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Saturday, August 24th, 2013 at 1:42 pm  |  92 responses

Dwight Howard Reportedly Wanted Kobe Bryant, Mike D’Antoni Out


Kobe Bryant has been discussing playing for a few more years with the Lakers, and that timetable was a factor in Dwight Howard’s decision to sign with the Rockets. Howard’s rift with Mike D’Antoni is well-known, and the big man also requested that D’Antoni be fired. Ric Bucher reports that the big man’s requests to fire Mike D’Antoni and amnesty Kobe Bryant were simply too much for the Lakers: “Talks with various people close to the situation make it clear there were two prerequisites for Dwight Howard to remain a Laker: fire Mike D’Antoni and amnesty, or at the very least muzzle, Kobe Bryant. As audacious as that might sound, it doesn’t come without precedent in Lakers’ history. When Kobe re-upped in 2004, it coincided with Shaq being shipped to Miami and Phil Jackson being let go. Of course, Kobe didn’t have to pressure the team braintrust — Mitch Kupchak and Jerry and Jim Buss — to make those moves, since Dr. Buss, in particular, was done with both Shaq and Phil at the time. The Lakers apparently asked Dwight to be patient on both fronts for at least another season, telling him ‘hey, you’re going to have to gut this out another year,’ a source said, although it sounds as if VP of basketball ops Jim Buss isn’t ready to abandon Kobe anytime soon. ‘Dwight didn’t want to play with Kobe for 2-3 more years,’ Buss said. ‘I’m going to stand behind Kobe because of his history with the franchise.’ It would seem, then, with all that happened, the Lakers had the wherewithal to keep Howard if they had desired; they simply found the price too high.”

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  • KingBenjamin

    I understand firing Mike D’Antoni because the guy is a complete idiot of a coach but Kobe Bryant arguably the greatest Laker off all-time getting amnestied? That’s a damn joke Dwight, you’re not that good to demand that, you can’t even be the number one scoring option.

    As a Lakers fan, the Lakers should have listened to Dwight and fired D’Antoni because that makes sense if they want to win in the short and long term and they should have just told Kobe to not say anything negative about Dwight because he is soo sensitive and is a diva. But since they didn’t, now we are stuck with D’Antoni and Chris Kaman, the Lakers management doesn’t even know what to tell the team about what their goals are for this season. What a complete joke.

  • spit hot fiyah

    does that mean that he wanted me to stay? :)

  • berkamore

    Negotiation 101: Understand when you have leverage and when you don’t. The Lakers acted like they did have leverage in the D-12 negotiation when they didn’t have any.

    I understand that the Lakers have a rich history but….. as somebody in an article (the one where j. buss disses howard) said , they seem content to live “on the History channel”.

    Next summer it’s gonna be interesting to see if they can sign any free agents to play with a volume shooter who no longer plays defense. That should be fun to watch………….

  • Smits#45

    Even though I’m not a Lakers fan I hope Kobe will never be amnestied or traded. People always talk about players only wanting money and not being loyal anymore but I think this goes both ways. What happened to Paul Pierce didn’t seem right to me even though it could be better for the team. That’s why I think Mark Cuban is a great owner when he publicly stated that Dirk Nowitzki basically can get any contract (in terms of years) that he wants. I believe this creates trust and self confidence amongst players which in turn makes them play better.

  • pposse

    Whats the point of playing on the Lakers if your not playing with Kobe? Seriously DH is a complete joke, anyone who roots for this guy outside of Houston are completely misguided and a joke too. IF all this nonsense that is being said about this whole situation is true i hope he doesn’t even sniff the hall of fame, DH belongs in the hall of shame.

  • KBM

    Spit you are hilarious.

  • Busta213

    Firing Dantoni in a transition year makes little sense if youre going to have to pay his salary anyway. Next year isn’t championship or bust for the Lakers – no one knows what to expect from Kobe.

  • i_ball

    The had some leverage – they could offer him more money

  • i_ball

    Even in Houston he will be the second guy on the team and, unlike Kobe, Harden is just getting started.

  • Busta213

    Lol, that’s a very silly statement. LA has been great before Kobe and can be after Kobe.
    Why would DH want another awful year alongside a terrible teammate like Kobe was to him? In terms of games missed, DH has been an NBA ironman for his most of his career. Yet a few months with Kobe publically running his mouth and most fans are calling DH fragile and unwilling to play through pain. Why would he want MORE of the same?

  • KingBenjamin

    How would it have made little sense? What are you saying that the Lakers should have kept D’Antoni to coach Howard? You have no idea what you are talking about.

  • spit hot fiyah

    so true, so if the above report is true, it is probably more personal than anything else

  • Busta213

    Look, even Phil Jax was not going to turn the hot mess that is the Lakers into a title team next season. Only a homer would think otherwise.
    Im not saying Dantoni is the right coach for LA long term – im not insane – but next season is a write-off and in terms of DH dictating MD be fired? There is something in not letting the inmates run the asylum.

  • Dominican Jordan

    What else is new SLAM?

  • JoeMaMa

    I get this logic. Kobe’s one of the all time greats,and Dwight has maturity issues – I didn’t really see him flourishing under the lights in LA. Of course, Kobe’s getting old and recently had a RIPPED ACHILLES, and Dwight’s an absolute stud….but this was a loyalty call. Organizations gain serious cred when they step up for their top guns. Kobe loves this, and it shows that Buss, despite his foibles, will take care of his guys. And that will draw talent.

  • Basketball_iQ

    I agree with you but let me say this: Paul gracefully bowed out and took one for the team bc if you remember the history of things, the celtics sucked for years after bird and McHale left,,, leaning on reggie (which so reminds me of Jeff, praying not) and that was the final blow…. No relevance for what,,, 10 full years? I wish I was in the garden to thank him when he comes back bc his acceptance of this trade will soften that blow and shorten that trip back to relevance. He’s my favorite player all time and his jersey should go up as soon as he gets back. Word.

  • Basketball_iQ

    This guy….. I mean c’mon,,,, your value has been revealed. He will not change Houston,,, he’s a pre Madonna.

  • Ishmael Jenkins

    Interesting. If true, not surprised that Dwight didn’t want to play with Kobe. I wouldn’t either if I had his personality and sensitivity. And we all know how tough Kobe is on teammates when they don’t do what he wants them to do. Just wish he’d hold himself more accountable when things go wrong instead of going after Pau and his other teammates.

    What’s also interesting is the organization telling Dwight to gut it out for one more season because if that’s true, it means they were going to be done with Kobe after one more season and give the team to Dwight. Not sure Kobe would love to hear about that.

  • logan12th

    All I know is that last season, Kobe in his last game of the season, left the floor after leading a 9-0 run, and hitting two clutch, heartfelt, inspirational free throws with no achilles tendon, in a must win game they only won by 2 points, to help clinch a playoff spot… Dwight, on the other hand… left the floor after only playing 21 minutes, scoring a total of 7 points, shooting 3 of 9 from the line, and being unceremoniously tossed out for a stupid play in a playoff elimination game. And Howard wanted Kobe amnestied?

  • Ishmael Jenkins

    To be fair, Kobe’s a “diva” too and has been the same amount of times, if not more, than Dwight. Not shooting in regular season and playoff games. Not wanting to do what Phil Jackson wanted him to do on the floor. Requesting a trade and changing his mind the same day. Getting caught on video saying he didn’t know why the organization didn’t trade Bynum for Jason Kidd. He’s just in a position now where he doesn’t need to show it that much because he’s happy. But when he’s not, he’s had his demands and forceful requests during his time in LA.

  • daBiz

    He (or his camp, at least) had to know the Lakers would never part with Kobe, which means this was his way of saying, “I’m never wearing purple and forum blue again.” I think Laker fans can live with that.

  • robb

    I dislike Dwight a lot. A LOT. But Jim Buss is acting like a jerk. Why say these things now? This stuff shouldn’t be made public, Dwight had the right to speak out and put his demands on the table, he did that behind closed doors, it should’ve stayed that way, this is a dishonorable move by Jim Buss.

  • The Seed

    Dude MJ was worst than Kobe, go research.

  • The Seed

    If Howard had any kind of mental toughness he would have played with Kobe and worked on his game. Howard is softer than my kids pillow.

  • JibbsIsBallin

    Howard thought he’s at that level where he can request to get the coach fired and get the Mamba out of there?

  • Brandan E.

    dwight is straight trippin if he thinks they would amnesty kobe like that. now mike d. thats another story.
    but i cant see why dwight didnt wanna learn from kobe on how to lead a team and win! kobe would do whatever he can to win and dwight didnt wanna learn.
    well i guess he gonna learn how hard it is in houston to win. he will see and only time will tell.

  • KingBenjamin

    I guarantee you that Phil would have turned this Lakers team around, because the players fit his personnel.

    Bottom line is that if the Lakers wanted Dwight to re-sign and have him be the future of the Lakers than they should have listened to him when he said he wanted Phil Jackson to be the coach, if Phil were to have been hired coach Dwight would have signed that extension right than and there, the Lakers would have been legitimate title contenders but instead they hired Mike D’Antoni and they don’t even know what they are playing for this season.

  • Evan Boland

    They were too injured to be turned around. Nash, Kobe, Blake and MWP couldn’t play in playoffs..

  • Jay Brodes

    i hate gossip but if this is true first off i have 0 respect for d12 and this only gives mamba more fuel. this just tells me d12 has no clue on the laker organization and never deserved to wear the purple and gold…good riddance. i hope harden ball hogs in h-town and i hope d12 tears his acl in game1..serves him right..yeah i said it..real talk!

  • Jay Brodes

    i concur..i would have never hired either mike brown or dantoni to begin with! that i would agree with d12..as per kobe if d12 actually demanded this he really does not have a clue of the organization he played on or the city! d12 got swept by the spurs. kb basically carried the lakers almost single handedly to the playoffs himself! period!

  • Feez_22

    3x dpoy… he is a HOF book in. Regardless of this situation being true or false, he is going to the hall.

    The funny thing is that a young kobe bryant threatened to go to the LA clippers and basically went to the lakers saying he did not want to be a sidekick anymore. Basically he said ME OR HIM… sound familiar? Kobe did the exact same thing d12 just did in terms of wanting to be the man yet i see people like you thinking that d12 is crazy because he didn’t want to play with kobe… crazy thing is shaq and phil departed. what did d12 want? kobe and d-antoni gone… sound freaking familiar to you?

    This leads me to this point… Who wouldn’t want to play with a shaq who was clearly the lakers best player in the finals prior to leaving the team? KOBE that is who. Yet when d12 does it 9 years later he’s the bad guy? LOL…

    This is why i can’t take basketball fans like yourself seriously. Basically by the comment you just typed, kobe also shouldn’t be in the hall (since he also didn’t want to play with a HOF player like shaq for his own selfish intentions). Think about that the next time you criticize a current player. The HYPOCRISY of your statement is just funny to me.

  • disqus_Gu7XIZJaOF

    To supplement your case about Dwight and Kobe’s similarities, Kobe had yet to reach his prime but clearly had the most potential of any player coming up in the league in 2004. Kobe was one of the top 5 players in the league on both ends of the court and had already averaged 30 ppg for a season. Shaq was the most dominant player of his era/of the post-Jordan era. Phil Jackson was coming off 4 straight Finals appearances and a third 3-peat. Kobe was also coming off a huge PR nightmare in the Colorado case. One could argue that Kobe’s request in 2004 was even more ludicrous based on those facts. This situation speaks volumes about how far Dwight has fallen in the last two-three years. Clearly, if the Lakers thought it worth to make that move to amnesty Kobe or fire D’Antoni, they could have, but they did not. It says more to me about Dwight’s actual value as a player at this point in time more than anything else.

  • AndyK415

    It’d be way more entertaining if Dwight didn’t get injured and he was just frustrated as hell the whole year.

  • berkamore

    That line made me laugh when I heard it during the Dwight sweepstakes.

    The Lakers could offer him a longer contract than anybody else but the actual annual salary was kind of the same. Besides, I would even wager that the take home pay in Houston would be higher for Dwight because there are no state income taxes in Texas.

    Furthermore, like Shock Exchange noted, a longer contract would mean that Dwight would probably have ZERO leverage for the next five years. (And since the Lakers don’t seem to worry too much about pleasing him when he DID have leverage……) I get D12′s reluctance to resign, it makes sense on MANY levels.

  • slay

    Cmooooon guys don’t be stupid everyone knows Kobe is a terrible teammate without Phil Jackson. He does whatever he wants and I am sorry his defense is atrocious he played good defense like 3 times this whole season. Once against LeBron in the all star game, once against kyrie and I forgot the other time. It doesn’t help that mike dosent teach any d Antoniii is there either. That Lakers roster was old burdened by the salary cap and has one of the worse coaches in the league. What superstar would waste his prime in a mess like that.

  • Tad

    Difference between Kobe in 04 and Dwight now is that Dwight is the only one that wants Kobe gone. Back in 2004 everyone realized that the Shaq Kobe Phil trio had run its course and couldn’t function any more. Kobe wasn’t the only one saying me or him, Shaq was saying it too. The Lakers just made the logical decision to side with the young superstar over the older one.

  • Ishmael Jenkins

    Dude, Phil Jackson said himself that MJ was better with teammates than Kobe was/is. Google it.

  • Caboose

    Hate the guy all you want, but calling for the dude to tear his ACL? That’s f*cked up and you know it.

  • Feez_22

    Yes for sure. However, we have to take in the fact that dwight howard was not 100% for pretty much the whole season health wise which contributed to his falling off. Last year, he wasn’t nearly as effective defensively as he was in prior years so we have to take that into consideration as well but yes… The lakers didn’t feel like a player of d12′s caliber (at least last yr) was worth the demands he was spewing. Heck… Even if d12 was fully healthy they wouldn’t have beckoned to that demand. Kobe is way too popular in LA and is much more valuable to the franchise monetarily and star power wise. They probably would have only granted the first demand in firing d’antoni (which is fair since d’antoni will never lead a team to a championship with his coaching philosophy).

    I just hate hypocrisy when it comes to the dwight bashing. For anyone to say that a 3x dpoy (in counting) deserves to be in the hall of shame for demands a bunch of star players make including one of the players d12 made it against is irresponsible and short sighted.

  • Feez_22

    Shaq only said “me or him” because kobe questioned his leadership skills. Kobe went on national television and basically called shaq, the LEADER of the team fat and not in shape. Think about that. Kobe wanted to be the leader and the “man” so bad that he was ready to throw shaq under the bus and DID on National TV. Then, kobe started snitching on shaq in terms of his promiscuous lifestyle which screwed shaq’s personal life up with his wife.

    Shaq didn’t want kobe gone for basketball reasons. He said “me or him” because kobe was DICTATING how the franchise was being run (sound familiar?) and was attacking his character to do it. Phil left bc of kobe. Shaq demanded a trade because of the lakers beckoning to what kobe wanted and demanded a huge pay raise to show kobe that he was still the man. Shaq went on to take a discount with the miami heat. Just think about that.

    Not only did shaq want kobe gone… Phil QUIT and by reports said he did not want to go back to the lakers if kobe returned. Think about that. one of the greatest centers ever and the greatest coach in the history of the game were disbanded because of one player. This is actually WORSE than d12′s demands. D12 is at least demanding for a coach that isn’t even championship caliber to be eliminated.

  • Tad

    I thought leaders were supposed to hold people accountable and not be afraid to speak the truth? Say what you want about Kobe bringing up Shaq’s personal drama but as a Laker fan I watched Shaq have fun all summer then come into training camp out of shape and decide to have foot surgery and miss the start of the season. Everyone around the league saw how great a player Kobe was becoming, Shaq made Kobe turn into a diva by not letting him be a co-leader. Kobe had to basically take some leadership away from Shaq which is why they had so many problems. Shaq was as big a diva as Kobe was.

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  • Ugh

    I guess that means when he grows up he’ll be post-Madonna.

  • pposse

    no matter what the opinion on Kobe is, he was still a top tier ball player. Even at the age of 35 he still has separated himself from being mediocre. I respect winning and Kobe was DH’s best shot to win in LA so for him to go off and make these stupid demands exemplifies a penut brain. DH hasn’t won anything, he got to the finals and got waxed by a Kobe led Laker team. DH logic is addition by subtracting a superstar ball player, i mean seriously what world does this make sense? Its about winning not about catching feelings. He made is decisiion and went to Houston which is fine, but whats the deal with him trolling LA Lakers management?

  • http://www.offthebackboard.wordpress.com/ Off The Backboard

    Shaq didn’t take a paycut to go to the Heat; he got traded while in his Lakers contract and thus made MORE money.

    He was making 24.7 million/year (!) in 2003-2004 with the Lakers. He made 27.6 million for his first year in Miami, and then signed a 20mill/year deal thereafter.

    In regards to your other points, I’d just like to say that a) PJ was going to be fired whether Kobe was a Laker or not. The Lakers brass (not just Kobe) wanted him gone by 2004. Rudy T was Jim Buss’ choice for a replacement. And b) I don’t think you realize how toxic that situation and that team had become by the end of 2004. There was barely any semblance of a team left; its still a miracle they made it to the 2004 Finals.

  • http://www.offthebackboard.wordpress.com/ Off The Backboard

    I think it just would have been a PR disaster had they amnestied Kobe (who’s given 17 years of heart and soul to the franchise) for a dude that coasted through his one season, talked sh*t about team leaders, and even managed to make Steve Nash question his maturity/effort levels.

    Howard is an exceptional talent, and Houston will be great next year, but LA and the Lakers were not the right situation for him.

  • http://www.offthebackboard.wordpress.com/ Off The Backboard

    I don’t blame Dwight for wanting out; Kobe is really difficult to play with. But I mean….DH played one season for the Lakers, gave minimal effort and coasted throughout. When the team was “his” with Kobe injured, he led them to exactly zero playoff wins and posted LOWER averages than he did in the regular season when Kobe was apparently inhibiting his playing abilities.

    So….let’s see, if I’m the Lakers brass: Option A: Choose the guy who played one season with your franchise and who fans were so-so about throughout the season, or; Option B: The player who fans adore and has given his all for the franchise since he was drafted 17 years ago. Not really a tough choice honestly, especially since Kobe only has one year left – it would be a PR disaster for them to just ditch Kobe the year before he became a FA, especially for DH.

  • pposse

    first of all I think your under the impression that I’m a kobe fan…which i’m not…not at all. You can search history over here for like 2 years and see all the critisim i gave him. Regardless of all this, when Kobe and Shaq separated Kobe was a cog on 3 championship teams, has DH done anything like this? He was never even close to actually winning a ring. The series with LA was over before it even started, stevie wonder could seen that. I know DH will be in the hall, but these personality traits should make almost everyone not want him to be (excluding houston fans). Kobe not wanting to play with Shaq was boneheaded, but Kobe was also a lot younger when he made his demands. Dwight is a 27-28 year old speaking foolishly. Your brain is fully developed by this age and apparently dwight has not developed into a mature respectable human being. Your right about one thing i’m a fan so i give perspective here based on fandom; with that being said there are still ways to be objective. I never like Kobe or his game, but understand that regardless him and the Lakers won 5 rings; how else are you supposed to look at Dwight for spitting in the face of that? I really want to know, believe me when I say that Kobe got a lot of flack from almost everyone i knew when Shaq and him separated…he was taught a lesson by the basketball gods..they rebuilded around him in his prime..losing first round playoff series, not getting to the playoffs, losing out on MVPs cause his team blowed etc.

  • pposse

    kobe can go to the hall of shame too for all i care. I look at anything less than 8 rings for him as a failure. Shaq made an immediate impact in Miami, they were pretty much a twisted rib (dwade game 5 vs pistons) away from getting to the finals in his first year with Miami. With Shaq still being dominant (as exemplified with his immediate deep run with Miami and championship the following year) and Kobe rising they could have and should have been lethal until 2011. Kobe trampled on his own legacy when he thought he was boosting it by gettting rid of Shaq. So yes DH and Kobe both made similar demands, and they are both idiots for it. Idk what part of the country your from, but Kobe has always had one of the worst reputations in the league amongst everyone and anyone who debates this. And you don’t think that has anything to do with his divorce with Shaq? DH has easily put himself in that category over the past 2 years and I was just explaining that. Nothing hypocritical, irresponsible or short sighted about it; when in actuality this is all foresight and needed to be said.

  • The Seed

    MJ teammates have stated that he was not, go research it.

  • pposse

    do you remember when he finally made his decision? and then there were reports that he reneged for a second because he didn’t want to leave 20-30 million dollars on the table? Dwight explained as much too through his PR during that time. The Lakers had a little leverage.

  • pposse

    there were some very interesting things about MJ, there was a book in the 80s that was written about MJ.. i can’t think of the name of it right now, but MJ as great as he was was not the easiest to get along with. Story has it that one time Horace Grant lost a rebound in an away game (something of that nature) which cost the bulls the victory so MJ in the airplane ride home seen Horace getting food and flipped the food tray and told him he couldn’t eat until he grabs a rebound. He also hated Scottie Pippen until Pip actually developed. He rode on Pip hard in practice but Pip was a big man and was able to take it and get better. Its cliche but Pip earned MJ’s respect. I’m just saying this because Kobe tries to emulate everything Jordan does. When did Kobe ever punch his teammate in the face? MJ did. idk they both used the same sort of leadership techniques, but i highly doubt Kobe would treat his teammates in the manner he does if MJ didn’t do it first.

  • pposse

    one more thing about Kobe…Kobe was in a position in 04 where the opportunity for shattering a lot of nba records was certainly possible and became a legit reality. Unfortunately the only way for this to happen would have been if he were the “leader” which is where he faulted. Because he could have shattered records by outlasting Shaq and still won a lot more rings than he has now.

  • berkamore

    We’ll see in a few years how much Dwight actually “left on the table” in that fifth year. Because he didn’t leave anything on the table for the first four years.

    88 million in Houston over 4 years is 22 million a year. 118 million in LA over 5 years is 23.6 million a year. BUT there are no state income taxes in Texas, state income taxes in Cali. are now a whopping 13%. So his TAKE HOME PAY in Houston is higher. (and hard, cold cash in your pocket is what it’s all about)

    Now, if the first year of his next contract pays him less than what he would have made with the Lakers in that fifth year, so yeah, he may have missed out. So far he’s sitting pretty but we’ll see when he negotiates his next contract.

  • Conor

    People underestimate what Rondo will do once he returns. Greatest Playoff PG in the League.

  • Conor

    Terrible teammate? Listen, if you perturb Steve Nash – the game’s quintessential teammate – to the degree he was perturbed this past season, it’s on you. “You” is Howard, the man once called “Dwight Coward” by former fans in Orlando…

  • Conor

    The East was a wasteland of competent big men during that era. The W.C. Playoffs were the true Finals… Los Angeles-Sacramento, Los Angeles-San Antonio, Los Angeles-Portland… and guess who the “greatest” player was, as admitted by Shaq himself, hahaha. O’Neal was most dominant of any player, physically, since Wilt.

  • Busta213

    It could be said that Steve Nash made a political decision and picked a side. In LA the smartest side to pick is the mamba’s.
    The “terrible teammate” thing is hardly a revelation – through multiple incarnations of the Lakers roster.

  • Busta213

    There is evidence that a doctor told Shaq to hold off on getting surgery to see how it responded to treatment.
    Its quite possible that the “healing on company time” comment was just a joke that got taken too seriously

  • Busta213

    Exactly. Pau was a mess at the start of the season, DH was still recovering his mobility. Add it to all the rest of their issues and that was not a top 4 squad in the west.

  • Busta213

    I don’t see it. They spent a full season together and have awful chemistry. Surely the smarter choice was to go to a team with younger, healthier pieces in place?
    No doubt Dwight needs to mature, but why in LA with a potentially hobbled Kobe? Hes already seen Kobes legendary work ethic up close. A fresh start in a more friendly environment seems to make more sense.

  • anon

    We all know Kobe is a lousy teammate. What we found out over the last 2 years is that Dwight is an even worse one.

  • Busta213

    Kobe is coming back from an injury that has destroyed many careers and Kobe takes up $35m on the cap. Add to that his “me first” shot selection and their animosity and I understand why DH would be OK with letting him go (if the rumor is true).
    HOWEVER, from the Lakers perspective, I would also say no. Even a fading Kobe has enough star power to sell out the arena. Im not sure if subtracting Kobe’s $35m would’ve even given them the flexibility to make an impact move (beyond saving luxury tax).
    The Lakers have a good plan to rebuild the following season, and I think they keep next year’s draft pick?

  • Busta213

    Im not a massive fan of Dwight, but I don’t buy all the knocks against him over the last 2 years.
    First it was all the trade rumors. “Oh D12 is soo fickle! He doesn’t even know where he does or doesn’t want to play!” How much of that had anything to do with him? Almost none. Most was media BS. He said he wanted to play in NJ.
    Then he gave in to pressure from his Dad and re-upped with the Magic. Again – “Dwight is soo dumb – he doesn’t know if hes coming or going!”. But rather than leave as a free agent (what Bron was condemned for) he let the Magic get the trade package they wanted. So he took more heat by trying to do right by the magic
    I do buy that he is a bit of a class clown, and it was disingenuous of him to say the magic put bad players around him. Though after a few good squads, they definitely did (Gilbert A….yikes..).

  • Feez_22

    1. … i never said you were a kobe fan. I never even implied it. I know you are a jordan fan. I have known this for a while.

    2. The lakers/magic series was over before it started because of the lack of quality teammates on the orlando magic side. D12 was basically 1 on 5 in that series and couldn’t pull through. Remember… an injured jameer nelson coming back was a detriment to that team’s chances because the chemistry waned off.

    Nonetheless, saying a player that made the finals was never even close to actually winning a ring is false. If you made the finals, you are closer to winning it than 30 teams off the bat. Magic were a game winning alley oop layup in game 2 away from this series going 6 and possibly 7 so think about that before you make a conclusion like that.

    3. Personality traits have nothing to do with hall of fame placement. Period. Is the player hall of fame caliber or not? If the answer is yes, that is all that is needed. A lot of people didn’t like the personality traits of guys like dennis rodman, reggie miller, etc etc but their play put them in the hall.

    4. You are right on the age thing. Kobe was 24 when he made his demands. D12 is 27. However, a 27 yr old kobe tried to force a trade from LA due to them not surrounding him with talent (which was HIS FAULT in the first place with the running out of town of shaq and phil) and just last year, a 34 year old shaq told the media that the lakers CAN’T WAIT FOR D12′S INJURIES TO HEAL… think about that. No courtesy for his new teammate yet d12 gets all the blame? This is why d12 made these demands and when they weren’t met, he left. It’s that simple.

    5. The lakers you saw last year were not the lakers that won those 5 rings. Not even close to a semblance of that. D12 spit in the face of the new look, dysfunctional lakers whom he took all of the media bullets for. An injured d12 took all of the slack for their defensive woes, was labelled as fragile and soft. A player that plays through a back injury that should have had him rehabbing until january isn’t soft or fragile period and pre-injury, d12 was one of the highest energy players in the nba but you wouldn’t have known that watching the team and the coverage of him last year.

    He wanted kobe and mike gone so that if he were to be criticized, it would actually be fair and on him v. criticism he got that wasn’t fair (last year). Do i think the lakers should have beckoned to his wish? NO. However, to say he deserves to be in the hall of shame for a demand that the guy he tried to get out did 9 yrs ago is just not right.

  • Feez_22

    When shaq became a free agent in the subsequent year after he was traded, he gave pat riley and the heat brass a discount. He signed a 5 yr 100M deal instead of a 5 yr 125+M dollar deal and decided against going for the 6 year deal.

    Shaq demanded the MAX from the lakers because he wanted to show kobe who the real leader was. He demanded a trade when he learned of the pjax situation and knew the lakers were doing everything to coddle kobe bryant.

  • Feez_22

    As a leader, you don’t air your teammates out in NATIONALLY TELEVISED INTERVIEWS especially when the true leader of the team and the driving force behind all of those championships at the time is the victim of those criticisms. Those criticisms are to stay in house. Leaders don’t throw teammates (especially focal points) under the bus.

    BTW it was doctors orders for shaq to not have surgery at the time. They tried to avoid surgery but it got too bad that he had to have it during the season. How you are criticizing shaq for that is funny.

    Shaq didn’t make kobe a diva. Kobe airing shaq out on live television and then snitching on him (for no reason by the way) regarding paying off groupies which pretty much ended shaq’s marriage was kobe’s doing and kobe’s doing only.

  • Roy Blumenfeld

    The Lakers organization is pathetic for leaking this. Who knows if it is even true or not. But D’Antoni will be fired by the end of the year anyways. He’s an awful coach and the decision to hire him was due to Jim Buss’s hubris and desire to win a ring without Phil.

  • Feez_22

    99-00 western conf finals (7 games)
    Shaq Oneal – 25.9ppg 12.4rpg 4.3apg 53.7% fg 2 bpg
    Kobe Bryant – 20.4ppg 4.9rpg 5.9apg 43.7% fg 2.1bpg

    - Best player in this series = Shaq.

    00-01 western conference finals (4 games)
    Shaq Oneal – 27ppg 13rpb 2.5apg 54.1% fg 1.3bpg 0.8spg
    Kobe Bryant – 33ppg 7rpg 7apg 51.4% fg 0.8bpg 1.5spg

    - Best player in this series = Kobe.

    HOWEVER, since the lakers actually had a tougher challenge in the nba finals (won in 5), the finals was actually the real finals. Don’t try this revisionist history stuff… The lakers beat the spurs by an average of 22.75ppg in the conf finals in a sweep. The lakers beat the sixers by an average of 10ppg in the finals and lost a game. In fact, the sixers were the lakers biggest challenge in their entire playoff run this year. This is a fact.

    What did shaq do in those nba finals v. what kobe did?

    Shaq- 33ppg 15rpg 4.8apg 57.3% fg 3.4bpg 0.4spg
    Kobe- 24ppg 7.8rpg 5.8apg 41.5% fg 1.4 bpg 1.4spg

    Shaq did this against the nba’s DPOY (dikembe mutumbo).

    01-02 Western Conference Finals
    Shaq – 30ppg 13.6rpg 1.6apg 53.2%fg 2.4bpg 0.4spg
    Kobe- 27.1ppg 6.3rpg 3.9apg 41.9% fg 1.1bpg 1.4spg

    - Best laker in this series = Shaq.

    So… Of the 3 western conf finals where the lakers went on to win their 3 peat, shaq was better than kobe in 2 of them. Kobe was better than shaq v. the spurs in 00-01 BUT that was NOT the real nba finals. The sixers were actually a tougher challenge for the lakers than the spurs were so the sixers/lakers finals was the real nba finals. In that nba finals, shaq dominated.

    … So , looks like shaq was just saying kobe was the best in all of those series to soothe kobe’s ego huh?

  • anon

    I do buy that the media created some of the stories about Dwight during the “dwightmare”. The 24/7 coverage of that made for some shady journalism — I saw articles that didn’t even have any quotes from “sources close to the matter”, let alone Dwight’s own quotes.

    But at the same time: Dwight’s a grown ass millionaire, and if he’s having such a bad time with the press — then he should hire himself a proper PR handler to speak for him and sue every mf’er who printed a lie. A grown man handles his business.

    That said, let me ask all the Kobe haters in the Slam family this: how many times during last season did you think to yourself “damn…Dwight’s making Kobe look like a saint out here. Kobe looks like true leader of warriors compared to this whining clown.”? I know for myself that my opinion of the mamba changed quite a bit when I saw how he looked compared to Dwight.

  • Busta213

    I don’t see how you can sue someone when its all “an unnamed source reports….”
    My opinion of Kobe didn’t change at all. I cant ever knock his drive or work ethic, but he showed himself to be the terrible leader of men he always has been.

    He proved that he is more media savvy than Dwight. we already knew that tho.

  • straight cake
  • Sergio

    Gotta agree with you.

  • JL

    LOL love that Nelly is trying to out yell Stephen A.

  • Ray

    I’m sure what Dwight said has been taken out of context, to 1) please Kobe and his fans, and 2) to vilify DH12 so that it makes him look bad and 3) to make Jim Buss look better. In my opinion 1 and 2 have been accomplished. Jim Buss just looks like a bigger asshole now.

    Remember, Mark Cuban said that the Lakers should amnesty Kobe. He wasn’t wrong, if the Lakers want to rebuild right away. Dwight didn’t want to wait one more year so that KOBE HAS A CHANCE AT ANOTHER RING. Dwight wants to win now, and it sure ain’t in LA.

  • JL

    I’m a Laker fan and I wish the Lakers woulda amnestied Kobe. That’s before I realized they can’t just sign him back next year. I woulda thought they should just have him rest for the majority of the year a la David Robinson, and tank for Wiggins. There’s your successor right there!

  • pposse

    1. so then why are you bringing Kobe’s past antics up? What purpose does that show? you comparing kobe’s antics to dwight’s says enough about both of their characters. And here you are assasinating kobe’s.

    2. I prefaced this whole point by stating Kobe greatly helped win 3 rings and didn’t even mention the 2 rings he won as the so called leader. So what your telling me is that DH accomplishment in the one finals compares to Kobe’s whole career? Or your just diverting the whole point to begin by bringing up semantics? “He was never even close to winning a ring” – sure a little exaggerated but put the emphisis on the term “a” vs. “multiple” (as in kobe’s case).

    3. “dwight belongs in the hall of shame” – was said because he aught to be ashamed for even making such a ludicrous request. It was literal, thats all there is to it. I don’t know if this is an age thing or not with some of yall, but having some respect would be nice. DH’s agent, pr personell etc. would have all told him that this was a dumb request that would not get honored. Why go there then? Only someone with no shame would do that, and you cosigning this act is shameful as well. Dwight aint Shaq.

    4. All of this could have been avoided if he just told them he wasn’t staying there from the get go..like the minute the FA period started. Like I said he never should have brought up Kobe’s stay with LA..this only makes him a clown. Everyone know 1 + 1=2 thats why we never actually state it:: kobe is never leaving LA under managements terms.

    5. No one is here to hold your hand, if he was supposed to rehab until january and didn’t then thats on him. Your just reiterating the fact he is stupid. Where was D Rose at last year? Does a true fan question that decision? You know..the smart decision? Seriously dwights a douche who has zero respect for his elders.

  • Ishmael Jenkins

    Don’t need to. I read/heard what Phil Jackson, who coached them both, had to say.

  • Ishmael Jenkins

    Kobe didn’t punch anyone in practice because he’s not built that way. He’s not stupid. He knows that if he threw a punch at any of those guys he played with, the outcome probably wasn’t going to be good for him. Who was he going to punch, Metta World Peace? Shaq? Shannon Brown? Shoot, even Sasha Vujacic looked like he could handle himself. We saw what happened with Chris Childs. He’s not a fighter. He grew up mostly in Italy. He’s not exactly what you would call a roughneck. He’s hardcore on the court when it comes to the game, but anything else…it’s not in him. Jordan was more intense and more driven to win than any other player probably in the history of the game. Kobe may be close, but he’s not on that level.

    Phil Jackson has a closer relationship with Kobe than he does with MJ. Why would he say MJ was a better leader if it was anything but the truth? If any NBA coach knows anything about leadership, it’s the guy who managed the personalities and egos of guys like Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, Bryant and Shaq.

  • pposse

    Everyone understands that Kobe will be eating up cap space this next year and how devastating the injury is..however, the last time i checked, Kobe is a player the same way Dwight Howard is. DH can only dream at this point to have a franchise agree to pay him 30 million in a season down the line. A lot of this is coming off like DH is hating. The Lakers will be poised to make a run at some FA in 2014, Kobe will not be getting anywhere near 30 million in 14-15 season.

  • pposse

    either way the way both treated their respective teammates are comparable. Picking a fight with Steve Kerr of all people if your MJ is still pretty bogus.

  • DAMN!

    THIS !!!!

  • i_ball

    The 5th year of the contract is the fattest so it’s not like he can get that money anywhere else

  • Feez_22

    1. I brought up kobe’s past antics because YOU said d12 deserved to be in the hall of shame for wanting a legend like kobe out. It is hypocrisy because kobe did the same thing to shaq and no one was saying kobe deserved or deserves to be in the hall of shame.

    This is why i am agitated. You said d12 was a complete joke for this yet it has been done numerous times in history by hall of famers INCLUDING THE ONE HE WANTED OUT!!! Do you not see the hypocrisy in that??? What goes around comes around. To call d12 a hall of shamer and to say “what is the point of playing on the lakers without kobe” is just ignorant to the fact that kobe did the exact same thing to shaq yet is now immune to being treated this way.

    You assassinated d12′s character because he wanted a guy who did the exact same thing he did on top of making the best coach walk away from the game out. Just think about that.

    2. Did i freaking say that what d12 accomplished in a yr is equal to what kobe accomplished in his career? LOL… cmon dude… go ahead and read my statement again. If that is what you took out of it, you missed the entire boat.

    I am saying that you can knock d12 all you want but the fact remains that he carried a magic team who was without their star pg in jameer nelson (who isn’t even a top tier star to begin with) along with 3 pt shooters to the finals. He is a talent and can propel a team to a finals and even win one if the team around him is sufficient and caters to his strengths (which isn’t hard).

    3. I understood why he did it. If i were the lakers i would not beckon to that request because kobe means so much to that franchise that it would be stupid to grant it. HOWEVER, i understand why d12 didn’t want to play with kobe and didn’t want to play for mike D. It was pretty obvious why and for you to say “Whats the point of playing on the Lakers if your not playing with Kobe?” in your first post shows you have no clue whatsoever to what the situation between dwight and kobe was. Kobe was a horrible teammate to dwight both as a player and as a teammate. D12 wanted to gauge the pull he had in that franchise. It failed and he left but to measure that gauge is something numerous stars in the nba have done and numerous stars in the nba will continue to do.

    Don’t preach the “respect” card when the player d12 wanted out didn’t display that respect towards the best coach in nba history and one of the best big man in the history of the goddamn game. Think about that and find the fault in that. If you can’t then i cannot help you.

    4. I’m not sure this is a rebuttal to my point but I will say that many players (including stars) don’t tell teams they are staying from the get go. Players like to be courted and then come back and make a decision.

    5. Don’t bring up d-rose in this. Please. Derrick Rose is in a totally different situation because his “true” fans are fans that have rooted for him since he was in college. He is a chicago kid and all that. If rose were a laker doing what he did last yr he would have been criticized to holy hell.

    D12 doesn’t have many true fans in LA. This is pretty much a rooted fact since all of them don’t even bring up his injury and think what he did last yr play wise is what he is as a player.

    D12 played through injury not because he is “stupid”. He wanted to be there for his new team. I would never call a player stupid for trying to contribute even though they are not 100%. This is sports. This is a game of having your team’s back. Many players have played through injuries and have gotten a pass and for dwight to not get a pass is just laughable to me. We are talking about a 3x dpoy perennial all star who was cast as basically a scrub last yr.

    LOL… d12 is a douche who has zero respect for his elders?you can say the same goddamn thing for another player on that laker roster. GUESS WHO… smdh. There it is… holding d12 to a standard no one else on that team was held to once again. Freaking hypocrisy. if you don’t get why i am saying this, you have no clue. Again, this is why i responded to your post in the first place. D12 is the media whipping boy now and you have freaking fallen for it. I understand why lakers fans fall for it but for a bulls fan to is just funny and said. Do you not see through the BS?

  • Conor

    LOL

    He sounds like an idiot.

  • pposse

    1. There is nothing hypocritical when both are being crucified for the same thing. In 04 the Lakers were a complete circus, and Kobe did take flack for it – you may not have remebered but I remember clearly. I wasn’t being ignorant to it at all bro believe that. But you say something funny..”what goes around comes around” haha. The difference? Its 2013 and not 2004 anymore. If it was 2004 then this would be newsworthy material too.

    2. DH can’t carry a team to a championship victory. First and foremost Hedo Turkoglu of all people did his thing that whole playoff run, and what really assisted that whole run was the fact that they didn’t even have to go thru a KG led Boston Celtic team to get there. But hey, what am I talking about…its not like KG led the Celtics to two straight finals appearances in the first two playoff runs he had with Boston. No that can’t be right? But it is. Oh yeah and Boston still pushed the Magic to 7 without their defensive anchor.

    3. I will never understand why you ask a question you know the answer to. Just plain stupid and disrespectful. Just cause you understand why he didn’t want to play with Kobe doesn’t give you the right to request ridiculousness. This fool is oblivious and doesn’t know his place…same with Kobe in 2004 and like Kobe he will most likely find out the hard way even tho he is on a stacked team now.

    4. I brought up an injured superstar for fair comparison. Chicago is the third largest market, there is def. interest from all media outlets on his situation. Fine forget D Rose..how about the fact that DH was guaranteed exactly $0 after the 12-13 season? He gambled with a bad back that he should have been rehabbing for a solid 8 months, this the same guy who almost reneged on his departure to Houston to stay in LA because of the extra guaranteed dollars he could have squeezed from LA. Those actions and his explanation of his almost balk to Houston is a clear indicator that in hindsight he would have never made the decision to play his back was ready. Everything to lose and nothing to gain is pitiful. But thats what you have doctors and trainers for. And just for the hell of it, i’ll put out there that D Rose’s problems started with a bad lower back in the beg of the 11-12 season and escalated. Dwight had some injuries too..a torn labrum. the back is the biggest nerve center in your body, a lot could have gone terribly wrong. This is was an improperly calculated risk which is why he is stupid.

    Both kobe and DH has zero respect for their elders. Both are at fault, atleast this time Kobe publicly endorsed Howard nothing is leaking about how Kobe didn’t want him there in LA with him. IF DH really said what they are saying he said, then this is a story whether you like it or not..same way it was in 04.

  • Feez_22

    1. Kobe took flack but NOT the flack d12 is taking for what happened here. Not only that but d12 didn’t succeed in getting kobe or d’antoni outed and he is taking even MORE flack. Think about that… does that make any sense?

    If the answer is no then my point is proven. You have fallen for the media BS regarding dwight howard. Dwight has been unfairly cast the villain when in fact he had done everything in his power to be an equal contributor to the team in his last year. Coach had a strategy that wasn’t optimal for him and his superstar teammate didn’t have his damn back.

    What goes around comes around doesn’t pertain to the media coverage of dwight howard. It pertains to d12 wanting kobe out just as he wanted shaq out 9 years ago. That is karma. You can call d12 a douche for trying to get kobe out but the way i see it, it was karma and now kobe sort of feels how it is to have a star player under him want him out of town as he did to a player way back when.

    2. The celtics had no garnett. That is true. However, the magic also had no jameer nelson. Nice you left that out. The celts were missing garnett but it was PIERCE who was the finals mvp (and rightfully so) the year before so they still had their leader as the magic did with d12.

    Now, let me ask you this… Ray Allen/Paul Pierce/Rajon Rondo or Dwight Howard/Hedo Turkoglu/Rashard Lewis? Take into consideration that if u want to downplay ray, ray allen had a 51 point game the series before they faced orlando so this isn’t a washed up ray or pierce.

    See… again… There you go with your selective memory. I wouldn’t expect less from you. Hedo/Rashard were good 3pt shooters but hedo was 15ppg on 41% from the field pre-finals. Since when is this holding his own? since he hit that GW v. the sixers and that almost gw v the cavs g2 that’s holding his own? this is where hedo got massively overrated. The dude was 16ppg on 42% the entire run and he was expected to be dwight’s 2nd option.

    Rashard was much better at 19ppg 44.8% shooting throughout those playoffs but even then without jameer, they were pretty even talent wise v the celtics. It took em 7 to win but hey… they won and advanced. D12 was the main reason they beat cleveland so don’t try to downplay dwight’s influence on that run. He was the driving force.

    3. How will d12 find out the hard way? how is he oblivious? He left the lakers squad to go to a MORE TALENTED ROCKETS SQUAD!!!!! LOL… Kobe let shaq and phil go and had a crappy laker squad for years thereafter. Harden will be a perennial all star (and is only 24), parsons will develop into a fringe all star and they still have cap space to go out and either trade for picks or to sign a good power forward down the road. They have a trade piece in asik that can get them something in return.

    The lakers went into the abyss for 3 yrs when shaq and phil left. totally diff trajectories. D12 won’t miss kobe a bit. Kobe missed shaq a whole lot and missed phil until phil came back… LOL at your misinterpretation of the situation.

    4. D12 gambled for the good of the TEAM. That’s first of all.

    Secondly, It is hard to leave 30 million on the table. That’s just a huge dollar mark but when he realized that he could just go ahead and structure this contract with an opt out at year 3 i believe, he could make it back no problem. This is a business move.

    This whole situation with the courtship where people think d12 was going back and forth beyond the money was also fabricated. Chris broussard put out some retarded story on espn that night saying d12 was 50-50 when in fact he WASN’T. That was a made up story and you bought in.

    Everything to lose and nothing to gain is what he sacrificed for the good of the NEW TEAM he was going to. He wanted to show them that he was committed. No matter what, he would have been paid (which is what happened) so in fact, he didn’t lose monetarily. He lost image wise but at this point, if you are following the media’s beck and call on the d12 story you are just as blind as the next guy.

    The docs said that he couldn’t have re-injured the back and it was only going to get better with time (which it DID… d12 looked much better to end the season than he did beginning and mid season) so how is it stupid? It wasn’t the best move for him but it wasn’t going to get re-injured and he could help the team so it wasn’t a stupid move. A stupid move would be playing on an injury that may get re-injured. He didn’t do that with his back. Maybe with his labrum but not his back.

    BTW. kobe didn’t put out a ringing endorsement saying d12 should stay. He was in the meetings saying what he had to say (not sure what he said, there is a lot of speculation) and after d12′s decision, he unfollowed d12 on twitter and posted a pic of him and pau.

    As i have said before… Stars have made these demands before including the star that d12 wanted out. D12 didn’t succeed in his demands and kobe did yet d12 is getting more flack for it than kobe did. It is karma and i see it that way.

  • pposse

    maybe because kobe has been in the league 17 years at this point vs. Shaq’s 12.

    2. Garnett is the heart and soul of the team. Pierce won finals MVP but Garnett is what makes that team go. Rondo made a crazy jump in play from those first two years with the Celtics to what he has become and yes I would have taken DH/Hedo/Rashard any day over Pierce/Allen/Rondo in 2008. The celtics with Garnett wasn’t some small ball team. Size is on the Magic’s side and I would take that any day over two 30 plus year olds who were not in their prime. It also took the celtics 7 games to get rid of chicago in the first round of that playoff.
    No one is knocking them for winning but this is a classic example of how its easy to forget the truth about the NBA and its players and politics. Unfortunately, KG (because of the injury bug) could have literally caught up to Tim Duncan on the all timer list if he was available that playoff run.

    They would have took a dookie all over Orlando and made Lebron cry …you do realize this Celtic team was the main reason guys like Pat Riley, Lebron, Wade, Bosh all teamed up right? And that’s not a joke that’s what i seriously believe.. Put it this way, the Celtics were a KG knee injury away from going right back to the finals and an unfortunate shoulder injury to Perkins in game 7 from winning the next finals. They only got 1championship out of the whole thing but it was damn near closer to 3 than yall stat gurus can comprehend. This team especially and also the Lakers when they picked up Pau and Andrew Bynum at the same ____ time is the sole reason the NBA is what it is now; atleast that big 3 were all over 30.

    KG is 1,000 x 1,0000,0000 times more important to his respective team than Jameer Nelson. There is a reason that his name wasn’t mentioned in my post. How dare you say KG and Jameer in the same breath. Again with the disrespect comparing KG to Nelson lol. KG was defensive player of the year the year in which they won the championship, please don’t forget that, that alone trumps anything Jameer ever accomplished in his life. What was Orlando good at? Pick and roll? What did KG specialize in stopping? And still your going to tell me Pierce was the leader cause he was finals mvp? cmon now.

  • Feez_22

    1. hmm… kobe played with shaq since he was a rookie and with shaq led them to 3 championships with 3 finals mvp’s. Kobe saw what shaq was capable of and still wanted him gone because he wanted to be the “man”.

    D12 played with kobe for 1 year and in that 1 yr, the lakers barely made the playoffs and on top of that d12 was blamed for the team faultering. It wasn’t d12′s team and he was taking the blame.

    Lets see… which elder should be more respected? the one that got me 3 championships or the one that could barely get me to the playoffs and didn’t have my back… HMM WHAT A FREAKING HARD QUESTION TO ANSWER…

    2. Was my question “who would you take in 08″? i asked you in that particular series who would you take. NOT 08. They faced each other in the conf semis of 09 where rondo just came off of a good series v the bulls and allen dropped 51 in that same series.

    D12>pierce but allen>hedo and rondo>rashard. Or rondo>hedo and allen>rashard. I’m taking the celtics 3 from 09 all day every day over what the damn magic had.

    BTW, It took boston 7 games to get rid of atlanta in their championship year WITH kevin garnett. What’s your point? The celts even at full strength were going 7 v inferior competition. That has no bearing on this.

    3. I am not questioning what the celts would have done with garnett. I never did. I am saying that the celts even without garnett had more talent than the magic on the squad. You can bring up all of that other stuff about them being an couple injuries away from 3 straight rings (which i agree with) but my main premise on the whole thing is that the celtics even without garnett had more talent than the orlando magic without jameer and i still believe they do.

    4. WHO IS COMPARING JAMEER TO GARNETT? I just pointed out that although the celts were missing garnett, they still had 2 all stars on the roster and rondo who played better than the magic’s 2nd option in his team’s run.

    The magic without jameer had 2 all stars d12-rashard, an overrated hedo and a bunch of roleplayers What cast is better? i’d clearly say the celts cast was still better.

    No one is comparing jameer and garnett and no one is putting them in the same breath. I just pointed out jameer was injured because you were typing as if the magic were fully healthy and were pushing the injured celts to 7. That wasn’t the case.

    5. Orlando was a P&R team but with d12 was also a kick it out team. Garnett didn’t guard dwight regardless so d12 could have posted and then kicked it out with garnett guarding rashard on the outside (just like he guarded bosh on the outside in the 2012 eastern conf finals). he would have been strung out and would have been rendered less effective in protecting the paint just as he was a couple yrs ago.

    BTW pierce was the leader. There is no doubt about that. Even when they won that championship, it was pierce that got injured game one, came back and won that game. It was pierce with allen who headed that comeback in game 4. In the conf semis game 7 of their championship year, it was pierce leading his team to victory with 45 pts. Pierce was the team leader and was the celtics franchise player.

    This back and forth is redundant. I have stuck to my main premise of my comment while you have wavered and have extrapolated onto other teams chances in yours. Pretty clear whose points are more valid so i will stop here.

  • pposse

    2. In 09 i would take Hedo Rashard Howard any day over Pierce Allen Rondo. Seriously you need to go back and rewatch those playoffs. KG was not playing and would have easily been the difference – this is clearly exemplified by the fact that the next year in 2010 when KG actually played in the playoffs again they went to game 7 in the finals – so DH’s championship run that one year which you foolishly tried to compare to anything Kobe did in his career, should be taken with a grain of salt. Besides all that why are you comparing Kobe’s ways to DH anyways? Both of them are douchebags – this is the 50th time im saying that. This conversation started when you referred to me as a hypocrite and it’ll end when when you finally understand that nothing i said was hypocritical. As far as the media bashing of DH i fear you are being paranoid. Honestly in 04 were you closer to the age of 10 or the age of 20? Kobe and Shaq both got shi**ed on by the media plain and simple. They are bashing DH now bc if what he said in this article is true he deserves it.

  • Dex

    Shoot your free throw first twelve years dwight b4 u act like a superman or franchise player lol

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