and the only reason Phil gets a pass for it is because Scottie is seen as surly and soft, while Phil is a genius.
    Plus, it angers fans everywhere to consider a player telling a coach he refuses to play. For some reason that grinds our collective gears.
    I don’t have that problem. I thought it was wrong even back then that Scottie didn’t get that shot. I can imagine how pissed he was after carrying that team all year, and showing everybody he could hoop without Mike. He was considered by many to be the best or second best player in the league that year, and for him to be told that a freaking ROOKIE was getting the last second shot instead of him, well that is just beyond bogus. I don’t care what it did for Kukoc’s middling career.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Allen, I didn’t say that Kukoc was killing, but you’ve got to hand it to Phil to have the stones to put the game in the hands of a rookie.
    And I understand Pip being pissed, and I agree that he should’ve been given an opportunity to win the game, but I’ve learned over the years that PJax has a reason for everything.
    Realistically speaking, I don’t think Pip hits that shot. NY’s defense would’ve keyed in on him making it extremely difficut given the circumstances to get it off. Kukoc would’ve had a much more open look at it.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Jackie
    That’s an “end justifys the means” argument and I try to stay away from that justification as much as possible. That’s a slippery slope.
    On paper, it was a dumbass move, and it alienated his best player. Sure, it worked, but it still showed Pippen up and forever darkened his rep.
    Kind of like riding a book about Kobe.
    Phil is a bit of penis.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I guess my comment disappeared into the ether.
    Anyway, Jackie, you’re saying that the ends justify the means, and I’ve never liked that argument.
    Phil made a decision that went against almost all collective wisdom and had the added bonus of showing up his best player. That it worked is luck, not a sign that it was the right decision.
    It’s kind of similar to how he wrote a tell-all book about Kobe before coming back to coach him. That worked out too, but that doesn’t make the book a smart move.

  • JTaylor21

    AllenP, come on so. So now players deserve shots? You’re better than that. Pip was never a great 3pt shooter, so PJax decided to use him as a decoy to open up a good look for a better 3pt shooter in Kukoc. The same way MJ was used as a “decoy” to setup GW shots for Kerr and Paxson. Just because you’re the best player doesn’t mean you gotta take every GW shot.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan, I can see that argument.
    But eff that. Teams ALWAYS keyed in on Jordan on every last second shot he hit. Didn’t stop him from getting the ball. Pippen was asked to carry Jordan’s burden that year. Dammit, if the man is going to be given the responsibility, he deserves the rewards. That’s just how I see life.

  • http://Www.slamonline.com Myles brown

    Michael decided to make Kerr the secondary option. Phil didn’t draw that play up. HUGE difference.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Myles saved me the keystrokes.
    Great players deserves shots. That’s the gift and the curse.
    Think about it.

  • Jackie Moon

    @Allenp- you have a point, ends doesn’t always justify the means, but I do think it indicates that Phil had some insight into what the best shot to take would be and who would have the best chance to make it considering the situation. No one is “deserved” a last shot, it’s a matter of strategy and circumstance. In game 4 of the 2009 Finals, with the Lakers down 3, Phil told Kobe he thought the Magic would try to foul him, and so to pass it on if a Magic player came near him when he had the ball. He passed it off to Ariza, and Ariza gave it to Fisher who hit the three. Not exactly the same thing as a last second shot, but point stands that the best player does not always get the last shot.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    I think Allen has argued me onto his side of all this. Its not like some team that plays 8 games, they played a full season with scottie as “the man,” might as well act like it. If Phil drew up that play with MJ in the huddle he would have either done the same thing, or walked up to whoever was inbounding the ball and said, look you better give me the f’n ball or you’ll be wearing a different jersey next season.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Why the hell everytime there’s actually a really dope discussion on here worth chopping it up about, it’s on days when I’m hella busy at work?! Damnit…

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Allen, I think Phil knew then what we all know now… Pip wasn’t a clutch player.

  • http://slamonline.com Ben Osborne

    Dear Kobe,

    Thanks for generating so much web traffic.

    Love,
    SLAM Ed.

  • JTaylor21

    If MJ was man enough to pass up a GW shot to kerr why couldn’t have Pip been man enough to be a decoy. I don’t understand how people can take what PJax did as being disrespectful to pip? Isn’t his job as a coach to make sure that he draws up the right play regardless of whether his freaking best player’s pouting. Also MJ was the first option at all times because he was a better offensive player and shooter than Pip could have ever dreamed of. Like BCrawford said, the chances of Pip hitting that shot with the knicks D focused on him was little to none. Kukoc made the freaking shot, y’all acting like he chucked up an airball.

  • http://brimartin13@gmail.com Brion

    What will yall do when its a Celtics / Spurs finals?

  • Yesse

    I really agree with Phil Jackson and Kobe should pass the ball around alot more. Lakers better get their heads straight or San Antonio will be in the finals.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Crawford, so im unused sperm for not knowing about a brokerage firm? A financial company that kited checks among other shady tactics, and got the slap on the wrist from the feds. A cheating financial company that got over on everyone and received no real punishment? Thats not common. And the companys been basically non existant for over twenty years. And im unused sperm for not knowing about the company? I could say that your mother uses my sperm for many things including but not limited to: a facial mask, stomach liner, and colon cleanser. But I wont say that. Instead, ill just say that your comment about me being unused sperm for not knowing about a long-obsolete company is misplaced and lame. ……….. … Lobe is a will continue to chuck because he does not want to be a second option again, esp if that means pau is the first option. Even tho that would be best for the team. Remember the mvp candidate pau from earlier? Lobe put an end to that. Now, pau cant get 10 shots a game.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    MJ choosing to pass off his own shot, is wholly different then Scottie not even having a say.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Oh and Allen, Phil drawing up that play for Kukoc didn’t darken Pip’s rep, Scottie’s refusal to go back into the game darkened his rep.
    And then there was that incident where he threw the chair… But that’s a convo for another day.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Tarzan
    Chill man, he wasn’t going at your neck, he was referencing my earlier comment that many of y’all are youngin’s who get certain allusions or remember certain events because you weren’t alive when they happened
    JTaylor
    Myles and NBK have explained this already. It’s an entirely different animal when a player makes a decision to pass the ball and when a coach draws up a shot for someone else.
    Against Utah one of those years, the Bulls were down three with time for one shot. You know who shot that three? It sure the hell wasn’t Steve Kerr or Toni Kukoc. Jordan, a pretty poor three point shooter for his whole career, took that shot because that’s what Jordan does!
    Bryan
    Pippen deserved to called out back when he was getting migraines against Detroit, but by 94, he was clutch. He wasn’t MJ clutch, but he was clutch. Bottom line, he was more clutch than Kukoc, and according to the numbers, was nearly his equal as a three point shooter.
    Sure, Phil’s decision won the game, but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t disrespectful and it doesn’t mean Pippen wasn’t justified in saying “Go f*ck yourself” to Phil.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Bryan
    Phil put Pippen in that position. Scottie doesn’t refuse to go in if he’s given a chance to take that shot.
    Y’all have to put yourself in Pippen’s shoes. He had carried the load. He had proven himself on the toughest stage. He was the effing MAN that year, and Phil then draws up a play for Toni Kukoc the “Euro Magic” who Pippen made it his business to embarass in Barcelona, and who came into the league as a rookie making like $5 million more than Scottie.
    This wasn’t a little decision by Phil’s calculating butt. He knew EXACTLY what he was doing, and that’s why he would have NEVER drawn up the same play for Jordan no matter what the defense knew.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    Actually Tarzan, the unused sperm comment alluded to the youth of a lot of the commenters here. That’s why I said it in reference to you and EF Hutton.
    No need to get all defensive, stupid, and downright disrespectful about it.
    But since you went there…
    Had your mom not decided to turn her life around, you wouldn’t even be here. You would’ve ended up on her blouse after she wiped the corners of her mouth. Which probably would’ve been best.

  • http://Slamonline.com Nbk

    @Brion – you mean Heat/Spurs Final? Either way, I will cry manly tears into my soup.

  • Jackie Moon

    That last nbk comment was me, not nbk. Also, I now know nbk’s email address. Not that I would do anything with it. Thanks, Slam online web designers!

  • http://Slamonline.com Nbk

    ^ that wasn’t me

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Scottie Pippen made a little over $3 mil in ’94. I’d be p*ssed too if on top of that, I didn’t get the last shot.

  • JTaylor21

    AllenP, great points but Kukoc made the damn shot. Who gives a f*ck about scottie’s feelings, dude acted like a feline there and that’s what blackened his otherwise stellar career. There’s nothing anyone can say that can excuse Pip’s behavior, you don’t do that to your teammates no matter what. Just imagine if Wade or Bron had decided not to enter those games vs NO and Utah in the closing seconds because Spo drew up the final shot for eddie freaking house. That’s what makes basketball so fun and challenging because it takes a combined team effort to win games not one pouting a** star.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    What makes a commenter on here young? I’m 26. I’m a youngin’ to some, but I’m an old fart to others. I think it’s all relative.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    JTaylor
    Again, you’re arguing that since things turned out well, it was the right choice.
    If Kukoc’s misses the shot, is it still the right choice?
    The right choice is not always determined by outcome, at least not in my opinion.
    Jordan make a commerical about all the times he missed game winning shots, does that mean him taking the shot was the wrong choice?
    Nah, Phil made the wrong choice, got the right result, and Scottie got the blame because most people think players are the employees of coaches.
    They are not.

  • Conoro

    The sheer volume of trolls on here who CONTINUALLY and ANNUALLY put so much credence in the regular season are ridiculous. One would think that after the second or third consecutive year of being ashamedly wrong that they would stop. Yet that doesn’t seem to be the case; which seems to be more of a reflection of their collective intelligence… (Eboy, jTaylor – HaHaHa-, et al.)

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    I see now that allen started the unused ssperm thing and you were just going with that. I thought you just took a shot at me from nowhere. I dont know your mother, but im sure shes a nice lady. ……

  • the nerve

    i’ll take it from here. dont talk bout dat nickas family or else he’ll kill ya.
    OH NOOOOOOOOOO!!!

  • cleveland87

    @ eboy

    Florida = pseudo sports fans

  • JTaylor21

    AllenP, you’re making great points but I think you still fail to look at the big picture. I said that he let his teammates down not the coach. The players are not the coaches employees but they do have a duty to have their teammates back at all times on the floor and for their teammates to be able to trust them. Also are you really trying to compare MJ’s ability to make clutch shots to Pip’s? I would rather have MJ taking a contested half court shot for the GW than Pip take a wide open 3pt. Last but not least; did Kobe refuse to enter the game vs the spurs because PJax ran the GW shot for DFish?

  • http://Slamonline.com Nbk

    JTaylor has been around for years? Conoro comments what once every couple weeks lol random

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    JTaylor, you can’t compare the ’94 Pippen/Kukoc relationship to the ’04 Bryant/Fisher relationship.
    Kobe and Fisher came in together as rookies, came up together and had mad love for one another and all that.
    Scottie had put in years of work by Kukoc’s arrival, yet management still treated Kukoc like he was the golden boy and the future of the franchise.
    Krause was absolutley enamored with Kukoc and there’s no way anyone can say that didn’t rub Scottie the wrong way.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Y’all don’t remember how much Scottie hated Kukoc and Krause, and how much he felt betrayed at times by Phil. This was a powder keg man.
    But, we ain’t gonna agree, it’s been nice talking about it.

  • http://Slamonline.com Nbk

    JTaylor how can you know if Pip was a clutch shot maker? MJ (rightly so) took or decided who took all of them. And if you haven’t noticed it was always him or the best shooter on the team when the shot was most important. But HE, Michael Jordan, as the Best Player and catalyst to the teams success made that decision. Not Phil Jackson. It sounds weird but the play should be drawn up for the player who put in the most work. Like a pick and pop between Scottie and Tony, anything that gets your best player involved IMO

  • JTaylor21

    Enigmatic, if you put it that way, I feel where Pip’s coming from. I probably would have pouted also but I would have at least be in the game. Though I don’t competely agree with AllenP’s and your point of view, let’s just agree to disagree.

  • http://slamonline.com Bryan Crawford

    It’s all good, Tarzan. No harm done. I respect you because you actually add valuable basketball commentary and you don’t show up just to troll…

  • OvaChicken

    The Heat should bring home the title this year. LOBE is the rapists new nickname & Brain Craw-Fish you think youre old at thirty something? Youre younger than me & id still kik ur fanny on the court. Wipe ur face with my ass, salt included. Make U SLOBBER-ON-MY-DOBBER B!t(h !! Don’t talk the talk if your monna sux …. —-> :-( ======8

  • OvaChicken

    YO MOMMAS MOMMA FANNY BOZ !!!!

  • OvaChicken

    YO MOMMAS SHOULDA SWALLOWED YOU !!!!!!!!!!

  • OvaChicken

    sorry i take that back now i didnt mean to offend any homosexuals on this site. No hard feelings B ?

  • OvaChicken

    sorry bout that wee man , i take it back. but it was fun !

  • the nerve

    Did yall kno the last time I wiped my ass Shermon Hemsley had hair on the top of his head? That built up fecal matter poisoned me all the way up to my brain. Plus, I hav a crush on Bryan.

  • Jackie Moon

    People tell me I am very mature for an eight year old.

  • Jackie Moon

    @Ovachicken Yay- you made a gay joke, by implying that someone was a homosexual, as if that was a terrible thing to be. Kudos to you, you awesome straight guy!

  • http://slamonline.com tealish

    Allenp — I understand Pip’s frustration. But there are about 82 better ways to vent your frustration in that situation. Even telling Phil to eff out, is fine. Refusing to return to the floor with your teammates when the effin’ game is on the line, is NOT one of them.

  • http://slamonline.com tealish

    off*

  • Jackie Moon

    Me being gay doesn’t make me less a man. So yea I’m offended by your gay jokes. Grow up!

  • the nerve

    I aint gonna fuuk w/u 2 nite man. u my ni99a.

  • the nerve

    Did you guys kno I was a science experiment gone wrong? Also, I’m gayer than Jackie Moon and sunshine with rainbows. But that’s beside the point. I’m in love with Bryan. There…I said it. I rarely shower.

  • http://www.need4sheed.com Tarzan Cooper

    Cool. See you tmrw crawford. …… Strange how the post up was a ghost town today because of phils comment about lobe. …. I bet figman is sad.

  • the nerve

    I’d teabag Kobe if I had the chance

  • the nerve

    I did the 3rd grade 6 times.

  • JeffOG

    Heat will beat the Lakers in the Finals this year. $500 wager. Takers?

  • Jackie Moon

    @JeffOG you can go to Vegas for that sort of stuff

  • http://slamonline.com Ugh

    Put the word ‘Kobe’ in the title and you get 200 comments. Do these people lurk, or do they have RSS for the word ‘Kobe’?

  • 80

    @Miles Brown, if you whink Jordan had no competition during his era, what do you call this roadkill quality of a basketball now? I am just challenging you to try and explain to me what is the criteria you are comparing the basketball of 80-90 era to any basketball you appreciate so you can post most ignorant comment of all times. You pointed out some flaws of the players who played against Mike, but all of them and I can add 30 more are doctors of basketball compared to these poor guys who run across courts in the Nba of today.

  • JeffOG

    @Ugh: Same can be said of ‘Lebron’ or ‘Heat’. @ Jackie Moon: I’d rather take the cash of the know-it-alls here.

  • flipnoyce

    HMMMM no one’s talking about 3peat, Kobe back to HOBE form again. I like it, the more he try to score the more the laker loses just like 06. I hope he’s not using that sacred finger of his as a lame excuse for poor shot selection that his always done.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Myles Brown

    I hate when people spell my name wrong. Especially when it’s right in front of them.

  • the nerve

    yall know some of thos comments wasnt me. but trust i understand bcuz i herbed yall boy n shtt. its cool 4 real. yall know what it is anyway. crawwwfit gorgin on APs thing thing 2day majorly. clown @$$ f@gg0tt. u still my nicka/white boy tho. ayo erbody know its u CCRRAAAWWWWFIT!! Bryant gumbel. u ass, man. resortin 2 sayin dumb shtt under my name. its fun n games tho. u take it serious. u dat crackhead nicka who be like DONT SAY NUTHIN BOUT MY MOMMA even if they sayin good thangs. Clown.

  • http://sjfklfsl.com Jukai

    I hate it too, Miles.

  • the nerve

    Miles y u be gettin mad for?

  • the nerve

    ^^AAAAHHHHH!!! They got me!! They gonna destroy THE NNNNEEEERRRRVVVE!!! NNOOOOOOOO!!! Somebody HELP MEEEEE!!!
    Punk ass NUCKAS!! LoLOLOLO

  • the nerve

    Ima be back 2morrow when they let me in da computer room 4 a hot sec. Den we gon go @ it again cuz I be knowin a lot bout dis sports stuff. I is not gon take it easy on yall cuz I be knowing a whole lot more den u.

  • the nerve

    AAAA damn yall be tryna play me? Aight cool. Watch when I be comin up in here wit a new handle.NOOOOOO!!! Not da nerve!

  • the nerve

    Nuckas be actin like i aint smart and edumacated like they is. I is smarter den most yall nuckas. Ima holla @ yall layter.

  • http://sjfklfsl.com Jukai

    I don’t like Kobe, I like to point out his flaws as much as anyone… but people are hating on him pretty bad here, it’s unwarranted. His team is playing way worse than he is. People hate on him for taking all the shots, but now he’s getting hate for not taking over games like MJ did. What’s this about?
    And as for the next debate… KG > Pip > Dirk.
    I know KG isn’t clutch. I know Dirk isn’t tough. But honestly, there was never any indication that Pippen was clutch and Pip shied away from a lot of fights and whined WAY MORE than just that one incident where Kukoc hurt his manhood.
    Pippen was sort of an odd case. People forget all his pouting and all his controversy, but very few people can be said to have worked as hard as Pippen, or gotten undervalued as much as Pippen did. On the other hand, people look back and WAY overrate Pippen’s offense. Dude rarely averaged over 20 (and never over 22), he didn’t shoot a high percentage mostly because his value was on the fast break and his shot was a tinge on the streaky side… his 3-point shot was unreliable and he clanked some big free throws in his days (especially early when the Bulls were always owned by Detroit).
    Still, he’s equally undervalued not because of his defense (people generally agree that he was lockdown beyond belief) but because of how great his passing and his rebounding was. Like, not just a great passer, but he’d occasionally create for other people, and distribute the ball perfectly.
    I still don’t think he’s a top-5 all-time SF though. That class is STACKED (not counting Pip, you got Larry Legend and Dr. J and Rick the Miami Greyhound, Hondo and Baylor, King James and Big Game James, Dominique the Human Highlight and… Bernard King and Alex English, and if you remember any nicknames those guys had, kudos to you).

  • Justin

    I think Pippen showed his all around skills in ’94 when Jordan retired the first time. A very good case could have been made for him being the MVP that year, and the Kukoc incident aside, provided very good leadership to that team. There weren’t a lot of guys that could grab a rebound and start the break himself either by finishing at the rim or making the right pass. He didn’t score a bunch partly because he was a passer more than a scorer but I’m pretty sure the year that Jordan was gone he was in the 24 ppg range. BTW Jukai, you’re crazy if you think Dominique, Alex English, or Bernard King were better overall players than Pippen. Scorers maybe, but overall? Not a chance

  • Towelie

    You know what? I noticed that Pau Gasol doesn’t demand the ball whenever he is on the floor. On some possessions he doesn’t even touch the ball. The Lakers need to take advantage of their size and Gasol needs to demand the ball more.

  • http://sjfklfsl.com Jukai

    Justin: I never said Nique, English, or King were better than Pippen. I just said that there have been lots of dominant small forwards in history and named them all, didn’t even order them. I’d have Pippen anywhere from 5 to 7, depending on how I feel about him, Havlicek and Lebron James in any given day.

  • http://sjfklfsl.com Jukai

    Also, as I said, his highest average was 22 points on 49% shooting. He never made it even a tenth of a point higher than that.

  • Justin

    Most likely because of his tendency to pass first and it had to be quite the transition for him that year. And when you say “I still don’t think he’s top 5 SF” and then ramble off a bunch of names, it’s implying that those guys are better.

  • http://sjfklfsl.com Jukai

    I think when I said “not counting Pip” it should have been a giveaway that I wasn’t including him in the top-10 small forward list. But hey, sorry I didn’t clarify it enough!
    Perhaps he never averaged over 22 points because he simply wasn’t that ludicrous of an offensive player? I’m not discounting 22 points a game in the most competitive league in history when defense was arguably at its best… but Pippen’s scoring was probably one of the weaker areas of his game. It is also why I can’t in good faith place him over a prime KG. I mean, KG as the go-to-guy in Minny put up 24-14-5-1.5-2.2 on 50% shooting. That’s one of the sickest lines for a season I’ve ever seen.

  • Conoro

    Nbk, that’s due in large part to my actually having a life outside of SLAMonline Forums…

  • Justin

    KG is also a 7 footer (or 6′ 12″ as he used to say lol) so scoring on small forwards and smaller power forwards shouldn’t have been a problem for him, especially with his athleticism. I will agree that scoring was definitely a weaker area of Pippen’s game and it could be argued that he was only the third best scorer on his team after Jordan and Kukoc. I believe that Kukoc could have scored lots more with the match up problems he gave teams but when you have Jordan and Pippen, he doesn’t get that chance.

  • Pingback: SLAM ONLINE | » Phil Jackson, Kobe Bryant Clear the Air

  • 80

    @Myles Brown sorry for misspell, didnt mean to disrespect, still would like to know what basketball era you consider to be superior, as you commented on Jordans opponents as being gimps basically.

Advertisement