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Monday, May 7th, 2012 at 9:45 am  |  152 responses

Post Up: On The Brink

New York avoids a Heat sweep while Boston, Philly and the Lakers go up 3-1.

Sixers 89, Bulls 82 (PHI leads 3-1)

The Bulls dropped another close game on the road in Philadelphia to the Sixers and are now just one loss away from being eliminated in the first round and having the dubious distinction of being the fifth No. 1 seed to lose to a No. 8 seed.

Philly knocked off Chicago 89-82 to go up 3-1 in Game 4 of their first-round, best-of-seven series and the scene shifts to Chicago for Game 5 on Tuesday at the United Center in what could very well be the last time NBA basketball is played in the Windy City until October.

After losing Derrick Rose in Game 1, the Bulls were also without Joakim Noah, who suffered a severely sprained ankle in the third quarter of Game 3 and kept him on the sideline sporting a walking boot for Game 4. His season, like Rose’s, is most likely over, since it’s highly unlikely he’ll be ready to go on Tuesday with such a quick turnaround.

Carlos Boozer led Chicago in scoring with 23 points and 11 rebounds and Taj Gibson provided energy off the bench with 14 points and 12 rebounds. And CJ Watson made an appearance (finally) in Game 4 after going scoreless in Game 3. He put up 17 points but still struggled with his shot (5-18).

For the Sixers, Jrue Holiday has been a problem that the Bulls haven’t been able to solve since Game 2. Holiday struggled mightily in the game with his shooting going 7-23 from the field, but he hit back-to-back three-pointers late in the fourth quarter that pushed Philadelphia’s lead from 1 to 7—that proved to be the dagger in the ball game. He finished the game with 20 points, 8 rebounds and 6 assists.

And Spencer Hawes continued his strong play, as he registered 22 points and grabbed 8 rebounds, following up a 21-point, 9-rebound performance in Game 3.

Game 4 was a must-win for Chicago. A victory would’ve evened the series and given them life going back to their home court for Game 5, but a loss pretty much spells their doom. It’s no longer a matter of “if” the Sixers can beat the Bulls, but “when.” —Bryan Crawford (@_BryanCrawford)

Knicks 89, Heat 87 (MIA leads 3-1)

First it was a stagnant Dwyane Wade-Chris Bosh pick-and-roll, then it was a botched Wade dribble-drive, then it was a contested Wade fade-away, and then it was over. Whatever the hell it was, the Miami Heat’s final play was a massive failure, and the Knicks, for the first time in a few hundred centuries—or 11 years, if you’re into specifics—outscored their postseason opponent and earned a playoff victory. Huzzah!

The game’s final few minutes were especially chaotic. Carmelo Anthony (41 points, 12 of which came in the fourth) hit shot after shot, breaking only to find Mike Bibby (!), who drained a three that gave the Knicks an 84-81 lead. But LeBron James (27 points) consistently kept the Heat close, tying things up with a trey and then putting his squad up with a 3-point play that he converted while barreling down the lane and finishing with a certain finesse-and-strength combo that at this point deserves the adjective “LeBronesque.” Another one of those aforementioned Melo jumpers gave the Knicks the lead, and then Miami’s final-play fiasco went down, and suddenly we’re headed back to Florida for Game 5 with the Heat leading the series 3-1.

“For me personally, I would have loved to have the ball, but as a team we win games together and lose games together,” LeBron said after the inevitable question about the last shot. “That’s all that matters.”

As much as the Knicks’ fanbase can and will rightfully celebrate the playoff win, it’ll also lament the loss of starting point guard Baron Davis, who went down in the third quarter with a dislocated right patella. Without Davis, the Knicks turned to Bibby, who was surprisingly solid, and JR Smith, who shot 3-15 and was, ya know, not so solid. Elsewhere, Amar’e Stoudemire returned, and was impressively effective, racking up 20 and 10.

Davis will almost definitely miss the remainder of the series, which’ll fuel talk of the return of a certain New York point guard who’s been sidelined for the past month following knee surgery. At this point, given the late-March injury that kept Jeremy Lin off the floor and out of the news for the past month, Linsanity feels like an isolated incident, a tornado that stormed through Manhattan and left rubble in the form of replica jerseys and bootleg t-shirts.

The Knicks and Heat face off next on Wednesday night, which is more than enough time for the hype machine to get Lin’s name back in the minds of optimistic Knicks fans hoping for one more miracle out of a 2011-12 session that’s featured one or two of ‘em. No team in NBA history has fought back from down 3-0 to advance to the subsequent round, but a little historical context won’t cloud the optimism of a fan base that doesn’t appear ready to waive goodbye to this dizzying rollercoaster of a season just yet.

Knicks coach Mike Woodson said Lin’s status remains uncertain, and that we’ll be receiving more information on the matter shortly, but the consensus is that by Wednesday, Lin should be good to go.

Which means: Like or not, some version of Linsanity is on its way back to town. Prepare accordingly. —Adam Figman (@afigman)

Celtics 101, Hawks 79 (BOS leads 3-1)

As much as side stories from Boston’s side (Ray Allen’s health) and Atlanta’s (Josh Smith’s return after missing Game 3; Al Horford’s first action since January) tried to captivate headlines on Sunday, this game boiled down to one match-up: Paul Pierce vs. Joe Johnson. Whichever all-star could play with the most urgency and execute would win the contest. Pierce, who’d averaged 23 points and 7 boards in the series, needed a good night to help the Celtics take a dominating 3-1 lead. Johnson, who’d had nights of 11, 22 and 29, had to be colossal for the Hawks to even the series at 2-2.

From the gate, it was clear that only Pierce got the above memo. It didn’t matter whose hand was in his face, Paul would nail the first-half shot. Floaters. Fadeaways. Fifteen-footers. The flightless Hawks had no answer. Things were going so well for Boston’s future Hall of Famer that TNT analyst Reggie Miller had to chime in: “He’s beautiful to watch. You’re watching greatness in [Number] 34 in white.” In fact, the only way Atlanta could slow Pierce down was with an inadvertent trip from Josh Smith towards the end of the first half. Didn’t matter. By that time, Boston was already nearing a 20-point lead. Pierce finished with 24 points in just 17 minutes.

As for Joe Johnson, we’re not sure what his issue was. Though he always wears a placid look about the face, Joe seemed especially uninspired in this one. Reggie tried to keep the talk around the Hawks guard optimistic with a “When he’s engaged, when he’s tuned in [he’s good]” line, but there was no helping this pathetic performance. 9 points, 3 assists and 1 rebound in a crucial Game 4? Seriously? And the fact that Johnson had fewer shot attempts (8) than the super-rusty Horford (10) shows an inexcusable lack of fire.

The Hawks All-Star and the rest of a bruised Hawks squad will have one last chance to stop Pierce, Rajon Rondo (20 points, 16 dimes) and company on Tuesday in Game 5. Oh, and Joe, just in case you decide to show up for that one, the game’s at 8 at Philips Arena in downtown Atlanta. —DeMarco Williams (@demarcowill)

Lakers 92, Nuggets 88 (LAL leads 3-1)

Ramon Sessions and Steve Blake hit clutch 3-point baskets in the final minute to help the Lakers hold on for a 92-88 victory over the Nuggets in Game 4. With 48 seconds left in the game, Pau Gasol found Sessions in the corner for a wide open look, giving LA a three-point cushion. Following an offensive goaltending call against Andre Miller, the Lakers went for the dagger on the next offensive sequence with Kobe Bryant finding Blake in the opposite corner for a three, putting the game out of reach. Blake finished with 10 points in 29 minutes of game action off the bench. Bryant praised him after the game. “He’s done it for us in the past,” Bryant said. “These moments don’t scare him.”  Bryant improved on his game 3 struggles, adding 22 points, 8 rebounds and 6 assists in Game 4. Andrew Bynum posted 19 points and Jordan Hill made a nice contribution off the bench with 12 points and 11 rebounds.

The Lakers grabbed 19 offensive rebounds and did a great job containing Denver big men JaVale McGee and Kenneth Faried, holding them to a combined 14 points and 11 rebounds. ”Losing always gets old. Losing is not fun. I’m not unhappy with my team, I’m not happy with where we’re at, but we still have a series to play,” Denver coach George Karl said. Danilo Gallinari led Denver with 20 points and Miller added 15. Game 5 is Tuesday night in L.A. —Nima Zarrabi (@NZbeFree)

Fan of the Night: This lady is a kook. Then again, she was wide open for three—c’mon Ty, pass the rock!

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  • MeloMan15

    The knicks just can’t catch any breaks can they

  • MeloMan15

    Also, the sixers don’t deserve any of this… it’s horrible. They tanked the last few games of the season just to get the bulls. Those damn cowards

  • http://abcnews.com charliewinning

    The series is still over, but I’m just glad the Knicks broke the playoff losing streak. For all the flack STAT gets, his energy was great yesterday…Lou Williams’ shot selection is absolutely awful. Awful. Glad the Sixers pulled it out tho… Joe Johnson would be an awesome second or third option on a contender.

  • dan

    lol @ this quote ““For me personally, I would have loved to have the ball, but as a team we win games together and lose games together,” LeBron said after the inevitable question about the last shot. “That’s all that matters.””

    well, lebron, you better not coz we all know what happens when you take the ball on the last play of a game. its either pass, turnover or clang! ;)

  • http://www.slamonline.com Dagger

    @Dan: Lebron has been CLUTCH this series. Last night was no exception: two three-point plays in a row. I understand why he wasn’t the first option given that Fields was defending Wade (although Melo is hardly a great defender), but why wasn’t he the second option? More importantly: why didn’t he defend Melo in the clutch? Battier is getting devoured out there. The only Heat player who can and should defend Melo is Lebron. As for the Bulls/76ers game: about as bad a playoff game as I’ve ever seen, and the epitome of why Boozer isn’t a top-50 player. He put up some big stats tonight, but everything about his play screamed soft. Missed layups, going up soft, brutal passing, and in the clutch: losing his handle and the game. The Boozer/Amare/Bosh trifecta of big men really ended up disappointing in the end.

  • Mike From Spain

    Lebron said the right thing. Unexpected that Bulls are going out of the Play Offs. First Knicks play-off victory in 11 years? Seriously? Ramon Sessions is the best PG the Lakers have had since… uhm… the prime of Fisher maybe. Like centuries ago. Jordan Hill also did some damage there. And how uncharacteristic of Kobe, not to get to the line at all. 1 FT in all game!

  • LA Huey

    Wade should have passed the ball to Bosh after Amare and Landry Fields switched the pick.

  • Heals

    Props to Smoove and Horford for gutting it up, but Atl finally got a taste of the C’s at their peak. Still can’t fathom how (given how he struggled to get up-and-down court in transition with speed) J threw down that NASTY 1st quarter dunk. Love how talking heads are already discussing Mia v Bos as if the C’s will just roll over Philly/Chi…

  • http://www.thesmashbrothas.com zen garden

    “She is literally out there”…haha oh Marv

  • AsadSaleh3

    Dumb decision by Coach Spoelstra not giving the ball to LeBron after he had just hit that 3 and made that ridiculous move to the basket and finished with the left hand. Stupid play.

  • http://slamonline.com AllBall

    Melo and A’mare get a lot of criticism but they were both great last night.

  • Da-Meat-Hook

    I don’t understand why Wade decided to turn a contested but very makeable 10 footer into a contested fading 21 footer with no time left for a possible tip-in…smh

  • http://www.yahoo.com The Fury

    Jordan Hill found a home in Tinseltown. He’s the perfect backup to both Gasol and Bynum….Lakers v. Oklahoma will be classic!!

  • http://www.yahoo.com The Fury

    I predict tom that Spurs will sweep, then Clips win for 3-1 lead. ;)

  • Fat Lever

    MeloMan15, the Sixers won 4 of their last 6 games. Yea, major tank job there. You should really do some research before spitting asinine sh!t. The Knicks wanted the Heat. They made their bed, now they have to lay in it. And to be honest, I thought the Sixers would fare better against the Bulls than the Heat. Meaning I thought they could take 2 games from the Bulls(even when fully healthy), but would ultimately lose the series. I was pretty confident that the Sixers wouldn’t even be able to take one game from Miami.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    - Steve Blake is slowly turning into DFish-lite. We all knew that if he got a clean look, it was going in.
    - McGee looks like a pretty big dude but it’s funny how Bynum totally destroys him in the post. Maybe it’s poor post defense fundamentals or just not strong enough.
    - In McGee’s defense, he’s put up decent games back-to-back.
    - There are a few things sadder than Pau settling for a contested turnaround jumper guarded in the post by Al Harrington or Gallinari. And he has the audacity to groan about it. You better than this, Pau.
    - Mike Brown catches a lot of heat for his coaching decisions. One thing I agree with is not playing the bench excessively through its mistakes. He is not shy about trotting the starters back out there after a short rest when things start slipping. Phil would sit there and patiently watch things crumble before putting a stop to it. And play his son 20+ minutes.

  • dan

    @dagger: lebron is probably the best overall player in the l and a freak of nature, no question. and yes, he plays big down the stretch in 4th quarters as well (only exceptions: the finals against the mavs and the conference finals vs the celtics the year b4). i just love pounding on that like the rest of the bball world does. as great as he is as a player as weak is the character that he shows off to the public (i dont know how he really is as a person). but his classless behaviour since the decision is the reason why i love to see him fail. and lately he was great in 4th querters to put his team in front or get close. but he is not the guy to perform clutch on the very last play of a game. that was what i was refering to. and this is why i am a little bit spiteful (which is not such a big sing of class neither, i know ;) )

  • T-Money

    i don’t care about the last shot really… wade is a little more elusive in getting his shot off and a better ball handler so it makes sense to put the ball in his hands in a dead ball situation with a few seconds to go. miami got what it wanted with amar’e defending wade on an island – wade just fumbled the ball driving the lane. what i can’t understand is spo sticking with battier on melo, that was just plain crazy. melo is shooting 53 % with shane on him and 29 % with bron on him so far. and you don’t even need to crunch numbers to see that melo is cooking battier!

  • T-Money

    also, what kind of of offensive set involves the mvp and best player in the nba standing in the corner? i’m cool with wade handling the ball but where was the 2-man action?

  • http://www.slamonline.com Eboy

    Filipino Simpleton strikes again!

  • feez_22

    A few things
    - As others on here have explained, battier guarding melo was a mistake. Melo can rise over just about any defender with his jumper because he has a quick jump (sort of shawn marion-esque but he can’t jump quite as high). Lebron also can’t stop him getting his shot off but because of his athleticism and his long arms, he can make a much bigger difference
    - Down 2 with 13 seconds to go, running the shot clock out shows me the heat were afraid of melo getting a last shot. Teams can’t play like that. you are up 3-0 for a reason… you have to get a shot within 5-6 seconds. the best way to get that type of shot with chandler out would have been a lebron/wade pick and roll. wade rolling hard 2 the basket, lebron running it (as lebron is a far superior interior passer). You put the ball in lebron’s hands bc he had the last 6 heat points. They may double lebron BUT lebron won’t hesitate to pass to the open man. they would have had a much easier and quicker open shot running it that way than a fadeaway 3 from wade which in my estimation has gone in 2% of the time this whole season.
    - As i said in my last paragraph (sorry for all the writing), the heat should have went quickly because if they did, they would have most certainly grabbed an offensive rebound (no chandler, amare with 1 hand, melo busy guarding the lebron/wade pick and roll). However, they didn’t. Thats a failure. Its similar to what the grizzlies did in game 3 of their series. down 1 or 2, you should get a quick, best shot so you can rebound. If you miss, you foul. The knicks did miss 3 of their last 5 FT’s. just a massive coaching failure on the last play.

  • feez_22

    & yes i know lebron was busy guarding chandler and others (like JR). However, in the 4th Q especially, lebron should have been on melo shutting him down. he was their only chance at winning. i blame spo for that.

  • feez_22

    btw, rick carlisle is a free agent coach in the offseason. If the heat/lakers lose… i wouldn’t hesitate to ETO spo/brown for him. not even for a second would i hesitate.

  • http://www.soundcloud.com/tray-5 T-Ray

    Lol @ Eboy
    But I love the way Kobe played yesterday. Maybe he should get double teamed more often so he finds the open man. We made them play our game and it was a success.

  • Andrew Woods

    I am by no means the first and foremost basketball scholar, but can anyone explain why in late games lebron and wade dont pick n rolls in these last second moments? Im really,perplexed, is there a,fundamental reason why this doesnt happen?

  • Myung

    Congrats to Heals and other C’s fans on their win vs. the Hawks. It was nice to see my favorite Hawk (Al Horford) finally back on the court for the first time in months, and I respect for Josh for making a quick return from his injury as well… but it didn’t matter. The Celtics absolutely rolled us in Boston just like they did in Game 7 of the 2008 Series. It wasn’t even a fair fight last night. The Hawks were playing chess, and the C’s were playing checkers. We got schooled. We’re not going to win three of the next three so congrats to the Celtics for advancing to Round 2. I’m a Hawks fan for life, but I’m realistic too.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Allen, you here today? I’m tryna discuss this David West situation with you a lil more.

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    the battier on melo thing was BAFFLING. Melo hit like 8 shots in a row then got fouled at the 3 point line… you’d think like after 2, or 3, a normal person would’ve said. “Hey maybe I should put my best defender on the most versatile defender on the planet!” Lebron suffocated the life out of melo the game before, throw him back at him.. and then the play they drew up… I don’t have a problem w/ wade closing but there needed to be more options, although wade should’ve thrown it to bosh when he was rolling w/ landry on him. Also is it just me, or is wade messing up more and more,like he was not like this in 09, sometimes it’s like he has mad cow out there smmfh

  • Myung

    If you would’ve told me that the Bulls would win game 1 convincingly and that Derrick Rose put on an MVP like performance during the first 97% of the game… and that the Hawks would win game 1 easily and Rondo would be suspended for game 2… I would’ve laughed if you told me the Celtics and Sixers would be facing each other in Round 2. And you’d be getting the last laugh.

  • http://slamonline.com AllBall

    Like Van Gundy said, Spoelstra really is in a no win scenario.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    When i saw Baron Davis go down I thought that was it for his career. Does he really want to put in the work to rehab again at this point? I just can’t see it. Dude had a good run, up and down, but he had a good run.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    David West was murking Ryan Anderson. Straight bullying him on the block NBK.
    If Darren Collison had made the leap I thought he would make the Pacers would be a dangerous team, but he appears to have plateaued. West still hasn’t recovered fully from the knee injury. I expect him to be a killer next year. Well “Killer” is relative.

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    also the lebron wade pick and roll was the superior play.. spoestra regularly wastes the offensive talent he has. Rick Adeleman or Doc rivers would be unstoppable with these guys.

  • Myung

    My three favorite NBA teams: my hometown Hawks. The Chicago Bulls (favorite player of all time is the G.O.A.T. and because of him, I became a Bulls fan as well). The world champion Mavs (I call them my team-in-law because my wife’s family is from Dallas). The Mavs got swept, and the Hawks and Bulls are pretty much done. So unless Atlanta and/or Chicago pulls off an incredible three game winning streak (which I don’t think will happen), I’m done watching the NBA until the 2012-13 season (or at least until the Olympics). I love the game of basketball, but it’s not so fun when your all the teams you root for get knocked out in Round 1.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Allen, my main issue with David West in Indiana is his $10M price tag. I don’t know if what he provides as a veteran, plus how he dominates horrible defender’s is really worth that. But given how his teammates talk about him, and what you were saying on Saturday, i have to say, i’m much more aware of his overall value.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    The Heat went small and didn’t think Battier could handle Amare. So they had Bosh on Chandler and Bron on Amare. That’s why he wasn’t on Melo.
    Bron got too disengaged after getting those fouls calls on him. He became a little passive. He made some big plays, which I was happy to see because I want dud to get that clutch monkey off his back, but he wasn’t as aggressive as I would have liked.
    And the mid-post is not the post. Apparently LeBron has forgotten this .

  • http://www.fiba.com Darksaber

    Myung: Or do what i am now doing, focus all energy on yellow/purple losing in the next round (they probably won’t now that Perk is out for a while, but hey…one can dream)

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    He only has one more year. They got him for $20 million for only two years. That’s why the annual price tag was a good idea. Now he’s a valuable starter and a great trade chip next year as an expiring contract with teams wanting to clear space for Dwight and CP3 and others. I thought it was one of the best moves Bird made as a GM.

  • Myung

    As a parting shot, is it OK to blame Tracy McGrady for our first round exit? We’ve made it to Round 2 the past three years. T-Mac joins us, and bam! we get knocked out in Round 1. Dude is uncanny. Even when he’s a role player, his inability to advance in the Playoffs is fierce. The force is strong in that one.

  • Myung

    Dark, I’m definitely a Laker hater, but I just don’t have it in me to watch basketball if I’m just not invested. I’ve got a business to run, a wife and 2 young children to love and spend time with. My relationship with basketball will be on pause and then I’ll un-pause it again in late November/early December.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I was talking to a friend of mine and he believes that if you replace Kobe with T-Mac back in the day the Lakers still three peat and possibly win more.
    Thoughts?

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    That’s fair enough Allen. I guess I just have a inherent problem with paying that much for a guy who is only giving you 12 and 6 a game. But if he is a catalyst to them winning then i concede.
    .
    I don’t want to start a hullabaloo, but I do believe McGrady would have had a similar amount of success as Kobe did with Shaq. Barring injuries, and other non-predictable factors he could have won 3 with Shaq. Plus I think their personalities would have meshed a lot better.

  • http://nba.com GP23

    Allen.. I don’t know man, I mean, Kobe was an elite defender back in them days, and T-Mac never bothered playing D. However, Tracy was excellent on the offensive end, but you have to play both ends to be successful. Tracy and Shaq may have won 1, but no three-peat.

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    I feel like T-mac would’ve given the ball to shaq when rip hamilton was draped all over him…so I cosign this statement.

  • http://stapledesign.com Spaceship Jay

    Yeah… that Battier/Melo match-up was…. Questionable.

  • Sean B

    Allenp – I don’t see a Tmac and Shaq having the same or higher ceiling as the Kobe-Shaq connection. As someone who watched that entire threepeat, I don’t know if Tmac makes the same huge plays that Kobe made (thinking Game 7 vs Portland and the 2002 Spurs series, in particular). Also, the 2001 Shaq-Kobe combo was clicking on all cylinders in the playoffs, and I don’t see how that could have been duplicated. T-Mac was awesome, but I just don’t see the Lakers having the same amount of success with him.

  • http://stapledesign.com Spaceship Jay

    AllenP, I had the same argument. Same results, significantly lesser ego.

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    I could see it. I think the prospect of winning a championship motivates T-mac to play at least adequate/above average defense. plus I bet T-mac passes the ball to shaq when rip hamilton is draped all over him. and T-mac probably doesn’t try and get shaq outta LA

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    I say 4-peat if you had a prime T-Mac without injuries. No way that team loses to Detroit in the Finals.

  • Myung

    Shaq was SO dominant during the Lakers title runs. Shaq would’ve elevated the games of a lot of good swing men. I could imagine Vince in his prime winning a ring or two with Shaq as well. ALTHOUGH… the series vs. the Pacers, Kobe definitely stepped up in Game 4 (OT game) when Shaq fouled out. An average SG/SF probably doesn’t rise to the occasion like Kobe did. Look, I’m a Kobe hater. I admit it. But that has more to do with his persona than his actual game. I respect his game immensely, even if he’s a little Michael clone. And Kobe isn’t just one of the top swingmen of the past decade (a la Tracy or Vince); he’s going to end his career as one of the top 5 to 10 players to ever play this sport. So even though we can say T-Mac would’ve won some rings with Shaq, I hope that isn’t trying to say that T-Mac could’ve been Kobe’s equal. But yes, early on (2000 to 2002), while Kobe was good to even great on those title teams, he was clearly Robin to Shaq’s Batman (I hate using a Skipbaylessism, but it’s the best analogy). I feel like when Shaq is THAT good in a series, even someone not on Kobe’s level could’ve been a good sidekick for him. The bigger question is (since we’re going all hypothetical here), could a team of Shaq-T-Mac beat those excellent Kings or Spurs teams? Honestly, the East was terrible in the early 2000′s. The Lakers beat a very good Pacers team, a flawed Sixers team, and a good but not amazing Nets team to win their rings. The Finals were almost an afterthough though. As dominant as Shaq was and as good as Kobe was, those Lakers title teams barely made the Finals… remember Portland’s epic collapse and that controversial Game 6 in Sacramento and the Robert Horry three. I’m not quite sure Shaq + really good 2 guard not named Kobe would’ve made back-to-back-to-back Finals. I think maybe that player would’ve clashed less with Shaq’s ego, but would the on court skill and chemistry have been enough to overcome those really good Kings and Spurs teams?

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Myung
    Kobe’s main claim to fame is the five rings.
    He is incredibly talented and skilled, but what gets people to justify his incredible flaws and failures are his five rings. There are incredibly hard to argue with if you’re knocking Kobe. And while he wasn’t AS important as Shaq to the Lakers he was still amazing and 1b.
    To me, TMac could play defense when motivated. He did it in Toronto before he had to carry the scoring load later in his career. It was his thing.
    I honestly believe that Vince, Iverson and T-Mac would have all won rings with Shaq. And I also think that Kobe would have had similar success to McGrady and Vince without Shaq. Not sure if he would have gotten a team to the Finals like Iverson did.
    I think Kobe maximized his talent and besides his mindset is a pretty much everything you could ask for in a player. But, I think Shaq was the difference. Shaq was crazy.

  • Andrew Woods

    Tmac was def as gifted as Kobe, if not more gifted physicallly. But when it comes to being fundamentally sound kobe is/was ahead of Tmac. Once u figure in defense and work ethic I doubt tmac would have the same affect. Plus kobe brought a level of focus needed to combat shaqs lack thereof.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    McGrady has more natural talent than Kobe. But Kobe has a psychotic work ethic. That is what separates the two. Maybe McGrady would have been more motivated to stay at the top of his game if he were on a team like those Lakers….or maybe he would have become even more complacent. It’s hard to say. But I do definitely think McGrady and Shaq would have won a minimum of one championship. Sh*t i think Shaq and Allan Houston probably would have won a title. That’s how good Shaq was.

  • Myung

    I’m not even trying to praise Kobe, Allen. I hate defending Kobe. Maybe it wasn’t clear in my post because I praised just how good a talent he is, but I really can’t stand him. My son is named Jordan for a reason. haha. and btw, please don’t tell me Kobe has 5 rings. Yes, he has 5 rings, but Adam Morrison has 2. I count Finals MVP’s when we’re talking about some of the best players of all time, which Kobe undoubtedly is. So if you’re going to give Kobe props, please do it gingerly by saying he only has 2 Finals MVPS’s vs. Michael’s 6. That being said, his main claim to fame isn’t just his 5 rings. It’s his ultra competitive nature, his willingness to play through injury, and his crazy scoring ability (his career numbers by age 33 are pretty insane). OK. Now I’m going to stop saying good things about him because it makes me want to punch myself.

  • Myung

    But we agree, Allen: Shaq was the difference from 2000-2002. There’s a reason he got three Finals MVPs. Especially in 2000. Wow.

  • Andrew Woods

    Ill take Shaq in his prime against anybody not named Lebron in this era

  • T-Money

    I think what really separates Kobe and T-Mac is a bad back and supremely talented bigs. Perhaps the injuries are related to work ethic (not enough time in the gym), that I’m not sure. perhaps the injuries are related to work ethic (not enough time in the gym), that I’m not sure. what t-mac did in his 4 years in orlando is on par with any swingman in the history of the game. i’m dead serious. he was scoring, making plays, playing d, shooting the 3-ball, posting up, hitting his free throws – there wasn’t a single weakness in his game. he had a couple of 25 ppg season in houston but the back was already acting up and the efficiency went south.

  • T-Money

    andrew woods – i would disagree. t-mac was a better ball handler than kobe and his jumper was cleaner. his balance and follow through were always on point. his defense was also incredible, in fact he was used as a defensive specialist early in his career in toronto. the only knock on tmac (and its a big one) was that he was lazy, he even admits this. but the talent and skill set were just absurd.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Here’s an interesting question, from these 3 all-gen teams, who is the best (at their prime)?
    Gen I: Magic, Jordan, Bird, Barkley, Olajuwon
    Gen II: Iverson, Kobe, T-Mac, Duncan, Shaq
    Gen III: Paul, Wade, LeBron, Melo, Dwight

  • Myung

    You probably nailed it with the “bad back” thing, T-Money, but that’s not something minor. That injury basically ended Larry Bird’s career. And the bad back basically turned T-Mac into a has been at a fairly early age. Dude is still like 32, yet he plays like he’s 42 years old. Yes, T-Mac had a terrific run in the mid 2000′s, but a LOT of athletes (basketball, football, etc) have had short bursts of greatness. The thing that separates the good from the great and great from the all time great are things like longevity, good health, good fortune, etc. We can say injuries derailed his career, but we’re not really pointing out an excuse as much as it is a reason. The best players of all time generally have sustained excellence for years upon years (at least a decade or so). And generally the best players of all time aren’t injury prone. It sucks for T-Mac, but dude is a shell of his former self. He’s the oldest 32 year old in the NBA. When I see him out there vs. the Celtics, I look at a dude who is younger than Pierce, Allen, and KG… and a guy who used to headline ASG’s all the time with those three players earlier last decade… and who is clearly worse than all three of them and it’s not really close.

  • http://abcnews.com charliewinning

    The lack of effort on defense was a huge weakness in his game. T-Mac is my favorite player since Magic, but I he didn’t have Kobe’s work ethic. Being in shape goes a long way in preventing injury. Offensively, he was way more talented than Kobe.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Oh and on the topic of T-Mac, the craziest stat about him that I found was that through his entire career, the highest he ever averaged was 3.0 turnovers (and that was once) despite how often he was called on to initiate the offense and score.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    What is up with Danilo Gallinari? The man skills seem to have regressed significantly with the Nuggs. He used to be such a good ballhandler for someone his size and his jumper was automatic with the Knicks but he can’t seem to do either consistently in DEN.

  • Myung

    It’s got to be Gen 1, right? Maybe I’m biased because those are the guys I grew up watching, but in Bird, Magic, Michael, and Hakeem, you’ve got 4 of the best 15 to ever play the game. I’d probably replace Chuck with Karl Malone. The mailman is generally regarded as the 2nd best PF of all time (1476 games + 36928 points (2nd all time) + 14968 rebounds + 5248 assists). Pretty sick numbers.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    The team with Hakeem and Jordan beats everybody else. But, can you really put Magic and Bird in that generation. I think you would have choose Stockton and Pippen to make it fair.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    He’s tasked with creating his own shot a lot more now Taylor. If someone has access to the information, look and see if his catch and shoot % has changed much. I doubt it has.

  • http://www.yahoo.com The Fury

    I’ll take Gen I..Bird and Magic are both unselfish, Barkley’s a force and The Dream is an all-gen defender…then there’s Mike.

  • Myung

    BTW by my count (doing this off memory so I might be off by one or two)… Gen 1: 16 titles… Gen 2: 13 titles… Gen 3: 1 title (Wade). And yes, you can say that Gen 3 is still young and yes, undoubtedly some of these guys WILL rings later on (and probably this year in Bron and Wade’s case), but all of these guys are now in their primes and they’ve all been in the League for 7 to 9 seasons so it’s not like we can use that excuse for them forever. If Gen 3 wants to enter the discussion of ALL TIME greats, they better start winning some rings ASAP.

  • T-Money

    jtaylor – gallo si such an infuriating guy to watch. so much talent but no consistency. in the first half, he put kobe and ebanks on SKATES on two beautiful drives to the hoop. and then faded as the game went along.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    People forget that Mac was such a great passer and a great defender when the entire offensive load didn’t depend on him. Those two attributes are the reason why I with AllenP on this one.
    Caboose, Gen I is easy- MJ. Gen II- TD Gen III- LeBron.

  • Myung

    Oh, and that Gen 2 has no chance in a pick up game. First of all, you’ve got Kobe + Shaq again. And a backcourt of Kobe + AI? Who’s going to distribute the ball???

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    “Must we spend days upon days pondering the virtues and ills of Mr. Bryant. Have we not better things to debate, like the capricious defensive decisions of Mr. Spoelstra.” — Charles Carson, Butler, Downton Abbey.

  • Myung

    BTW, can be argued that Gen 3′s SF should be Durant (too young?) and Gen 2′s PG and SF should be Nash (over AI) and either KG, Dirk, or Pierce (over T-Mac).

  • Myung

    I’m waiting for someone to come on here and go, “Well, I can’t comment on Gen 1 because I never saw them play live.” That’s going to make me feel super old. :)

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Well I don’t think it’s even close between those generations. imo, gen 1 has 4 of the 10 best players ever. lol

  • http://www.soundcloud.com/tray-5 T-Ray

    Yea Gen 1 is too stacked and has arguably the best players to have played their position.

  • T-Money

    gen 1 easily. and i would make the team even better by dumping chuck, putting dream at the 4 and starting d. robinson.

  • Heals

    At least we click on our dislike of purple and gold Myung. Hey man even though it looks dire, just win 1 home game and the whole dynamic of the series flips for game 6…

  • http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhML7iq4dK491bduli Max

    Click my name to see how a Knicks fan reacts to a 3-1 deficit.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Haha ok, let’s try this then:
    Gen I: Magic, Dominique, Bird, Moses, Kareem
    Gen II: Stockton, Jordan, Pippen, Malone, Hakeem
    Gen III: Kidd, Kobe, Garnett, Duncan, Shaq

  • http://abcnews.com charliewinning

    Lmao someone sent me that same link Max. It was funny as hell, but keep in mind the site you got it from. Those idiots do anything stupid so that they can post a vid and get attention.

  • http://www.soundcloud.com/tray-5 T-Ray

    Tough one Caboose I think I’m gonna go with Gen II by a hair.

  • http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/videos/video.php?v=wshhML7iq4dK491bduli Max

    Well, I can’t comment on Gen 1 because I never saw them play live.

  • Andrew Woods

    T-money…..i agree with you mostly on Tmac. And we will never know how much his back played a part in us not knowing how great he could of been. Also I think tmac was clearly the better passer than kobe. Defensively I think kobe has the edge along with kobes footwork and post moves. One caveat I would like to add is I think tmac being ‘lazy’ prob tied in to his injuries mote than its given credit for

  • Da-Meat-Hook

    Gen 1 is stacked offensively, but assuming there’s no zone defense, who are Magic and Bird going to guard?

  • Myung

    Dominique called and wanted me to tell you he was flattered to be picked over Dr j… but wanted to know how he (drafted in 82, two years before stock and dream and mj) was in the same generation as kareem (drafted in 69). that’s like lumping iverson (96) in the same generation as Blake griffin (2009). but he’s still very flattered.

  • Da-Meat-Hook

    also, could gen 4 be Paul, Wade, Lebron, Dirk, Dwight?

  • Andrew Woods

    I think the evolution of the NBA athelete has me wondering would gen 1 be as effective as gen 3? Gen 1 centers would prob thrive because of the lack of quality centers. But gen 1 guards and forwards might have a tougher time dealing with the enhanced athleticism of gen 3 players…i.e..lebron, westbrook, d rose, rondo, dwight, and others……..just a thought

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    I would take Stockton, Jordan, Pippen, Barkley and Dream against any five, although T-Money’s five with Robinson was impressive.
    And I think there should be another generation for the 90s cats not named Jordan
    Like Shaq, Webber, Kemp, Steve Smith, Reggie, Payton and the like.

  • Myung

    gen 2.5 payton Mitch Richmond grant hill webber shaq? pretty weak, but they’re basically the best of that 1988 to 1994 draft crew? other nominees would be zo, mutombo, Kemp, glen rice, smitty, Larry Johnson, derrick coleman, and Jason kidd. Talking about that generation takes me back to early slam issues, nba inside stuff, and basketball cards.

  • Myung

    Oops forgot David Robinson and sprewell and tim hardaway

  • Myung

    Dmh, dirk is kobes generation. kd or melo would probably be gen 4′s sf. if kd is too young, he headlines gen 5: rose westbrook (got to put him at 2) kd love and … bynum? where have all the shooting guards gone? i can think of like 20 good young pg’s and only like 5 good 2 guards.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Haha my bad Myung. Definitely swap Dominique with Julius then.
    Gen I: Oscar, West, Baylor, Russell, Wilt
    Gen II: Magic, Erving, Bird, Moses, Kareem
    Gen III: Stockton, Jordan, Pippen, Barkley, Hakeem
    Gen IV: Payton, Iverson, McGrady, Webber, Robinson
    Gen V: Kidd, Kobe, Dirk, Duncan, Shaq
    Gen VI: Paul, Wade, LeBron, Melo, Dwight
    Honestly, this latest crop of players looks the weakest (close to Gen IV). Not too many rings on their fingers…

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    I think I’d take either Gen I or III. Russell and Wilt down low is just unfair but the Jordan factor is huge.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Generation Four and Five are messed up.
    Should look like
    Kidd, Payton, Grant Hill, Webber, Shaq
    Iverson, Kobe, McGrady, Duncan, Garnett

  • http://www.yahoo.com The Fury

    Gen IV!!! Because GP is my favorite player of all time!! Yeah!! lol…The outside-inside defensive tandem of the Glove and The Admiral, it doesn’t get any better than that.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    That looks better Allen. It’s hard to get it just right though haha especially since Kidd is still in the L and Ivy isn’t.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Uhm, wait a second, Kidd and Payton in the same generation?
    .
    Wouldn’t it be
    - Payton, Miller/Hardaway, Hill, Webber, Shaq?

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Too bad Kobe was so selfish down the stretch or maybe LA coulda pulled this one out.
    Sarcasm.
    I am really looking forward to testing the Thunder. Everyone thinks they are the favorites in a series with LA. I say heck no. Yes Westbrook will run circles around everyone. That’s what he does. What LA will be able to do, is keep up with him better than ever before(ei. Sessions) while still having the bigs in the paint to stymie any ill intended hammers Russ tries to knock in.
    Thabo guards Kobe very well. As well as anyone, but we all know KB still gunna school son.
    Lakers guard Durantula as well as anyone. He will get his like Kobe will, but should be a tough point every time he scores. I think he and Russ will both shoot 45%-ish for the series. Still able to put up numbers but not at the efficiency and ease they normally do.
    As good as Ibaka and Perk(?) are, they cannot hold a candle offensively to what the Lakers have on the post. Bynum does need to be very careful in the series though, because these guys will be looking to be pushing his buttons and trying to get under his skin at every turn. Bench is where OKC has the advantage. It will remain to be seen how much of an advantage.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    So many little overlap problems…I think Gen IV should encompass drafts between 1990-1995. Gen V has 1996-2001. Gen VI has 2002-2007. The up and coming Gen VII would have 2008 onwards.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    Good point NBK
    I think of Kidd and Payton as contemporaries, but they aren’t. Kidd is in the Iverson/Kobe generation.
    Should he bump Iverson or Kobe?
    Now that’s a good question

  • Da-Meat-Hook

    My bad Myung, I thought we were doing decades instead of draft classes.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    The real problem with this is when all these guys hit their primes. Like take Kidd and Hill for example. They should technically be grouped together because they were drafted together. But Hill hit his prime years before Kidd did. And Kidd’s prime lasted long after Hill’s was over. This is too hard without some kind of guidelines lol

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    I think JKidd should replace AI.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Hrmmm…I’ve gotta take AI over Kidd. Kidd will push a good team over the top, but prime Iverson might have pushed the Bobcats to the playoffs this year.

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    he should bump neither…. and I like GP. although the offensive flow most likely improves with one gone. unless iverson finally on a team with equally talented people decides to simply pass instead of score… hmmm

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Just saying, at their best, Payton only averaged 1.1 assists more than Iverson. And only .5 more for his career.

  • http://idunkonthem.blogspot.com albie1kenobi

    word to nbk on the guideline. i feel that we created multiple generations from the 1990-present because we are familiar with them. So in a sense we created expansion teams that water-down the talent. Gen I consisted of 5 best players in the first 3 decades of the league, so this is quite skewer.
    nevertheless, props to Caboose for bringin up this fun thought exercise. i’m totally reminiscing the “forgotten” 90s.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    JKidd’s 107 trip dubs in the RS and 11 in the Postseason are more impressive than anything AI ever accomplished.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Word albie. Let’s try this then, split the game into 4 generations then you guys pick your own “All Gen” team.
    Gen I: Players drafted before 1968
    Gen II: Players drafted between 1968-1982
    Gen III: Players drafted between 1983-1995
    Gen IV: Players drafted between 1996 and present.
    That should be a challenge.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Nick Tha Quick

    ^^ JT with the blasphemous speech in many circles (although I fully agree).

  • http://slamonline.com Datkid

    who guards westbrook lakeshow? He can probably swing a series by himself

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    .Gen 1: Frazier/West, Robertson, Baylor, Russell, Chamberlain.
    .Gen 2: Magic, Julius, Bird, Moses, Kareem
    .Gen 3: Stockton, Jordan, Pippen, Hakeem, Shaq
    .Gen 4: Iverson, Bryant, James, Garnett, Duncan.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    that is how it would break out too me with Caboose’s guidelines.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Personally, my teams would then be:
    Gen I: Oscar, West, Baylor, Russell, Wilt
    Gen II: Magic, Erving, Bird, Moses, Kareem
    Gen III: Stockton, Jordan, Pippen, Olajuwon, Shaq
    Gen IV: Iverson, Kobe, LeBron, Garnett, Duncan

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Nbk, we totally just picked the exact same teams. And I honestly didn’t see yours before posting, just tapping away on my iPhone.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    GenI- Oscar/Frazier/West/Russell/Wilt
    GenII- Isiah/Magic/Larry/Moses/Kareem
    GenIII- Stockton/MJ/Barkley/Malone/Hakeem
    GenIV- Paul/AI/Kobe/LeBron/Duncan

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    JT: you’re missing Shaq.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    LOL that’s awesome.
    .
    I would put Frazier in over West. Because Frazier gave West 36 and 19 for the 1970 title. So there is a slight difference, I put West in there because just about everyone considers him a better overall player.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    KG came along before 96 (95 draft)

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    I would love to see Gen 1 vs Gen 3. I would never be able to pick a winner.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Ah nice JT, missed that one. Swap Dirk in for me then.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Caboose, I know. I just feel that Malone was better than Shaq in the 90s. 2000s were a different story though.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Oh no no, not when they peaked. Otherwise you’d be taking Magic and Bird in basically their sophomore year. Take every player at his prime, the dates are just for qualifying for the gens.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Don’t sleep on Gen II though. They have 3 of the best all-time at their respective positions.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Sessions and Kobe. Blake occasionally. Maybe MWP or Barnes. It doesn’t matter. Like I said he is going to get his, but I think he will “get his” at any cost. Including OKC losing with him going out guns a blazing.
    Your right he can swing a series. In both directions.
    I honestly would not put money on any of these “era” teams in a 7 game series. Anyone of those teams could win against the others under the right circumstances. nbk’s gen 3 looks so deadly, but then you look at his gen 2 and it’s like, weeeeeeell, maybe…. Then you look at his gen 4 and that one is as deadly as the others imo. I would take Kidd on the gen 4 team over Ivy. Only because they could use the passing and organizing Kidd would provide. Iverson is basically a small Kobe offensively. (completely different players, but provide similar offense)
    Unless LeBron wanted to fully take on PG duties then AI, and Kobe with Bron playing point is absolutely ridiculous.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Ehh, I knew KG was drafted in 95 i just ignored it.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Oh…ok, my fault. Shaq replaces Malone.

  • Myung

    Gen 4: nash kobe lebron dirk duncan (hardest to omit: durant)

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Not to make this an anti-Bron rant, but look at the players Jordan went through in his generation vs the league today. I’m probably rewriting history a bit, but Jordan’s league looks stronger (from the top down view) than LeBron’s.

  • Myung

    Gen 4: stockton mj pippen Karl Malone hakeem (hardest to omit: shaq)

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Myung, you’ve got prime Malone over prime Shaq?

  • Myung

    Gen 1: before my time so no comment. gen 2 was slightly before my time too (followed the nba in the mid 80s) but since i saw a few of them, i will go magic, zeke, bird, doc, kareem (hardest to omit: Moses… and Dominique… jk).

  • Myung

    I guess im trying to not put in two centers. Btw shaq had a tremendous prime, but Karl Malone is statistically the best pf of all time. Duncan dwarfs him w the rings and will continue to compile stats and should be considered the best pf of all time but Karl is a close second. i will still take Karl over shaq. second leading scorer in nba history. ridiculously healthy in his first 18 seasons ( missed 10 total games).

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    But Wilt is statistically the best player of all time. I think Olajuwon could play the 4 next to Shaq; his defense was so damn good. Put it this way, I say Stockton has a ring(s) if you replace Malone with Shaq.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Hakeem did play the 4 for a few years. So there is that.

  • http://abcnews.com BigBlue

    Baron Davis is out for 12 months. Damn. Knicks got the injury bug something awful.

  • Anthony

    before the gen I II III IV discussion, you guys were talking about T-Mac playing with Shaq and how many rings they couldve possibly get, but what about Duncan having the same supporting cast than Shaq, any thought on this ?

  • http://www.kb24.com The Seed

    Can’t believe some DUMMY is comparing TMac to Kobe, I watched Tmac play and he was a ball hog who didn’t play defense, put up bad shots and choked over and over again. being up 3-1 losing to Pistons. Also the Rockets were better when he was hurt. Tmac had Yao and did nothing with him and Tmac is so overrated to be compared. More like Tmac compared to Anferenee Hardaway. Tmac wouldn’t even compare himself to Kobe. Tmac on the Lakers would have been worst. Tmac has no work ethic, been reported, no post game, never wanted to be the best and settled for jumpers too much. Some of yall need to rewatch Tmac play, ALSO NOBODY DURING THAT TIME EVER ON NBA BROADCASTS OR ANALYST EVER COMPARED TMAC TO KOBE, wow someone must hate Kobe. HE GOT THOSE ringsssss and he got a ring as being the only Hall of Famer on his team getting to two multiple rings. BOOK IT!!

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    Anthony: That’s a really good question. Honestly, I’d say probably close to the same result.

  • IAMORANGE4EVER

    First off, @Max LOL at that video of the Knicks fan. As for the Knicks game 4 win, it felt good. They have another game to play. I’m thankful for that. Love that these Knicks, despite all the adversity they’ve been through, simply won’t go quietly. Melo made all the right moves on Sunday. Amar’e played with a lot of heart with his hand all stitched together. Can’t believe he played and grabbed a double double. I do feel bad for Baron Davis though…couldn’t even watch the replay.

  • MeloMan15

    @Fatlever… they won 4 games in a row to make sure they would get into the playoffs… once they clinched hat they started tanking, to avoid miami… and why would the knicks want miami, they lost to them 3 times in the regular season. Clearly they wud have prefereed the bulls… they just didnt wanna sissy out and lose games on purpose

  • jinolin

    I don’t get how you can put the Stockton/Malone combo together for their respected generations, when both guys couldn’t get it done when it… I’d go with Isiah Thomas at the point for Gen III.
    This is open to opinions.

  • MeloMan15

    As for t-mac… the curse was set as soon as he left the raptors… could’ve had something great with vince but wanted to be the man, and it’s backfired his whole career… in terms of winning

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    So you’re going to sit there and act like Kobe’s teams never choked big leads before? How bout losing to PHX in 06 after being up 3-1? How bout losing after being up 24 to the Celtics (largest comeback in the NBA Finals since ’71) in the 08 Finals? How bout losing by the largest margin in NBA Final’s history to the same celtic team? Kobe fans are funny, it seems like they suffer from selective ammensia with regards to Kobe’s playoff failures.

  • http://slamonline.com Mars

    Happy for the Knicks, but we all know that series is over as too is Baron’s season. Man I love BD’s heart, so sad to see him go down like that. Get well soon Baron Davis. Almost as ugly as Shaun Livingston’s injury. :0(

  • http://Slamonline.com nbk

    Isiah would be in Magic’s generation. Not Stockton’s.

  • http://www.t-mac.com/tmac/index unf*ckwitable

    Sorry for bringing this up again but i think possibly yesterday in a thread i may have offended/angered some people with some comments on racism(i didnt use any racial slurs). Anyone it goes against what i believe in so if i did offend anyone( i wasnt trying too but thats no excuse) im sorry.

    Someone called me something which got me heated and then i just made myself look silly and childish.

  • http://slamonline.com Allenp

    It’s not blasphemous to think Kidd is better than Iverson. I’m one of the biggest Iverson fans in the world, and I think that’s a decent position to have. I don’t know if I agree, but I think it’s a legitimate belief to hold.

  • http://juan.garcia@computershare.com Miami Joe

    Whatt a bunch of f’n nerds. Sounds like a Dungeons & Dragons meeting up in here.

  • http://juan.garcia@computershare.com Miami Joe

    Rings are all that matter. Whether you’re option 1A/1B same difference. Do you take away a chip from Magic or Duncan, let’s say, because another player on his team got a Finals MVP over them? No! No again yesterday! The greats are self evident.

  • http://Roosterteeth.com Caboose

    What a condescending and unintelligent douchebag who wants to look tougher than he actually is. Sounds like a University of Phoenix class right there.

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