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Tuesday, October 4th, 2011 at 2:18 pm  |  142 responses

Top 50: John Wall, no. 25

The definitive ranking of the NBA’s best players.

by Abe Schwadron / @abe_squad

Living life as a Washington basketball fan is generally a maddening experience, to put it lightly. More like, eternally frustrating, constantly infuriating or perpetually depressing.

Since swapping “Bullets” for “Wizards,” it’s been one bad move after another. An aging late-‘90s core gave way to the worst No. 1 pick in NBA history, then to history’s best player in his worst condition. And just when things were looking up, with an eccentric star and a stellar supporting cast making multiple Playoff appearances, the crap hit the fan. The star went from funny to foolish, his behavior becoming a league-wide joke and his game going by the wayside.

So us Wiz fans don’t get excited too often. We don’t let our guard down anymore. We refuse to open our hearts for just anyone. We’re the girl who can’t have a relationship without being cheated on, without falling in love only to find out he’s married. To multiple wives.

Enter Prince Charming.

The 2010 NBA Draft Lottery should have been boring. In the middle of a Playoff schedule, it should have been a footnote, and nothing more. No ping-pong balls could be more important than real live hoop. But to Wizards fans, it meant everything.

I would argue that following the ’09-10 season, no NBA team had a worse outlook. Six months after trading away the No. 5 pick in the Draft for a pair of veterans in Mike Miller and Randy Foye—hoping to add the final complimentary pieces to a conference contender—the team was in shambles.

Before season’s end, the Wiz traded away four-fifths of those mid-2000s Playoff teams in Caron Butler, Antawn Jamison, DeShawn Stevenson and Brendan Haywood. Gilbert Arenas’ monstrous, untradeable contract was still on the books, and without young talent to cultivate in a dead season, the likes of Earl Boykins, Alonzo Gee and Cartier Martin saw increased playing time to wrap up a 26-win season.

On top of that, odds were Washington would land a pick outside the top four in a Draft with only one real franchise player. All of which brought unusual significance to the ‘10 Lottery. I can remember sitting on the edge of my seat, face-in-hands (a body contortion we Wiz fans know well), whispering a silent plea to the basketball gods.

When the Wizards slipped into the top three, my insides tightened. “No way,” I thought, fumbling to reply to the flurry of texts pouring in from fellow DC fans.

Before I had time to think, Adam Silver’s beautiful, bald-headed dome pulled the Nets’ logo, then the Sixers’…

I’ve been to a series-clinching NBA Playoff game (May 6, ’05, Wizards over Bulls), rushed the court at my alma mater’s NCAA arena (January 16, ’10, Northwestern over No. 6 Purdue), coached a youth rec league team to a title (won’t bore you with the details). Not then, not ever, have I made the shrieking noise I made when the ping-pong balls went the way of the Wiz that night.

John Wall was going to be a Washington Wizard.

It was—literally—an answer to a fanbase’s prayers. The sure doom of the decade to come suddenly turned to legitimate promise of a real-live basketball team somewhere in the future. The long nightmare in the nation’s capital was over.

Am I overdoing it? Maybe. But ask any Wizards fan, that’s how it felt. That’s how it still feels.

Fast-forward a year later, and Wall’s doing the damn thing. He finished seventh in the NBA in assists per game (8.3), besting some of the best at his position. Considering the, well, “talent,” around him, that’s a staggering stat. Add 16.4 points, 4.6 boards and 1.8 steals a night, plus an uncanny ability to finish at the rim with either hand, with power or grace, all while battling a lingering foot injury, and there’s no doubt dude’s for real.

How many rooks are asked to learn on the fly while playing 38 minutes a game (11th in the L) surrounded by chaos in the form of raw young players and under-performing veterans?

The sky’s the limit for Wall. It’s not rocket science: the kid has incredible god-given talent and an equally intense will to win.

An All-Star bid and a bump in scoring in year two should be well within his reach, and don’t be surprised to see him take a run at the assist title, too. If he can sustain his improved jumper from summer runs, which looks more confident and more fluid, he’ll be a serious problem for opposing point guards on a nightly basis.

The fact that Wall, admittedly, has plenty left to learn about the game of basketball, is downright scary. Let this serve as your official heads up—when he gets his education up, look out below, because his assault on this list is far from over.

SLAMonline Top 50 Players 2011
Rank Player Team Position Pos. Rank
50 Luol Deng Bulls SF 8
49 Andrew Bogut Bucks C 7
48 Ray Allen Celtics SG 9
47 Marc Gasol Grizzlies C 6
46 David West Hornets PF 15
45 Kevin Martin Rockets SG 8
44 Andrew Bynum Lakers C 5
43 Brandon Jennings Bucks PG 11
42 Lamar Odom Lakers PF 14
41 Gerald Wallace Blazers SF 7
40 Brook Lopez Nets C 4
39 Joakim Noah Bulls C 3
38 Carlos Boozer Bulls PF 13
37 Kevin Garnett Celtics PF 12
36 Eric Gordon Clippers SG 7
35 Tony Parker Spurs PG 10
34 Andre Iguodala 76ers SG 6
33 Al Jefferson Jazz PF 11
32 Al Horford Hawks C 2
31 Stephen Curry Warriors PG 9
30 Tim Duncan Spurs PF 10
29 Josh Smith Hawks PF 9
28 Manu Ginobili Spurs SG 5
27 Tyreke Evans Kings PG 8
26 Rudy Gay Grizzlies SF 6
25 John Wall Wizards PG 7

Notes
• Rankings are based solely on projected ’11-12 performance.
• Contributors to this list include: Maurice Bobb, Shannon Booher, David Cassilo, Bryan Crawford, Sandy Dover, Adam Figman, Jon Jaques, Eldon Khorshidi, Ryne Nelson, Doobie Okon, Ben Osborne, Quinn Peterson, Dave Schnur, Abe Schwadron, Dan Shapiro, Irv Soonachan, Todd Spehr, Tzvi Twersky, Yaron Weitzman, DeMarco Williams and Ben York.
• Want more of the SLAMonline Top 50? Check out the archive.

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  • http://slamonline.com/ Ryne Nelson

    Gonna be a face soon. Top 25 for sure this season.

  • http://slamonline.com/ Ryne Nelson

    And the charts are back for the Top 25.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    that was really really good Abe. Good enough that I got in trouble at work, zoning out.

  • http://slamonline.com/ Adam Figman

    I absolutely cannot believe the word “beautiful” is crammed between “Adam Silver’s” and “bald-headed dome.” Great write-up.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    can’t wait to see this kid reach his potential.

  • http://redoftoothandclaw.ca/ niQ

    Thanks Ryne for the charts! lol
    Man, that is one huge leap for John Wall. Dude is already a problem for opposing PGs.

  • http://www.2ksports.com Showtime

    Mark it down , it he keeps with the progression, Kid will be the best Pg in the game and a top 5 player. Unnatural talent…

  • Matt

    Nice article bud. Go wiz!

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Could be in the Top-10 by next summer.

  • ctkennedy

    Top25 talent no question top 25 player RIGHT NOW no….shouldnt be n the top 40 …PG r determine by wins more than any other position n basketball….ranked WAYYYYY too high

  • http://slamonline.com Ben Osborne

    HUGE season on deck…if there is a etc etc etc

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    ctkennedy…really????

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    I think ctkennedy meant top 5 talent no question. top 5 right now, no. this spot makes good sense, might even be underrated. That’s what he had to have meant.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    OK, I think Gordon, Tyreke and Curry are gonna have a better season, but I cant hate on this too much.

  • MUBWAR

    Adam Silver’s beautiful, bald-headed dome pulled the Nets’ logo, then the Sixers…loool definitely future top 5 in the league.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Excellent spot for an untested, but obviously gifted young talent. He is already my favorite PG. Weird I know. I love CP3 and D-Rose, but this kid just seems to have something that they don’t(Jason Kidd height, Gary Payton’s hands, John Stocktons passing). The only thing is the jumpshot, but gotta say it’s already looking better than allot of others.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    He was an unhealthy rookie who was 7th in assists and steals. And he was 6th in scoring among all PG’s. Plus his team is only improving (unlike Sacramento). Also He is clearly a better player then Steph Curry

  • Hum

    first!!

  • Reel

    I put curry ahead of him

  • ctkennedy

    Wall is nice as hell …but he not a top 25player right now …he its team franchise player(fair or unfair) he judge by Ws ..PERIOD…thats what comes with the title n off that alone makes him not top 25

  • http://www.2ksports.com Showtime

    So @ctkennedy that negates all the bull your spew yesterday on reke…with what was just said about gettin W’s for pgs – reke doesn’t belong in the top 60.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    clearly better than Curry, Really?

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    ^uhh, yeah…

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Kid put up numbers that would’ve gotten him the ROY award almost any other year, but more than the numbers, it’s the fact that this dude is like, in my opinion, as if someone combined Derrick Rose’s and Rajon Rondo’s strengths and molded them into one player.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Kennedy doesn’t even pay attention to the sh*t he says from one day to another.

  • MUBWAR

    well said enigmatic, just add a little faster than both as well

  • http://www.thehoopscene.com lawlow

    ah, a little high, but prove me wrong mr. wall

  • seriousblack

    In three seasons, he will be the league’s best pg. We have yet to see this kid play at full-speed, full-health. All he has to do is keep working and stay healthy.

  • ben

    Better than Reke?

  • ctkennedy

    i said Reke is the one player that COULD change who the best player is n 3-5yrs …COULD
    i never said he is better at all or none of that …reread what i wrote
    n i said Reke need the Ws too

  • Brandon

    The kid is special. Let me first get the obvious out the way. I have to say the difference between him and Derrick Rose is the strength. When you look at them both Wall is not slim, but definitely not as strong. I just believe Wall only plays at one speed currently, he doesn’t quite understand to switch up his pace to what the game dictates. I believe he will learn it as his career progresses, but he to me is not at the higher echelon of point guards.(Rose, Paul, Williams not in any particular order) I love his aggression and passion for the game though and I can see that he is working on his weaknesses unlike some point guards in the game. I am not going to mention any names cough cough Rondo. This is just my Chicago fanatic coming out of me, but seriously I like John Wall trajectory in the NBA.

  • http://Slamonline.com Caboose

    This kid could easily put up 20-10-5 next season. I’d put him higher but maybe I’m just optimistic.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Yeah, if I can touch further on what Brandon alluded to, two strengths of Rose which Wall does not possess are literally his strength, for one, in that he can bulldoze his way into the lane, absorb heavy contact and still finish the way Rose can.
    And while blindingly quick, Wall cannot control his speed and change directions in a drop of a dime like Rose can.
    But this shouldn’t turn into a Wall vs. Rose post.
    Wall is a beast and he will only get better.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    *he can’t bulldoze his way, etc., not “he can”.

  • http://Slamonline.com Caboose

    This kid could easily put up 20-10-5 next year. I’d put him higher but maybe I’m just optimistic.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Maybe Wall only plays at one speed, but learning to slow down is just that. You just have to remind yourself that it’s not always smart to try and out race everyone every time. He should be developing that this season i’d imagine. Rose does have that slight edge on the “Bull-Doze” factor. I wouldn’t take Rondo over Wall next season, but I ain’t mad.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    And I just feel the need to point out that despite what analysts may have said during the draft, the likes of Kyrie Irving and Brandon Knight will be nowhere near as good as this kid.
    All this talk about Irving being the “next great point guard” is wack, dude won’t be nearly as good as Wall.

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    Your right kennedy you did say Tyreke needs to win. But you also said hes a good defender, “a better defender then Derrick Rose and Kevin Durant already” And you also said If Reke had a jumper he would be better at basketball then Derrick Rose. Then John Wall comes up, has the best Rookie PG campaign out of any of them and your sayin hes overrated. Because that makes sense. You argue Tyreke Evans against Derrick Rose one day, and John Wall is overrated the next.

  • seriousblack

    Controlling his speed and gaining strength are the most fixable issues for Wall, which is part of what makes him the pg with the most potential. Of course Rose and others have those advantages over him NOW, but they also have a few more seasons under their belts than him. Only Tyreke came into the league as strong as he is now. I just can’t see anyone being better than him in the next 2-3 seasons.

  • Zabbah

    He’s not a top 25 player but everyone won’t be saying that after Season 2.

  • http://vc.com vc

    WHERE IS DEMAR DEROZAN???????????????!

  • ctkennedy

    I think Tyreke is too high too for the same reasons as Wall…yes with a jumpshot Tyreke will be harder too guard cuz of the height n length …he is a better defender than the two…Wall is a better defender than Rose also …Rookie campaign wont better than Tyreke either …Wall will be a top 25player soon just not RIGHT NOW

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    just be quiet ctkennedy…just stop…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    @ vc- not in the top 50 because he’s not that good.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Nah, I agree with Soop.
    Wall did have the best rookie campaign out of him, Rose and Evans.
    The 20, 5, 5 thing as a rookie is overrated.
    Sure, only Big O, MJ, LeBron and Tyreke have done it.
    But you know, I’d rather have Magic’s 18, 7 and 7 or Larry Bird’s 21, 10 and 4.5 as a rookie than Reke’s 20, 5 and 5.
    And Roberston’s 30.5, 10.1 and 9.7 and Jordan’s 28.2, 6.5 and 5.9 are a FAR CRY from Evans’ 20.1, 5.3 and 5.8 as rookies.

  • ctkennedy

    @Enigmatic u right the PLAYERS u named didnt have better rookie seasons just not JOHN WALL

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Wall is great though…he’s gonna be a top 5 pg this year. CP3, DRose, DWill, Nash, Wall by the end of the year. It’ll be a close call between him and Rondo though.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    Yall dudes tripping talking about clearly better than curry, If I said this about rose and cp3, yall goofies would be going to war right now, wall is good but he is not clearly better nor better than curry right now. curry is a way better shooter, has just about as good of a feel for the game as wall if not better(doesnt mean better passer, just knows whats needed in the game at that given moment) curry gets just as many steals as wall. No one better not bring up defense either because quiet as kept, wall was horrible defensively last season but thats rarely brought up. So neither of them have a advangtage on defense, and they both are equally good rebounders for a pg. @ctkkennedy wall is not a better defender than Rose, this is why I hate perception, wall has good instincts on defense but he was horrible defensively last year.

  • ctkennedy

    @Wayno …Wall is great now…smgdh….he goint to be ..i wont argue that …but already…smgdh

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    omg , i’m getting sick of all this wall licking seriously, i sound like a hater right now, but wall did not have a better rookie season than Rose and defintely did not have a better rookie season than tyreke. People seem to have short memories; even though the kings still had a losing record they were much improved than the year prior and that was because of tyreke. the kings felt comfortable trding kevin martin because tyreke was performing so good, and shaq said he defintely should of been a all-star that season. yall tripping today

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    top 25 in the NBA is not a “great player”. YOu realize Joe Johnson, Monta Ellis are still too come? I would take John Wall over Monta Ellis every day of every week. unless I have a team full of guys who can only defend. Other then that John Wall is a better player.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    In year one Wall and Rose’s scoring numbers were similar. Wall’s rebounding numbers were better and his assist numbers were better.
    For Wall to average 8.3 assists playing for the Wizards as a rookie is impressive as f*ck. He doesn’t have KG, Allen and Pierce on his team like Rondo yet puts up similar assist numbers.
    And Curry over Wall?
    C’mon now!
    First of all, all those damn G State player’s stats are suspect cause it’s Golden State, where they specialize in inflated stat lines.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Derrick Rose rookie stats 16.8PPG 6.3APG 3.9RPG .9SPG 37MPG —
    John Wall rookie stats 16.4PPG 8.3APG 4.6RPG 1.8SPG 37.8MPG —-
    And I said John Wall had a better rookie PG season then the other two. I realize what Reke did, but he did it as a SG who controlled the ball like a PG.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    And do y’all realize that I’m a die-hard Bulls fan who has also been a fan of Derrick Rose since he was a high school sophomore, and thus it’s not easy for me to admit that Wall had a better rookie season than Rose or that I think Wall, and not Rose, wil one day be the league’s best point guard?
    But still, biasness pushed aside, I feel that highly about Wall.

  • ctkennedy

    @nbk that dont make what Reke do less impressive when only Wade,Bron,and Kobe do 20 5 5 on the regular n JoeJohnson had a stretch but THATS IT n he shot 45percentage doin it …dont underrated his rookie season like that

  • seriousblack

    Word. Dude gotta be the truth if Enigmatic places him above Rose long term lol. One thing’s for sure, guards will have the league on lock for a while. There’s a lot of pgs and combos that have only scratched the surface so far.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Tyreke Evans is NOT a PG. Did I say what he did wasn’t impressive? Its going to be easier to win with John Wall then Tyreke Evans. Better defender, much better teammate. Better at running a team. All the things that make a winning PG John Wall has. All the things that make pretty stats Tyreke Evans has. I’ll take the winner. fin

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    I’ll take the winner too.
    Derrick Rose it is! :D

  • ctkennedy

    u dont need a GREAT point guard to win a title n the NBA…but u need the Big n Wing scorer….i would take Evans over Wall to build a team

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Wow… umm gotta agree with ctkennedy on this one. Ya’ll are underrating Reke’s rook season. That ain’t no fluke. He ain’t in G-state or PHX. He put up legitimate great numbers. Not as impressive as the greats but common fellas. Give credit where it is due. Reke’s rook season > Wall, Rose. Now in order who is the best player right now: Rose, Wall, Reke. (Right now)

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    NO you don’t. HAHAHAHAHA what? Tell that too Dallas. And Detroit (for all of their titles). And San Antonio. And LA (showtime lakers). Michael Jordan & Kobe Bryant have ROYALLY screwed up peoples perception of what wins in the NBA. ROYALLY

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    nbk, your 5:10 post sounds allot like me when debating LBJ vs KB man… an awful lot. Thought you loved the “pretty stats”?!

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Lakeshow – LeBron is a better defender, rebounder, passer then Kobe. I don’t need stats to say why he’s better. I need stats to fight your ridiculous opinions.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    No. The only thing LeBron is better at is passing. His rebounding is a result of his size and athleticism. He’s a better defender as a result of him having knees and legs that work. Kobe is just as good a rebounder per him not being as tall and athletic and doesn’t play a position where rebounding is a premium. I ain’t tryna convince you anything, but your rediculous for thinking i’m rediculous. It isn’t about stats all the time I agree with you on that. I’m just saying that for the same reason you would take Wall over Reke is the same reason why i’d take KB over LBJ.

  • nbaNw8

    ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? :/

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Lakeshow, you’re ridiculous for the way you spell ridiculous.
    What’s also ridiculous is how this suddenly became a Kobe/LeBron debate.
    Next thing you know we’ll have JTaylor, MUBWAR, The Seed, Kap, even Eboy on here defending their guy….

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Better is better. LeBron is better. The size of their body and the level of athletic ability are apart of their ability to perform skills, you can’t discount a guy because he’s naturally better. Better is better. LeBron is better at everything but scoring 1 on 1 and shooting. You can tell me your opinions all you want.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    Would you say Stephen Curry is better then Tyreke Evans Lakeshow? Same dumb concept.

  • dc sham

    Wall played in 69 games, shot 41% from the field and did’nt even sniff the playoffs and people believe he had a better season than Evans(20-5-5) and Rose who led an under achieving team the previous year to a playoff berth and a 7 game series against the Celts? Guys its not just about stats its the impact the players have on winning that truly matters

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Oh, and LeBron’s better.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    No Curry is not. He’s also not a better “scorer” than Reke. Which Kobe is a better scorer than Bron. So no not same dumb concept. Curry is strictly a better shooter than Reke. Everything else Reke is better at. Your also unfairly comparing down hill mid 30′s Kobe to LBJ. Kobe was a better defender than Bron in his prime. Much better. Rebounding and passing LBJ is better at, even if it is because of his natural gifts instead of game IQ. But Kobe is a winner. He know’s what it takes to win. Bron has yet to show us that. I’ll take Kobe over LBJ. Enig, shove it. REDICULOUS is twice the adjective that ridiculous will ever be!!!! (dam, thats why my phone won’t allow me to tell people they are “rediculous”)

  • http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/10/4/2468098/nba-lockout-2011-owners-david-stern-robert-sarver-the-hook Allenp

    You can’t say “He’s only better because of X” like that’s a valid argument.
    It’s not.
    He’s better. The reasons are immaterial.
    LeBron is a better rebounder, passer and defender. It’s not disputable. The reasons why don’t negate the reality of what is true.
    The United STates is a superpower. The reason why we’re a superpower don’t negate the reality that we are a superpower and the Soviet Union is not.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    For one. WHAT THE F*CK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT PRIME KOBE FOR? and 2 – all of your points are opinions that cannot be proven, and are easy to argue. And the whole Kobe was a “much better” defender comment, is a glaring example of how overrated Kobe Bryant is in your EXTREMELY biased mind. I am done.

  • http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/10/4/2468098/nba-lockout-2011-owners-david-stern-robert-sarver-the-hook Allenp

    And who cares what Kobe was in his prime. We’re not comparing careers. If you were doing that, Kobe would win hands down and nobody with a brain would ever argue.
    This is about right now.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    Ha ha word to Allen’s 6 PM comment.
    That’s like saying “Dania Ramirez is hotter than America Ferrera. But that’s only because Dania has a better face and body!”

  • ctkennedy

    Neither Wall or Evans should be top 30 right now …they both have the talent to be top 10 n the league down the line….the question is will they teams built around them CORRECTLY …they very easily can have a Marbury n VC type careers where they numbers is great but get no Ws

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Excuse me with the “much better.” He was just better not much better. None the less a better defender. You all are delusional if you think otherwise. I give you the better rebounder/passer. Why wouldn’t I argue prime Kobe? Should I say D-Rose is a way better player than Jason Kidd. Look at what Jason Kidd has done. That’s not a smart argument. We don’t know if D-Rose will be good enough to compare him to an all time great like Kidd. Just like you guys are stupidily arguing LbJ a two time Finals loser to an all time great, 5 championship winner like Kobe. Keep on supporting the fake Legacy of “The King.” I am done.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    But Enig, what if America Ferrera is a much, much better wife?? Eh? EH? see? ehhh? ok i’ll stop haha.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    We are looking at the top 50 for next season. not a career accomplishments page. Stop fishing.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Well yes LBJ is the better overall player next year. Hands down. I’d take Kobe though.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    @ ctkennedy – this is a projection of what they will do this season. Wall WILL be a top 25 player and a top 5 PG by the end of this season. Do you even watch basketball? Tyreke may or may not be, but Wall is as close to a sure thing as they come in the NBA.

  • http://slamonline.com nbk

    and duh. we already know that.

  • http://www.2ksports.com Showtime

    To me reke rookie campaign wasn’t all that special..by the second half of the season, paul was just giving the green light to just stat stuff. Curry had the better season later part on it was clear to see. Also its Wall>Rose>then Reke rookie season

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Yawn!!! Y’all bore me with this Kobe vs Bron nonsense.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    Even tough Tyreke is not a pg, he still had a better rookie year than wall and Rose. sure wall had more steals, rebs. and assist, that does not constitute a better season imo. Rose shot way better than him as a scoring pg and yet people look at him like he is the inefficient one. Rose advandced stats were better than walls in per, eff, win share, and he did this all on a winning team. @enigmatic how are you going to give wall a compliment for getting stats on a horrible team and discredit currys stats because of his team? @nbk how do you know it will be easier to win with wall than with Tyreke? you going off what ifs instead of the evidence, like I stated before in tyreke rookie season he made his team better unlike wall with lesser talent.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    nbk, on a serious note man, in their prime, at the height(maybe we haven’t seen LBJ’s “prime” yet) of their careers, Kobe was a better defender than LBJ. You concur or no? Basically i’m saying Kobe in his prime vs LBJ now defensively. I know LBJ can guard more positions 1-4 as opposed to Kobe’s 1-3. But who guarded who they could guard better iyo? Kobe had a “lock you up” factor that I haven’t seen LbJ do on the regular at all. But throw in the LbJ’s blocks from distance it makes for an interesting debate.

  • http://www.bulls.com Enigmatic

    It’s not about the team being horrible.
    It’s about the Warriors’ playing style that allows Curry to rake up more points and assists than he would on other teams.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    wall rookie season was much better than cp3 rookie season.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    what about walls style though, he is a open court player. I watched plenty of his games last season and as soon as he got the ball he was flying up the court, and I know flip had to encourage those type of play because of his athlecticsm. its no big difference to me.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    You do know that Bron was right up there with Iguodala in terms of defensive rating/win shares among perimeter defenders, right?
    So there goes that notion of Bron’s lack of “lock you up” factor.

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    Who for the Lakers guarded Allen Iverson? Who for the Heat guarded Derrick Rose?

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    I thnk it’s silly to debate anything other than stats and facts for a rookie season. Whomever scored more, assisted more, and rebounded more is the player who had the most successful season. Tyreke had the most successful rookie season. How could it not have been? You guys who are arguing for Wall are crazy. Wall this next year might be better than Reke, but the rookie season is pretty easy and simple to toss to Reke.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    Lebron is a overrated defender period, how did he lock up Rose and not jason terry, because it was more of a team effort on Rose than some can comprehend, they werent worrying about any bulls player creating a shot for himself besides Rose or hitting threes besides korver which allowed more help D, but when he had to play some real D and couldnt get that help because those guys had to stay home on those shooters and penetrators like barea lebron was not nearly as much of a shut down defender and terry exposed him.
    Kobe in his prime is the better defender.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    It’s actually closer than you think. Reke scored more points, took more shots, shot a better % from the field and grabbed more rebounds but Wall had more assists, steals, blocks, shot better from 3 and the FT line. Wall is a PG, so I expect him to take less shots and score less.
    The slight edge goes to Reke but for Wall to rank 7th in steals and assists is downright impressive given dysfunction and lack of talent around him.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    nbk….. Kobe did… sometimes Fisher. And LbJ guarded Rose…. I don’t quite see what I am missing here…

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Agree with you 100% Taylor. I mean I am not saying that Reke destroyed them. It just is obvious that he had a slightly more impressive year. I’d take Wall running my team his Rookie year over Reke, but Reke was the better player.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    It’s much harder to “lockdown” a player that’s always on the move and uses screens like JT does. Anyone who’s ever played basketball should know that.

  • respect

    stephon curry is no where near john walls level and neither is tyreke
    John Wall>Tyreke Evans>Stephon Curry

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    It was tyronne lue.

  • zach

    Even tho Reke is a beast, he’s a shooting guard who masqueraded as a pg. He scored more as a rookie than Wall did. Wall is a legit pg. He ran his team better than Reke, who can be a bit of a ball stopper at times. In terms of a rookie pg, no question Wall had the better season. He ran his team better than Reke, even w/o looking at assist numbers.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    In big highlight it was Lue. Next time define what you talking about. Kobe had plenty of games where he was guarding AI. Lue was on the Lakers for 3 years. Kobe in general guards AI when he plays against him. Fish had his moments also. So did Brian Shaw. Throughout a game you toss plenty of defenders at a guy who is as good as AI. Kobe is needed to much for his Offense to guard the opposing best wing player the entire game. I mean Kobe at 33 was guarding CP3 this last year (doing a terrible job, but what 33 year old 6’6″ wing wouldn’t struggle against a prime CP3)

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Lakeshow, come on now. Just because he attempted and failed to slowdown CP, we should give him props? It wouldn’t have matter whether it was a 26-yr old Kobe, no one expect for prime GP, is slowing down CP.
    Kobe used to be a great defender but even you have to admit that he’s been overrated defensively the past couple seasons. How and why he continues to be selected for the all-defensive team baffles me.

  • Gateway

    Wall’s rookie year was overrated. On the surface 16 and 8 look good, but on 41% shooting and 4 turnovers is pretty bad. I would say his rookie year was good but not historic. Looking at Rose he shot 48% from the field in his 1st year but that’s because his jumper was better than advertised, Wall was pretty much advertised as having a better jumper than Rose out of college but those predictions were incorrect and his jumper is still flawed.

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    No one could stop Iverson, as the Lakers lost game 1 of the finals, so Phil decided to test out Lue’s quickness against him. It worked. The Lakers swept the next four games, and Lue’s benchwarmed skills were finally put on display, against a superstar in front of millions. His NBA career was saved, as Lue has since established himself as a trusty point guard.

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    That was a quote from a Laker website. I can fond more if you want. Those finals are why Lue got a contract with Atlanta instead of somewhere in europe. Bryant was a very good defender but he has never locked up an opposing go-to player in a playoff series, like James has, atleast twice. Bryant is the better all time player but defensively idk, James seems more effective and versatile.

  • davidR

    damn, i thought SLAM would put wall ahead of monta (and i’m a gstate fan). i think monta is gonna blow this season especially with mark jackson as coach, but i’ll be very very surprised if he cracks the top 20.
    i’ll also await the firestorm of comments about how overrated he is

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    Kobe Bryant’s regular season defensive exploits are the most overrated collection of fact and fiction ever. He is still winning defensive awards, and hasnt been even asked to be an elite defender since 08.

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    What did I say Taylor? Did I say he did well against CP3? No I didn’t. I was pointing out that Kobe guarded CP3, over Fisher, Artest, Barnes, Blake. CP3 is goin to make anyone look foolish including Bron. I think LBJ on D-Rose was kinda like Artest on Durant. It was more of a “Got ya!” D-Rose will probably destroy Bron even this next year. D-Rose was unprepared for Bron. Sure as f*ck Bron ain’t guarding AI for extended mins. Tossing a quick young player out there for defense is a common Playoff move nbk. It made sense. Kobe in guarded AI in general though. Who did Bron lock up beside Rose?

  • http://slamonline.com LakeShow

    Yeah I agree that Kobe has about 5 more Defensive 1st team selection than he deserves I don’t know why they keep voting him in on that lol. But allot of guys get those 1st, 2nd, 3rd team awards even though they don’t really deserve them. TA wasn’t even 1st team right? That’s some Bullllsh*t

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    Paul Pierce. – no TA didnt get first team. Grant Hill didnt get any recognition and I really thought second team was the worst he should’ve done, he was spectacular, and idk if Jrue Holliday did either.

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Paul Pierce (’10/’11 playoffs), Deng (’11 playoffs- didn’t lock him down but Deng struggled mightily) and JJ (’09 playoffs).

  • http://Slamonline.coM nbk

    Kobe was not a defensive option in that series against Iverson btw. It was Shaw-Fisher-Lue. Kobe was havin to deal with Aaron McKie on the other end. That guy was one hell of a one on one defender. But Kobe played his ass off in those finals and was a great help defender. imo that was his greatest defensive strength anyways, he took advantage of his uber knowledge too go with his athletic ability to affect the game as a help defender even as a guard in the half court. Not many guys have ever had that kind of impact as a guard.

  • http://slamonline.com datkid

    couple things… kobe is vastly overrated as a defender. Lebron at this point can literally make people non-factors in games… all the examples of kobe guarding people you used… he played DECENT defense on them, but he didn’t take them out of the game… lebron can do that and then drop 30 on you. Paul pierce, luol deng, Joe Johnson, andre iguodola, and derrick rose are proof of this. plus lebron can front positions 1-4 and some 5′s… kobe could never do that.

  • http://slamonline.com datkid

    a couple of things about reek vs john wall rookie year btw… when reke was grabbing 20-5-5 he WAS the king’s offense… esp. with kevin martin gone. however john wall wasn’t necessarily the wizards ENTIRE offense his rookie year. they had several capable scores albeit underachieving, crazy ones. If john wall had been the entire offense for the wizards he might have been able to put up similar or better #’s

  • http://www.kb24.com The Seed

    What is America coming too, is this based off him playing in exhibtion games this summer, because he is not top 25 talent. I take alot of players over him. He is vastly overrated and Brandon Jennings is better than him. BOOK IT!!

  • http://cnbc.com JTaylor21

    Looks like Seed is sniffing markers again.

  • DukeFromDeep

    I swear I love these forums…I laugh my ass off at the regulars here having a go. By the way Wall is better than Reke/Rose if you give him another year or two.

  • Galagu

    I like Wall and he has all-star written all over…only concern with both reke and wall is i don’t know if they are winners…ya they score ya they draw crowds with the way play and fill up a stat sheet. But again if they aren’t winning or at least getting closer to a playoff spot after the fresh to league buzz wears off then they won’t be as appealing and probably won’t be on a list like this again. In college they had similar careers where their team (what was it memphis for reke and kentucky for wall) were good but again they didn’t win as much as i think they could have. Given they haven’t been in the league for a considerable amount of time, I just don’t know if as good as Wall and Reke are if they will get W’s the way Rose racks them up. Either way Wall and Reke will continue to get ridiculous stats but on what kind of team.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    I got to be in the effing twilight zone dude, somebody tell me when wall got so good,dudes can say reke and curry are no where near his level. yall watching too many of those exhibition games with no defense being played. lebron and kobe defense are overrated, they aint no pippen but kobe was better. shutting down pierce really? how old is pierce, i can recall when pierce was in his prime just two or three years ago giving lebron forty in the playoffs, but now lebron is a shut-down defender? no, his team is a great defensive team, in the playoffs they played some of the best defense as a units that I ever seen, they were fast and quick to help or recover.

  • http://slamonline.com datkid

    Ric, reke is near wall’s level… but i wouldn’t say curry is anywhere near wall, athletically, in terms of passing, or rebounding. curry’s a better shooter though. and personally i don’t think tyreke is anywhere near as good a passer as wall is, or anywhere near as athletic. he’s just a tall lead/point guard who’s good at slashing…. What are you smoking? we’ve all ALWAYS been this high on wall….

    and yeah pierce and lebron did at one point (08) hang 40+ on each other’s heads but lebron has grown by leaps and bounds as an individual defender in recent years… he completely took paul pierce out of his game on 2 different teams. so no it’s not just that he plays on good defensive teams. lebron >kobe as a defender

  • http://Slamonline.com Caboose

    Ok, let’s get some things straight.
    1. Wall will have a much better next season than Curry and Reke.
    2. Reke’s rook stats are inflated but still impressive.
    3. I think Wall’s rookie year is the best given his assist total.
    4. Kobe was an elite defender. Elite.
    5. Kobe is not a great defender now but he is not Kevin Martin.
    6. LeBron is a better help defender than 1 on 1.
    7. LeBron is still a very good 1 on 1 defender.
    8. The Seed and ctkennedy are out of their minds.

  • http://slamonline.com datkid

    ^^ COSIGN… all of that.

  • bigMvp

    Wall will have a better season than Curry and Tyreke next year which is why he is placed higher than them on this list there is not much to argue here and agree with @Caboose

  • AirForceONE

    Can people please stop bringing up Stephen Curry. The kid can shoot, but that’s about it. He is not on the same level as John Wall or Tyreke Evans. As for John Wall, I watched him play this summer at the Indy (Knox) Pro Am. He scored 41 points, dished out 11 assists, and grabbed 10 rebounds. I was impressed with his play to say the least.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    ^ dude shut the hell up, kyle lowry drop 48 at one of those games, nick young drop 60 and john lucas drop 50, who cares! they dont play any defense.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Yes….Brandon “37% career shooting percentage” Jennings is better than John Wall. Way to add to your lack of cedibility Seed…

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Oh yeah, cosign Caboose

  • marc

    Brandon Jennings is one of my favorite players but hes not better then Wall. And i don’t know why people keep saying all Steph Curry can do is shoot. He clearly has knowledge of the game. Alot of players and coaches talk about his basketball IQ. He can obviously handle the ball. He makes smart plays. Just because he doesn’t dunk on everyone doesn’t mean all he can do is shoot. He is going to be a top 10 pg in years to come. Maybe top 5. And why are people bringin him up. This is a john wall article

  • marc

    This might sound stupid to some people but if you replace John Wall with Rondo do you get the same results? I think John Wall and Rondo are basically the same players just that rondo has better talent around him.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    Um…wall has potential to be a prolific scorer…like 20+ ppg…Rondo has never averaged more than 14 ppg. Conversely, Rondo is on a whole different level than Wall defensively. As distributors Rondo is better now, but Wall could easlit be as good.

  • toinefan88

    He looked really strong in that last video of the all-star game. Looks like he’s put on a little muscle. He’s gonna be a problem the coming years.

  • http://www.slamonline.com Wayno

    easlit = easily

  • the truth

    coming from a UK homer and a huge j dub fan…this isn’t right. Potential to be the best point guard in the league, but right now, nope, not top 25

  • ctkennedy

    Question to ALL THE JOHN WALL lovers where do u think he rank RIGHT now as a FRANCHISE player against the other 29n the league …Every team got SOMEBODY they quote on quote builtin around (1-30)

  • dc sham

    I saw every game that Wall and Rose played against each other and Rose is probably the only PG that Wall looked physically intimidated by. Wall has the tools to challenge Rose, Cp3 and Deron for the #1 spot but what takes those three guys to the next level are their mastery of pace in the halfcourt game. You cant defend any of those three with a pg because they will kill them with their skill set. look at the playoffs this year when the Lakers had to put Kobe on CP3, and Indy put Paul George on Rose, with Miami following the same gameplan in the fourth with Lebron. A Franchise player shows the ability to at times single handedly get their teams victories throughout an 82 game season and Playoffs. Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Cp3, Howard, Dirk, Durant and Rose all embody what a Franchise player is

  • http://www.slamonline.com Slick Ric

    ^ well spoken

  • http://slamonline.com Chester

    are you kidding me? way to many john wall fanboys on this page this is ridiculous

  • Irfan

    Wall 10 spots ahead of Parker? Come on SLAM. Wall is barely top 50 at the moment don’t be ridiculous.
    No Scola on the list, Deng very low, Parker too low, Bogut & Marc Gasol too low… isn’t there a HUGE American bias here?
    That’s really a bad ranking now.

  • Bullet

    Someone asked a very interesting question. Where does John Wall stack up against the other “franchise players” in this league? Is John Wall already in the top tier, is he capable of rising to the elite level of Kobe, LBJ, Durant, or DRose? As a long-suffering Washington Bullets/Wizards fan I can say with 100% biased predjudice that the great Wall of Chinatown is indeed a franchise player. However, I reason such not because of stats and averages and wins and losses but instead based on the role and responsibility that being a franchise player demands. When Wall was selected it brought relief to a city of fans that were stressed and depressed from the embarassing and immature antics of Agent Zero. Now as the new face of the franchise, John Wall has restored optimism, enthusiasm, and excitement in Wizards fans about their team because he is a legitimate franchise player. Wall has the game, he has youth, and he has the demeanor that owners, general managers, and coaches look for when they are seeking a player to build their team around.

  • Justin G

    So Wall will be better than the MVP in 2 years…Hmm well the MVP will start for team USA next year,will lead his team to a top 3 record overall in the NBA ,and will play deep in the Playoffs,Bulls vs Wizards who wins those games ?…And he will only be 23 where the freak does somebody see J-Wall passing up the MVP at what Time ??? Ok in two years when the MVP is 25 at his max prime thats when you see J-Wall passing up Derrick? Really…Really!!!Derrick won two state titles,took his college team to a national chip,#1pick,playoffs rookie year ,playoffs second year,best record #1 seed and won the MVP,…Ok now John Wall,highschool don’t know wut he did but he lost 2 somebody,college lost to West Virgina ,who the F did they have on the squad ???..#1 pick,team had a horrible record…I love J-Walls game but 4 you clowns to compare him to the MVP need 2 stop…the NBA is about Winning!!! Compare winnin with those two… #Winning

  • Jer Dawg

    He’s nice player. Definitely would pay to watch him play. His style is very appealing to the masses. But he’s still a few years away. He gets numbers just blazing past everyone for layups and assists. Very transitional player. Gets plenty of steals with his speed. If it weren’t for his tendinitis throughout the season I think he would’ve been ranked higher. Aside from that caveat, he still is improving and will be watching him hopefully develop into a elite guard that challenges Derrick Rose and Russell Westbrook. Guards with size and speed at that position.

  • brad

    in 3 years, ROSE, WALL, PAUL, RUSSEL. to say that stephen “female defense” curry is better than John Wall is a retarded statement. Im sure Jerry West would give up Monte and Curry for Wall. Curry can shoot but the rest of his game isnt half as good as Wall’s

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